August 14, 2006
UK Muslim Leaders : Rein in the Jews--or Else
The leaders of 38 Muslim groups in the UK have released the following statement:
Prime Minister, As British Muslims we urge you to do more to fight against all those who target civilians with violence, whenever and wherever that happens. ...[Translation : "Why are you worried so much about our boys here in Britain? There's lots of violence in the world. If you're worried about what might happen here, maybe you should pay attention to what's going on in the rest of the world (hint, hint)..."]... It is our view that current British government policy risks putting civilians at increased risk both in the UK and abroad. ...["...I mean, this is a mighty fine country you've got here. Sure would be a damn shame if something bad were to happen to it..."]... To combat terror the government has focused extensively on domestic legislation. While some of this will have an impact, the government must not ignore the role of its foreign policy. ...["...just no telling what might happen if our boys don't calm down a bit. They can get a little 'worked up', ya know, especially when they hear about those Jews. We ask 'em to behave, of course, but can you blame them, really??..."]The debacle of Iraq and now the failure to do more to secure an immediate end to the attacks on civilians in the Middle East not only increases the risk to ordinary people in that region, it is also ammunition to extremists who threaten us all.["...damn shame if they got a little excited again, upset about those out-of-control Jews and did something disproportionate to your pretty country, here. Now, if you were to rein in those Jews, we might manage to get our boys to calm down and listen to a little reason..."]... Attacking civilians is never justified. This message is a global one. We urge the Prime Minister to redouble his efforts to tackle terror and extremism and change our foreign policy to show the world that we value the lives of civilians wherever they live and whatever their religion.Such a move would make us all safer. ...
["Yup, it's a deal, I tell ya. A real deal. Really would be a damn shame if something happened to this nice place..."]
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This makes me physically ill... Although highly unlikely, I just wish there was someone in the British government who had the balls to step up and, in their best Wyatt Earp impression, address these asshats thusly:
"Nice mob you have here... now, shut the EF up, gather 'round, and listen closely.
You present yourselves as British Muslims; let me clarify what this means. You have chosen, of your own free will (as if you had any idea what that would be), our country to be your home. This means your Primary, Overriding Allegiance will be to Mother England. First and foremost. Before all others, including God, Jehova, Yawheh, Ja, Allah, Hindu-Floaty-Thing, or whatEVER.
If you find these conditions unacceptable, please find a one-way ticket, to be used at your earliest convenience, back to whatever goat-humping, mood-god worshipping hell hole you wish.
Thank you for your consideration, and Bob's Yer Uncle..."
Freaks.
"Nice mob you have here... now, shut the EF up, gather 'round, and listen closely.
You present yourselves as British Muslims; let me clarify what this means. You have chosen, of your own free will (as if you had any idea what that would be), our country to be your home. This means your Primary, Overriding Allegiance will be to Mother England. First and foremost. Before all others, including God, Jehova, Yawheh, Ja, Allah, Hindu-Floaty-Thing, or whatEVER.
If you find these conditions unacceptable, please find a one-way ticket, to be used at your earliest convenience, back to whatever goat-humping, mood-god worshipping hell hole you wish.
Thank you for your consideration, and Bob's Yer Uncle..."
Freaks.
Posted by: EricInTexas at August 14, 2006 12:11 PM (jvP3p)
Posted by: All-Seeing Eye at August 14, 2006 12:27 PM (c/4ax)
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Prime Minister, As British Muslims we urge you to do more to fight against all those who target civilians with violence, whenever and wherever that happens.
This is our first lie. As you will begin to understand as you read, we do no really mean "all those who target civilians" with violence. We are not referring, really, to anyone at all who targets civilians with violence.
It is our view that current British government policy risks putting civilians at increased risk both in the UK and abroad.
If you support Israel, we will murder civilians. Therefore, you are guilty of murdering civilians, as is Israel because they have forced us to do so simply by existing.
To combat terror the government has focused extensively on domestic legislation. While some of this will have an impact, the government must not ignore the role of its foreign policy.
The fact that murder is against the law is not the problem. The fact is that you are forcing us to murder you because you are not letting us murder the Jews. How dare you! It is our Koran-given right to murder the Jews first and the infidels second.
The debacle of Iraq and now the failure to do more to secure an immediate end to the attacks on civilians in the Middle East not only increases the risk to ordinary people in that region, it is also ammunition to extremists who threaten us all.
If you fight back, we will murder more of you. Then, our "peaceful" Muslims will decry the fact that you have forced the "extremist" Muslims to murder your citizens. They are, afterall, lovers of peace. How dare you force others to murder your civilians?
Attacking civilians is never justified.
Though some such attacks are "less never justified" than others.
This message is a global one.
Actually, it is not. We will only apply our duplicitous morality to the Jews and those who support them. We do not play by any rules, but we will attempt to hold you to your own Christian rules of morality any chance that we can. We will exploit your every weakness, and pose as every possible spiritual thing in order to lull you into our scheme. Then, we will finish you.
We urge the Prime Minister to redouble his efforts to tackle terror and extremism and change our foreign policy to show the world that we value the lives of civilians wherever they live and whatever their religion.
The only way for you to live peacefully is to stop fighting. You will die that much easier, when we decide you are no longer useful to us. Also, I am told that life in dhimmitude is quite fair. You really should accept this. It is quite wrong of you to force us to force you.
This is our first lie. As you will begin to understand as you read, we do no really mean "all those who target civilians" with violence. We are not referring, really, to anyone at all who targets civilians with violence.
It is our view that current British government policy risks putting civilians at increased risk both in the UK and abroad.
If you support Israel, we will murder civilians. Therefore, you are guilty of murdering civilians, as is Israel because they have forced us to do so simply by existing.
To combat terror the government has focused extensively on domestic legislation. While some of this will have an impact, the government must not ignore the role of its foreign policy.
The fact that murder is against the law is not the problem. The fact is that you are forcing us to murder you because you are not letting us murder the Jews. How dare you! It is our Koran-given right to murder the Jews first and the infidels second.
The debacle of Iraq and now the failure to do more to secure an immediate end to the attacks on civilians in the Middle East not only increases the risk to ordinary people in that region, it is also ammunition to extremists who threaten us all.
If you fight back, we will murder more of you. Then, our "peaceful" Muslims will decry the fact that you have forced the "extremist" Muslims to murder your citizens. They are, afterall, lovers of peace. How dare you force others to murder your civilians?
Attacking civilians is never justified.
Though some such attacks are "less never justified" than others.
This message is a global one.
Actually, it is not. We will only apply our duplicitous morality to the Jews and those who support them. We do not play by any rules, but we will attempt to hold you to your own Christian rules of morality any chance that we can. We will exploit your every weakness, and pose as every possible spiritual thing in order to lull you into our scheme. Then, we will finish you.
We urge the Prime Minister to redouble his efforts to tackle terror and extremism and change our foreign policy to show the world that we value the lives of civilians wherever they live and whatever their religion.
The only way for you to live peacefully is to stop fighting. You will die that much easier, when we decide you are no longer useful to us. Also, I am told that life in dhimmitude is quite fair. You really should accept this. It is quite wrong of you to force us to force you.
Posted by: endurion at August 14, 2006 12:42 PM (/9PCN)
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I urge Britons to rise up and slaughter the muslim scum in their midst, as we one day must; do not let one escape alive, because they will always come back to murder innocent people.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 14, 2006 12:44 PM (v3I+x)
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Resistance is futile.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 14, 2006 01:59 PM (7teJ9)
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But would be fun.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 04:01 PM (AzkTD)
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Another set of demands from muslims. Another example of their desire to rule the world on their terms. Revolution is long overdue in the UK. Muslims need to be driven out.
Posted by: Jester at August 14, 2006 04:41 PM (TuAMG)
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My sentiments entirely. Only by mass deportations can balance in the west be achieved. I might be old fashioned but it just seems natural for English to be in England, French in France, Spanish to Spain, Germans in Germany, etc: And of course Iranian shitheads in Iran. So we can get all of them at one time. When I go to Sweden and see a bunch of recent rag heads running around it stinks. Move them back to their countries. They can't get along with anyone else. Hell, the terds can't even get along with each other.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 08:16 PM (y5dGS)
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I have been deleted. So has Habib the Muslime. Was it something I wrote? Did I not have enough compassion?
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 14, 2006 08:49 PM (D2g/j)
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Leatherneck: Had you said: You filthy jews i kill you mother fucker. I hope to allah i cut all heads for you son of bitchin, go fuck you sister, death to america.
You would not have been deleted. Don't believe me folks? Check the archives.
You would not have been deleted. Don't believe me folks? Check the archives.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 09:24 PM (y5dGS)
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jester, aren't you from the UK? What is the general feeling about mass deportations? Among the people at large.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 14, 2006 09:35 PM (rUyw4)
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No longer living in the UK, JJ. I'm now in the colonies...New Zealand. They even have too many muslims here, is there anywhere on the planet I can go that is a muslim free zone? I'm still British and proud of it though and will probably return there eventually. If the civil war starts I'll be back to fight the muslims.
Posted by: Jester at August 14, 2006 10:21 PM (TuAMG)
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Ok, jester, I do seem to remember you saying on another occasion that you were in NZ, just forgot about it. You answered my question about numbers of Muslims in NZ, and I was well aware through Tim Blair's blog that the numbers of radical Muslims in Australia were high. Good luck down there.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 14, 2006 10:33 PM (rUyw4)
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The difference between Jester and the middle easterners here is that Jester will go back and fight. The middle easterners will hide behind him. Screaming for blood.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 16, 2006 09:39 AM (vCjBd)
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Damn muzzies, theyll never fit into western society, send the blighters packing (all generations), and take their filthy mosques,
berquas,qurans with them.
I spit on Islam!
berquas,qurans with them.
I spit on Islam!
Posted by: Hisslam at August 21, 2006 09:27 AM (mfayL)
Hizb'Allah is Everywhere
First, this footage of a Paris Hizb'Allah rally, courtesy of Moonbat Media:
Then there's this footage of this D.C. rally, courtesy of Age of Hooper
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Pigs.
Posted by: Fernando Rivera at August 14, 2006 06:53 AM (piM5f)
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It's the marker that tells you that we're not yet serious about our rhetoric after 9/11. If we were, everyone in that DC march would have been rounded up and deported (if not citizens), and put on a terror watch list in any case. Many of them would perhaps have been jailed. We are acting timidly, and for that reason will be utterly shocked, shocked I tell you when Islamists here conduct or support another 9/11-scale attack in the US. We know much, and do little, to our shame and eventually to our pain.
Posted by: Jeff Medcalf at August 14, 2006 07:02 AM (7Q2cA)
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Yup, something is seriously wrong when hizbullah is listed as a terrorist organization and an ally is engaged in war with them and a masked supporter goes unarrested - something is very, very wrong. On US soil a supporter of a terrorist group conceals his identity and goes unchecked. I'm seriously beginning to wonder if another 9/11 would even wake this nation up - I doubt it.
Posted by: goesh at August 14, 2006 07:11 AM (1w6Ud)
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Fore! For those of you who are new, that is the sound George makes on his many, many war-time vacations ......
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 14, 2006 08:38 AM (gLMre)
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Glad I spent last night on the Gulf fishing. There is as much reason to throw up here as there.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 09:11 AM (N0n43)
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I am Canadian and like Americans I live in an absolute democracy. We can demonstrate for or against our government or anything else -- an enshrined right in Canada.
In my home town of Montreal, Canada there was a demonstration on Sunday, August 6th 2006 against the war in Lebanon [however, it turned out to be an anti-Israel demonstration]. Local and provincial politicians were invited to attend...and they did [looking for potential voters?]. Hezbollah and Hamas are deemed terrorist organizations in Canada and are illegal.
While most protesters carried Lebanese flags there were Hezbollah flags too...illegal in Canada. No action was taken against demonstrators with Hezbollah flags. If we in the west wish to preserve our Western civilization and our democratic ways, we must enforce our own laws. Not arresting those demonstrators with Hezoballah flags is wrong. Who told the police to look the other way? and why?
Another thing which most of us in democracies do not do when demonstrating is cover our faces. When people cover their faces to hid their identities, I figure they are my enemy.
The governments of Canada and the United States are correct in supporting Israel. Israel, a democratic Western nation was attacked by terrorists. Western nations have the right to protect themselves against acts of war committed by terrorists. It is sad innocent children die because they and their mothers are being used as human shields. But it is NOT us, the Western nations that use human shields...it is terrorist agents in non-democratic countries who do and in doing so, they are guily of crimes against humanity.
Very happy to have found http://kenlydell.typepad.com/islamic_evil
Coventina
In my home town of Montreal, Canada there was a demonstration on Sunday, August 6th 2006 against the war in Lebanon [however, it turned out to be an anti-Israel demonstration]. Local and provincial politicians were invited to attend...and they did [looking for potential voters?]. Hezbollah and Hamas are deemed terrorist organizations in Canada and are illegal.
While most protesters carried Lebanese flags there were Hezbollah flags too...illegal in Canada. No action was taken against demonstrators with Hezbollah flags. If we in the west wish to preserve our Western civilization and our democratic ways, we must enforce our own laws. Not arresting those demonstrators with Hezoballah flags is wrong. Who told the police to look the other way? and why?
Another thing which most of us in democracies do not do when demonstrating is cover our faces. When people cover their faces to hid their identities, I figure they are my enemy.
The governments of Canada and the United States are correct in supporting Israel. Israel, a democratic Western nation was attacked by terrorists. Western nations have the right to protect themselves against acts of war committed by terrorists. It is sad innocent children die because they and their mothers are being used as human shields. But it is NOT us, the Western nations that use human shields...it is terrorist agents in non-democratic countries who do and in doing so, they are guily of crimes against humanity.
Very happy to have found http://kenlydell.typepad.com/islamic_evil
Coventina
Posted by: Coventina at August 14, 2006 09:26 AM (eirIx)
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Haywood believes in free speech, but to support of those who wish all of us dead is asking for an ass whooping. At least check that wannabe terrorist's id.
It's as if you want to burn a flag to show that you don't appreciate how nice you have it here, then you have that right, but try to do it in Haywood's presence, and you'll be exercising your right to urgent health care.
It's as if you want to burn a flag to show that you don't appreciate how nice you have it here, then you have that right, but try to do it in Haywood's presence, and you'll be exercising your right to urgent health care.
Posted by: haywood jablowmi at August 14, 2006 10:17 AM (VUmVc)
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I recognize the eyes. Yes it is! It is Jill Carrol, I am sad to inform !
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 14, 2006 10:36 AM (gLMre)
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Did Jorje the Pizza man morph into Fernando the smooth epithaph tossing pizza master of the lame comback?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 14, 2006 10:57 AM (7teJ9)
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Hmmm... if I remember correctly, as a reaction to the KKK, and in an effort to suppress its activities, it was made illegal for any person to disguise or hide their identity in public. So why is the law not being applied to muslims?
Our government has surrendered to terrorism and we are abandoned to their tender mercies, and if we fight back, the government will come down on us like they did at Ruby Ridge and Waco. The government is not fighting islam, as it should, but is trying to make the conquest as bloodless as possible, in the interest of "peace". Our government is a coalition of cowards and traitors, and cannot be trusted.
It's up to us to defend our nation. It's not just our right - it's our duty. Any person, whether civilian, police, or military, who stands against We, the People in our efforts to defend ourselves is a traitor and an enemy, and must be treated as such, without mercy.
Now is the time to choose; prepare to fight, or accept slavery. There is no third option.
Our government has surrendered to terrorism and we are abandoned to their tender mercies, and if we fight back, the government will come down on us like they did at Ruby Ridge and Waco. The government is not fighting islam, as it should, but is trying to make the conquest as bloodless as possible, in the interest of "peace". Our government is a coalition of cowards and traitors, and cannot be trusted.
It's up to us to defend our nation. It's not just our right - it's our duty. Any person, whether civilian, police, or military, who stands against We, the People in our efforts to defend ourselves is a traitor and an enemy, and must be treated as such, without mercy.
Now is the time to choose; prepare to fight, or accept slavery. There is no third option.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 14, 2006 11:09 AM (v3I+x)
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It did seem the Govt was more concerned with who was living in the woods in Northern Idaho than who was interested in blowing up planes. But then, during the two years I lived in Spokane, there were four or five pipe bombs set off in Spokane.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 14, 2006 11:19 AM (7teJ9)
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IM: Bingo. No shit. Neither the Government or the Academic meatheads in our universities are doing their tax supported job. One ignores the terrorist demonstrations and the other shouts freedom of expression. That is if that group is not pro white. Some actually say we need these middle eastern animals in our country. For the sake of what? More traffic jams? More cell phone sales?
That's not what the founding fathers meant when they said freedom of speech.
Next some idiot from academia will conclude that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness to a muslim is killing all other people. Therefore they're guaranteed that right by the Constitution.
Both our Government and our Universities needs an enema.
That's not what the founding fathers meant when they said freedom of speech.
Next some idiot from academia will conclude that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness to a muslim is killing all other people. Therefore they're guaranteed that right by the Constitution.
Both our Government and our Universities needs an enema.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 12:07 PM (L92U0)
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Yesterday I stayed in pretty much all day, watching the History Channel air program after program about what...? White "supremacists", of course! Yep, everyone knows there is no threat from any other quarter but White Christians.
The Weavers were plotting the takeover of the planet, which is why a fourteen year old boy was shot in the back, and a mother holding her baby killed by an FBI sniper. And Waco? Yep, you guess it; they were going to overthrow the government through obscure, fringe religious beliefs, and had to be put down with heavy armor and machine guns. God bless Bill Clinton and Janet Reno for saving us from these horrible, dangerous people, and bless the History Channel for reminding us that White Christians are the greatest threat to humanity.
Nothing to see here, move along...
The Weavers were plotting the takeover of the planet, which is why a fourteen year old boy was shot in the back, and a mother holding her baby killed by an FBI sniper. And Waco? Yep, you guess it; they were going to overthrow the government through obscure, fringe religious beliefs, and had to be put down with heavy armor and machine guns. God bless Bill Clinton and Janet Reno for saving us from these horrible, dangerous people, and bless the History Channel for reminding us that White Christians are the greatest threat to humanity.
Nothing to see here, move along...
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 14, 2006 12:50 PM (v3I+x)
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But the majority of people were conditioned to that response by Whom? De Govement, de schools and de newpapers.
Jus ax em.
Yea man. Those people in Waco were a danger to this nation. They were fixing to invade Texas. Just ask the dog ugly, lesbian, monstrosity that Rhodes scholar Clinton appointed as Attorney General.
Clinton was the #1 Academic meathead.
Jus ax em.
Yea man. Those people in Waco were a danger to this nation. They were fixing to invade Texas. Just ask the dog ugly, lesbian, monstrosity that Rhodes scholar Clinton appointed as Attorney General.
Clinton was the #1 Academic meathead.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 01:05 PM (L92U0)
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IM: I attempted to watch those programs. Yesterday afternoon we went 60 miles off shore. We were trolling and the TV kept going in and out. The trouble with my satallite (Direct TV)is that it resets itself every time it loses signal. This takes about 3 minutes. Fish were biting and I drank too much and fell asleep in my deck chair. My good friends let me sleep until I turned bright red with sunburn. But payback will be a mother.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 01:12 PM (L92U0)
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Let me summarize for you since you missed it Rooster:
White Christians are the only evil in the world, and all misery in the world flows from them.
White people who want to live in peace among their own kind must be exposed and destroyed.
White Christians are the only threat to the safety and existance of Jews.
Neo-Nazi's are representative of all White Christians.
Black and Hispanic gangs, and the violence they perpetrate, are directly caused by White Christians.
Timothy McVeigh is the icon of terrorism.
White Christians are the only evil in the world, and all misery in the world flows from them.
White people who want to live in peace among their own kind must be exposed and destroyed.
White Christians are the only threat to the safety and existance of Jews.
Neo-Nazi's are representative of all White Christians.
Black and Hispanic gangs, and the violence they perpetrate, are directly caused by White Christians.
Timothy McVeigh is the icon of terrorism.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 14, 2006 01:34 PM (v3I+x)
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Oh! I thought they had someting new.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 04:03 PM (AzkTD)
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Don't forget to globalize yourself. The History channel states that every 10min. Who owns the History channel, and why do they want people to hear Gobalize Yourself over, and over, and over...?
Many fronts, one war.
Many fronts, one war.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 14, 2006 05:59 PM (D2g/j)
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Yea! The history channel diffinately has some liberals on the payroll. Who knows maybe even a few dog shit muslims.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 14, 2006 08:20 PM (y5dGS)
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I got this reply from the D.C. police regarding the against wearing of masks in public:
District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition Currentness
Division IV. Criminal Law and Procedure and Prisoners.
Title 22. Criminal Offenses and Penalties. (Refs & Annos)
Subtitle I. Criminal Offenses.
Chapter 33. Trespass; Injuries to Property.
§ 22-3312.03. Wearing hoods or masks.
(a) No person or persons over 16 years of age, while wearing any mask, hood, or device whereby any portion of the face is hidden, concealed, or covered as to conceal the identity of the wearer, shall:
(1) Enter upon, be, or appear upon any lane, walk, alley, street, road highway, or other public way in the District of Columbia;
(2) Enter upon, be, or appear upon or within the public property of the District of Columbia; or
(3) Hold any manner of meeting or demonstration.
(b) The provisions of subsection (a) of this section apply only if the person was wearing the hood, mask, or other device:
(1) With the intent to deprive any person or class of persons of equal protection of the law or of equal privileges and immunities under the law, or for the purpose of preventing or hindering the constituted authorities of the United States or the District of Columbia from giving or securing for all persons within the District of Columbia equal protection of the law;
(2) With the intent, by force or threat of force, to injure, intimidate, or interfere with any person because of his or her exercise of any right secured by federal or District of Columbia laws, or to intimidate any person or any class of persons from exercising any right secured by federal or District of Columbia laws;
(3) With the intent to intimidate, threaten, abuse, or harass any other person;
(4) With the intent to cause another person to fear for his or her personal safety, or, where it is probable that reasonable persons will be put in fear for their personal safety by the defendant's actions, with reckless disregard for that probability; or
(5) While engaged in conduct prohibited by civil or criminal law, with the intent of avoiding identification.
end
District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition Currentness
Division IV. Criminal Law and Procedure and Prisoners.
Title 22. Criminal Offenses and Penalties. (Refs & Annos)
Subtitle I. Criminal Offenses.
Chapter 33. Trespass; Injuries to Property.
§ 22-3312.03. Wearing hoods or masks.
(a) No person or persons over 16 years of age, while wearing any mask, hood, or device whereby any portion of the face is hidden, concealed, or covered as to conceal the identity of the wearer, shall:
(1) Enter upon, be, or appear upon any lane, walk, alley, street, road highway, or other public way in the District of Columbia;
(2) Enter upon, be, or appear upon or within the public property of the District of Columbia; or
(3) Hold any manner of meeting or demonstration.
(b) The provisions of subsection (a) of this section apply only if the person was wearing the hood, mask, or other device:
(1) With the intent to deprive any person or class of persons of equal protection of the law or of equal privileges and immunities under the law, or for the purpose of preventing or hindering the constituted authorities of the United States or the District of Columbia from giving or securing for all persons within the District of Columbia equal protection of the law;
(2) With the intent, by force or threat of force, to injure, intimidate, or interfere with any person because of his or her exercise of any right secured by federal or District of Columbia laws, or to intimidate any person or any class of persons from exercising any right secured by federal or District of Columbia laws;
(3) With the intent to intimidate, threaten, abuse, or harass any other person;
(4) With the intent to cause another person to fear for his or her personal safety, or, where it is probable that reasonable persons will be put in fear for their personal safety by the defendant's actions, with reckless disregard for that probability; or
(5) While engaged in conduct prohibited by civil or criminal law, with the intent of avoiding identification.
end
Posted by: Kurt at August 17, 2006 09:52 AM (tPPP4)
August 13, 2006
Hizballah Accused of Putting Handicapped Kids in Qana Building
Cross-posted from The Dread Pundit Bluto (Le Pandit Bluto De Crainte)
ynet news links to a Lebanese Christian site that accused Hizballah on the day of the Qana tragedy of placing handicapped children in the building at Qana, then firing rockets from the roof in order to create "Qana 2".
The Lebanese site is published in French. I've translated their posting below: more...
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Give me your downtrodden, and the weary ....
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 13, 2006 11:15 PM (gLMre)
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The saddest irony of all is that they were probably doing the poor kids a favor by bringing them a swift death, if not a pleasant one; just think of the hell of growing up at the bottom of that food chain. It's bad enough being a healthy arab, but if you're handicapped... damn. If I were reincarnated as an arab, I'd kill myself as soon as I was old enough to be fully aware of how bad life sucked.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 13, 2006 11:57 PM (v3I+x)
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11 hours without a single shot fired. Why no entry on that? Honestly, you Conservative bloggers are all like,'That can't be right. Let's question!', and put up bullshit conspiracy stories about how Hizballah put those children in the building that they've been digging up graves and shit. Like what the fuck?
Posted by: Some Dude at August 14, 2006 11:29 AM (Iq9PC)
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Hey some dude, does it tickle your chin when you go balls-deep on muslims? And doesn't the smell of goat's butthole bother you?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 14, 2006 12:52 PM (v3I+x)
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Some dude: you dare question me? Make sure that I have reviewed the vile contents of your evil blog.
You, running dog lackey of the Yankee imperialists who would seek to destroy the glorious shining achievements of the once-oppressed peoples of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea who have followed and prospered by the admirable and inspired Juchi path of cherished leader Kim Jong-il and have them placed once more under the thumb of the capitalist aggessor nations who seek only to exploit and parasitically drain the life blood of free peoples everywhere have no standing to comment upon my own posts.
Kamsi-hamnida
You, running dog lackey of the Yankee imperialists who would seek to destroy the glorious shining achievements of the once-oppressed peoples of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea who have followed and prospered by the admirable and inspired Juchi path of cherished leader Kim Jong-il and have them placed once more under the thumb of the capitalist aggessor nations who seek only to exploit and parasitically drain the life blood of free peoples everywhere have no standing to comment upon my own posts.
Kamsi-hamnida
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 14, 2006 12:57 PM (vBK4C)
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Ass allam ah lick em
Haywood doesn't want to get involved in your little piss fight, but does want to high five Max and say, maybe that's why it's so easy to find muslims to deliver explosives with that personal touch.
I'm not going to say any of them possess the slightest amount of the good quality called bravery (don't have Brian Williams' spin machine), but what must those nads be thinking, to plan to carry their piece of the pie onto a plane, hand it to al magyver cockbar, and go sit in their seat and wait until the damn thing pops? Easily manipulated and directed.
Lick em Ass Allam
Haywood doesn't want to get involved in your little piss fight, but does want to high five Max and say, maybe that's why it's so easy to find muslims to deliver explosives with that personal touch.
I'm not going to say any of them possess the slightest amount of the good quality called bravery (don't have Brian Williams' spin machine), but what must those nads be thinking, to plan to carry their piece of the pie onto a plane, hand it to al magyver cockbar, and go sit in their seat and wait until the damn thing pops? Easily manipulated and directed.
Lick em Ass Allam
Posted by: Haywood Jablowmi at August 14, 2006 04:07 PM (lS40s)
7
Wow, 25 posts. Keep up the dilligent work. Most of the guys that bash here don't have a site. Have a look at mine and return the favor.
It's war dude, and Hezbollah has contiued f-ing with the Israelis. But they did stop firing the rockets for now. This is when we catch Syria and Iran running resupply. Aug 22 here we come. BTW Dude, just for the record do you believe Hezbollah violated Isael's sovreignty when they crossed the border committed murder, and kidnappings?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 14, 2006 06:02 PM (n4VvM)
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Come, come dude! " 11 hours without a single shot fired. Why no entry on that? Honestly, you Conservative bloggers are all like ". Well, actually dude, there were several rockets fired by the Hez into southern Lebanon. However, the Israelies exercised restraint, since the rockets didn't go into Israel.
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 14, 2006 11:47 PM (gLMre)
August 12, 2006
Lebanese Photographers Digging Up Bodies?
LGF has the story, courtesy of photographer Bryan Denton:
i have been working in lebanon since all this started, and seeing the behavior of many of the lebanese wire service photographers has been a bit unsettling. while hajj has garnered a lot of attention for his doctoring of images digitally, whether guilty or not, i have been witness to the daily practice of directed shots, one case where a group of wire photogs were choreographing the unearthing of bodies, directing emergency workers here and there, asking them to position bodies just so, even remove bodies that have already been put in graves so that they can photograph them in peoples arms. these photographers have come away with powerful shots, that required no manipulation digitally, but instead, manipulation on a human level, and this itself is a bigger ethical problem.If this is true, the MSM has some serious explaining to do.
Ace describes it as “a serious, meltdown level scandal for the media.â€
Allahpundit says:
It’s worth reading the whole thread at Lightstalkers, not only for the blog-bashing and grotesque moral equivalence (â€Israel is no different than Saudia Arabia or Egypt when it comes to oppressing peopleâ€), but because the guy who made the accusation showed up and left a second commentThat comment included the following:
i have also heard from friends of mine in lebanon, respected photographers, that this was not an isolated incident.Developing...
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"If this is true, the MSM has some serious explaining to do."
You mean you don't even know whether it's a lie or not and you put it into print?
You mean you don't even know whether it's a lie or not and you put it into print?
Posted by: grinnel at August 12, 2006 06:38 PM (u8Vo9)
2
Yup. I don't have any way of verifying whether Bryan Denton's story is correct.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 12, 2006 07:03 PM (JBdud)
3
The hyenas are nipping at his heels as we speak, and he has been apologetic, but he has not backed off his story as of yet, even though some Lebanese or perhaps Arabs are trying to discredit him. We all know these bastards supporting Hizb'Allah will think nothing of lying if it will further the cause of their masters in Iran and Syria.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 12, 2006 07:47 PM (rUyw4)
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BTW, grinnel, if you have any info impacting Denton's story one way or the other, I'd be happy to post it.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 12, 2006 07:54 PM (JBdud)
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No, I have no special information to support his story one way or the other. But, like all anecdotal tales told, I'll reserve judgement until further evidence comes to light.
Posted by: grinnel at August 12, 2006 11:32 PM (u8Vo9)
6
You mean you don't even know whether it's a lie or not and you put it into print?
Posted by: grinnel at August 12, 2006 06:38 PM
Thanks for pointing this out, grinnel, -- I admit I would not have caught it. These are important topics about ethics in journalism and photojournalism... it would be a sad day indeed if portions of this blog would up on the Urban Legends site.
Posted by: grinnel at August 12, 2006 06:38 PM
Thanks for pointing this out, grinnel, -- I admit I would not have caught it. These are important topics about ethics in journalism and photojournalism... it would be a sad day indeed if portions of this blog would up on the Urban Legends site.
Posted by: Who Dere at August 13, 2006 09:46 AM (5VOfj)
7
Agreed, ethics in journalism across the board are indispensible in understanding world events that shape our own opinions right here.
I have to admit I'm often ambigous about the efficacy of blogging as a counter-balance to the MSM. Many point to blogs as not only an alternative to the inequities (both perceived and real) of Old Media, but as a more-honest remedy to the editorial agendas of a liberal elite. Fair enough I say. Then, something like this, a story related anecdotally, by one man, admittedly without corroboration of any kind. And no problem seen in that. Then I get back to thinking blogs as a medium of legitimate communications have a long, long way to go.
I have to admit I'm often ambigous about the efficacy of blogging as a counter-balance to the MSM. Many point to blogs as not only an alternative to the inequities (both perceived and real) of Old Media, but as a more-honest remedy to the editorial agendas of a liberal elite. Fair enough I say. Then, something like this, a story related anecdotally, by one man, admittedly without corroboration of any kind. And no problem seen in that. Then I get back to thinking blogs as a medium of legitimate communications have a long, long way to go.
Posted by: grinnel at August 13, 2006 12:59 PM (u8Vo9)
Euphemism of the Day : "An Imperfect Deal"
Even the AP admits this imposed "cease fire" deal is a crock:
For Israel, the U.N. cease-fire deal is far from perfect. A U.N. force deploying in south Lebanon as part of the truce will have trouble keeping Hezbollah at bay for long or prevent the Iranian-supplied guerrillas from rearming, critics said, pointing to past failures of international peacekeepers.Replace the word "could" with "will", and I'm right there with ya, buddy...The U.N. terms will buy temporary calm, but make the next war between Israel and Tehran's proxy army inevitable, former Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom and some military analysts warned.
"It begs the question, `What was it all for?'" Shalom said, reflecting a growing chorus of criticism. . . .
Defense analysts warned more fighting was likely in the future.
Iran can easily reactivate Hezbollah for its own political needs, particularly if it were to be attacked by the West over its nuclear weapons ambitions, Israeli counterterrorism expert Boaz Ganor said.
Shalom, of the right-wing Likud Party, agreed that another war is inevitable. "This was just the preview for the main movie," he said of the conflict that began July 12 when Hezbollah crossed the border and captured two Israeli soldiers.
"They (Hezbollah) will now rebuild themselves. We could then see long-range missiles, perhaps with non-conventional warheads," warned Shalom.
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I wonder what will happen to those kidnapped soldiers.
Posted by: Jersey Dave at August 12, 2006 05:48 PM (rdLTC)
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My thoughts exactly.
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief at August 12, 2006 06:07 PM (/qy9A)
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Yeah and I am right there under them on the rockets' bull's eye 
Olmert obviously forgot that he leads a party called Kadima (forward) and pulled a "squirrel in the street" on us. Better than a "deer in the headlights" but not by much.
Olmert obviously forgot that he leads a party called Kadima (forward) and pulled a "squirrel in the street" on us. Better than a "deer in the headlights" but not by much.
Posted by: Yaeli at August 12, 2006 06:13 PM (iHLqc)
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I think Israel has captured enough Hezzies to trade for their soldiers, if they're still alive, this is. This just sucks.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 12, 2006 06:21 PM (v3I+x)
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Is this just me, or does it feel like the Nazis just marched into the Sudetenland after taking over Austria? 1938?
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 12, 2006 06:41 PM (rUyw4)
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No, JJ, it's not just you; and Condi comes back waving a piece of paper, telling us we can have peace in our time.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 12, 2006 08:27 PM (v3I+x)
7
Why is Olmert singing Falsetto?
Ms. Condi castrated him in one short phone call the moment he showed any resistance to the US-French-Chameleon propsal!
Ms. Condi castrated him in one short phone call the moment he showed any resistance to the US-French-Chameleon propsal!
Posted by: sue at August 13, 2006 04:12 AM (cxJYd)
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Maybe, I hope, Condi is setting the liberal Israeli government up for a fall, so that hardliners can get reelected. Remember that Israel is a parliamentary democracy, and can have elections at any time. Olmert is a milquetoast liberal, and has botched this war from the start, as liberals always do. The time is right for an Israeli firebrand conservative to be PM, so the conservatives might sweep any upcoming elections, since even the most liberal of Israelis now must admit that there is no chance for peace without victory.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 13, 2006 10:28 AM (v3I+x)
Snatching Defeat From The Jaws Of Victory
Say it isn't so.
Several noted pundits have compared these times to 1938, or 1939.
Well, it just got pushed up to 1940, and the analogy is Dunkirk.
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And State are rubbing their hands with glee....
Posted by: Keith at August 12, 2006 01:18 AM (KBTvN)
2
Snatching Defeat From The Jaws Of Victory
this reminds me of all the times i've fallen asleep watching a movie and waking up tring to figure out what the hell is happening because I missed so much of the plot line.
the best part is when I ask her what happned she tells me to shut up.
:-)
/lets kill kofi
this reminds me of all the times i've fallen asleep watching a movie and waking up tring to figure out what the hell is happening because I missed so much of the plot line.
the best part is when I ask her what happned she tells me to shut up.
:-)
/lets kill kofi
Posted by: Rubin at August 12, 2006 01:36 AM (A5l/D)
3
We knew what to expect from the UN, but Condi comes out of this looking like a complete idiot. Very disappointing.
Posted by: Pixy Misa at August 12, 2006 03:11 AM (dluiY)
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so....basically there's gonna be 15,000 UNdies not doing what the 5,000 UNdies weren't doing at the start of this whole thing?
Posted by: Ranba Ral at August 12, 2006 09:07 AM (444mS)
5
I've always wondered whether Bush et al are the stupidest idiots or the smartest geniuses, because their actions and policies are beyond comprehension, but here's a possible scenario: Nobody has any illusions as to the futility of going the UN peacekeeping route, or about the fact that the UN is not only useless to the cause of world peace, but that it is actually detrimental. With that in mind, this latest folly may be designed specifically for the purpose of illustrating that point. Everyone knows that UN peacekeepers not only will not use force to stop terrorism, but they will actually stand by and watch impartially as terrorists fire rockets into Israel, and may even aid the terrorists by various means as they have in other places, thus demonstrating the uselessness of the UN in the glare of the spotlight of islamic terrorism.
Or maybe Bush et al really are a bunch of idiots. I guess we'll see.
Or maybe Bush et al really are a bunch of idiots. I guess we'll see.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 12, 2006 09:18 AM (v3I+x)
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Guys, it takes two to tango. I doubt very much Israel is obligated to anything Hezbollah doesn't actually do. Given that Hezbollah will not accept this agreement, or if they do, they will not honor it, this is just one of those distinction-drawing actions that Bush loves so much.
It lets him look like he's pursuing peace, and forces Hezb and their puppeteers into a tight corner.
Meanwhile, Israel presses on until they hear from Hezbollah, uh, I mean Lebanon.
It lets him look like he's pursuing peace, and forces Hezb and their puppeteers into a tight corner.
Meanwhile, Israel presses on until they hear from Hezbollah, uh, I mean Lebanon.
Posted by: Allan at August 12, 2006 09:35 AM (39+B+)
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Allan, Hezbollah is not a party to, and thus is not bound by, any agreement between Israel and Lebanon. The fact that the UNSC won't even mention Hezbollah speaks volumes. The UN is the world's primary terrorist front organization.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 12, 2006 10:03 AM (v3I+x)
Posted by: Good Lt at August 12, 2006 10:21 AM (jWYAe)
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As usual, Maxie makes the valid points, namely that Hizb'Allah is not even mentioned, yet we know it to be the perpetuator of the conflict. The government of Lebanon is nothing, it doesn't even hold sway over most of its own territory. And the UN is worse than useless, as it supports these Islamic terrorists, and I believe that support is based on the premise that the West must be destroyed.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 12, 2006 10:33 AM (rUyw4)
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I think that we shouldn't rush to judgment here.
We all know that Israel and Hezbollah was just the war on the surface, and that the real player here was Iran. We also know that Iran used its proxy Hezbollah as a gambit to distract the world and especially the UN Secuity Council from focusing on its nuclear program. While the fighting has gone on, Iran pretty much succeeded in at least distracting the Security Council.
I suspect that our country and Israel agreed to this latest truce in order to set in motion their plan to take this conflict with Hezbollah off of the Security Council's plate. That way, the greater threat, i.e. Iran, can be dealt with without distractions. Especially with August 22 only ten days away.
Here's why that date is important:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/012399.php
We all know that Israel and Hezbollah was just the war on the surface, and that the real player here was Iran. We also know that Iran used its proxy Hezbollah as a gambit to distract the world and especially the UN Secuity Council from focusing on its nuclear program. While the fighting has gone on, Iran pretty much succeeded in at least distracting the Security Council.
I suspect that our country and Israel agreed to this latest truce in order to set in motion their plan to take this conflict with Hezbollah off of the Security Council's plate. That way, the greater threat, i.e. Iran, can be dealt with without distractions. Especially with August 22 only ten days away.
Here's why that date is important:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/012399.php
Posted by: Northern Cross at August 12, 2006 10:53 AM (7vz05)
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NC,
I hope to God that you're right.
But then again, why on earth do the democracies of the world even bother with the UN anymore at all?
I hope to God that you're right.
But then again, why on earth do the democracies of the world even bother with the UN anymore at all?
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 12, 2006 11:14 AM (Bp6wV)
12
Good point NC, but the best way to deal with the situation is to quit pussyfooting around and start an air and sea blockade on Iran while invading Syria in a pincer movement from the sea and Iraq. Once Syria is crushed, we could then invade Iran. Once the mullah's are destabilized, the Iranian people, who are as sick of the mullahs as we are, and who are ready for freedom, could be left to clean up.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 12, 2006 11:57 AM (v3I+x)
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And what about Assad and Madmanadinajerk.......? Condi should redsign and go back to her musical hobbies. Bush, wake up! Israel, wake up! We lost this one, thanks to you guys.
Posted by: n.a. palm at August 12, 2006 12:59 PM (JOsBs)
August 11, 2006
Green Helmet Guy launches new blog
Green Helmet Guy now has his own blog. And he be liking the photoshops:
Props to LGF.
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Looks like a trailer for " Village of the Damned "
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 11, 2006 11:45 AM (gLMre)
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Haywood loves the creativity. It's great to see you kids putting your toys to good use. I just hope the right people get to see it...
Posted by: haywood jablowmi at August 11, 2006 12:08 PM (VUmVc)
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This is too funny! Don't you love photoshop!
Posted by: The Boodge at August 11, 2006 02:04 PM (6AeQ4)
4
I would prefer a simple red dot.
Posted by: hondo at August 11, 2006 02:12 PM (XrexX)
Posted by: Oyster at August 11, 2006 02:44 PM (cc4fT)
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Stinking hilarious!
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 11, 2006 04:40 PM (D2g/j)
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Photoshop hell, this is the real thing. Right?
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 11, 2006 09:19 PM (rUyw4)
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Now that's too funny! You owe me a new monitor for the one I just sprayed iced tea on.
Posted by: Dadzilla at August 11, 2006 10:25 PM (QBjpv)
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Just call it the ACME BOMB ATTACTING MAGNET and the guy looks like THE LORD OF MISHAP and i wonder if he had better be careful it might arrract a A-Bomb
Posted by: sandpiper at August 13, 2006 08:22 PM (stdEd)
August 10, 2006
Qana II : Busted Wide Open
We already knew Green Helmet was an actor in the eh, 'blockbuster' production that was Qana II : Hezboogaloo. We conjectured that he might have even been the director. As this video makes abundantly clear, we were 100% right. Green Helmet sets up the shot, goes through a trial run, and then directs the camera as to how to set it up just right:
Previous Posts on Qana:
MSM on to Green Helmet Guy
"Compelling Stories"
Qana : WaPo Defends Hizb'Allah's Honor
JPost : Blogger's Questions on Qana Spur Inquiries
Green Helmet to 'Helm' Miniseries
Qana : Hizb'Allah Story Still Falling Apart
More from the Qana Flim-Flam Festival
Qana : Turning Warheads into Whine?
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BOOOYAH!
Disturbing images. He is obviously an insensitive person. He treats the body of a dead child as if it were a prop. But I guess for him it is.
Disturbing images. He is obviously an insensitive person. He treats the body of a dead child as if it were a prop. But I guess for him it is.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 10, 2006 12:13 PM (7teJ9)
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I live in Germany and I have to say that I am proud of the people here for seeing through this charade.
Kudos to the German press for having their reporters read blogs like the British blog that started it all (or was it LGF)?
Kudos to the German press for having their reporters read blogs like the British blog that started it all (or was it LGF)?
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 12:25 PM (859GW)
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Agreed. Kudos to the Germans so far.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 10, 2006 12:39 PM (8e/V4)
Posted by: hondo at August 10, 2006 12:53 PM (XrexX)
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 10, 2006 01:01 PM (8e/V4)
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Ein glucklich tag fur die Deutschvolk. (sorry, I couldn't figure out how to do an umlaut . . . I haven't done any german in about 18 years . . .)
Posted by: Ansar al-kufir at August 10, 2006 05:21 PM (+fSLY)
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I want to hear jd explain it.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 10, 2006 06:00 PM (v3I+x)
8
We gonna start doing this blog in German? Whoa - its been a few years - I'm gonna need some practice! I'm OK using first person - but after that I really start to stumble.
A glorious day for the German people????
A glorious day for the German people????
Posted by: hondo at August 10, 2006 07:48 PM (XrexX)
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I think it's hard to make a judgement on the dude's level of sensitivity, w/o knowing what it's like to handle dead children. I would expect a certain callousness to be developed after a time. Similar to how nurses seem cold and uncaring because they have to turn it all off to keep their sanity. Just my perspective struggling to be w/o sexism or racism 
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 10, 2006 09:21 PM (gLMre)
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Larry, given muslims' total lack of regard for the sanctity of life, how can we expect them to respect the dead? They are worse than animals, because animals don't know any better.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 10, 2006 11:37 PM (v3I+x)
August 09, 2006
Richard Engel on the "Compelling Stories"
We've been seeing a lot of manufactured news lately. Seems like even more than normal--or maybe we're just paying closer attention. At any rate, these comments by Richard Engel of NBC News shed some light on the motivations behind the media's made-up news:
There are very few people left in the villages now. The only people, when we went recently, and found were just young military-age men, most likely Hezbollah or Amal Party fighters. So it is difficult to continue to find compelling stories, but every day the conflict is changing.Tragic, isn't it? Here we have a perfectly-good war zone, but all the women and children have left! What the hell were they thinking? Don't they know there are deadlines to be met, Pulitzers to be sought and agendas to be pushed? Who's gonna shed a tear over a f#@&!ng crying terrorist? Who's gonna be "compelled" by that story? Who's getting a Pulitzer for that pic? ALMOST NOBODY, that's who. Media is a business. The western media have papers to sell, and that means they need "compelling stories". They need photos of HOMELESS OLD WOMEN and SCREAMING BLOODY BABIES, and they need them NOW.
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I can't believe someone hasn't created a PS macro to paste civilian casualties, childrens' toys, and korans into scenes of destruction.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 09, 2006 12:59 PM (v3I+x)
August 08, 2006
Fwench Do What They Do Best: Wimp Out
Cross-posted from The Dread Pundit Bluto
I know, a real dog-bites-man story. Is there anyone who didn't see this coming?
From Fox News:
UNITED NATIONS — The French-American alliance at the United Nations over a Mideast cease-fire agreement is crumbling, sources tell FOX News.Yeah, that'll work. The Lebanese army, which hasn't been capable of dealing with Hizballah for 25 years, and the UN, which hasn't been capable of dealing with anything, ever, will now be issued magic wands.The French U.N. delegation has joined with Arab nations and is now calling for a complete and immediate Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon as a condition of any cease-fire, the sources said.
In addition, the French have reportedly agreed with Arab demands that the Lebanese force be accompanied only by UNIFIL, with no international force to be deployed.
After World War II, I guess collaboration just comes naturally to the Fwench.
Guess I was too "optimistic" when I posted this the other day.
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>>>>The French U.N. delegation has joined with Arab nations and is now calling for a complete and immediate Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon as a condition of any cease-fire, the sources said.
The Israeli answer is NO. Now make me.
The Israeli answer is NO. Now make me.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 08, 2006 11:18 PM (8e/V4)
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now stand up, good. now raise your hands up, no higher up...no, higher! good.
now you are the french army!
Joe loosing is good news, really.
Arrrg! At least he will win in the election. Also this shows that the democratic base is too left to win in 08. If L-man had won tonight it would have shown a willingness of the base to moderate and thereby swing the middle electorate. so temp. bad news for joe, long term good for me!
Hey, come see my post on why we need chicks in massachusetts, ok?
http://amassachusettsrepublican.blogspot.com/
now you are the french army!
Joe loosing is good news, really.
Arrrg! At least he will win in the election. Also this shows that the democratic base is too left to win in 08. If L-man had won tonight it would have shown a willingness of the base to moderate and thereby swing the middle electorate. so temp. bad news for joe, long term good for me!
Hey, come see my post on why we need chicks in massachusetts, ok?
http://amassachusettsrepublican.blogspot.com/
Posted by: massachusetts republican at August 08, 2006 11:38 PM (TiKv7)
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cheese eating surrender monkeys!
Posted by: Rod Stanton at August 09, 2006 07:36 AM (K2OdL)
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LOL, I was surprised that the French offered, and even more surprised anyone took it seriously.
The French can act quickly and effectively when they see their own interests on the line and the politicians don't have a chance to put their oar in. Their offer regarding Palestine/Israel does not qualify.
The French can act quickly and effectively when they see their own interests on the line and the politicians don't have a chance to put their oar in. Their offer regarding Palestine/Israel does not qualify.
Posted by: Phillep at August 09, 2006 09:22 AM (JswvB)
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Somedude, calling somedude. The frogs are under attack.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 09, 2006 09:40 AM (q2ko6)
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I'm shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you, that the french would side with fascists; it's totally unprecedented!
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 09, 2006 09:57 AM (v3I+x)
7
The French are the most corrupt cowards in Europe. Who cares what they say? They will turn and run if you challenge them!Remember who were the big takers (besides Kofi and son) in the "Food fo Oil" scam!
Posted by: Jo macDougal at August 09, 2006 12:58 PM (2vpLj)
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In a perverse way, this is actually a good thing. Misha @ nicedoggie.net explains (better than I could) that this will mean that the UN resolution is now doomed to failure, or at least a few more weeks of yacking. If the resolution would have passed quickly, then Israel would have less time to take out the hizgarbage. Now they can do a more thorough job.
Not that France gives a rats ass about Israel.
Not that France gives a rats ass about Israel.
Posted by: HoundOfDoom at August 09, 2006 01:03 PM (66E5G)
Posted by: Bill Faith at August 09, 2006 03:22 PM (n7SaI)
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The UN has done very well in Sierra Leone, the DRC, and Kosovo. France did technically win WWI, even though it was with British help (It's called an alliance). France just doesn't want to go to war. Are we calling Fiji a bunch of cowards for not going into Iraq? No. They've never won a war and lost to the big European powers when they came to colonize. France is mad cool. Look at their soccer team and the league. They've given the NBA some nice players like Tony Parker and Boris Diaw. They have pretty good music. They helped the US out before a bunch of times. Hell, we wouldn't be 50 states if they didn't sell us all of that land in the Louisiana Purchase. They left Lebanon after us. Kicked a lot of Kraut @$$ in WWII. And they were one of the first democratic nations in Europe. But the Dutch are cooler.
Posted by: Some Dude at August 11, 2006 10:01 PM (Iq9PC)
August 07, 2006
Crazy weather?
One day, one place, one old man, one photographer...
more...
...and yet...
[SEE BELOW]
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If I was Lesbianese, I probably would not be kissing a picture of some guy, even if he is all beard.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 07:36 PM (+nlyI)
Posted by: Rsluty at August 07, 2006 07:41 PM (x+8Rs)
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All his pictures of Nasrallah are all stuck together.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 07:42 PM (+nlyI)
4
In one picture he says Nasrallah is no. 1, and in the other he says Nasrallah is number two? Obviously he can't be both.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 07, 2006 07:54 PM (8e/V4)
5
JC---Bwahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Posted by: Rsluty at August 07, 2006 07:56 PM (x+8Rs)
6
Have you seen these videos? Bomb-cam films showing Hezbollah mobile rockets launchers staged, even firing from within built up areas in Beruit. A bunch more in the "More Videos" box next to it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZ8fSkSMhjw&mode=related&search=
Do people not understand that Israeli has one of the most accomplished and technically advanced Air Forces in the World? Do they really think that a UAV can’t track a missile leaving a launcher using FLIR and real-time video? Or that the IDF might have a bird or two on station overhead with 1,000 pounders under each wing, waiting for a target to show itself?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZ8fSkSMhjw&mode=related&search=
Do people not understand that Israeli has one of the most accomplished and technically advanced Air Forces in the World? Do they really think that a UAV can’t track a missile leaving a launcher using FLIR and real-time video? Or that the IDF might have a bird or two on station overhead with 1,000 pounders under each wing, waiting for a target to show itself?
Posted by: TBOB at August 07, 2006 07:59 PM (uAPGI)
7
Okay, so Johnson kind of made a name for himself with the smoke over Beirut photos. You're kind of pushing it, though. These are just silly.
Posted by: Len at August 07, 2006 08:03 PM (qBSry)
8
Len is JEALOUS!
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 08:06 PM (+nlyI)
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 07, 2006 08:06 PM (8e/V4)
Posted by: Len at August 07, 2006 08:09 PM (qBSry)
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 08:49 PM (+nlyI)
12
Len, I believe the point is that the sky, in two photos, is cloudy or smoke-filled. In the third, it's clear. In all three pics, it's the same guy -- same clothes, same pic of Nasrallah.
Was the sky clear or foggy/smoky?
Were the pics taken at the same place? The two with the smoky sky were clearly at the same place; the one with the clear sky appears to be at a different location.
If the pics were taken on different days, or in different locations on the same day, how did the photographer manage to get pics of the same person, doing the same thing, in multiple places or times?
And, no, the point hasn't been made. Until the freaking press owns up to the fact that their habit of hiring terrorist agents to gather "news" turns them into terr propaganda channels, then turning up these little "coincidences" is necessary. The extent of the problem has to be exposed.
Was the sky clear or foggy/smoky?
Were the pics taken at the same place? The two with the smoky sky were clearly at the same place; the one with the clear sky appears to be at a different location.
If the pics were taken on different days, or in different locations on the same day, how did the photographer manage to get pics of the same person, doing the same thing, in multiple places or times?
And, no, the point hasn't been made. Until the freaking press owns up to the fact that their habit of hiring terrorist agents to gather "news" turns them into terr propaganda channels, then turning up these little "coincidences" is necessary. The extent of the problem has to be exposed.
Posted by: Robert Crawford at August 07, 2006 08:49 PM (bH9q3)
13
The MSM, and the rest of the world will do, and say anything to make Israel look bad. Those Jewish folks are really hated for some reason across the world.
Friday, I am sending 50 bucks to One Family to help support Jews who have been harmed by terror. I am doing it because I think the world is screwed up in the head, and I want to support who they hate.
Friday, I am sending 50 bucks to One Family to help support Jews who have been harmed by terror. I am doing it because I think the world is screwed up in the head, and I want to support who they hate.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 07, 2006 08:59 PM (D2g/j)
14
I dunno.....looks to me like maybe the smoke is being carried by the wind in one direction, and the photog got a picture in the other direction.....
Posted by: Rsluty at August 07, 2006 08:59 PM (x+8Rs)
15
PS-But it is still clearly staged. This is one of thoe Hezbollah tours that they take the journalists on. This guy is probably giving the V sign to a crowd of photogs, not just a dude.
Posted by: Rsluty at August 07, 2006 09:05 PM (x+8Rs)
16
So it doesn't seem strange to you, Len, that the sky went from clear and blue in one pic to impenetrably dark and smoky in another pic taken at the same place at approximately the same time on the same day? I've never seen the sky go from bright clear blue to dark grey that quickly. That's just my personal experience.
Now, maybe the pictures reflect exactly what happened on that day. On the other hand, maybe the photographer decided that a blue sky just wasn't "dramatic" enough for war photos and decided to enhance them with a heavy "touch of grey."
Do I have proof that the grey sky was a photoshop effect? No. Even if I had the time to travel to Reuters HQ to investigate, I doubt they'd grant me unfettered access to their files. Does that mean I'm somehow forever precluded from questioning the veracity of a Reuters stringer photo unless and until I can prove it isn't legit? Thankfully, no.
I'm not asserting that any of these photos is bogus. I have no way of knowing one way or the other. I am suggesting that, taken as a group, these photos look fishy. Nothing more, nothing less.
Now, maybe the pictures reflect exactly what happened on that day. On the other hand, maybe the photographer decided that a blue sky just wasn't "dramatic" enough for war photos and decided to enhance them with a heavy "touch of grey."
Do I have proof that the grey sky was a photoshop effect? No. Even if I had the time to travel to Reuters HQ to investigate, I doubt they'd grant me unfettered access to their files. Does that mean I'm somehow forever precluded from questioning the veracity of a Reuters stringer photo unless and until I can prove it isn't legit? Thankfully, no.
I'm not asserting that any of these photos is bogus. I have no way of knowing one way or the other. I am suggesting that, taken as a group, these photos look fishy. Nothing more, nothing less.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 07, 2006 09:09 PM (c/4ax)
17
By the way, if you look closely in the background, the same buildings are present in each of the first two pictures--reference the "scallopy" building on the far right, the "eggcrate" building just left of it and the shallow "hangar" building in the middle, which is visible in the first pic only by its right front upper corner (disposed to the right of the old man's head.) All three of these can be seen in the first two pics. A portion of the "hangar" is also faintly visible in the third pic, just above the old man's head.
In other words, the three pictures were taken along the same line of sight in the same vicinity.
In other words, the three pictures were taken along the same line of sight in the same vicinity.
Posted by: All-Seeing Eye at August 07, 2006 09:23 PM (c/4ax)
18
Darth:
First I'm jealous. Then I'm a member of Hizb'Allah.
Thanks for the laughs, my friend, and for the evening's entertainment. It has been fun.
Take care... don't let the evildoers getcha!
First I'm jealous. Then I'm a member of Hizb'Allah.
Thanks for the laughs, my friend, and for the evening's entertainment. It has been fun.
Take care... don't let the evildoers getcha!
Posted by: Len at August 07, 2006 09:42 PM (qBSry)
19
FYI - I've changed up the post to better illustrate the above points. I removed the third pic, since the point was made just fine with the first two and they show the issue most clearly.
Posted by: All-Seeing Eye at August 07, 2006 10:06 PM (c/4ax)
20
The shadows on the old dude don't line up with the ones cast by the buildings.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 07, 2006 10:07 PM (n4VvM)
21
Although this won't explain the smoke . . .Over at LGF there is a comment explaining the use of differet camera lenses yielding different perspectives of the same location.
These photos do appear to be staged.
Perhaps a file called "Hajj's Central casting" can be opened to track how many photos can be credited to Reuters/Hezbos/Hajj's star performers . .. i.e. green helmet guy, white t-shirt guy, most unfortunate Lebanese madame landlord, the above Hezbo groupie etc.
These photos do appear to be staged.
Perhaps a file called "Hajj's Central casting" can be opened to track how many photos can be credited to Reuters/Hezbos/Hajj's star performers . .. i.e. green helmet guy, white t-shirt guy, most unfortunate Lebanese madame landlord, the above Hezbo groupie etc.
Posted by: heroyalwhyness at August 07, 2006 11:03 PM (MAPKL)
22
link to discussion by Seerak regarding camera lenses -
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=21982#c0078
Regarding your recent post "A Bridge Too Weird", I think you've gotten a bit caught up with the storm over Adnan Hajj's duplicity. With one exception, your inferences are quite far from what the image evidence shows.
For brevity, I'll refer to the images by sequence, #1, 2, 3, 4 and 5.
My qualifications: over 12 years in the visual FX industry, and 19 years of experience in photography.
Regarding shot #5, there is no doubt that is a different bridge; the lack of rebar is the big giveaway.
But the others are all consistent with being shot around the same time and place. The wrecked car isn't moving at all; Hajj is switching lenses, using both very long telephoto lenses and wideangles (probably 20mm wide and a 300mm telephoto, assuming standard 35mm framesize... that means film or either of the full-frame digital cameras, Canon 1Ds mark II or a Canon 5D. I happen to own the latter).
Shot 1,3 and 4 were all shot wide, probably around 20mm. The characteristic distortion of the tower roof in #4 demonstrates this. Shot #2, however, was shot with a long telephoto, probably around 300mm; this shot shows a lot of telephoto compression (i.e. the background details are all a lot bigger in frame, even though the subject remains about the same size). The smashed bridge is indeed in that shot, but it's barely visible because of this flattening effect; all we can see of it is the rebar "fur", behind the three red-and-white posts. The rebar shows that the bridge is NOT open in shot #2.
In shot #2, the car is sitting at precisely the same angle (relative to the ground) as shot #4, even the lighting on the dented corner of the car's door (to camera right of hole #1) that we see is *precisely* the same. That shows that the car *did not move* between those two shots; there is no way anybody can manipulate a 3000-pound car that precisely and that quickly. It also shows that they were shot very close together in time, as the sun hasn't moved enough to alter the highlight.
Shot #4 thereby shows how much room there is between the bridge and wrecked car. That leaves leaves lots of space for Hajj to shoot #3 without the car in it.
***
Geeez, it's late (12:11 am) here - I'm watching Fox News and it appears that Jennifer Griffin just interviewed a witness in Lebanon . . .the witness has a remarkable resemblance to the ever famous incompetent photoshop photographer, Hajj Ali.
Shaking head and going to bed.
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=21982#c0078
Regarding your recent post "A Bridge Too Weird", I think you've gotten a bit caught up with the storm over Adnan Hajj's duplicity. With one exception, your inferences are quite far from what the image evidence shows.
For brevity, I'll refer to the images by sequence, #1, 2, 3, 4 and 5.
My qualifications: over 12 years in the visual FX industry, and 19 years of experience in photography.
Regarding shot #5, there is no doubt that is a different bridge; the lack of rebar is the big giveaway.
But the others are all consistent with being shot around the same time and place. The wrecked car isn't moving at all; Hajj is switching lenses, using both very long telephoto lenses and wideangles (probably 20mm wide and a 300mm telephoto, assuming standard 35mm framesize... that means film or either of the full-frame digital cameras, Canon 1Ds mark II or a Canon 5D. I happen to own the latter).
Shot 1,3 and 4 were all shot wide, probably around 20mm. The characteristic distortion of the tower roof in #4 demonstrates this. Shot #2, however, was shot with a long telephoto, probably around 300mm; this shot shows a lot of telephoto compression (i.e. the background details are all a lot bigger in frame, even though the subject remains about the same size). The smashed bridge is indeed in that shot, but it's barely visible because of this flattening effect; all we can see of it is the rebar "fur", behind the three red-and-white posts. The rebar shows that the bridge is NOT open in shot #2.
In shot #2, the car is sitting at precisely the same angle (relative to the ground) as shot #4, even the lighting on the dented corner of the car's door (to camera right of hole #1) that we see is *precisely* the same. That shows that the car *did not move* between those two shots; there is no way anybody can manipulate a 3000-pound car that precisely and that quickly. It also shows that they were shot very close together in time, as the sun hasn't moved enough to alter the highlight.
Shot #4 thereby shows how much room there is between the bridge and wrecked car. That leaves leaves lots of space for Hajj to shoot #3 without the car in it.
***
Geeez, it's late (12:11 am) here - I'm watching Fox News and it appears that Jennifer Griffin just interviewed a witness in Lebanon . . .the witness has a remarkable resemblance to the ever famous incompetent photoshop photographer, Hajj Ali.
Shaking head and going to bed.
Posted by: heroyalwhyness at August 07, 2006 11:15 PM (MAPKL)
23
The thing is, the background seems to be real. Somewhat that fellow is out of place. If you look carefully, in one picture you see him from the side and in the other from the front. That is strange!
Posted by: Dan at August 08, 2006 09:56 AM (Z2OsI)
24
I don't think there has to be anything wrong with the buildings. The photo is just taken from different plase using different focal lenght. If you compare the visual sizes of the wide building in the middle and the one at background, you see that in first image the wide building is taller than in the second, where the background building is much taller. This is not Photoshop, but different focal lenght. An example can be found from this site: http://www.kevinwilley.com/l3_topic04.htm
As the focal lenght changes, the guy at the foreground has to move away from the buildings for few dozen meters with the photographer. This makes them to move at the front side of the collapsed building. The smoke is not blown backwards, so it is not visible in the first shoot.
Of course it can be photoshopped, but why should they in this case? There surely are lots of smoking rubble at the area and willing people to pose. Why bother PS:ing when you can just take local supporter and give him a photo?
As the focal lenght changes, the guy at the foreground has to move away from the buildings for few dozen meters with the photographer. This makes them to move at the front side of the collapsed building. The smoke is not blown backwards, so it is not visible in the first shoot.
Of course it can be photoshopped, but why should they in this case? There surely are lots of smoking rubble at the area and willing people to pose. Why bother PS:ing when you can just take local supporter and give him a photo?
Posted by: PK at August 08, 2006 07:31 PM (LmrGQ)
25
it will be nice if you kiss my lebaneese ass
Posted by: fadi at August 09, 2006 05:44 AM (kTTRK)
26
The second picture (with the smoke) looks to me like it was shot from the same angle and orientation as the first, only the photographer backed up about fifty yards, and the subect also came forward (from his perspective) fifty yards. Note the shadow of the building just to the right of the subject in the first picture. The same shadow can be seen in the second picture, only it is much less distinct because the smoke blurs it, and it is now about fifty yards further into the background. The photographer just had the suject come forward about fifty yards for the second photo.
Posted by: Larry at August 09, 2006 08:03 AM (UJUGT)
27
What stands out to me is this: in the second photo, the Nasrallah pic has no perspective, like it's 2-dimensional. It's bright, high contrast, but has no cast shadow on it. The man has some pretty dark cast shadows, which should have been softened by the light filtering through dust in the air. You can see in the first photo that the Nasrallah picture was curling, which would cause it to cast a shadow on itself.
Also look at the shadow under his raised arm -- in both photos it's in the same position (under his arm). So unless these photos were taken many hours apart to give the suna chance to move, the same buildings should be behind him.
My analysis: photocomposite. The huge dusty building on the left was added, and the curling, shadow-obscured picture of Nasrallah was replaced with a flat one in Photoshop.
Much less clumsy than Hajj's though -- this one probably used layer masks.
Also look at the shadow under his raised arm -- in both photos it's in the same position (under his arm). So unless these photos were taken many hours apart to give the suna chance to move, the same buildings should be behind him.
My analysis: photocomposite. The huge dusty building on the left was added, and the curling, shadow-obscured picture of Nasrallah was replaced with a flat one in Photoshop.
Much less clumsy than Hajj's though -- this one probably used layer masks.
Posted by: rosh at August 09, 2006 08:30 AM (qgJ8b)
28
I'm gonna retract what I said about the building being photoshopped in. The sun in both photos is high and in the direction he's pointing, so it's possible the building was in front and to the left in the first photo without casting a shadow. The sun is in the same place, so no time passed except what it took for the subject to walk forward. But the flatness of the Nasrallah picture in the second is really really fake looking. His picture was curling, and looks like it was "fixed" in Photoshop in the second one.
Posted by: rosh at August 09, 2006 08:51 AM (qgJ8b)
Hezbollah Supplied With Russian RPGs
In a report today from MOSNEWS.com:
The majority of the Israeli Defense Force's ground-troop casualties, both infantry and armored, were the result of Russian-made anti-tank units of Hezbollah, according to intelligence sources quoted by Haaretz daily.Naturally, the Russians are in denial.The same sources note that these units have not retreated from southern Lebanon following the deployment of large Israeli ground forces in the area.
The Hezbollah anti-tank teams use a new and particularly potent version of the Russian-made RPG, the RPG-29 that was sold by Moscow to the Syrians and then transferred to the Shi'ite organization.
At first Israeli inquiries that Russia was transferring modern anti-tank weapons to Syria and on to Hezbollah were received with anger. The Russians demanded proof that this had been done.So, the Russians can't identify their equipment without a serial number. What a bunch of hooey!Contrary to common practice, Israel transferred to Russia the tail-end of a rocket for analysis. The Russian response was that in the absence of a serial number it was difficult to identify it as part of a load delivered to Syria.
Notably, in a later report and contrary to the above, Russia flatly denies supplying arms to the Middle East.
Russia has not supplied modern anti-tank armaments to the Middle East, so Hezbollah militants cannot possibly be in possession of them, Deputy President of the Academy of Geopolitical Problems Col. Gen. Leonid Ivashov told Interfax-AVN.Ivashov's assertion is based on the belief that there would be many more casualties if Russian weapons were used. Pretty arrogant, I'd say.
Frankly, I believe that the Russians just haven't had a chance to formulate a consistent story. Even so, one can't help but sense that they're hip deep in culpability.
Companion post at Interested-Participant.
Posted by: Mike Pechar at
05:43 PM
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Post contains 294 words, total size 2 kb.
1
"Frankly, I believe that the Russians just haven't had a chance to formulate a consistent story. Even so, one can't help but sense that they're hip deep in culpability."
Indeed, a consistent story is exceedingly important when dealing with RPGs.
Indeed, a consistent story is exceedingly important when dealing with RPGs.
Posted by: George guy at August 07, 2006 06:06 PM (QkOQC)
2
MP,
It's complete bull for Russians to deny selling advanced weaponary to the middle east. They've always been the main supplier in the region. They've sold Eshkaval (spelling?) torpedoes as well as their most modern SAM airdefence systems to the Islamic Republic ruling Iran. Not to mention selling nuclear technology to the Mullahs.
It's complete bull for Russians to deny selling advanced weaponary to the middle east. They've always been the main supplier in the region. They've sold Eshkaval (spelling?) torpedoes as well as their most modern SAM airdefence systems to the Islamic Republic ruling Iran. Not to mention selling nuclear technology to the Mullahs.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 07, 2006 06:22 PM (Bp6wV)
3
The Russians sell to Iran who sell to everyone else. Everybody knows that.
Posted by: Jester at August 07, 2006 07:26 PM (TuAMG)
4
Of course he's right. They supplied them to Iran, who in turn supplied them to Syria, who supplied them the Hezb'allah. Iran is really Persia and so it's not "really" part of the Middle East . . . right?
Posted by: ansar al-kufir at August 08, 2006 04:07 AM (+fSLY)
5
Russia is selling arms to the 'slamoturds as part of an agreement to keep the jihadis off their backs. In other words, Putin doesn't have the balls to kill the terrorists who did the Beslan or Nord Ost operations, and instead made a deal with Iran to call off the dogs in return for arms. Putin is just another anti-American political whore who will trade arms for dead children.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 08, 2006 09:45 AM (v3I+x)
6
"the Russian response was that in the absence of a serial number it was difficult to identify it AS PART OF A LOAD DELIVERED TO SYRIA"
So they are admitting that they do ship these to Syria. No surprise there, they've been supplying the entire third world with their weapons for what 50-60 years.
Typical Russian response though, lie first, then try to come up with a plausible excuse.
So they are admitting that they do ship these to Syria. No surprise there, they've been supplying the entire third world with their weapons for what 50-60 years.
Typical Russian response though, lie first, then try to come up with a plausible excuse.
Posted by: memphis761 at August 08, 2006 01:48 PM (D3+20)
7
And why not memphis? We've let them get away with it for all these years, no need to stop now.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 08, 2006 02:28 PM (v3I+x)
8
Hummmm: Typical goodie Lt. responce. Lie first, then try to come up with a plasible excuse.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 08, 2006 05:53 PM (BQiRv)
9
Heh, the US supplies detonators to Pakistan, which are used in the infamous 1993 Mumabi bomb blasts- India's 9/11..but thats ok. US donates goodies to Pakistan, which allow it to believe that its conventionally secure and wage war against India...thats ok. The US supplies thousands of ATGMs to assorted ME regimes, including the Saudis and Egyptians, thats ok. It arms Israel to the teeth- thats ok. But hey, if a struggling Russian arms industry sells a few thousand ATGMs to Syria and Iran- Allah uh Akbar, these culpable heathens should be punished!
I mean seriously, are you in denial or something? Look around- the US is arming the worlds worst dictatorships, and you guys are beating up on the Russians..
I mean seriously, are you in denial or something? Look around- the US is arming the worlds worst dictatorships, and you guys are beating up on the Russians..
Posted by: Jimbo at August 10, 2006 01:27 AM (wqJBS)
10
Yes, Jimbo, it's all us... and the JOOOOOOooooooozzzz!!!
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 11, 2006 11:13 AM (v3I+x)
Mysterious "Tourist Guy" Spotted in Beirut?
The elusive and mysterious "Tourist Guy", last seen atop the World Trade Center was recently spotted in Lebanon by a Reuters stringer:
Or was he?
UPDATE RS: The "original" undoctored Reuters photos being found everywhere. Check some of them out below.
UPDATE ASE: More pics by Reuters photographer Adnan Hajj here. more...
Posted by: Ragnar at
03:01 PM
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Oh yeah, you see, this is the same Bush/CIA operative that planted the bombs to make the towers fall.
Posted by: demdum at August 07, 2006 03:33 PM (YmQg9)
2
Ironically, you did a much better job editing the photo than he did.
Posted by: hdw at August 07, 2006 03:50 PM (PhqeV)
3
Haywood loves it!
That's probably where they got the idea.
I understand Wilson from Castaway can also be found among the survivors.
Don't stop
till they all drop
That's probably where they got the idea.
I understand Wilson from Castaway can also be found among the survivors.
Don't stop
till they all drop
Posted by: haywood jablowmi at August 07, 2006 04:12 PM (VUmVc)
4
Sigh... Some things just never get old.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 07, 2006 04:23 PM (v3I+x)
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 07, 2006 04:30 PM (c/4ax)
6
Oh man, that brings back memories. Unfortunately, the 9/11 conspiracy nuts are still out there, even being given jobs at the University of Wisconsin at Madison.
Posted by: joeschmo1of3 at August 07, 2006 04:43 PM (lfbf9)
7
I really wish that people would quit erasing Greyrooster's comments. For two years I've enjoyed the spice he adds to the program. He is honest. Your or I agreeing with him has nothing to do with his adding commentary.
Disagree with him if you must, but holding a one way conversation just isn't fair play.
I suspect he has more fans on this blog than this Good Lt character who just recently came out of the woods.
Disagree with him if you must, but holding a one way conversation just isn't fair play.
I suspect he has more fans on this blog than this Good Lt character who just recently came out of the woods.
Posted by: curdog at August 07, 2006 05:26 PM (NbWo9)
8
Where's Waldo? /deleteguard/active bullshit/filter + 7
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 07, 2006 07:49 PM (gLMre)
9
Funny how Rooster's comments are getting deleted, but not the lefturds'...
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 07, 2006 10:21 PM (v3I+x)
Reuters : Don't DARE Question Their Veracity
The MSM is all offended that we, mere bloggers, would dare question the veracity of the professionally-produced images coming from Lebanon. How terribly cheeky of us! What could we know, after all, about what's going on in Lebanon? How could we possibly evaluate the quality of the reporting in Lebanon from the air-conditioned comfort of our offices? It's tough, to be sure, but I imagine we'll keep it up. After all, I'm sure we all remember these recent classics, all of which were either staged or photoshopped events:
This didn't really happen (photoshop)...
Condi's not really a zombie (photoshop)...
[MORE BELOW]
Posted by: Ragnar at
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"What could we know, after all, about what's going on in Lebanon?"
We migth not know much about what's happening in Lebanon; but we sure as hell have figured out how it's being reported! Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
We migth not know much about what's happening in Lebanon; but we sure as hell have figured out how it's being reported! Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 07, 2006 12:26 AM (Bp6wV)
2
I think they were trying to make Condi look like a Goa'uld, not a zombie.
(...though it's possible she's Tok'ra.)
(...though it's possible she's Tok'ra.)
Posted by: Patrick Chester at August 07, 2006 05:59 AM (MKaa5)
3
What diference would it make. If you liberal bastard posters didn't like it you would delete the truth anyway. Same as Al-Jazeera. You're no better than they.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 07, 2006 09:12 AM (NbWo9)
4
Unfortunately these aren't isolated incidents. It's been going on for years now. There's a reason why folks have lost trust in the MSM. It's not just in our heads.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 07, 2006 11:15 AM (8e/V4)
5
A friend said she had stopped watching TV news so I asked why. The answer - "I'm sick of being lied to."
Posted by: yankeewombat at August 07, 2006 11:38 AM (mi/h7)
6
At this point there is sufficient evidence to draw a reasonable inference that ALL Reuters Mideast photos are touched and/or doctored in some fashion. The burden of proof has shifted. If it's Reuters, I assume it is fake unless shown decisively otherwise.
The job now is to prove it to Wall Street.
The job now is to prove it to Wall Street.
Posted by: Careful Reader at August 07, 2006 12:19 PM (sVRPf)
7
Yeah, that's logical Careful Reader. Keep living in that pretend world.
How is Reuter's fixing the problem a bad thing?
I don't understand this.
I understand how this can be extrapolated into a "very bad thing" damning of all things journalistic. But only if you fall for that either / or garbage. Either Reuters is a group of biased terrorist sympathizers OR they are an unbiased organization who agrees with us.
I don't have time for people who think this way. It's not the world.
I'm not buying it.
I'm smarter than that.
So are most people. Many just like to play dumb.
And I'm thrilled an unethical little maggot of a photographer got canned. All his photos were ripped from the Reuters library. What more could you want?
How is Reuter's fixing the problem a bad thing?
I don't understand this.
I understand how this can be extrapolated into a "very bad thing" damning of all things journalistic. But only if you fall for that either / or garbage. Either Reuters is a group of biased terrorist sympathizers OR they are an unbiased organization who agrees with us.
I don't have time for people who think this way. It's not the world.
I'm not buying it.
I'm smarter than that.
So are most people. Many just like to play dumb.
And I'm thrilled an unethical little maggot of a photographer got canned. All his photos were ripped from the Reuters library. What more could you want?
Posted by: Temple Stark at August 07, 2006 01:25 PM (to9f3)
8
Pardon my ignorance :-/
I'm familiar with most of these pictures, but what was "the rape that wasn't" and what was the top picture supposed to be of as well?
I'm familiar with most of these pictures, but what was "the rape that wasn't" and what was the top picture supposed to be of as well?
Posted by: Lynn at August 07, 2006 01:53 PM (uyYKF)
9
"The rape that wasn't" is easily the most hilarious of these fake evidence examples. The pics were stills from a porno film that some monumental retards in Boston presented as evidence of US soldiers raping Iraqi women. I believe The Boston Globe reported the whole story as fact.
The first photo was a fake from early in the Afghan campaign, if I remember correctly.
The first photo was a fake from early in the Afghan campaign, if I remember correctly.
Posted by: Neal at August 07, 2006 02:11 PM (zLPMP)
10
> What more could you want?
The editor who hired the maggot getting fired.
The editor who ran the picture getting fired.
All stringers getting very severe warnings.
A lawsuit against the maggot in question.
I would be a lot less annoyed if the errors were *random* but mysteriously, every one of these mistakes somehow, somehow went *against* US and Israeli interests. It's like being short-changed. Sure, maybe it's an honest mistake, but eventually you start to notice that the clerk is always favoring himself.
> "the rape that wasn't"
Some political group in Boston was peddling commercially produced porn, claiming it was documentary evidence of rapes of Iraqi (or perhaps Afghani, they weren't clear) women by US troops. The Boston Globe got so excited that they printed hard-core photos on their front page.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38481
The editor who hired the maggot getting fired.
The editor who ran the picture getting fired.
All stringers getting very severe warnings.
A lawsuit against the maggot in question.
I would be a lot less annoyed if the errors were *random* but mysteriously, every one of these mistakes somehow, somehow went *against* US and Israeli interests. It's like being short-changed. Sure, maybe it's an honest mistake, but eventually you start to notice that the clerk is always favoring himself.
> "the rape that wasn't"
Some political group in Boston was peddling commercially produced porn, claiming it was documentary evidence of rapes of Iraqi (or perhaps Afghani, they weren't clear) women by US troops. The Boston Globe got so excited that they printed hard-core photos on their front page.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38481
Posted by: Malvolio at August 07, 2006 02:11 PM (meNGN)
11
Don't forget the cover of TV Guide showing Oprah in a beautiful gown, weighing about 30 pounds under her then-weight. Someone had pasted her head on top of a decades-old photo of Ann-Margret.
Posted by: Jay at August 07, 2006 02:50 PM (zo/+l)
12
All,
Once upon a time the press held the gov't to account. Since then, no one has held the press to account until blogs came around. Thank *Insert the God/Gods of your Choice here* for Blogs.
Pete
Once upon a time the press held the gov't to account. Since then, no one has held the press to account until blogs came around. Thank *Insert the God/Gods of your Choice here* for Blogs.
Pete
Posted by: Pete at August 07, 2006 03:26 PM (Zql5R)
13
Keeping with the StarGate analogy:
Condi is a Goa'uld.
Rove is a Wraith
Cindy Sheehan is an Ori
Well, at least the last one doesn't require Photoshop!
Condi is a Goa'uld.
Rove is a Wraith
Cindy Sheehan is an Ori
Well, at least the last one doesn't require Photoshop!
Posted by: old_dawg at August 07, 2006 03:45 PM (7nc0l)
Posted by: Psycmeistr at August 07, 2006 03:49 PM (kpWUF)
15
I linked from Old War Dogs >> Reutergate 5 -- And the beatdown goes on.
Tomorrow when the world finds out Hajj and Green Helmet Dude have been
sleeping together for years, remember you heard it from me first so I can
be on Drudge Radio and CNN.
Posted by: Bill Faith at August 07, 2006 04:29 PM (n7SaI)
16
This is the only reference I can find to this photo at the moment,
http://brutus1964.blogspot.com/2006/03/reuters-runs-cheney-retire-photo.html
but I know other websites had this one, plus a long shot that did NOT have "retire" over Cheney's head.
http://brutus1964.blogspot.com/2006/03/reuters-runs-cheney-retire-photo.html
but I know other websites had this one, plus a long shot that did NOT have "retire" over Cheney's head.
Posted by: iamfelix at August 07, 2006 04:31 PM (MBuLb)
17
This is the only reference I can find to this photo at the moment,
http://brutus1964.blogspot.com/2006/03/reuters-runs-cheney-retire-photo.html
but I know other websites had this one, plus a long shot that did NOT have "retire" over Cheney's head.
http://brutus1964.blogspot.com/2006/03/reuters-runs-cheney-retire-photo.html
but I know other websites had this one, plus a long shot that did NOT have "retire" over Cheney's head.
Posted by: iamfelix at August 07, 2006 04:32 PM (MBuLb)
18
The top photo was a picture of a U.S. soldier superimposed on a group of Iraqi refugees. The original pic showed a soldier just standing there. The revised pic shows him pointing a rifle at one group of Iraqis and making dominant hand gestures toward the man holding the child. If I recall correctly, I think they also made the soldier bigger.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 07, 2006 04:39 PM (c/4ax)
19
Sorry about the double post above - I have dialup, and it's very slow and balky today. Here's a reference with a long shot:
http://www.rightwinged.com/2006/03/followup_reuters_cheney_photo.html
http://www.rightwinged.com/2006/03/followup_reuters_cheney_photo.html
Posted by: iamfelix at August 07, 2006 04:43 PM (MBuLb)
20
Temple Stark: evidently you're not as smart as you seem to think. In law there's this idea called "false in one, false in all." That is, once a witness has committed one lie (and been caught out) then the jurors may disbelieve all their other testimony.
Reuters has shown itself not just to be "false in one" but false repeatedly, in the same direction. Which part of this don't you understand? It is no longer our job to sort out the lies by Reuters from the truth, it's their damn job to regain our trust.
I figure you must be so smart that you're still sending your banking info to people in Nigeria who are going to share milllions of dollars with you. After all, ALL those emails can't be false, can they?
Reuters has shown itself not just to be "false in one" but false repeatedly, in the same direction. Which part of this don't you understand? It is no longer our job to sort out the lies by Reuters from the truth, it's their damn job to regain our trust.
I figure you must be so smart that you're still sending your banking info to people in Nigeria who are going to share milllions of dollars with you. After all, ALL those emails can't be false, can they?
Posted by: JorgXMckie at August 07, 2006 06:31 PM (f02nH)
21
What about that photo of a protester, where the guy in the background held a sign that was offensive so it was photoshopped out?
Posted by: Amphipolis at August 07, 2006 08:03 PM (mB/jw)
22
I don't know, Congoleeza looks pretty much how I would expect her to look after dealing with those morons over there in lala land!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 08, 2006 01:50 AM (gLMre)
23
I'm stunned that more people aren't bright enough to know that the liberal media has an agenda to snow the American people. Once again, it's all about trying to resume their position of power, regardless of whom it may harm. The liberal media has far more responsibility in deaths of our soldiers and innocent bystanders of these conflicts than anyone is willing to admit. If we had the same liberal slant in the "news" back in the 40's we would probably all be speaking a different language today.
Posted by: Randy Mitchell at August 09, 2006 04:41 PM (1lNcy)
August 05, 2006
As if We Needed Any More Reasons to Love Israel...
More IDF hotties, courtesy of israelmilitary.net:
Two chicks on the beach. A kite. Beer. An assault rifle.
Don't you tell me there's no beauty in this world...
[MORE PICS BELOW THE FOLD]
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1
Where can I join the IDF??
Posted by: Richard H. at August 05, 2006 12:46 AM (7KF8r)
2
If you want to join the IDF you have to be Jewish or married to one!
Posted by: Dan at August 05, 2006 01:41 AM (Z2OsI)
3
...or a citizen of Israel. They also let non-Jewish, non-citizens join, but only in certain units.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 05, 2006 08:14 AM (v3I+x)
4
My great grandmother was jewish. Does that count?
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 05, 2006 10:06 AM (8e/V4)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 05, 2006 11:11 AM (Bp6wV)
6
Wow. Just...wow.
Posted by: david at August 05, 2006 11:51 AM (9tauC)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 05, 2006 02:05 PM (Bp6wV)
Posted by: Paul Moore at August 05, 2006 02:14 PM (0iltp)
9
You horn dogs put your peckers back in!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 05, 2006 03:42 PM (gLMre)
10
About 10 years ago, I lived in Egypt and regularly visited Israel...I'll never forget walking around Carmel Market in Tel Aviv one day, and bumping into an absolutely gorgeous girl, dressed in fatigues, and carrying an M-16. They seemed to be everywhere, and all were quite mammiferous! As we used to say, "There's something in the water up there..." Great pics!
Posted by: Dave at August 07, 2006 03:14 AM (ttKWI)
11
Maximus,
Explain to the other guys here how you don't care about a new US law that makes it illegal to meet these Israeli women online without filling out reems of paperwork that each woman has to approve before you can write "hello"?
I think you said "nobody here cares about dating foreign women. I served in the Gulf War so go f yourself." Before that you said that the only people who tried to contact foreign women were those "soliciting underaged Filipinas"?
So I guess the above women are underaged Filipinas? Damn, they're hot anyway.
The law hasn't come into effect yet because it has a restraining order which may be lifted any day. We can thank Congress and RINO Republicans for this mess.
Read the law yourself at:
Veterans Abroad.
Explain to the other guys here how you don't care about a new US law that makes it illegal to meet these Israeli women online without filling out reems of paperwork that each woman has to approve before you can write "hello"?
I think you said "nobody here cares about dating foreign women. I served in the Gulf War so go f yourself." Before that you said that the only people who tried to contact foreign women were those "soliciting underaged Filipinas"?
So I guess the above women are underaged Filipinas? Damn, they're hot anyway.
The law hasn't come into effect yet because it has a restraining order which may be lifted any day. We can thank Congress and RINO Republicans for this mess.
Read the law yourself at:
Veterans Abroad.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 05:16 AM (859GW)
12
By the way, nobody is expected to read a whole law, least of all your Congressman. So when you read IMBRA, go to page 12 where section iv prohibits any website from giving you the email address or phone number of women like the above who want guys to have that information, without her reading your life history first and "approving" by electronic signature. This quasi-fits the American norm of 2006 of using anonymous webmail to chat. Problem is, most foreigners aren't so paranoid that they need anonymous webmail technology to say hello. It is an example of the existence of technology being used to justify new restrictions on our lives.
There are two lawsuits over page 12 section iv and one lawsuit, in Georgia, won a restraining order. The other lawsuit, in Ohio, got a preliminary response from a judge saying "The Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners". Don't be fooled by the misleading description "international marriage broker." This term is defined as a social website with less than 50% American women on it, without regard to whether people really intend to marry each other. Democrat Senator Cantwell wrote this law.
There are two lawsuits over page 12 section iv and one lawsuit, in Georgia, won a restraining order. The other lawsuit, in Ohio, got a preliminary response from a judge saying "The Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners". Don't be fooled by the misleading description "international marriage broker." This term is defined as a social website with less than 50% American women on it, without regard to whether people really intend to marry each other. Democrat Senator Cantwell wrote this law.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 06:39 AM (859GW)
13
Imagine you are in a bar in Tel Aviv. You see one of these hotties off-duty and want to go speak with her.
Suddenly an American official grabs your arm and tells you that, because you are an American man, you need to submit to a background check and have the documents collected by the bartender for presentation to the hottie...and for her to sign her approval before you can say hi.
This argument was used to get a judge to put a restraining order on IMBRA because it is the exact equivalent and not even an analogy.
But the Ohio judge, I don't know what his problem was. Maybe not getting any from the wife and wants to spread his misery.
Suddenly an American official grabs your arm and tells you that, because you are an American man, you need to submit to a background check and have the documents collected by the bartender for presentation to the hottie...and for her to sign her approval before you can say hi.
This argument was used to get a judge to put a restraining order on IMBRA because it is the exact equivalent and not even an analogy.
But the Ohio judge, I don't know what his problem was. Maybe not getting any from the wife and wants to spread his misery.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 06:52 AM (859GW)
August 03, 2006
Qana : WaPo Defends Hizb'Allah's Honor
The Washington Post's Jefferson Morley comments on the bloggers questioning Hizb'Allah's Qana story:
I think some combination of cynicism, complacency and insulation has stifled the instincts of very good reporters. I also think there is also a failure of leadership at the senior editorial level. The issues raised ... are very serious. To pursue them is to invite confrontation. This means that ‘beat’ reporters cannot realistically pursue the story. I say all this way of explanation, not rationalization. There are several natural follow up stories ... that we should be pursuing right now….Oh, wait... wrong quote. That was Morley's comment on the Downing Street Memo. Here's his comment on Qana:
[Blogger Richard] North says he is just trying to "raise questions," which is certainly a legitimate goal. My question is: What is it about the photos from Qana that made Israel's supporters prefer fantasy to fact?Apparently, the standard of cynicism in the wake of inconsistent facts varies widely based on which side Morley's on. As The American Thinker puts it:
But [the Downing Street Memo] was then, this is now, and it was leftists who were demanding that questions be raised.LGF is all over it:In his attempt at debunking the questions being raised about Qana, he doesn’t bother actually examining the evidence.
Morley doesn’t bother to actually address any of the facts raised by those questioning the Qana photos, of course. But he would be well-advised to do a little research before echoing the talking points of the lefty blogosphere, so that he doesn’t embarrass himself...The Real Ugly American puts it well:
Again I have no idea if Hezbollah brought additional bodies to the scene or not but neither do you. I am also well aware that terrorist organizations like Hezbollah are not above faking death tolls, or planting bodies and so are you.Well, Mr. Morley?
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1
Thank you for the link.
It would be nice if journalists who get paid for a living actually checked their facts before questioning the work of amateur journalists/bloggers.
It would be nice if journalists who get paid for a living actually checked their facts before questioning the work of amateur journalists/bloggers.
Posted by: The Ugly American at August 03, 2006 04:55 PM (2D349)
2
Are we slowly but surely finding out that journalism is rife with fakery, bias, sloppiness, and mind-numbing hypocricy?
Nah!!!!
Nah!!!!
Posted by: Eman at August 03, 2006 05:21 PM (ljoDE)
3
I made my call here. The questions isn't if the town was hit. It was. The question isn't if people were killed. They were. The issue, and the hoax, is that the cr^p that was spread all over the TV was staged by Lord Green Helmet.....and no one in the MSM is willing to call them on it. It is pathetic that a bunch of part timers like bloggers are have to do the heavy lifting.
Posted by: CDR Salamander at August 03, 2006 05:25 PM (1KpeT)
4
My question is, "Why shouldn't we question the accuracy of reporters who are Arab, or Lebanese, or stringers who probably have an agenda?"
Why doesn't the media get some people in these areas who can either be trusted, or else quit using their staged photos? When I looked at the names of these reporters, I knew they couldn't be trusted. You see, with these folks, Islam first, everything else last. Lying to the infidel is what old Mo told them to do. They are being good Muslims. So anyone in their right mind should have known these photos were staged without bloggers having to tell them.
Why doesn't the media get some people in these areas who can either be trusted, or else quit using their staged photos? When I looked at the names of these reporters, I knew they couldn't be trusted. You see, with these folks, Islam first, everything else last. Lying to the infidel is what old Mo told them to do. They are being good Muslims. So anyone in their right mind should have known these photos were staged without bloggers having to tell them.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 03, 2006 05:36 PM (rUyw4)
5
My question is - where did the extra bodies come from?
And it's a genuine question - no ulterior motive, no political agenda. But, if they were planted - how does Hezbollah have a seemingly endless supply of fresh, unputrefied corpses?
Are they killing random citizens for the sake of a good shot? They might well be, for all I know, but I suspect that the locals might be up in arms about it if they were...
If Joe (or in this case, Josephine) Public got killed in the course of war... It's very sad, but it happens. Why should it make any difference at all if it all happened in one building, or across a country? The toll remains the same.
My question is - where did the extra bodies come from?
And it's a genuine question - no ulterior motive, no political agenda. But, if they were planted - how does Hezbollah have a seemingly endless supply of fresh, unputrefied corpses?
Are they killing random citizens for the sake of a good shot? They might well be, for all I know, but I suspect that the locals might be up in arms about it if they were...
If Joe (or in this case, Josephine) Public got killed in the course of war... It's very sad, but it happens. Why should it make any difference at all if it all happened in one building, or across a country? The toll remains the same.
Posted by: Dale at August 03, 2006 06:19 PM (BV7IP)
6
Oh, yeah, All-Seeing Eye, since when did the Washington Post or Hizb'Allah have any honor to defend?
j/a
j/a
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 03, 2006 06:25 PM (rUyw4)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 03, 2006 06:36 PM (Bp6wV)
8
Greyrooster -
Do you ever miss an opportunity to expose your ignorance? If not, you should.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the point of this site is to document the various attrocities commited under the banner of Islam.
It's not a sounding-board for your childish, ignorant hatred of anyone with darker skin than yours.
Do you ever miss an opportunity to expose your ignorance? If not, you should.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the point of this site is to document the various attrocities commited under the banner of Islam.
It's not a sounding-board for your childish, ignorant hatred of anyone with darker skin than yours.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 06:41 PM (BV7IP)
Posted by: Robert Byrd at August 03, 2006 06:55 PM (/qy9A)
10
Now hold on heah jes a second. If Grayuhroostah had been elected, this heah coontry'd beya much nahser place, I tell ya'll that raht now.
Posted by: Trent Lott at August 03, 2006 06:58 PM (/qy9A)
11
Kayup spahkin truth to de Powah, Roostah.
We heah in Nawlins LUV YEWWWWWW.
Tahm to put dem pesky nigras in dey PLAHS!
We heah in Nawlins LUV YEWWWWWW.
Tahm to put dem pesky nigras in dey PLAHS!
Posted by: David Duke at August 03, 2006 07:01 PM (/qy9A)
12
Greyrooster is a pseudonym for Tarnishedcock
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 07:12 PM (n4VvM)
13
This ain't a laughing matter.
Niggers, blacks, poo-men, wogs, darkies, Americans of Alternative Ethic Origin, call them what you will...
Fact is, there are more than a few of them fighting for the same ideals that any sane person holds foremost in their hearts. They've gone into bat against terrorism. They've fought, some have died, and they continue to do so. Which, when you get down to it, is more than Greyrooster, for all his atavistic bile, has achieved.
Not all blacks are good - some are murderous, worthless excuses for human beings - but not all blacks are bad. Same's true of whites.
Show some respect for those that have died for our cause.
Niggers, blacks, poo-men, wogs, darkies, Americans of Alternative Ethic Origin, call them what you will...
Fact is, there are more than a few of them fighting for the same ideals that any sane person holds foremost in their hearts. They've gone into bat against terrorism. They've fought, some have died, and they continue to do so. Which, when you get down to it, is more than Greyrooster, for all his atavistic bile, has achieved.
Not all blacks are good - some are murderous, worthless excuses for human beings - but not all blacks are bad. Same's true of whites.
Show some respect for those that have died for our cause.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 07:15 PM (BV7IP)
14
Boy, it must really piss Greyrooster off to see black folks like Condoleezza Rice and Colin Powell rise to such positions of power and distinction; positions that he, his Klan ilk and their progeny don't stand a snow ball's chance in hell of ever achieving.
Huh huh huh huh huh huh huh
Fortunately for the world the American Nation produces many more people like President G.W. Bush, President H.W. Bush, Gen. Powell, Dr. C. Rice, Gen. Patton, President Gen. Eisenhower, Gen. Omar Bradley, Gen. Omar Bradley, President Abraham Lincoln and others than it does KKK members like "Greyrooster".
Huh huh huh huh huh huh huh
Fortunately for the world the American Nation produces many more people like President G.W. Bush, President H.W. Bush, Gen. Powell, Dr. C. Rice, Gen. Patton, President Gen. Eisenhower, Gen. Omar Bradley, Gen. Omar Bradley, President Abraham Lincoln and others than it does KKK members like "Greyrooster".
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 03, 2006 07:26 PM (Bp6wV)
15
Yvom,
People are people. The people of less motivation and victimhood have been sold a bag of goods. The US Gov selected them to classify them as a special catagory. They have experimented with them in a social engineering experiment gone awry. However, the payout is the drug. Color is not a factor just a coincidence.
People are people. The people of less motivation and victimhood have been sold a bag of goods. The US Gov selected them to classify them as a special catagory. They have experimented with them in a social engineering experiment gone awry. However, the payout is the drug. Color is not a factor just a coincidence.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 07:28 PM (n4VvM)
16
The All-Seeing Eye,
One of the idealogical ways in which I combat Islamism is to refute their anti-American propaganda. What I tell people is that nearly all Americans I've met share the beliefs and values of great men like General Douglas MacArthur and General Marshal, and NOT the likes of "Greyrooster".
One of the idealogical ways in which I combat Islamism is to refute their anti-American propaganda. What I tell people is that nearly all Americans I've met share the beliefs and values of great men like General Douglas MacArthur and General Marshal, and NOT the likes of "Greyrooster".
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 03, 2006 07:33 PM (Bp6wV)
17
The shattering of truth, and reality, is a cancer in this country. The media HAS changed this land, thru it's neverending assault on these precious things.
In days gone before, most of the people understood what challenge was before us, and were willing to commit to the solution, whatever it required. These days, soft stupid AMERICA stands as an easy target.
Will we resist, or bow down to the onslaughtof tyrrany?
You tell me, AMERICANS.
In days gone before, most of the people understood what challenge was before us, and were willing to commit to the solution, whatever it required. These days, soft stupid AMERICA stands as an easy target.
Will we resist, or bow down to the onslaughtof tyrrany?
You tell me, AMERICANS.
Posted by: n.a. palm at August 03, 2006 07:36 PM (fbTsJ)
18
Nice one, guys.
It's really made my evening to see that sanity is not yet dead.
Islam, purely through weight of numbers, has largely dug its own grave. There are good muslims, no doubt about that - but they tend to have grown up under the aegis of non-muslim governments. I dated a muslim lass in the UK - she was beautiful, friendly, and her family showed me nothing but kindness. A far cry from most muslim governments, who'd have chopped off her hands for fraternizing with an infidel.
It's a genuine pity to see a rational argument hijacked by ignorant white-supremacists. Yes, I'm looking at you, Greyrooster. Distasteful as it is to do so.
It's really made my evening to see that sanity is not yet dead.
Islam, purely through weight of numbers, has largely dug its own grave. There are good muslims, no doubt about that - but they tend to have grown up under the aegis of non-muslim governments. I dated a muslim lass in the UK - she was beautiful, friendly, and her family showed me nothing but kindness. A far cry from most muslim governments, who'd have chopped off her hands for fraternizing with an infidel.
It's a genuine pity to see a rational argument hijacked by ignorant white-supremacists. Yes, I'm looking at you, Greyrooster. Distasteful as it is to do so.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 07:47 PM (BV7IP)
19
I don't think many of you know greyrooster very well. He is outspoken, but he does not hate people of color just because they are of color. What he says about NO, La, is basically true, as I have been connected in one way or another to that city for years. So has greyrooster, and he has the racial politics of that city down pat. And if disgust for such people as Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson makes me a racist, then racist I am. But I do not believe that is the litmus test. Greyrooster has a familial attachment to the Phillipines, whose people are hardly lily white. And I know he would honor any black, brown, white, yellow, or red person who served honorably, no matter the venue, so criticism there is unwarranted.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 03, 2006 07:51 PM (rUyw4)
20
Eh, read his posts.
He's never missed an opportunity to twist any discussion into racist diatribe.
He's a relic.
He's never missed an opportunity to twist any discussion into racist diatribe.
He's a relic.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 07:57 PM (BV7IP)
21
What makes Greyrooster racist is his willingness to accept that the worst characteristics shown by any member of any ethnic grouping are automatically valid for all members of the same ethnic grouping. Still - if you can dig up any of his posts that aren't just ignorant bile, I'll grant you your point.
Fine. Hate Al Sharpton if you like - the bloke's an idiot. That's a personal thing.
But don't extrapolate. You end up looking like an idiot.
Fine. Hate Al Sharpton if you like - the bloke's an idiot. That's a personal thing.
But don't extrapolate. You end up looking like an idiot.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 08:03 PM (BV7IP)
22
Actually, JJ is right. Greyrooster invites misunderstanding through his dialog. But many of us have been around long enough to understand him more thoroughly. Frankly, if push came to shove, I'd want Greyrooster on my side regardless what color I am. And while I'm at it, Maxie too. They both get radical in speech, but in action I suspect, nay, I "know", either could be counted on to be on the right side. And I don't mean "right" in a political sense.
Posted by: Oyster at August 03, 2006 08:19 PM (YudAC)
Posted by: hondo at August 03, 2006 08:21 PM (MVgHp)
24
Sigh... Those of you who matter know my position; discuss.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 03, 2006 08:28 PM (v3I+x)
25
If he's so nice, but so misunderstood - why does he take *every available opportunity* to bring his hatred of blacks into any available discussion? If you want his most random assault, read the article about Rusty going on holiday.
'What does that have to do with blacks...', you might ask....
Greyrooster found something.
The bloke is a cancer upon society.
If he's so nice, but so misunderstood - why does he take *every available opportunity* to bring his hatred of blacks into any available discussion? If you want his most random assault, read the article about Rusty going on holiday.
'What does that have to do with blacks...', you might ask....
Greyrooster found something.
The bloke is a cancer upon society.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 08:29 PM (BV7IP)
26
I don't know him or her. I agree sometimes, and then sometimes I am left scratching my head. I also have lived in the south most of my life. My father would not say the word F**k but ni*&er was a staple. Please don't assume to lecture me on race. I went to a city school in a suburb of Atlanta that was not white oriented. I served in the US by God Marine Corps with men and women of many races and religious beliefs.
Black women have the softest lips period.
I remember when Jacksonville Fl had a downtown of wannabe skyscrapers, mixed in with 100 year old frame houses populated with the poorest of the poor.
I remember delivering thanksgiving dinner to a family who were actually a group of families. They had a mud yard and an oil furnace for heat. The house reeked of fuel oil, and the floor was dirt covered scrap plywood.
You can try to lecture about the Nawlins disease but hate is hate. The blacks in Nawlins are just the symptom of the system. If it hasn't changed the Tanished Cock should look in the mirror. Because it is the people around him that sustain the disease.
Black women have the softest lips period.
I remember when Jacksonville Fl had a downtown of wannabe skyscrapers, mixed in with 100 year old frame houses populated with the poorest of the poor.
I remember delivering thanksgiving dinner to a family who were actually a group of families. They had a mud yard and an oil furnace for heat. The house reeked of fuel oil, and the floor was dirt covered scrap plywood.
You can try to lecture about the Nawlins disease but hate is hate. The blacks in Nawlins are just the symptom of the system. If it hasn't changed the Tanished Cock should look in the mirror. Because it is the people around him that sustain the disease.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 08:53 PM (n4VvM)
27
I am a link whore. Will someone have a look and like to my site? I have groovy Headlines like:
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and his Israel Fettish
Down with America! (And drink Pepsi)
Staging a funeral on a hot day?
Try a cool refreshing Pepsi Cola.
Mermaid Man (John Murtha) sued for defamation
Marine Names Murtha in Defamation Suit
He really does remind me of Mermaid Man from Spongebob Square Pants. The Dem Weiner reminds me of Barnacle Boy.
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and his Israel Fettish
Down with America! (And drink Pepsi)
Staging a funeral on a hot day?
Try a cool refreshing Pepsi Cola.
Mermaid Man (John Murtha) sued for defamation
Marine Names Murtha in Defamation Suit
He really does remind me of Mermaid Man from Spongebob Square Pants. The Dem Weiner reminds me of Barnacle Boy.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 09:05 PM (n4VvM)
28
Hey Tarnishedcock, you should check this one out from my site.
Frank Melton for Mississippi Governor
ACLU Accuses Mayor Of Jackson Mississippi of Racial Profiling
Color really is just a red herring (no pun intended)
Damn that would make a great headline for this article.
Frank Melton for Mississippi Governor
ACLU Accuses Mayor Of Jackson Mississippi of Racial Profiling
Color really is just a red herring (no pun intended)
Damn that would make a great headline for this article.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 09:08 PM (n4VvM)
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 03, 2006 09:50 PM (dpUkO)
30
Whether or not I believe it is immaterial. It's a simple fact.
And by the way - piss-ant should be hyphenated.
And by the way - piss-ant should be hyphenated.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 09:58 PM (BV7IP)
31
Oyster - I'm with you. I'd pick Greyrooster and Maxie for my team any day.
I think their intellectual honesty rubs people the wrong way.
Some people like their reality fuzzy and out-of-focus. I like mine clear, straight up.
I think their intellectual honesty rubs people the wrong way.
Some people like their reality fuzzy and out-of-focus. I like mine clear, straight up.
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 03, 2006 10:17 PM (aH6Zf)
32
...and whilst I'm being pedantic, you should have employed a comma... Two different meanings.
"keep beleiving that, piss-ant" - I'm a piss-ant, and I should beleive the thing in question.
"keep beleiving that piss-ant" - I should place my beleif in a piss-ant.
People - generally, those lacking in education - babble on about how the correct form of expression should not detract from an argument. They forgo spelling, punctuation, capitalization, and feel that they should not be held to account for it.
Tell me the difference between these two statements...
1) I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse
2) I helped my uncle jack off a horse.
Grammar is important, kids. Get back to school.
"keep beleiving that, piss-ant" - I'm a piss-ant, and I should beleive the thing in question.
"keep beleiving that piss-ant" - I should place my beleif in a piss-ant.
People - generally, those lacking in education - babble on about how the correct form of expression should not detract from an argument. They forgo spelling, punctuation, capitalization, and feel that they should not be held to account for it.
Tell me the difference between these two statements...
1) I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse
2) I helped my uncle jack off a horse.
Grammar is important, kids. Get back to school.
Posted by: Your very oen mother at August 03, 2006 10:20 PM (BV7IP)
33
Heroic dreamer -
If you can explain how sad, tired pastiches of coloured americans counts as 'intellectual honesty', you might have the basics of a point.
As it is, you're just an apologist. My advice - get your tongue out of his ass, because that spot will shortly be needed by my boot.
If you can explain how sad, tired pastiches of coloured americans counts as 'intellectual honesty', you might have the basics of a point.
As it is, you're just an apologist. My advice - get your tongue out of his ass, because that spot will shortly be needed by my boot.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 10:27 PM (BV7IP)
34
Your very own mother, you say: "get your tongue out of his ass,"
I say: Yuck! my mother would never speak like that. if you can't frame an argument without being disgusting I'm not allowed to play with you. Sorry.
I say: Yuck! my mother would never speak like that. if you can't frame an argument without being disgusting I'm not allowed to play with you. Sorry.
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 03, 2006 10:35 PM (aH6Zf)
35
http://www.bootmurtha.com/
Posted by: Booby Fett at August 03, 2006 10:36 PM (+nlyI)
Posted by: hondo at August 03, 2006 10:47 PM (MVgHp)
37
*sigh*
At no point did I express any form of desire to jack off a horse. It was merely an illustration of the benefits one gleans from correct capilaization.
A point clearly lost on you.
*sigh*
At no point did I express any form of desire to jack off a horse. It was merely an illustration of the benefits one gleans from correct capilaization.
A point clearly lost on you.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 10:50 PM (BV7IP)
38
Or, indeed, capitalization.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 03, 2006 10:53 PM (BV7IP)
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 03, 2006 10:54 PM (aH6Zf)
40
Blow me asshole (or ass-hole):
piss·ant also piss-ant (psnt) Slang
n.
1. One that is insignificant.
2. Obsolete An ant.
adj.
Not important; insignificant: "Some pissant Texas court wants to make [the company] pay . . . more than $10 billion in reparations" New Republic.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pissant
piss·ant also piss-ant (psnt) Slang
n.
1. One that is insignificant.
2. Obsolete An ant.
adj.
Not important; insignificant: "Some pissant Texas court wants to make [the company] pay . . . more than $10 billion in reparations" New Republic.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pissant
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 03, 2006 10:56 PM (dpUkO)
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 03, 2006 10:59 PM (dpUkO)
42
Mother, you say: "keep beleiving that, piss-ant" - I'm a piss-ant, and I should beleive the thing in question.
"keep beleiving that piss-ant" - I should place my beleif in a piss-ant."
WOW! I thought for a second you were speaking Irish - you know,like, Leif Erickson.
But as long as we're (remember the apostrophe!) back in school you should know that the correct spelling is "i" before "e" - belief, believing - not beleif, beleiving
"keep beleiving that piss-ant" - I should place my beleif in a piss-ant."
WOW! I thought for a second you were speaking Irish - you know,like, Leif Erickson.
But as long as we're (remember the apostrophe!) back in school you should know that the correct spelling is "i" before "e" - belief, believing - not beleif, beleiving
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 03, 2006 11:09 PM (aH6Zf)
43
sorry mother
The point was not clearly lost. Reverse utilization of your illustrated example (horse jacking) does in fact have a literary name in the genre of satire (which hondo truly looooves!). But - its not important.
This is a blog - and I consider Jawa to be more akin to a neighborhood bar. It is helpful to leave all intellectual pretentions and airs at the door, relax, kick back and be yourself. Now whether or not yourself's personality and intelligence can stand alone without augmentation of superfical literary props is - well - up to you.
I don't share some of greyrooster's beliefs - and he knows that. I don't defend him either - don't have to - he is one tough old smart son-of-a-bitch and he can handle himself easy enough - and I like that.
I prefer to concern myself with matters that are truly important in the scheme of things. Horse jacking is not one of them - but Carpenter Ants! - now that's another story!
The point was not clearly lost. Reverse utilization of your illustrated example (horse jacking) does in fact have a literary name in the genre of satire (which hondo truly looooves!). But - its not important.
This is a blog - and I consider Jawa to be more akin to a neighborhood bar. It is helpful to leave all intellectual pretentions and airs at the door, relax, kick back and be yourself. Now whether or not yourself's personality and intelligence can stand alone without augmentation of superfical literary props is - well - up to you.
I don't share some of greyrooster's beliefs - and he knows that. I don't defend him either - don't have to - he is one tough old smart son-of-a-bitch and he can handle himself easy enough - and I like that.
I prefer to concern myself with matters that are truly important in the scheme of things. Horse jacking is not one of them - but Carpenter Ants! - now that's another story!
Posted by: hondo at August 03, 2006 11:21 PM (MVgHp)
44
Hondo - I'll finish helping you with those ants as soon as I learn how to spell them - promise.
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 03, 2006 11:28 PM (dpUkO)
45
"I'd rather have a division of Gregs in front of me than a division of Greyroosters behind me."
Gen. Rusty Shackleford, ca. 1944.
[excerpted from the book "Rusty Speaks! An Annotated History Of Jawa Quotes From A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far, Far Away]
Gen. Rusty Shackleford, ca. 1944.
[excerpted from the book "Rusty Speaks! An Annotated History Of Jawa Quotes From A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far, Far Away]
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief Pro Temporeâ„¢ at August 03, 2006 11:32 PM (/qy9A)
46
"Waaaaahhhhhhhh, It looks like I've been banned, say goodbye for me!"
[from the book "How I Squished Carpenter Ants And Wished They Were Vinnie" by hondo, Random Comments House, ©2006]
[from the book "How I Squished Carpenter Ants And Wished They Were Vinnie" by hondo, Random Comments House, ©2006]
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief Pro Temporeâ„¢ at August 04, 2006 12:02 AM (/qy9A)
47
Not interested.
Posted by: hondo at August 04, 2006 12:06 AM (MVgHp)
48
Damn Capitilist Piss-ants!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 04, 2006 03:58 AM (gLMre)
49
You want to make a logical point, Greyrooster? Hey, I guess it'd be a first - but do so with the force of intellectual argument, rather than lame pastiche. I'm guessing you're labouring under the misapprehension that it's somehow amusing.
To address some of your more banal points: no, I've never dated a black, but that's a coincidence. Yes, I dated a muslim, and she was a far better human being than you. Having done so does not make me support the current fight against terrorism any less. Oh, and as things stand, I'm about to marry a white girl, so don't worry your racist little heart about that.
As for my boot up your ass? Nothing would give me greater pleasure, but it'd be fleeting at best. I'm guessing you're some bitter, fat, sweaty fifty-something, who has an axe to grind with the world because he never achieved all he felt entitled to. But, of course, your myriad failings were never your own fault...
Stop yapping and find yourself another pie.
To address some of your more banal points: no, I've never dated a black, but that's a coincidence. Yes, I dated a muslim, and she was a far better human being than you. Having done so does not make me support the current fight against terrorism any less. Oh, and as things stand, I'm about to marry a white girl, so don't worry your racist little heart about that.
As for my boot up your ass? Nothing would give me greater pleasure, but it'd be fleeting at best. I'm guessing you're some bitter, fat, sweaty fifty-something, who has an axe to grind with the world because he never achieved all he felt entitled to. But, of course, your myriad failings were never your own fault...
Stop yapping and find yourself another pie.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 04, 2006 07:39 AM (BV7IP)
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 04, 2006 07:42 AM (rUyw4)
51
Ah, damn. I'll have to amend my CV - get rid of all those pesky qualifications, the two university degrees, the industry accolades, etc. Jesusland Joe thinks I'm stupid. That must make me unemployable...
Greyrooster - I won't hate anyone because of their colour. If I hate someone, it's because they've proved themselves worth hating - I'm quite content to either hate or like blacks, whites, yellows, anyone, on their own individual merits. If what you say about New Orleans is true - hell, I might even end up hating the majority of the town. But I still wouldn't make absurd, sweeping generalisations, because it's a stupid thing to do.
Still, seems like you've already enjoyed a long relationship with stupidity. Keep it up, you particularly dull man - if nothing else, people like you make me look better.
Ah, damn. I'll have to amend my CV - get rid of all those pesky qualifications, the two university degrees, the industry accolades, etc. Jesusland Joe thinks I'm stupid. That must make me unemployable...
Greyrooster - I won't hate anyone because of their colour. If I hate someone, it's because they've proved themselves worth hating - I'm quite content to either hate or like blacks, whites, yellows, anyone, on their own individual merits. If what you say about New Orleans is true - hell, I might even end up hating the majority of the town. But I still wouldn't make absurd, sweeping generalisations, because it's a stupid thing to do.
Still, seems like you've already enjoyed a long relationship with stupidity. Keep it up, you particularly dull man - if nothing else, people like you make me look better.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 04, 2006 08:21 AM (BV7IP)
52
I have a couple of popints that may actually go along with GR's earlier staements about how some folks are willing to give the Mulims a pass.
Those wearing the Malcome X shirts probably don't realize X was on his way out of the Nation of Islam, and leaving behind his message of hatred. It is suspected he was killed for these reasons.
Anyone who can say the muslems did nothing to them, probably did not have any money invested in the market on 9/11. If they had, they would have seen the consequences over the following days and weeks as the value of their accounts tanked.
Hey GR, what do you think of all the Chinese sneeking into the country and taking low paying jobs in the dry cleaning and laundry biz?
Those wearing the Malcome X shirts probably don't realize X was on his way out of the Nation of Islam, and leaving behind his message of hatred. It is suspected he was killed for these reasons.
Anyone who can say the muslems did nothing to them, probably did not have any money invested in the market on 9/11. If they had, they would have seen the consequences over the following days and weeks as the value of their accounts tanked.
Hey GR, what do you think of all the Chinese sneeking into the country and taking low paying jobs in the dry cleaning and laundry biz?
Posted by: Cmunk at August 04, 2006 08:43 AM (7teJ9)
53
Regarding your very own mother's apologetics; Rooster is right and everyone knows it, but his views don't fit into the dystopian PC reality that we've been forced to accept that the point of a gun, and so even those of us, (self excluded, because I have no fear), who agree with what he says must shake our heads and give him a tsk tsk! while knowing in our hearts he is right.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 04, 2006 09:23 AM (v3I+x)
54
I apologise for nothing. I simply believe that every man has the right to be judged upon his own personal successes or failures, not upon those of others.
Maximus, if you have no fear, get out there on the front line. It's easy to be brave in the comfort of your own lounge.
I apologise for nothing. I simply believe that every man has the right to be judged upon his own personal successes or failures, not upon those of others.
Maximus, if you have no fear, get out there on the front line. It's easy to be brave in the comfort of your own lounge.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 04, 2006 09:32 AM (BV7IP)
55
Mother, you are one stupid asshole. Maxie served in the Gulf War and Greyrooster served in Vietnam. Take your dumn ass somewhere else. And rooster is right about the majority of blacks supporting the Paleostinians, and he is right about NO, La. If you don't want to hear the truth, go somewhere else, or listen and learn. Do I agree with everything Greyrooster says, hell no, but he has the right to say it. So go away, mother of all stupidity. And being judged is not a right, either.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 04, 2006 10:27 AM (rUyw4)
56
They both served? Good on them. I mean that whole-heartedly. Does it mean they're now impervious to fault?
Nope.
As Greyrooster has the right to say what he says, so I have the right to disagree.
Nope.
As Greyrooster has the right to say what he says, so I have the right to disagree.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 04, 2006 10:31 AM (BV7IP)
57
Yes, you do. Enough said.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 04, 2006 10:48 AM (rUyw4)
58
Simple. Since the blacks had a long history of serving as slaves, it is no surprise that they feel the world owes them a living. What goes around comes around ......
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 04, 2006 10:52 AM (gLMre)
59
I'd love to be able to ride my bike to work - it's a great bike, about $3000's worth - but as it's 25 miles, I drive. When I'm done with my day's work, I drive back to the 17th-century cottage I share with my fiance and my two dogs. So, no luck there with the random insults.
I'm not remotely jealous of your hummer. If I wanted something that size, I'd buy a barge. Very kind of you to offer me a ride, though.
I think if you scroll upwards, you'll find that the majority of the name-calling has actually come from you.
To reiterate - if I lived in New Orleans, I'd be perfectly happy to hate any asshole on an individual basis, if they proved themselves worthy of hatred.
Hrm. Full marks for vitriol, but you get a fail on factual accuracy.
I'm not remotely jealous of your hummer. If I wanted something that size, I'd buy a barge. Very kind of you to offer me a ride, though.
I think if you scroll upwards, you'll find that the majority of the name-calling has actually come from you.
To reiterate - if I lived in New Orleans, I'd be perfectly happy to hate any asshole on an individual basis, if they proved themselves worthy of hatred.
Hrm. Full marks for vitriol, but you get a fail on factual accuracy.
Posted by: Your very own mother at August 04, 2006 12:11 PM (BV7IP)
60
Aww, bless...
You think I'm going to take offense at the wearied ramblings of some shaved-ape from the swamp?
You can't insult me. You're just not bright enough.
You think I'm going to take offense at the wearied ramblings of some shaved-ape from the swamp?
You can't insult me. You're just not bright enough.
Posted by: Your own mother at August 04, 2006 12:28 PM (BV7IP)
61
Heh, always count on a lefturd to start slinging insults when he starts losing the argument, and then claim victory as he flees the field. Now to take him to task...
I simply believe that every man has the right to be judged upon his own personal successes or failures, not upon those of others.
Well isn't that special. But we aren't talking about the merits of individuals, such as Condi Rice for example, (a.k.a "Aunt Jemima" to the lefturds), but about collective groups en toto. Condi, whom I think is probably the most qualified person alive to be the POTUS, is also one of the most reviled by blacks and liberals for committing the cardinal sin of being a conservative, (and a Christian), despite being a woman and minority, but who is widely embraced by mostly white conservatives, solely because of her merits, and without regard to the fact that she is a member of an ethnic group that is so disproportionately responsible for crime in this country, that if all of them disappeared, crime in most areas would fall to almost nothing. You see, we're the ones who judge people on their merits, whereas lefturds judge people solely on their VQ, or Victimhood Quotient, which is why the Dhimmicrats have now chucked the blue collar white workers and perpetually outraged blacks in favor of muslims and Mexicans. We're wise to you, so go peddle you papers somewhere else.
I simply believe that every man has the right to be judged upon his own personal successes or failures, not upon those of others.
Well isn't that special. But we aren't talking about the merits of individuals, such as Condi Rice for example, (a.k.a "Aunt Jemima" to the lefturds), but about collective groups en toto. Condi, whom I think is probably the most qualified person alive to be the POTUS, is also one of the most reviled by blacks and liberals for committing the cardinal sin of being a conservative, (and a Christian), despite being a woman and minority, but who is widely embraced by mostly white conservatives, solely because of her merits, and without regard to the fact that she is a member of an ethnic group that is so disproportionately responsible for crime in this country, that if all of them disappeared, crime in most areas would fall to almost nothing. You see, we're the ones who judge people on their merits, whereas lefturds judge people solely on their VQ, or Victimhood Quotient, which is why the Dhimmicrats have now chucked the blue collar white workers and perpetually outraged blacks in favor of muslims and Mexicans. We're wise to you, so go peddle you papers somewhere else.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 04, 2006 01:44 PM (v3I+x)
62
GR it worked just as I planned Hahahahahah. Sorry that was maniacal laughter.
I agree with you on all points. But I do not hate blacks. You are funny. Wish you could get past the hate part.
I agree with you on all points. But I do not hate blacks. You are funny. Wish you could get past the hate part.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 04, 2006 02:58 PM (7teJ9)
63
I'm pretty much opposed to GR, and I'm pretty surprised at the support he has here. He's a complete racist, who judges people on the basis of their skin color. I don't really care what experiences he has had that lead him to think that way. Let's review all the stupid things he has said lately:
1. He doubts any blacks have been killed in Iraq. What an insult to our heroes who have fought for us who are black. It's a lie of the left to say that blacks are dying disproportionately, but it is a lie of the racist right to say that none are dying who are black. That's just easily disproved racist stupidity.
2. He's said that descendants of blacks who served on his family's plantation are in public housing, so he's still "paying" for them. Uh, did you ever pay them back for two hundred years of free labor? For rapes? For family separation? For another 150 years of living in segregation? For living under fear of lynching? I don't support reparations, but your stupidity and hatred makes me want to support reparation taxation on dumb whites.
3. He always ends up reverting to crude sexual insults and fantasies. He's particularly fond of homophobic ones.
Other than the fact that he's racist, afactual, and insulting, I have no problems with him.
1. He doubts any blacks have been killed in Iraq. What an insult to our heroes who have fought for us who are black. It's a lie of the left to say that blacks are dying disproportionately, but it is a lie of the racist right to say that none are dying who are black. That's just easily disproved racist stupidity.
2. He's said that descendants of blacks who served on his family's plantation are in public housing, so he's still "paying" for them. Uh, did you ever pay them back for two hundred years of free labor? For rapes? For family separation? For another 150 years of living in segregation? For living under fear of lynching? I don't support reparations, but your stupidity and hatred makes me want to support reparation taxation on dumb whites.
3. He always ends up reverting to crude sexual insults and fantasies. He's particularly fond of homophobic ones.
Other than the fact that he's racist, afactual, and insulting, I have no problems with him.
Posted by: jd at August 04, 2006 03:23 PM (aqTJB)
64
Hey, GR--I give you points for honesty. But all those people who have been defending him as an "interesting perspective" and as someone who "calls it like it is" or whatever other rationalism you use, please read his post above. He just said segregation worked. That we didn't have these problems them. That is among the most disgusting, ignorant statements I've ever seen. Look at infant mortality among blacks, or housing, or education, or income, since desegregation. Look at the gap between white/black since then. Desegregation and de jure equality finally pulled blacks out of the terrible hell America left them in. Are we done? no, but to say things were better when a black man could be killed on the steps of the courthouse in front of 100 witnesses for trying to vote--that's the days that GR wants back.
You know who else was a big fan of America's segregation? Adolf Hitler. It's in Mein Kampf.
As you really want segregated living for Jews. And Muslims. Another gut check. We've just had someone endorse that Jews go back to the ghetto. A voice many of you respect.
Anyone that respects this voice is in direct contradiction of the ideals of this nation. In agreeing with GR, you are taking a crap on the American flag. You are spitting on the Constitution.
I'm less disgusted at this point by GR than by his mealymouthed defenders here. They are utterly unamerican.
Oh, and finally--GR, Al Sharpton is an idiot. Calling him an idiot isn't racist. Calling the black race dumb because Al Sharpton is black is racist.
You know who else was a big fan of America's segregation? Adolf Hitler. It's in Mein Kampf.
As you really want segregated living for Jews. And Muslims. Another gut check. We've just had someone endorse that Jews go back to the ghetto. A voice many of you respect.
Anyone that respects this voice is in direct contradiction of the ideals of this nation. In agreeing with GR, you are taking a crap on the American flag. You are spitting on the Constitution.
I'm less disgusted at this point by GR than by his mealymouthed defenders here. They are utterly unamerican.
Oh, and finally--GR, Al Sharpton is an idiot. Calling him an idiot isn't racist. Calling the black race dumb because Al Sharpton is black is racist.
Posted by: afamiliarvoice at August 04, 2006 04:06 PM (aqTJB)
65
Don't call me mealymouthed, afamiliarvoice. And I guarantee you wouldn't do it to my face but one time. I said Greyrooster had his right to free speech, and I'll say it again. And I said I didn't agree with everything he says. So there, I defending his right to FREE SPEECH. If you don't like what he says, don't read it, dumb ass. And don't comment on it. And never call me mealymouthed unless you intend to back it up. Typical liberal talking tough on the internet pissing me off.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 04, 2006 05:28 PM (rUyw4)
66
Actually, you're not here today, either.
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief Pro Temporeâ„¢ at August 04, 2006 07:04 PM (/qy9A)
Hezbollah Rocket Launch Video
Via Vital Perspective. The video shows Hezbollah fighters firing from a civilian house thereby adding that area to the Israeli target list. Next we will see Hezbollah screaming that the counter attack was, “unjustifiedâ€. As Rusty says, “See how this works?â€
Note this interview this AM on NPR where al-Manar’s foreign editor admits clearly that Hezbollah fighters are civilians. He then turns right around and blames Israel for bombing, You guessed it Civilians. Renee Montagne calls him on it and he acts as if she doesn’t have him by the balls. Renee should have pressed him harder she had him.
Others : Powerline, All Things Beautiful, Fullosseous Flap's Dental Blog. more...
Posted by: Howie at
09:48 AM
| Comments (5)
| Add Comment
Post contains 127 words, total size 1 kb.
1
And this while the demo/libs morph into hyena/vultures tearing at the carcass of our great nation and it's heroes....
They are UNFIT TO LEAD, FOLLOW, or even to live here in AMERICA.
They are UNFIT TO LEAD, FOLLOW, or even to live here in AMERICA.
Posted by: n.a. palm at August 03, 2006 10:16 AM (fbTsJ)
2
I didn't even have to see the video, and frankly, these Leftists didn't either. They knew the Hizb'Allah freaks were firing from houses. Hell, look at what the feaks say themselves. They want to die, they will give their children to die, and they take pleasure in dying. I think we should take them at their word. Enough said.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 03, 2006 10:22 AM (rUyw4)
Posted by: Howie at August 03, 2006 11:58 AM (D3+20)
4
Who cares about civilian casualties, again?
I sure don't. Neither does anyone who is worth a damn.
I sure don't. Neither does anyone who is worth a damn.
Posted by: MiB at August 03, 2006 02:05 PM (6jwxg)
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I care. They are bad OK. The civilian I'm talking about also happens to be the guy shooting the rockets at Israel.
Posted by: Darth Odie at August 05, 2006 08:58 AM (D3+20)
August 02, 2006
This Headline Could Have Been Written 1400 Years Ago
Mideast war rages with no end in sight
Hezbollah didn't start this war, Israel didn't start this war. Mohammed started this war in the 7th century.
And it's not actually a "Mideast war," it's expanded a tad since then.
Update: Oh, Greg, you are so tough. I quake at your script. Ow, oh, it burns, please stop.
Posted by: Vinnie at
06:21 PM
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Vinnie,
The following article sheds some light on the intrinsically evil and violent and misanthropic nature of Islam:
http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=Sections&req=viewarticle&artid=1&page=1
The following article sheds some light on the intrinsically evil and violent and misanthropic nature of Islam:
http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=Sections&req=viewarticle&artid=1&page=1
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 06:34 PM (Bp6wV)
2
Wow, that really showed him greg! I bet he's considering voting for Hitlery now. Honestly, is that the best you can do? You're such a pathetic little punk bitch.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 02, 2006 07:02 PM (v3I+x)
3
The Koran is Mohammed's attempt to re-write history so that the Ishmaelites are the chosen people, instead of the Israelites. All this jihad garbage is just the acting out of a great cultural inferiority complex. Not only predictable, but predicted. See Genesis 16.
Greg: Seek help.
Greg: Seek help.
Posted by: Hucbald at August 02, 2006 07:11 PM (Q6gPh)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 07:33 PM (Bp6wV)
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Greg,
While you pathetic Mo-slimes were doing this a number of your Mo-slime kind. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
Mecca, Medina and Riyadh MUST BE NUKED now.
While you pathetic Mo-slimes were doing this a number of your Mo-slime kind. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
Mecca, Medina and Riyadh MUST BE NUKED now.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 07:37 PM (Bp6wV)
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Greg,
While you were doing this, your Mo-slime kind were being cut down by the brave Israeli soldiers. Think about; I do.
Heh Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
While you were doing this, your Mo-slime kind were being cut down by the brave Israeli soldiers. Think about; I do.
Heh Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 07:39 PM (Bp6wV)
7
"You think you hold all the power, but you hold none. You can't ban us."
Why would anybody want to ban your goat loving ass. You should be proud that your heroes killed a bunch of Muslim kids on a soccer field today in Iraq. Your children will wear clothes designed by us and use products bought from us. You can see the writing on the wall o follower of the child rapist Mohammad (Piss Be Upon Him)
Why would anybody want to ban your goat loving ass. You should be proud that your heroes killed a bunch of Muslim kids on a soccer field today in Iraq. Your children will wear clothes designed by us and use products bought from us. You can see the writing on the wall o follower of the child rapist Mohammad (Piss Be Upon Him)
Posted by: Randman at August 02, 2006 07:45 PM (Sal3J)
8
How stupid.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 02, 2006 07:56 PM (XqAoh)
9
Randman,
In this behaviour of Greg's you can see the effects that Islam has on a person. Mo-slimes think they have the right to tell others what to think, how to live and what to believe in.
Their need for violence and bloodshed is so great that when they find themselves unable to kill non-Muslims, or at least unable to kill non-Muslims in sufficient numbers to quench their blood lust, they turn on each other as you can see in Iraq. Since the beginning of this year, Mo-slimes have murdered 14000 other Muslims in Iraq.
I read somewhere "A peron without virtue is like a tree that bears no fruit. The only thing it is fit for is to be cut down and cast into fire". Islam is exactly such a tree.
In this behaviour of Greg's you can see the effects that Islam has on a person. Mo-slimes think they have the right to tell others what to think, how to live and what to believe in.
Their need for violence and bloodshed is so great that when they find themselves unable to kill non-Muslims, or at least unable to kill non-Muslims in sufficient numbers to quench their blood lust, they turn on each other as you can see in Iraq. Since the beginning of this year, Mo-slimes have murdered 14000 other Muslims in Iraq.
I read somewhere "A peron without virtue is like a tree that bears no fruit. The only thing it is fit for is to be cut down and cast into fire". Islam is exactly such a tree.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 07:58 PM (Bp6wV)
10
All of Greg's posts will be deleted. There's 34 of us, and only one of him.
Oh, wait, I'm still trembling from fear at his awesome abilities.
Hey, Greg, here's how much influence you have. I'm shutting the lid of the laptop.....lower, lower, lower....whaddya know, no more Greg.
Oh, wait, I'm still trembling from fear at his awesome abilities.
Hey, Greg, here's how much influence you have. I'm shutting the lid of the laptop.....lower, lower, lower....whaddya know, no more Greg.
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief Pro Temporeâ„¢ at August 02, 2006 08:01 PM (/qy9A)
11
Thanks for getting rid of Greg. Now, back to topic.
I read that news clip. What is strange, to me is how fast the U.N. wants to do something in the middle east, but we have not heard a word about the Sudan. I suppose, the U.N. really does not care about the Sudan because it is mostly Christians being killed by Muslimes.
I read that news clip. What is strange, to me is how fast the U.N. wants to do something in the middle east, but we have not heard a word about the Sudan. I suppose, the U.N. really does not care about the Sudan because it is mostly Christians being killed by Muslimes.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 02, 2006 08:18 PM (8uWFo)
12
Excellent and true points Garduneh and leatherneck is spot on as well.
But don't forget the racist qualities of the Muslims. Those in Sudan
are killing their fellow Muslims as well...if they have been guilty of
the crime of being born black. I have a good friend who now lives in
Ethiopia and rescues those poor souls who are lucky enough to get out
of that hell hole Sudan. He tells stories of the Sudanese Muslims who
kill their black slaves for the crime of literally looking the wrong
way.
But don't forget the racist qualities of the Muslims. Those in Sudan
are killing their fellow Muslims as well...if they have been guilty of
the crime of being born black. I have a good friend who now lives in
Ethiopia and rescues those poor souls who are lucky enough to get out
of that hell hole Sudan. He tells stories of the Sudanese Muslims who
kill their black slaves for the crime of literally looking the wrong
way.
Posted by: Randman at August 02, 2006 08:41 PM (Sal3J)
13
I believe the correct description of muslim reads, " racist, sexist, perverted, bigoted, homophobes........"
There. I feel MUCH better now.
There. I feel MUCH better now.
Posted by: n.a. palm at August 02, 2006 09:22 PM (KuN5N)
14
The pride and glory of the Israeli state.
About the Israeli raid on Ba`albak: an elite force of 300 Israeli soldiers were in pitch battle against 4 Hizbullah fighters FOR MORE THAN SEVEN HOURS.
But the Israeli raid was a success, according to Israeli media. Not only did it net Hasan Dib Nasrallah, but a pregnant woman was killed on her way to the hospital for delivery. She was shot from the air by Israeli helicopters.
About the Israeli raid on Ba`albak: an elite force of 300 Israeli soldiers were in pitch battle against 4 Hizbullah fighters FOR MORE THAN SEVEN HOURS.
But the Israeli raid was a success, according to Israeli media. Not only did it net Hasan Dib Nasrallah, but a pregnant woman was killed on her way to the hospital for delivery. She was shot from the air by Israeli helicopters.
Posted by: Multiculturalist at August 03, 2006 12:54 AM (0v4Wy)
15
Then you woke up and realized you had soiled your favorite bunny jammies.
Who's muslorectum did you find that "information"?
multiculturalist...?
Only if that culture involves gang-banging livestock.
Who's muslorectum did you find that "information"?
multiculturalist...?
Only if that culture involves gang-banging livestock.
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 03, 2006 01:05 AM (dpUkO)
16
Multicultist,
ah yes, no Zionazi story would be complete without the obligatory "pregnant woman." As per formula.
ah yes, no Zionazi story would be complete without the obligatory "pregnant woman." As per formula.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 03, 2006 01:39 AM (8e/V4)
17
How about: http://haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArtVty.jhtml?sw=hospital&itemNo=745766
Though of course no mention of whether those civilians were men, women (pregnant of otherwise) or children. Though why would that matter to a jewish newspaper, when this is what their religion of peace teaches them:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/1,7340,L-3283720,00.html
Yesha Rabbinical Council: During time of war, enemy has no innocents
The Yesha Rabbinical Council announced in response to an IDF attack in Kfar Qanna that "according to Jewish law, during a time of battle and war, there is no such term as 'innocents' of the enemy."
All of the discussions on Christian morality are weakening the spirit of the army and the nation and are costing us in the blood of our soldiers and civilians," the statement said. (Efrat Weiss)
Though of course no mention of whether those civilians were men, women (pregnant of otherwise) or children. Though why would that matter to a jewish newspaper, when this is what their religion of peace teaches them:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/1,7340,L-3283720,00.html
Yesha Rabbinical Council: During time of war, enemy has no innocents
The Yesha Rabbinical Council announced in response to an IDF attack in Kfar Qanna that "according to Jewish law, during a time of battle and war, there is no such term as 'innocents' of the enemy."
All of the discussions on Christian morality are weakening the spirit of the army and the nation and are costing us in the blood of our soldiers and civilians," the statement said. (Efrat Weiss)
Posted by: Multiculturalist at August 03, 2006 03:00 AM (0v4Wy)
18
Multiculturalist: We all know muslims are not racist. But does the characture, now being circulated though the muslim world, of Congoleeza Rice pregnant with a monkey have anything to do with Islam? Muslims give racists a bad name.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 06:34 AM (XqAoh)
19
During the American Civil war there was a man who had a farm at Bull Run. For those of you who are historically challenged, this battle of Bull Run was an opening of the war.
This same poor bastard who owned his farm at Bull Run and had it used a s a field hospital, sold it and moved to Appomatox Corthouse in Virginia. Why, because he did not want his family to be exposed to the hell and danger of war again. Guess where the surrender of Lee's army took place? That's right, in this same guys new house hundreds of miles away from Bull Run.
Lebanon as well was there in the 70's when the war against islamofacism started.
Here we are 30 years later and back in the middle is Lebanon. Except this time the enemy is so deeply entrnched in the country it may tear it apart to remove the cancer that is Hezbollah.
BTW, Israel saw the enemy was biding time waiting for the week to 10 day timeline for Israel to leave to pass. Seeing there was no pressure on Hezbollah to withdraw and disarm, they are wratcheting the pressure up on the world. Now the world bleats like a stuck pig. I just want this all over and done before my son is old enough to go to war. And yes I am selfish.
This same poor bastard who owned his farm at Bull Run and had it used a s a field hospital, sold it and moved to Appomatox Corthouse in Virginia. Why, because he did not want his family to be exposed to the hell and danger of war again. Guess where the surrender of Lee's army took place? That's right, in this same guys new house hundreds of miles away from Bull Run.
Lebanon as well was there in the 70's when the war against islamofacism started.
Here we are 30 years later and back in the middle is Lebanon. Except this time the enemy is so deeply entrnched in the country it may tear it apart to remove the cancer that is Hezbollah.
BTW, Israel saw the enemy was biding time waiting for the week to 10 day timeline for Israel to leave to pass. Seeing there was no pressure on Hezbollah to withdraw and disarm, they are wratcheting the pressure up on the world. Now the world bleats like a stuck pig. I just want this all over and done before my son is old enough to go to war. And yes I am selfish.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 03, 2006 09:23 AM (7teJ9)
20
Dang! Late for the party again. Didn't get to see what Greg had to say! Thought police are out again. What a drag! Bringing the quality of TJR down ... laughable ...
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 03, 2006 09:25 AM (gLMre)
21
Two threads down
Posted by: Howie at August 03, 2006 09:29 AM (D3+20)
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CMUNK: The opening battle of the civil war was Ft Sumter, in Charleston South Carolina.
"Those of you who are historically challenged" God I hate that attitude. Makes you sound like these academic meatheads. Parts of Bull Run is now a national park. Oscar Atkins owns the surrounding property. I have known Oscar for 35 years. He claims the actual battle of Bull Run was on his property. Naturally. Guess who won.
"Those of you who are historically challenged" God I hate that attitude. Makes you sound like these academic meatheads. Parts of Bull Run is now a national park. Oscar Atkins owns the surrounding property. I have known Oscar for 35 years. He claims the actual battle of Bull Run was on his property. Naturally. Guess who won.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 11:54 AM (XqAoh)
23
Greyrooster,
Though I'm not an arab, my understanding is that in muslim world monkeys (and apes) are associated with jews not blacks. In fact the monkey that represents Rice's "new middle east" is wearing a yarmulke and carrying a gun. (it also looks a lot like dubya, but that's a whole different topic).
The association of monkeys with blacks is a uniquely european/american type of racism.
Though I'm not an arab, my understanding is that in muslim world monkeys (and apes) are associated with jews not blacks. In fact the monkey that represents Rice's "new middle east" is wearing a yarmulke and carrying a gun. (it also looks a lot like dubya, but that's a whole different topic).
The association of monkeys with blacks is a uniquely european/american type of racism.
Posted by: multiculturalist at August 03, 2006 01:01 PM (0v4Wy)
24
OK: Put me in my ignorant place. So they are saying she's pregnant with a Jewish baby.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 04:49 PM (XqAoh)
JPost : Bloggers' Questions on Qana Spurring Official Inquiries
The Jerusalem Post reports that the Red Cross and the IDF, spurred largely by bloggers, are taking a closer look at exactly what happened at Qana:
The IDF is looking into allegations raised over the past few days by several pro-Israel, Jewish and conservative Weblogs that Hizbullah may have staged aspects of the Kana tragedy on Sunday, in which some 60 Lebanese bodies were removed from a building that collapsed seven hours after being hit in an Israel Air Force strike.Fellow Munuvians get a specific shout out:The dead were mainly children, women and elderly people.
The International Committee of the Red Cross Mission in Israel said Tuesday that it would inform its Swiss headquarters about the allegations and seek to clarify the questions raised.
according to the antiliberal [Confederate] Yankee blog, "The child in the photo shows no signs of injuries - no blood, no disfigurement or crushing wounds consistent with a building collapse. The two men [carrying the child] show no signs of having been digging in rubble. Their clothes are unbelievably clean, especially the black fatigues that would so easily shown concrete dust."Previous:
Qana : So far, More Questions than Answers
Qana : Turning Warheads into Whine
More from the Qana Flim-Flam Festival
Qana : IDF Corrects Earlier Statements; Hizb'Allah Story Still Falling Aoart
Posted by: Ragnar at
04:13 PM
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Here is a powerful and amazing statement on Al Jazeera television. The woman is Wafa Sultan, an Arab-American psychologist from Los Angeles. I would suggest watching it ASAP because I don't know how long the link will be active.
http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null
http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null
Posted by: osie at August 02, 2006 04:48 PM (DYfAe)
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If the Israelis confirm what we're all suspecting, then maybe they should broadcast it in Hezbollah TV.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/1DCBA43C-C892-4F02-8964-83BDA9081FC8.htm
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/1DCBA43C-C892-4F02-8964-83BDA9081FC8.htm
Posted by: Northern Cross at August 02, 2006 05:55 PM (mtrrA)
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I won't speculate on the condition of any bodies. I'm not a coroner, nor was I there, but I do have reservations due to the fact that there never seem to be any survivors, none, when they want to make a big deal of any particular situation.
So many lies have come of every skirmish, every confrontation, every bombing, that immediate suspicion becomes the norm. It's exasperating wondering how much truth there is to anything coming out of the Middle East.
So many lies have come of every skirmish, every confrontation, every bombing, that immediate suspicion becomes the norm. It's exasperating wondering how much truth there is to anything coming out of the Middle East.
Posted by: Oyster at August 02, 2006 06:41 PM (YudAC)
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Good.
The photos where obviously staged for maxium effect - but that's normal for the middle east, and not a crime, though it would get rescue workers fired in any decent country.
There are lots of questions surrounding the actual events, though. It's possible that all that happened is that there was a tragic accident; people being in the wrong place at the wrong time, and Hezbollah exploited that. (Even then, Hezbollah is at fault given their operations from within and around Qana.) It's possible that Hezbollah was far more complicit, one way or another.
But as Oyster points out, the important thing is don't believe the news coming out of southern Lebanon. At best it is distorted, at worst made up entirely.
(The "ambulance hit by an Israeli missile" story, on the other hand, is Fakey F. McFakepants.)
The photos where obviously staged for maxium effect - but that's normal for the middle east, and not a crime, though it would get rescue workers fired in any decent country.
There are lots of questions surrounding the actual events, though. It's possible that all that happened is that there was a tragic accident; people being in the wrong place at the wrong time, and Hezbollah exploited that. (Even then, Hezbollah is at fault given their operations from within and around Qana.) It's possible that Hezbollah was far more complicit, one way or another.
But as Oyster points out, the important thing is don't believe the news coming out of southern Lebanon. At best it is distorted, at worst made up entirely.
(The "ambulance hit by an Israeli missile" story, on the other hand, is Fakey F. McFakepants.)
Posted by: Pixy at August 02, 2006 09:17 PM (FRalS)
5
At this point, I think there are a lot of questions.
In areas where local rescue workers and journalists are NOT on the payroll of international terrorists, we're more willing to accept tragic stories at face value, even with imcomplete information.
In areas where local rescue workers and journalists ARE on the payroll of international terrorists, they sure as hell better have their fuckin' story straight if they want me to buy it.
That's all I'm sayin'.
In areas where local rescue workers and journalists are NOT on the payroll of international terrorists, we're more willing to accept tragic stories at face value, even with imcomplete information.
In areas where local rescue workers and journalists ARE on the payroll of international terrorists, they sure as hell better have their fuckin' story straight if they want me to buy it.
That's all I'm sayin'.
Posted by: The All Seeing Eye at August 03, 2006 02:03 AM (I9YKk)
Victory? No, Not Victory. Begun WW III Has.
I’ve been disturbed lately by the lack of backbone displayed by the west. We have war on many fronts and no one has actually declared war on anyone. Did the US declare war against the Taliban? Nope, that was an authorization, but not war. Iraq, no same deal. Somalia, no that’s an unstable situation. Israel and Lebanon, no declaration there either.
The only ones with enough gall to actually declare war are terrorist organizations who have declared war worldwide. This is often dismissed as the ranting of Islamic terrorists, but they mean what they say. The terror supporting states such as Iran have not said it either. What? You expect them to tip us off? Why? They are depending on our bad case of denial to give them a good head start.
So to spare further silly denial and get the ball rolling I’ll help us all out.
WW III will begin on Thursday August 3rd at 8:00 pm EDT 7:00 pm central. Check your local listings. The time between 9/11 2001 and then shall be known as, “The events leading up to WW III.†Even though we all know it’s the same damn thing. more...
Posted by: Howie at
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I decided this back on the 31st.
http://bigdicksplace.blogspot.com/2006/07/now-where-in-hell-should-i-begin-this.html
http://bigdicksplace.blogspot.com/2006/07/now-where-in-hell-should-i-begin-this.html
Posted by: dick at August 02, 2006 01:46 PM (XlQVK)
2
Dick. If you use the new commetn thingy and clicky the 7th icon you can do this. http://bigdicksplace.blogspot.com/2006/07/now-where-in-hell-should-i-begin-this.html
Posted by: Howie at August 02, 2006 01:49 PM (D3+20)
3
It's on between Iran and America. The war in Lebanon is being fought by their proxies. Folks need to choose sides.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 02, 2006 02:05 PM (8e/V4)
4
I don't believe the US ever declared war during the Korean war.
Destroy Iran and all the bullshit will stop. If we don't it will spread to Africa and South America.
Destroy Iran and all the bullshit will stop. If we don't it will spread to Africa and South America.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 02, 2006 02:36 PM (XqAoh)
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Come on Howie,
WWIII ended in on Christmas 1991 with the disolution of the Soviet Union- thereby ending the Cold War/ Great War on Communisim/ WWIII.
WWIV started on 9-11. It is still on going.
WWIII ended in on Christmas 1991 with the disolution of the Soviet Union- thereby ending the Cold War/ Great War on Communisim/ WWIII.
WWIV started on 9-11. It is still on going.
Posted by: QC at August 02, 2006 02:49 PM (PX+vn)
6
The best thing the west could do to win this war is to find a way to end our dependence on oil. It is the oil that flows from Iran to Europe, and from Saudi to the US that is the biggest part of the funding of these Islamists.
The rulers of those oil producing countries pay off these groups to keep them off of their ass, and try to put the blame for their plight on others. "It's all the Israeli's and the American's fault that we are kept down"..... BULLSHIT !!
We can never reason with these groups, they only care about these things: their tribe or clan, any past transgression against them or their clan (whether real or imagined), and the entire world under Sharia law. Anyone who is not with them, can and should die by their reasoning... and by their reasoning I mean what their Iman tells them, because ... 1. if it's not in the Koran then it doesn't exist and 2. the masses are too stupid to make the correct decision for themselves as to what it says, so the Iman has to interpret it for them.
If we didn't buy their oil, the funding for everything they do would totally dry up. Also, no nukes for Iran without the cash to keep everything running. Once that money disappears, their economies would crash, the tyrants and mullahs would be crushed by the people looking for direction (and food).
We could fight this fight for a thousand years and NOT win the battle as long as we are their buying oil. If we stop funding them, it might still take a decade or so but we could win.
The rulers of those oil producing countries pay off these groups to keep them off of their ass, and try to put the blame for their plight on others. "It's all the Israeli's and the American's fault that we are kept down"..... BULLSHIT !!
We can never reason with these groups, they only care about these things: their tribe or clan, any past transgression against them or their clan (whether real or imagined), and the entire world under Sharia law. Anyone who is not with them, can and should die by their reasoning... and by their reasoning I mean what their Iman tells them, because ... 1. if it's not in the Koran then it doesn't exist and 2. the masses are too stupid to make the correct decision for themselves as to what it says, so the Iman has to interpret it for them.
If we didn't buy their oil, the funding for everything they do would totally dry up. Also, no nukes for Iran without the cash to keep everything running. Once that money disappears, their economies would crash, the tyrants and mullahs would be crushed by the people looking for direction (and food).
We could fight this fight for a thousand years and NOT win the battle as long as we are their buying oil. If we stop funding them, it might still take a decade or so but we could win.
Posted by: memphis761 at August 02, 2006 03:18 PM (D3+20)
7
Good post, I've linked to you here: http://consul-at-arms.blogspot.com/2006/08/re-victory-no-not-victory-begun-ww-iii.html
Posted by: Consul-At-Arms at August 02, 2006 05:48 PM (cQmlH)
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Very eloquent, Howie.
Posted by: Oyster at August 02, 2006 07:18 PM (YudAC)
9
Pardon my ignorance, but just what exactly happens tomorrow at 8:00pm EDT?
Posted by: CanForce 101 at August 02, 2006 08:37 PM (xfvyZ)
10
Thanks Oyster, Consul, I tried my best.
Posted by: Darth Odie at August 02, 2006 09:57 PM (D3+20)
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I fixed a few more errs since you all like it.
Oh and someone made and excellent chess/war association here today.
I say Iran is setting up to place Israel in check. Israel is trying to take out at least a night and a bishop to disrupt the attack. Of course if you could take out queen Nasarallah that would be a good move.
Oh and someone made and excellent chess/war association here today.
I say Iran is setting up to place Israel in check. Israel is trying to take out at least a night and a bishop to disrupt the attack. Of course if you could take out queen Nasarallah that would be a good move.
Posted by: Darth Odie at August 02, 2006 10:03 PM (D3+20)
12
Memphis761: Would be nice but wouldn't work. If we stopped buying oil tomorrow the price would drop and Europe and the emerging nations like China and India would grow tremenously until they relied on it the same as we. In 30 years in will start to dry up. The countries that have the space and climate to grow alternative fuels will rule. As more and more grains go to fuel the price of food may soar. Who will be in the catbirds seat. Heh, heh. China, India, Africa and the middle east cannot feed itself now.
And with the exception of China the rest continue to over populate without regard of their future. Maybe they will all become muslims and threaten us with nuclear war if we don't feed them. Who knows the future. But oil will dry up.
And with the exception of China the rest continue to over populate without regard of their future. Maybe they will all become muslims and threaten us with nuclear war if we don't feed them. Who knows the future. But oil will dry up.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 07:00 AM (XqAoh)
13
WWIV started on 9-11. It is still on going.
You are off by over two decades.
Radical islam is the adversary, and they first attacked the US on November 4, 1979.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Hostage_Crisis
A truly amazing amount of the crap we've had to deal with in the middle east orginated in Tehran.
You are off by over two decades.
Radical islam is the adversary, and they first attacked the US on November 4, 1979.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Hostage_Crisis
A truly amazing amount of the crap we've had to deal with in the middle east orginated in Tehran.
Posted by: rosignol at August 03, 2006 07:41 AM (ofA/v)
14
Iranians are the #1 shit stirers in history.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 12:01 PM (XqAoh)
15
Dunno the date, but WW IV (we won WW III aka The Cold War in '8
began with the assassination of RFK in the summer of '68.
Most of us (not all, certainly) just started paying attention on 9/11.
began with the assassination of RFK in the summer of '68.
Most of us (not all, certainly) just started paying attention on 9/11.
Posted by: Tim at August 03, 2006 02:11 PM (kQdjB)
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rosignol, I considered saying it started then, but decided since we didn't become a war until we woke up and decided to fight back.
Posted by: QC at August 03, 2006 10:20 PM (uGBZD)
Green Helmet Guy to "Helm" Holocaust Miniseries
From PointFiveBlog:
"We're extremely excited to be working with Green Helmet Guy" said Dora Bridges, an ABC spokeswoman. "It's hard to turn a corner in the world of Lebanese productions and not find him somewhere involved."Green Helmet Guy burst into the world of Hizb'Allah street theater in 1996, with a blockbuster called The First Qana Massacre, in which his star was a small child with its head blown off. He has since worked with many other corpses, his projects always seeing multiple encores and extended runs His latest project, Qana 2, has drawn praise for his "sensitive handling of death in a war zone," although some critics have balked at its four hour length. . . .
Bridges said that Green Helmet Guy has an encyclopedic knowledge of the Holocaust, and can tick off facts and statistics endlessly. "He knows everything about how the 'gas chambers' were really just for delousing, how the requirements for incinerating millions of bodies would have been far beyond the capabilities of fuel- strapped Germany, how most of the 'missing Jews' actually just emigrated to America or Britain. I just laugh when he gets going-- he sounds just like Mel [Gibson].
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August 01, 2006
Houston, We Have An Invasion
I'd call 10,000 troops an invasion, wouldn't you?
Bill Roggio analyzes.
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That's my Israel. Now you're talking!!!
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 01, 2006 10:51 PM (8e/V4)
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Why am I suddenly tempted to change your nickname to Holy Land Carlos?
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief Pro Temporeâ„¢ at August 02, 2006 12:18 AM (/qy9A)
Posted by: g at August 02, 2006 03:05 AM (KIU4h)
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After viewing an interview with the president of Lebanon, I realize that he is a supporter of Hezbollah. Bloggers here said so before. They were right. He was easy to see through. No excuses please. If he's afraid of Hezbollah he should resign and take testosterone shots.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 02, 2006 05:19 AM (XqAoh)
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"Israel has not yet released the identity of those captured. However, when asked by the AP whether any were "big fish," Olmert said: "They are tasty fishes.""
hahaha!
hahaha!
Posted by: Oyster at August 02, 2006 07:11 AM (YudAC)
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I say God Speed to the IDF.
In the larger context of stopping Islamic ambitions of world domination, eradicating Hizbullah is very significant because it would also be a major humiliation for the Mullah regime of Iran on whose behalf Hizbullah is acting.
The Mo-slime psyche is such that they tend to rally around "power", humiliating the Mullahs causes them to be isolated even amongst Mo-slimes.
In the larger context of stopping Islamic ambitions of world domination, eradicating Hizbullah is very significant because it would also be a major humiliation for the Mullah regime of Iran on whose behalf Hizbullah is acting.
The Mo-slime psyche is such that they tend to rally around "power", humiliating the Mullahs causes them to be isolated even amongst Mo-slimes.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 02, 2006 07:51 AM (Bp6wV)
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Rooster, welcome back, and I'm afraid you are right. Hizb'Allah is the de facto ruler of Lebanon, and has been since the majority of the Syrians left. Why do you think the Syrians left so easily? Their clients were in charge. The government of Lebanon is afraid of Hizb'Allah, does not have the means to challenge them, and is fearful of a new civil war. Hizb'Allah has had veto power over Lebanese actions that might affect them, and has informed the government in no uncertain terms that they will take over Lebanon by force if neccessary. The Christians and Druze have no stomach for fighting, so they are going along. I would imagine that everyone with any sense in Lebanon is hoping Israel will destroy Hizb'Allah, but they are realistic enough to know that the Euros and many in the US, and of course, the rest of the uncivilized world will step in just in time to prevent the destruction of Hizb'Allah by Israel. Very strange why governments in the West would want to save these Islamist groups, but for some reason they do. The Lebanese are hedging their bets.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 02, 2006 10:35 AM (rUyw4)
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Witness the might of gregtard's rhetorical abilities and tremble before his crushin logic!!! This is a perfect example of why lefturds should be neutered, lobotomized, and... oh, wait, that would be redundant. We should just tie them all together and dump them in the ocean.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 02, 2006 01:03 PM (v3I+x)
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Damn IM: Calm down and please don't dump them in the ocean. I fish there.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 02, 2006 03:00 PM (XqAoh)
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Jesusland Joe: Okay. We understand the problem. But what can we do about it? Nothing I fear. I think governments get worn down by the left. Perhaps we could have a conservative/liberal all out war like Russia did. Only this time have the conservatives win.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 02, 2006 08:23 PM (XqAoh)
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10,000 an invasion? I thought the 12 million illegal aliens was an invasion.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 02, 2006 08:39 PM (8uWFo)
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Greyrooster, there is nothing that we can do about it right now other than supply and encourage Israel. To know that these animals are going to survive and kill again is very depressing. It is very much like the criminal element in NO. And very much like your fishing. Catch and release. Catch and release.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 02, 2006 08:53 PM (rUyw4)
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Yea! Catch and release. Catch and release. Same old shit. I say can them.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 07:23 AM (XqAoh)
Qana : IDF Corrects Earlier Statements, Hizb'Allah Story Still Falling Apart
From Ha'aretz:
As the Israel Air Force continues to investigate the air strike, questions have been raised over military accounts of the incident.I'm sure there will be those who are ready to pounce on the IDF for making an incorrect statement. I'll agree they deserve some criticism for making an incorrect statement. Do they get any credit for correcting it? Isn't the correction itself an indication of something positive? Does anyone remember the last time al Qaeda, Hamas or Hizb'Allah corrected an earlier statement?It now appears that the military had no information on rockets launched from the site of the building, or the presence of Hezbollah men at the time.
The Israel Defense Forces had said after the deadly air-strike that many rockets had been launched from Qana. However, it changed its version on Monday.
The site was included in an IAF plan to strike at several buildings in proximity to a previous launching site. Similar strikes were carried out in the past. However, there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike.
The article also notes the strange timing of Hizb'Allah's Qana narrative:
The survivors say rescue teams arrived only in the morning, as night conditions made the rescue mission difficult. The Red Cross in Tyre received a call for help only in the morning, explaining their late arrival.The Hizb'Allah side is apparently sticking to the story that the building collapsed around midnight.The media first heard of the bombing at 8 A.M. The foreign press quoted Lebanese sources explaining the late announcement, saying the electricity and phones in the village of Qana were almost entirely cut-off by IAF attacks.
So, if you believe Hizb'Allah, the building collapsed around midnight, with ~50 people inside, including at least 19 children. There were apparently a whole bunch of witnesses to the building's collapse. This didn't happen in the middle of nowhere. After the building collapsed, the villagers leapt to action and... did what? Were there any survivors under the rubble? Did the villagers attempt to find out? Did they care? Did they dive into the wreckage to save any of their loved ones who may have survived the building's collapse? It doesn't appear so. Israel Insider notes that
Lebanese rescue teams did not start evacuating the building until the morning and only after the camera crews came. The absence of a real rescue effort was explained by saying that equipment was lacking. There were no scenes of live or injured people being extracted.
From what we can tell, the villagers did exactly NOTHING in the wake of the collapse. We're told the villagers didn't dig into the rubble to search for survivors because... well, there were "conditions," you see, and they were... well, they were "NIGHT conditions." And you know how those night conditions are. They're all, ya know, "night-ish" & dark & stuff. Somebody might trip or something. There might be ghosts. The villagers apparently couldn't call anyone because all communications lines (wired and wireless) out of Qana were completely cut off between midnight and 7:00 am. They couldn't send anyone up the road to Tyre (15 miles away) to get help because... well, we're not really sure why no one did that, but I'm sure there will be some explanation. Or there won't.
The more we hear about the events at Qana, the less Hizb'Allah's story makes any sense at all.
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Despite the evidence which shreds the conspiracy theories, including the admission of guilt by Al Queda, there are still those that readily believe that 9/11 was an inside job. Qana is no different. Hizb'allah could release a statement like "Yes we staged it, stuffing the building with dead kids and then bringing it down. Whatcha gonna do about?" The Israelis would still be blamed until the end of time for it.
Posted by: Graeme at August 01, 2006 02:16 PM (5Yhea)
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Notice how Haaretz couldn't/didn't want to name any names of their "IDF sources"...
Posted by: Ariya at August 01, 2006 02:25 PM (yHb0A)
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Ariya -
I guess you lost me. Isn't that the normal course of business for undisclosed sources--i.e., that their identity not be disclosed?
I guess you lost me. Isn't that the normal course of business for undisclosed sources--i.e., that their identity not be disclosed?
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 02:28 PM (c/4ax)
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Graeme,
Or, to put the shoe on the other foot, Israel could apologize for the unintentional killings of civilians at Qana, admit their responsibility, and people here would still believe it was Hezbollah that faked it.
Oh wait, that's already happened.
Or, to put the shoe on the other foot, Israel could apologize for the unintentional killings of civilians at Qana, admit their responsibility, and people here would still believe it was Hezbollah that faked it.
Oh wait, that's already happened.
Posted by: notdj at August 01, 2006 02:29 PM (aqTJB)
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 02:30 PM (c/4ax)
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notdj -
You're apparently ready to swallow the Hizb'Allah line despite the fact that nothing about the story makes sense.
Assuming the facts are as the villagers present them, can you even begin to explain the bizarre behavior of the locals? If you knew people were trapped under a building and there were no rescue workers available, would you stand around for eight hours for someone to do something, or would you get in and try to do something? Even if you weren't sure whether to dig, wouldn't you call the rescue teams up the road, or go get them, if necessary? Would the arrival of the news cameras have any effect on your behavior one way or the other?
Once you started digging, and you found a dead baby in the rubble, would you spend all day dancing around with it for the benefit of the news cameras, or would you go back to digging, hoping, even against hope, that someone might still be alive under there?
You wouldn't--unless you knew for a fact that there were no living people in the rubble.
Botom line: this story is as fishy as a wharf. Why do you find that so hard to admit?
You're apparently ready to swallow the Hizb'Allah line despite the fact that nothing about the story makes sense.
Assuming the facts are as the villagers present them, can you even begin to explain the bizarre behavior of the locals? If you knew people were trapped under a building and there were no rescue workers available, would you stand around for eight hours for someone to do something, or would you get in and try to do something? Even if you weren't sure whether to dig, wouldn't you call the rescue teams up the road, or go get them, if necessary? Would the arrival of the news cameras have any effect on your behavior one way or the other?
Once you started digging, and you found a dead baby in the rubble, would you spend all day dancing around with it for the benefit of the news cameras, or would you go back to digging, hoping, even against hope, that someone might still be alive under there?
You wouldn't--unless you knew for a fact that there were no living people in the rubble.
Botom line: this story is as fishy as a wharf. Why do you find that so hard to admit?
Posted by: All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 02:42 PM (c/4ax)
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All-Seeing Eye: notjd is a self-loathing Jew. He will never admit anything good about Israel, America, or the West so long as a potential negative is in sight.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 03:06 PM (vBK4C)
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It isn't that fishy to me, although I'm willing to see what trained forensic experts say about claims about the state of the bodies, etc.
As for the pause--hell, it's in the middle of a war zone, Israeli jets overhead, missiles falling. Do you think people are going to rush out of their own shelters when they hear a large explosion? Me, I'd burrow down until I was sure it was safe.
So it doesn't seem suspicious that the rescue operations begin in the morning. And again, where do they get those dead bodies? Whose are they? they don't seem all that worried about people recognizing their faces. Imagine you are some Christian Arab in Lebanon, and you see Hezbollah waving your mother's corpse around, saying she was killed in a bombing by the Israelis, and you know she was killed last week of heart attack. And buried for all you knew.
If your conspiracy theory is true, where do they find these bodies?
I do think Hezbollah is inviting reporters in, parading the bodies before the media. Absolutely. From their perspective, it is inconceivable that the world still sees them as the agressors, and not Israel. I'm closer to seeing it Israel's way most of the time, but I'm trying to understand why they parade with their dead. It is an attempt to affect world opinion.
It does not mean this tragedy was staged in some way. Was the 100 dead in 96 in Qana staged? Sabra and Shatila? Sometimes, Israel is culpable in terrible things. I say this as a man who believes in their right to exist in a safe and secure nation, at peace with its neighbors. They, like all nations, have a right to self-defense.
I do, incidentally, very much like the suggestion by Totten that what they should have done is bomb Syria for every missile from hezbollah. In addition, they should have attacked the south only. The attack on the power plant on the coast has been a disaster, a half-Valdez in a very small sea.
As for the pause--hell, it's in the middle of a war zone, Israeli jets overhead, missiles falling. Do you think people are going to rush out of their own shelters when they hear a large explosion? Me, I'd burrow down until I was sure it was safe.
So it doesn't seem suspicious that the rescue operations begin in the morning. And again, where do they get those dead bodies? Whose are they? they don't seem all that worried about people recognizing their faces. Imagine you are some Christian Arab in Lebanon, and you see Hezbollah waving your mother's corpse around, saying she was killed in a bombing by the Israelis, and you know she was killed last week of heart attack. And buried for all you knew.
If your conspiracy theory is true, where do they find these bodies?
I do think Hezbollah is inviting reporters in, parading the bodies before the media. Absolutely. From their perspective, it is inconceivable that the world still sees them as the agressors, and not Israel. I'm closer to seeing it Israel's way most of the time, but I'm trying to understand why they parade with their dead. It is an attempt to affect world opinion.
It does not mean this tragedy was staged in some way. Was the 100 dead in 96 in Qana staged? Sabra and Shatila? Sometimes, Israel is culpable in terrible things. I say this as a man who believes in their right to exist in a safe and secure nation, at peace with its neighbors. They, like all nations, have a right to self-defense.
I do, incidentally, very much like the suggestion by Totten that what they should have done is bomb Syria for every missile from hezbollah. In addition, they should have attacked the south only. The attack on the power plant on the coast has been a disaster, a half-Valdez in a very small sea.
Posted by: notdj at August 01, 2006 03:10 PM (aqTJB)
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Oh, and yes, the IDF gets points for correcting its misstatement. That's what honest bloggers and institutions do.
Posted by: notdj at August 01, 2006 03:10 PM (aqTJB)
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notdj -
I'm not going to say I know for the fact I'd have the courage to dig through the rubble in a war zone to try to save people trapped in it. I can't say that because I've never been in that situation. I'd like to think I'd have the intestinal fortitude to take a chance if I could help someone else. I'd like to think other folks would do the same thing if I were trapped. I'd hate to think "I'd burrow down until I knew it was safe" and ignore the fact that people may be dying while I was hiding. Frankly, the thought makes me ill. I believe that even the bad guys love their own children. Maybe I'm wrong.
If we can believe Hizb'Allah, there are 400 or so dead bodies of "civilians" in southern Lebanon. Around 30 dead children were on display in Tyre just a day earlier. No one's saying conclusively that these children didn't die as a result of IAF airstrikes. It's not unlikely that they did--but that's not even close to the point.
The fact that Sabra and Shatila happened doesn't mean that Jenin happened or that Mohammed al-Duri really died. I happen to believe that the truth matters. Should we PRETEND that Jenin and al-Duri did happen, since they might have happened if the world had been different? What sense does that make? If a bad thing happened, we should admit it. If it didn't really happen, however, there's no reason to act as if it really did happen.
Given the world situation, we could conceive of Hizb'Allah shooting a missile at a ship evacuating US citizens from Beirut. If there's an unexplained explosion on one of those ships, should we ASSUME that it's a Hizb'Allah missile without further inquiry, or should we pay attention to the EVIDENCE? I know plenty of lefties who'll never believe the official story on 911 no matter how much evidence might come to light. I'll bet a lot of those same folks are ready to swallow Hizb'Allah's story without a second thought.
Back to Qana, Hizb'Allah apparently wants a replay of 1996. Yhe story that Hizb'Allah wants to tell about Qana 2006 is looking less and less like a true story. Some are saying it doesn't matter whether it REALLY happened, since it COULD HAVE happened. I find that position ridiculous.
I'm not going to say I know for the fact I'd have the courage to dig through the rubble in a war zone to try to save people trapped in it. I can't say that because I've never been in that situation. I'd like to think I'd have the intestinal fortitude to take a chance if I could help someone else. I'd like to think other folks would do the same thing if I were trapped. I'd hate to think "I'd burrow down until I knew it was safe" and ignore the fact that people may be dying while I was hiding. Frankly, the thought makes me ill. I believe that even the bad guys love their own children. Maybe I'm wrong.
If we can believe Hizb'Allah, there are 400 or so dead bodies of "civilians" in southern Lebanon. Around 30 dead children were on display in Tyre just a day earlier. No one's saying conclusively that these children didn't die as a result of IAF airstrikes. It's not unlikely that they did--but that's not even close to the point.
The fact that Sabra and Shatila happened doesn't mean that Jenin happened or that Mohammed al-Duri really died. I happen to believe that the truth matters. Should we PRETEND that Jenin and al-Duri did happen, since they might have happened if the world had been different? What sense does that make? If a bad thing happened, we should admit it. If it didn't really happen, however, there's no reason to act as if it really did happen.
Given the world situation, we could conceive of Hizb'Allah shooting a missile at a ship evacuating US citizens from Beirut. If there's an unexplained explosion on one of those ships, should we ASSUME that it's a Hizb'Allah missile without further inquiry, or should we pay attention to the EVIDENCE? I know plenty of lefties who'll never believe the official story on 911 no matter how much evidence might come to light. I'll bet a lot of those same folks are ready to swallow Hizb'Allah's story without a second thought.
Back to Qana, Hizb'Allah apparently wants a replay of 1996. Yhe story that Hizb'Allah wants to tell about Qana 2006 is looking less and less like a true story. Some are saying it doesn't matter whether it REALLY happened, since it COULD HAVE happened. I find that position ridiculous.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 04:03 PM (c/4ax)
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I do not subscribe to the "conspiracy theory."
However that being said, one thing is apparent -- the Jihadi's have found a way to neutralize both Israel and the U.S militaries superior technology of precision air-strikes, by ensuring civilian casualties they know they can turn the Muslim world, and most of the International community opinions by making sure pictures of dead Women and Children are shown all over the world.
The strength of a Guerilla war is the ability to completely bog down a conventional military response -- by removing the ability to destroy terrorists with air firepower, it ensures that troops have to be committed and fight hand to hand, and this is how the Jihadi's love it, this allows them to attack supply lines with IED's, to use civilian's as cover, and fight in civilian clothing and do all of the things that give them an advantage over the military who follow the rules of war.
However that being said, one thing is apparent -- the Jihadi's have found a way to neutralize both Israel and the U.S militaries superior technology of precision air-strikes, by ensuring civilian casualties they know they can turn the Muslim world, and most of the International community opinions by making sure pictures of dead Women and Children are shown all over the world.
The strength of a Guerilla war is the ability to completely bog down a conventional military response -- by removing the ability to destroy terrorists with air firepower, it ensures that troops have to be committed and fight hand to hand, and this is how the Jihadi's love it, this allows them to attack supply lines with IED's, to use civilian's as cover, and fight in civilian clothing and do all of the things that give them an advantage over the military who follow the rules of war.
Posted by: davec at August 01, 2006 04:25 PM (voZp6)
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Eye--you make good points. I'm certainly not one of those who says it doesn't matter what the truth is. It matters intensely.
And yes, if I knew that the building down the street had been blown apart, I'd go help if I could. My point is that in the midst of a bombardment, you don't know what has happened down the street. In the dark, with no civil defense units, with no lights, with no ambulances, with no fire trucks, with no winches or cranes...it seems a lot to ask that the Lebanese immediately organize into rescue missions. I don't think it is because they are cowards who don't love their children or their fellow citizens.
Did they pick up bodies from one bombing, and transport them en masse to Qana? I guess it is possible, although driving a truck through that part of Southern Lebanon is sort of like signing your own death warrant. It would take some pretty convincing evidence to sway me to that. Occam's Razor still points towards an Israeli strike that went badly awry. But let's see what further investigation brings.
And yes, if I knew that the building down the street had been blown apart, I'd go help if I could. My point is that in the midst of a bombardment, you don't know what has happened down the street. In the dark, with no civil defense units, with no lights, with no ambulances, with no fire trucks, with no winches or cranes...it seems a lot to ask that the Lebanese immediately organize into rescue missions. I don't think it is because they are cowards who don't love their children or their fellow citizens.
Did they pick up bodies from one bombing, and transport them en masse to Qana? I guess it is possible, although driving a truck through that part of Southern Lebanon is sort of like signing your own death warrant. It would take some pretty convincing evidence to sway me to that. Occam's Razor still points towards an Israeli strike that went badly awry. But let's see what further investigation brings.
Posted by: notdj at August 01, 2006 04:25 PM (aqTJB)
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Eye, I suspect Hezballah's propaganda isn't the only thing of theirs jd is eager to swallow.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 01, 2006 04:34 PM (v3I+x)
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There have been a lot of Jewish women, and children murdered by the likes of Hizboallah. Maybe, Hizboallah is finding out, it does not feel so good. War sucks.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 01, 2006 05:25 PM (D2g/j)
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There have been a lot of Jewish women, and children murdered by the likes of Hizboallah. Maybe, Hizboallah is finding out it does not feel so good. War sucks.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 01, 2006 05:26 PM (D2g/j)
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>>>However, there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike.
If there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike, it becomes hard to argue that it was a Hesbollah setup. Am I missing something here?
If there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike, it becomes hard to argue that it was a Hesbollah setup. Am I missing something here?
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 01, 2006 05:48 PM (8e/V4)
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notdj -
I'm not claiming the Lebanese are cowards. If they knew that there were no living people in the building to begin with, there would be no reason to get agitated about the bodies in the rubble. Only if there was a chance that a living person might die would there be any reason to be concerned. If you knew for a fact that every body in the building was already dead, there is no need for immediacy and hiding becomes completely defensible.
As to how much we can reasonably expect from the civilians, remember that eight hours went by. It wasn't a thirty minute delay, or even an hour delay. This was an eight hour delay. No effort to search for survivors. No calls for help. No digging, no calls to the Red Cross, no calls to the nearby city of Tyre, no calls to reporters, no messengers to Tyre. No action for EIGHT HOURS.
In my opinion, this is strange--but only if the people in the building were alive when it collapsed.
If the bodies were placed there, I seriously doubt that the bodies were from a single incident. If they were, why move them? Instead, the children were more likely the casualties of a number of different airstrikes, none particularly dramatic by itself.
I'm not claiming the Lebanese are cowards. If they knew that there were no living people in the building to begin with, there would be no reason to get agitated about the bodies in the rubble. Only if there was a chance that a living person might die would there be any reason to be concerned. If you knew for a fact that every body in the building was already dead, there is no need for immediacy and hiding becomes completely defensible.
As to how much we can reasonably expect from the civilians, remember that eight hours went by. It wasn't a thirty minute delay, or even an hour delay. This was an eight hour delay. No effort to search for survivors. No calls for help. No digging, no calls to the Red Cross, no calls to the nearby city of Tyre, no calls to reporters, no messengers to Tyre. No action for EIGHT HOURS.
In my opinion, this is strange--but only if the people in the building were alive when it collapsed.
If the bodies were placed there, I seriously doubt that the bodies were from a single incident. If they were, why move them? Instead, the children were more likely the casualties of a number of different airstrikes, none particularly dramatic by itself.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 06:17 PM (c/4ax)
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JC -
I don't see that at all, so long as the IAF behaves in a somewhat predictable pattern. The absence of missile launches on that day plays directly into Hizb'Allah's "IAF is targeting civilians" theme. The only question is whether you can force an airstrike on a day when rockets aren't flying. Hizb'Allah would know that based on IAF targeting patterns. With a few experiments, they could gain insight into how the IAF will react to a given situation and manipulate accordingly. It's not necessary to pick a particular building, or even a particular village--though there is a certain poetry to using Qana. I can definitely see a game plan put together in advance looking something like this:
1. Fire shitloads of rockets from Qana, thereby reserving Qana a good spot on the "high-value targets" list.
2. Await an airstrike on a suitable building.
3. Collect corpses
4. Load the building full of corpses.
5. Blow the building.
6. Call the media.
Is that so hard to believe?
I don't see that at all, so long as the IAF behaves in a somewhat predictable pattern. The absence of missile launches on that day plays directly into Hizb'Allah's "IAF is targeting civilians" theme. The only question is whether you can force an airstrike on a day when rockets aren't flying. Hizb'Allah would know that based on IAF targeting patterns. With a few experiments, they could gain insight into how the IAF will react to a given situation and manipulate accordingly. It's not necessary to pick a particular building, or even a particular village--though there is a certain poetry to using Qana. I can definitely see a game plan put together in advance looking something like this:
1. Fire shitloads of rockets from Qana, thereby reserving Qana a good spot on the "high-value targets" list.
2. Await an airstrike on a suitable building.
3. Collect corpses
4. Load the building full of corpses.
5. Blow the building.
6. Call the media.
Is that so hard to believe?
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 06:57 PM (c/4ax)
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On this subject I'm wondering whether I should believe a civilized people whose creed is "Thou shalt not lie"; or a bunch of callous murderous brutes whose creed is to resort to "Taqqiyah = falsification" and "Kitman = obfuscation"?!? Hmmmmmmmm?!?!?!?!?
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 01, 2006 07:22 PM (Bp6wV)
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You know , If I had not posted on that pro hezbollah professor just before this happened and saw how they use the dead bodies of children for propaganda I might half ass believe them. Sorry no matter what the truth is I discount it somewhat becuase I know they are using it (sensationalizing it). Also this is a 24/7 story in the ME. Bigger than here by far and here it's big. It's the thing like nightline and the first gulf war was here.
Posted by: Howie at August 01, 2006 08:31 PM (D3+20)
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The All-Seeing Eye,
I just read a very interesting article on the implications of the Qana incident for the Muslime mind called "Why Should Muslims pray for Israel?" http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=306
I just read a very interesting article on the implications of the Qana incident for the Muslime mind called "Why Should Muslims pray for Israel?" http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=306
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 01, 2006 08:33 PM (Bp6wV)
22
Here's what real victims look like being pulled from the rubble. They look a lot like the bodies of my friends that I pulled out of rubble back in 1983.
http://www.ogrish.com/archives/rocket_attack_israel_Aug_01_2006.html
Not those moulaged up bodies the Hezbillies recycled.
http://www.ogrish.com/archives/rocket_attack_israel_Aug_01_2006.html
Not those moulaged up bodies the Hezbillies recycled.
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 01, 2006 10:47 PM (2BOvC)
23
I just posted on my blog about a whole string of questions that I have concerning the behaviour of the rescuers.(it is along the lines of all-seeing-eyes thinking)
I end with this, because to me this is the essential question.
Did the rescuers know there was no one alive to hurry for? Or did they not care?
That to me is the essential question.
Because if my child was trapped in the rubble and I saw Green Helmet and White T-Shirt doing the dead baby parade I would be mighty sore and Green Helmet and White T-Shirt would find themselves mighty sore as well.
We may not get the answers to any of the questions to anyones satisfaction.
BTW, there was of course a delay between the reports of missiles coming out of Qana and the bombing of Qana. Israel sent leaflets and warnings to the people to leave as they intended to bomb the area, and gave the people of the area several DAYS to leave...which of course would give Hezzbullah time to leave as well. It pushes them back, hopefully further, into Lebanon, further from Israel, and the strikes would then prevent FUTURE bombings as they would have less places to hide, and would be more visible to ground troops. At least that is my way of thinking.
I end with this, because to me this is the essential question.
Did the rescuers know there was no one alive to hurry for? Or did they not care?
That to me is the essential question.
Because if my child was trapped in the rubble and I saw Green Helmet and White T-Shirt doing the dead baby parade I would be mighty sore and Green Helmet and White T-Shirt would find themselves mighty sore as well.
We may not get the answers to any of the questions to anyones satisfaction.
BTW, there was of course a delay between the reports of missiles coming out of Qana and the bombing of Qana. Israel sent leaflets and warnings to the people to leave as they intended to bomb the area, and gave the people of the area several DAYS to leave...which of course would give Hezzbullah time to leave as well. It pushes them back, hopefully further, into Lebanon, further from Israel, and the strikes would then prevent FUTURE bombings as they would have less places to hide, and would be more visible to ground troops. At least that is my way of thinking.
Posted by: Rachel Ann at August 04, 2006 02:05 AM (yKZpp)
24
btw, concerning the lack of brusing etc. on the bodies...
Here is a picture of a mom and her son who claimed they survived Qana, both of whom did have bruises. http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=1127142006
So there is a question as to why the other children don't have bruises. (so perhaps some bodies were brought in?)Even if they suffocated, they aren't likely to have suffocated in ten seconds flat...there should be some sign of bruising or tearing of the skin from the first few moments when the rubble fell on them..crushed heads, wounds etc. There should have been some blood.
Also the pictures don't show that there is a great amount of rubble covering the children. You can see people are partially covered, not completely covered. Faster work, if indeed those children were alive to begin with and not plants, could have saved some more.
Like I said above, either the rescuers knew there was no one to rescue or they didn't care.
Here is a picture of a mom and her son who claimed they survived Qana, both of whom did have bruises. http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=1127142006
So there is a question as to why the other children don't have bruises. (so perhaps some bodies were brought in?)Even if they suffocated, they aren't likely to have suffocated in ten seconds flat...there should be some sign of bruising or tearing of the skin from the first few moments when the rubble fell on them..crushed heads, wounds etc. There should have been some blood.
Also the pictures don't show that there is a great amount of rubble covering the children. You can see people are partially covered, not completely covered. Faster work, if indeed those children were alive to begin with and not plants, could have saved some more.
Like I said above, either the rescuers knew there was no one to rescue or they didn't care.
Posted by: Rachel Ann at August 04, 2006 02:19 AM (yKZpp)
Qana : Michelle Hammers it Home
Posted by: Ragnar at
10:44 AM
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Post contains 6 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Hezbollah is supported by Iran, OK, but those bombs are all American made, baby!
You better start talking were this Israeli war is going to end, because; it is going to be nasty.
The Israelis do not have a clear win strategy unless they are wiling to take over Lebanon completely and smoke every hole by hand. This thing is being pushed in such a way that eventually every surrounding country will become part of it (Syria is already deploying his troops at their border). Iran and Iraq are rumbling up men. Turkey is also deploying troops to get into Kurdistan, against the troublesome PKK rebels. Every other country is busy with something else, so why not! This will place Israel in a tight spot and needs the help from America to get them out of it. As being the plan from the beginning!
This is going to be big, huge, massive, ugly and nasty. WAR!!!
Go polish your nails sucker pop. Or better, Start collecting aluminum for the war industry!
You better start talking were this Israeli war is going to end, because; it is going to be nasty.
The Israelis do not have a clear win strategy unless they are wiling to take over Lebanon completely and smoke every hole by hand. This thing is being pushed in such a way that eventually every surrounding country will become part of it (Syria is already deploying his troops at their border). Iran and Iraq are rumbling up men. Turkey is also deploying troops to get into Kurdistan, against the troublesome PKK rebels. Every other country is busy with something else, so why not! This will place Israel in a tight spot and needs the help from America to get them out of it. As being the plan from the beginning!
This is going to be big, huge, massive, ugly and nasty. WAR!!!
Go polish your nails sucker pop. Or better, Start collecting aluminum for the war industry!
Posted by: Dan at August 01, 2006 12:18 PM (Z2OsI)
2
Right on Michelle! Keep hammering the filthy cockroaches! Blast away!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 01, 2006 12:37 PM (gLMre)
3
Odd! " Evil, wicked, mean and nasty " Sounds a lot like ...... Armegeddon! Sing praises!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 01, 2006 12:42 PM (gLMre)
4
THE RESURGENCE OF ORWELLIAN IDEALS
BY: FERN SIDMAN
When George Orwell originally penned his classic novel "1984", I would venture a guess that neither he nor his readers ever actually envisaged a world that would embrace these warped and twisted values. Fast forward to the year 2006 and we are witness to a world that is being taunted with such strikingly similar values. We live in a world where otherwise educated and civilized people perceive an aggressor as a victim and the victim as the aggressor. Ideals and organizations that are predicated on a theology of terror and espouse a mantra of hate have been elevated to a heroic like status. They have garnered sympathy and support, while the world expresses its unabashed opprobrium towards concepts and countries that espouse justice and respect for life.
We need only look to the current crisis in the Middle East for qualification of the latest version of Orwellian values. The organization known as Hezbollah, an internationally renowned terrorist organization that is being sponsored by Iran and Syria, countries that espouse terrorism and the ultimate demise of Israel and the Western world, staged an unprovoked attack against Israel on July 12th. Since that time, Israel and Hezbollah have been embroiled in a war that raised the ire of the world. The Lebanese people have been used as human shields by Hezbollah whose main objective is to transform the fledgling democracy in Lebanon into another fundamentalist Islamic state.
Hezbollah is a well organized and thoroughly trained band of guerilla fighters who fight their battles while living in civilian populations and blending in with the civilian infrastructure. Since the inception of this current conflict they have fired thousands of Katyusha rockets into Israel from civilian strongholds and neighborhoods throughout southern Lebanon and in Beirut. Civilians are warned each and every time Israel prepares to strike back at Hezbollah terrorists. Thousands of leaflets are disseminated through these civilian areas, imploring all civilians to leave the area.
The recent incident in Qana, which aroused worldwide condemnation of Israel for the killing of 56 civilians, mostly women and children, deserves closer examination. According to writer David Horowitz, "Qana, be it noted was the source of 150 missile attacks on Israeli civilians, and the population of Qana was warned to leave but chose to stay alongside the terrorists. Like most of Lebanon, the population of Qana is on the side of the aggressors, and apparently like most Muslims in this part of the world, death for them is a badge of martyrdom and honor, and a noble pathway to heaven. They are willing instruments of the Islamist jihad."
Further evidence of Hezbollah's intent to place the Lebanese civilian population at risk has been revealed by Israel Insider's Reuven Koret, who filed on a report on 7/31/06 which stated, "On the morning of July 30, according to the IDF, the air force came in three waves. In the first, between midnight and one in the morning, there was a strike at or near the building that eventually collapsed. There was a second strike at other targets far from the collapse building several hours later, and a third strike at around 7:30 in the morning. There too the nearest hit was some 460 meters away, according to the IDF. But first reports of a building collapse came only around 8 am.
Thus there was an unexplained 7 to 8 hour gap between the time of the helicopter strike and the building collapse. Brigadier General Amir Eshel, Head of the Air Force Headquarters, in a press briefing, told journalists that "the attack on the structure in the Qana village took place between midnight and one in the morning. The gap between the timing of the collapse of the building and the time of the strike on it is unclear."
Gen. Eshel appeared genuinely mystified by the gap in time. He said, "I'm saying this very carefully, because at this time I don't have a clue as to what the explanation could be for this gap," he added.
The army's only explanation was that somehow there was unexploded Hezbollah ordnance in the building that only detonated much later.
"It could be that inside the building, things that could eventually cause an explosion were being housed, things that we could not blow up in the attack, and maybe remained there, Brigadier General Eshel said.
Eshel reported that as recently as two days ago, military intelligence reported the building area had been used by the terrorists for storage or firing of weapons. It was a bad place to cram dozens of women and children.
There are other mysteries. The roof of the building was intact. Journalist Ben Wedeman of CNN noted that there was a larger crater next to the building, but observed that the building appeared not to have collapsed as a result of the Israeli strike.
Why would the civilians who had supposedly taken shelter in the basement of the building not leave after the post-midnight attack? They just went back to sleep and had the bad luck to wait for the building to collapse in the morning? "
These are questions that have yet to be answered. Perhaps in the days that follow investigations of this incident will uncover facts that Hezbollah would prefer to hide from the world. Hezbollah has already won the public relations battle. They clearly have the United Nations in their corner, an international governmental body that sits with bated breath at every opportunity to condemn Israel. They have the EU and the Arab countries on their side. South American and Asian countries have chimed in with their vocal and strident condemnation of Israel as well.
Hezbollah has won the hearts and minds of the Lebanese people, however, in retrospect that wasn't an arduous battle. The Lebanese people have thrown their support behind Hezbollah as is evidenced in the composition of the Lebanese parliament. Over 20 percent of the members of this parliament are Hezbollah representatives. The Lebanese people never demanded that their government implement and enforce United Nations Security Council resolution 1559 issued in the year 2000, which placed the responsibility of harnessing Hezbollah forces in the hands of the Lebanese military.
The Lebanese people, particularly the Shiitte population in southern Lebanon, view Hezbollah as a big, warm and giving social service agency. Hezbollah has adroitly filled the stomachs of its constituents, fattening them up, metaphorically speaking for the kill. For the beneficiaries of Hezbollah's outreach and social service programs are now being called upon to pay the piper. They pay with their lives and the lives of the children as human shields for those who gained favor in their hearts for all the "goodness" that was bestowed upon them.
It is of no great revelation that we hear that Lebanese president Faud Siniora praised Hezbollah for its efforts in defeating the Israeli enemy as he attempts to shore up even more support from the Lebanese population for Hezbollah, thereby encouraging even more of them to die as martyrs to an organization that cares nothing for them, their lives or the future of their children.
And yet we hear no sounds of outrage and indignation at the murderous policy of Hezbollah directed at the Lebanese people. We hear of no raucous and explosive demonstrations directed at Hezbollah for placing the lives of its own people in death's doorway. Instead, we are deluged with condemnations and denunciations of Israel's military actions in Lebanon. We hear the world condemn Israel's "disproportionate" response to the constant barrage of Katyusha rockets that have rained down on Israeli cities and towns. We hear admonitions directed at Israel to exercise self-restraint when attempting to defeat their hardened enemy that seeks its destruction.
As Charles Krauthammer stated in his article entitled, 'Disproportionate' in What Moral Universe?' (Washington Post, 7/28/06), "When one is wantonly attacked by an aggressor, one has every right -- legal and moral -- to carry the fight until the aggressor is disarmed and so disabled that it cannot threaten one's security again."
Mr. Krauthammer goes on to state that, "The perversity of today's international outcry lies in the fact that there is indeed a disproportion in this war, a radical moral asymmetry between Hezbollah and Israel: Hezbollah is deliberately trying to create civilian casualties on both sides while Israel is deliberately trying to minimize civilian casualties, also on both sides.
Israeli innocents must die in order for Israel to be terrorized. But Lebanese innocents must also die in order for Israel to be demonized, which is why Hezbollah hides its fighters, its rockets, its launchers, its entire infrastructure among civilians. Creating human shields is a war crime. It is also a Hezbollah specialty.
Had Israel wanted to destroy Lebanese civilian infrastructure, it would have turned out the lights in Beirut in the first hour of the war, destroying the billion-dollar power grid and setting back Lebanon 20 years. It did not do that. Instead it attacked dual-use infrastructure -- bridges, roads, airport runways -- and blockaded Lebanon's ports to prevent the reinforcement and resupply of Hezbollah. Ten thousand Katyusha rockets are enough. Israel was not going to allow Hezbollah 10,000 more."
Today the nation of Israel faces even more deadly attacks from the Hezbollah terrorists. Today the nation of Israel, which represents the values of preserving human life, of upholding the loftiest of moral concepts has been transformed into the world's bogeyman. It is viewed as a giant and ruthless murder machine, which displays a callous disregard for civilian lives. Today the nation of Israel is being raked over the proverbial coals by a world possessed by Orwellian values. Bad is good, right is wrong, justice is injustice. The aggressor is now the victim and the victim is now the horrific aggressor.
Mr. Orwell, wherever you are, we send you a message that your ominous vision has manifested itself. It is a world gone mad, and all vestiges of morality and conscience are slowly and methodically becoming obsolete.
At this most frightening and difficult period in history, those of us left with a modicum of morality, ethics and values must speak out. We must orchestrate a campaign to challenge the purveyors of Orwellian thoughts and to neutralize their vitriolic and incendiary rhetoric.
It is indeed a dark moment in the history of the Jewish people and of the nation of Israel. Our values and ethos must come from our unwavering faith and trust in the Almighty G-d of Israel. Our morals and values must be derived from our G-d given sources of Torah. Our values must reflect the words of our prayers to G-d. Our morals and values spring forth from the divine words of King David in the book of Psalms. It is time to rededicate ourselves to serving our G-d with devotion and passion.
May the Almighty G-d of Israel protect His nation, Israel and may we see a world that can distinguish between light and darkness and of right and wrong.
BY: FERN SIDMAN
When George Orwell originally penned his classic novel "1984", I would venture a guess that neither he nor his readers ever actually envisaged a world that would embrace these warped and twisted values. Fast forward to the year 2006 and we are witness to a world that is being taunted with such strikingly similar values. We live in a world where otherwise educated and civilized people perceive an aggressor as a victim and the victim as the aggressor. Ideals and organizations that are predicated on a theology of terror and espouse a mantra of hate have been elevated to a heroic like status. They have garnered sympathy and support, while the world expresses its unabashed opprobrium towards concepts and countries that espouse justice and respect for life.
We need only look to the current crisis in the Middle East for qualification of the latest version of Orwellian values. The organization known as Hezbollah, an internationally renowned terrorist organization that is being sponsored by Iran and Syria, countries that espouse terrorism and the ultimate demise of Israel and the Western world, staged an unprovoked attack against Israel on July 12th. Since that time, Israel and Hezbollah have been embroiled in a war that raised the ire of the world. The Lebanese people have been used as human shields by Hezbollah whose main objective is to transform the fledgling democracy in Lebanon into another fundamentalist Islamic state.
Hezbollah is a well organized and thoroughly trained band of guerilla fighters who fight their battles while living in civilian populations and blending in with the civilian infrastructure. Since the inception of this current conflict they have fired thousands of Katyusha rockets into Israel from civilian strongholds and neighborhoods throughout southern Lebanon and in Beirut. Civilians are warned each and every time Israel prepares to strike back at Hezbollah terrorists. Thousands of leaflets are disseminated through these civilian areas, imploring all civilians to leave the area.
The recent incident in Qana, which aroused worldwide condemnation of Israel for the killing of 56 civilians, mostly women and children, deserves closer examination. According to writer David Horowitz, "Qana, be it noted was the source of 150 missile attacks on Israeli civilians, and the population of Qana was warned to leave but chose to stay alongside the terrorists. Like most of Lebanon, the population of Qana is on the side of the aggressors, and apparently like most Muslims in this part of the world, death for them is a badge of martyrdom and honor, and a noble pathway to heaven. They are willing instruments of the Islamist jihad."
Further evidence of Hezbollah's intent to place the Lebanese civilian population at risk has been revealed by Israel Insider's Reuven Koret, who filed on a report on 7/31/06 which stated, "On the morning of July 30, according to the IDF, the air force came in three waves. In the first, between midnight and one in the morning, there was a strike at or near the building that eventually collapsed. There was a second strike at other targets far from the collapse building several hours later, and a third strike at around 7:30 in the morning. There too the nearest hit was some 460 meters away, according to the IDF. But first reports of a building collapse came only around 8 am.
Thus there was an unexplained 7 to 8 hour gap between the time of the helicopter strike and the building collapse. Brigadier General Amir Eshel, Head of the Air Force Headquarters, in a press briefing, told journalists that "the attack on the structure in the Qana village took place between midnight and one in the morning. The gap between the timing of the collapse of the building and the time of the strike on it is unclear."
Gen. Eshel appeared genuinely mystified by the gap in time. He said, "I'm saying this very carefully, because at this time I don't have a clue as to what the explanation could be for this gap," he added.
The army's only explanation was that somehow there was unexploded Hezbollah ordnance in the building that only detonated much later.
"It could be that inside the building, things that could eventually cause an explosion were being housed, things that we could not blow up in the attack, and maybe remained there, Brigadier General Eshel said.
Eshel reported that as recently as two days ago, military intelligence reported the building area had been used by the terrorists for storage or firing of weapons. It was a bad place to cram dozens of women and children.
There are other mysteries. The roof of the building was intact. Journalist Ben Wedeman of CNN noted that there was a larger crater next to the building, but observed that the building appeared not to have collapsed as a result of the Israeli strike.
Why would the civilians who had supposedly taken shelter in the basement of the building not leave after the post-midnight attack? They just went back to sleep and had the bad luck to wait for the building to collapse in the morning? "
These are questions that have yet to be answered. Perhaps in the days that follow investigations of this incident will uncover facts that Hezbollah would prefer to hide from the world. Hezbollah has already won the public relations battle. They clearly have the United Nations in their corner, an international governmental body that sits with bated breath at every opportunity to condemn Israel. They have the EU and the Arab countries on their side. South American and Asian countries have chimed in with their vocal and strident condemnation of Israel as well.
Hezbollah has won the hearts and minds of the Lebanese people, however, in retrospect that wasn't an arduous battle. The Lebanese people have thrown their support behind Hezbollah as is evidenced in the composition of the Lebanese parliament. Over 20 percent of the members of this parliament are Hezbollah representatives. The Lebanese people never demanded that their government implement and enforce United Nations Security Council resolution 1559 issued in the year 2000, which placed the responsibility of harnessing Hezbollah forces in the hands of the Lebanese military.
The Lebanese people, particularly the Shiitte population in southern Lebanon, view Hezbollah as a big, warm and giving social service agency. Hezbollah has adroitly filled the stomachs of its constituents, fattening them up, metaphorically speaking for the kill. For the beneficiaries of Hezbollah's outreach and social service programs are now being called upon to pay the piper. They pay with their lives and the lives of the children as human shields for those who gained favor in their hearts for all the "goodness" that was bestowed upon them.
It is of no great revelation that we hear that Lebanese president Faud Siniora praised Hezbollah for its efforts in defeating the Israeli enemy as he attempts to shore up even more support from the Lebanese population for Hezbollah, thereby encouraging even more of them to die as martyrs to an organization that cares nothing for them, their lives or the future of their children.
And yet we hear no sounds of outrage and indignation at the murderous policy of Hezbollah directed at the Lebanese people. We hear of no raucous and explosive demonstrations directed at Hezbollah for placing the lives of its own people in death's doorway. Instead, we are deluged with condemnations and denunciations of Israel's military actions in Lebanon. We hear the world condemn Israel's "disproportionate" response to the constant barrage of Katyusha rockets that have rained down on Israeli cities and towns. We hear admonitions directed at Israel to exercise self-restraint when attempting to defeat their hardened enemy that seeks its destruction.
As Charles Krauthammer stated in his article entitled, 'Disproportionate' in What Moral Universe?' (Washington Post, 7/28/06), "When one is wantonly attacked by an aggressor, one has every right -- legal and moral -- to carry the fight until the aggressor is disarmed and so disabled that it cannot threaten one's security again."
Mr. Krauthammer goes on to state that, "The perversity of today's international outcry lies in the fact that there is indeed a disproportion in this war, a radical moral asymmetry between Hezbollah and Israel: Hezbollah is deliberately trying to create civilian casualties on both sides while Israel is deliberately trying to minimize civilian casualties, also on both sides.
Israeli innocents must die in order for Israel to be terrorized. But Lebanese innocents must also die in order for Israel to be demonized, which is why Hezbollah hides its fighters, its rockets, its launchers, its entire infrastructure among civilians. Creating human shields is a war crime. It is also a Hezbollah specialty.
Had Israel wanted to destroy Lebanese civilian infrastructure, it would have turned out the lights in Beirut in the first hour of the war, destroying the billion-dollar power grid and setting back Lebanon 20 years. It did not do that. Instead it attacked dual-use infrastructure -- bridges, roads, airport runways -- and blockaded Lebanon's ports to prevent the reinforcement and resupply of Hezbollah. Ten thousand Katyusha rockets are enough. Israel was not going to allow Hezbollah 10,000 more."
Today the nation of Israel faces even more deadly attacks from the Hezbollah terrorists. Today the nation of Israel, which represents the values of preserving human life, of upholding the loftiest of moral concepts has been transformed into the world's bogeyman. It is viewed as a giant and ruthless murder machine, which displays a callous disregard for civilian lives. Today the nation of Israel is being raked over the proverbial coals by a world possessed by Orwellian values. Bad is good, right is wrong, justice is injustice. The aggressor is now the victim and the victim is now the horrific aggressor.
Mr. Orwell, wherever you are, we send you a message that your ominous vision has manifested itself. It is a world gone mad, and all vestiges of morality and conscience are slowly and methodically becoming obsolete.
At this most frightening and difficult period in history, those of us left with a modicum of morality, ethics and values must speak out. We must orchestrate a campaign to challenge the purveyors of Orwellian thoughts and to neutralize their vitriolic and incendiary rhetoric.
It is indeed a dark moment in the history of the Jewish people and of the nation of Israel. Our values and ethos must come from our unwavering faith and trust in the Almighty G-d of Israel. Our morals and values must be derived from our G-d given sources of Torah. Our values must reflect the words of our prayers to G-d. Our morals and values spring forth from the divine words of King David in the book of Psalms. It is time to rededicate ourselves to serving our G-d with devotion and passion.
May the Almighty G-d of Israel protect His nation, Israel and may we see a world that can distinguish between light and darkness and of right and wrong.
Posted by: FERN SIDMAN at August 01, 2006 04:10 PM (uy3W4)
5
Dan, oddly enough, you're correct, although not in the way you intend. It is going to turn into a regional war, and the sooner, the better, because war is the only way to fix things now.
Fern, great post! Orwell wasn't imagining a worst case scenario though; he was warning us of what was to come. If you combine aspects of 1984 and Huxley's Brave New World, you get what we have now - a screwed up mess.
Fern, great post! Orwell wasn't imagining a worst case scenario though; he was warning us of what was to come. If you combine aspects of 1984 and Huxley's Brave New World, you get what we have now - a screwed up mess.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 01, 2006 04:33 PM (v3I+x)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 02, 2006 03:04 AM (gLMre)
7
Too many words hurt the head, eh Larry? If I could only figure out a way to get people to pay for monosyllabic, non-compound sentence structure, one paragraph translations of thoughtful, well written works, I'd be rich, but lazy people are usually cheap anyway. Oh well.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 02, 2006 09:36 AM (v3I+x)
8
I am embarrassed for the pedegogs exposing themselves. Every extra word screams: " I'm a narcisstic pompous asshole who has the answer and can spell it out for all my inferior subjects. "
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 02, 2006 11:15 AM (gLMre)
More From the Qana Flim-Flam Festival
Cross-posted from The Dread Pundit Bluto
Yesterday, I suggested that the "massacre" at Qana was, in fact, a Hizballah-manufactured event in the tradition of Pallywood. Thanks to commenter Cmunk (see comments to The All-Seeing Eye's post below) for pointing me to this photo from SkyNews, which apparently shows an ammunition can in the rubble of the "victims" refuge: more...
Posted by: Bluto at
10:38 AM
| Comments (36)
| Add Comment
Post contains 67 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Yep, looks like an ammo can to me, but in the interest of total objectivity, ammo cans are useful for lots of other things; I, for example, have many which hold anything but ammo.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 01, 2006 12:00 PM (v3I+x)
2
Also there's that whole, "why did the building fall down five hours after the strike?" thing going on...
Posted by: DirtCrashr at August 01, 2006 12:08 PM (VNM5w)
3
I considered the same thing, perhaps they store fruits and veggies in old ammo cans. You can put charts and maps which help target Israeli cities in an ammo can as well as small hand guns.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 01, 2006 12:20 PM (7teJ9)
4
I'm not sure that's an ammo can. It looks more like a car battery to me (white body, blue lid) with one of its folding handles raised.
Posted by: Graeme at August 01, 2006 12:30 PM (5Yhea)
5
Maybe it's a diaper bag.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 12:41 PM (vBK4C)
6
Yeah! That's it! a diaper bag! They were all just innocent members of two peaceful " families ". ROPMA
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 01, 2006 12:50 PM (gLMre)
7
I think it may well be an ammo can, as it looks at least similar to the the two I keep at my cottage to store bolts and such. Which as we all know makes me a member of Hezbollah. It's now official. Bluto is insane.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 01:31 PM (UHKaK)
8
Yes, grinnel; I'm sure they were simply using the ammo can to store bolts and such. What was I thinking to question the word of international terrorists? Everyone knows that Hizballah uses ammo cans for bolts and such. They use diaper bags for munitions.
Jesus H. Christ, man...use your head for something besides a hatstand for once in your clueless, gullible life.
Jesus H. Christ, man...use your head for something besides a hatstand for once in your clueless, gullible life.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 01:50 PM (vBK4C)
9
I don't know whether grinnel buys left-wing propaganda hook, line and sinker, but it's funny to me that the same people who won't believe a single word the U.S. or Israeli govts. say about anything are ready to swallow every nugget of terrorist propaganda they can get their hands on.
No, the ammo can doesn't, by itself, prove anything. But it's a piece of information that might indicate that Qana wasn't the innocent choir boy Summer camp that Hizb'Allah would have us believe in. When you add that piece of information to other similar pieces of information, a picture starts to emerge. You won't see it if you don't want to, but that doesn't mean it's not there.
No, the ammo can doesn't, by itself, prove anything. But it's a piece of information that might indicate that Qana wasn't the innocent choir boy Summer camp that Hizb'Allah would have us believe in. When you add that piece of information to other similar pieces of information, a picture starts to emerge. You won't see it if you don't want to, but that doesn't mean it's not there.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 02:25 PM (c/4ax)
10
Sometimes I think of myself as a surly waiter in an exclusive French restaurant.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 03:02 PM (vBK4C)
11
A mint for Monsieur? It is just one wafer thin mint. Bon appettite.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 01, 2006 03:35 PM (7teJ9)
12
Hold on, hold on. Yes, I was being purposely glib and hyperbolic to illustrate how ludicrous these conspiracy theories are.
For God's sake people stand back for a moment and listen to yourselves.
There's the absence/presence/inconsistencies of rigor mortis. Then there's the delayed building collapse. And let's not forget the lack of blood and babies with pacifiers that weren't there a minute ago. And now we have ammo cans "suggestive" of what,this was actually a Hezbollah stronghold and the bodies were merely thrown in for effect? This goes beyond poor-man's forensics and lazy journalism to the stuff of moon-landing deniers and Bushitler 9/11 conspirasists.
It's not psosible that civilains got the shit end of the stick because bad stuff happens to them in guerilla war? It was a tragic mistake, but one made in legitimate attempts to nail Hezbollah? That's exctly what Israel's been saying, without the conspiracy theories, because that's the way some things happen in war. Why the need for this crap, which frankly sounds like something from the tinfoil crowd? It does no good and actually clouds the truth. And if that is being a gullible apologist for Hezbollah, guilty as charged.
For God's sake people stand back for a moment and listen to yourselves.
There's the absence/presence/inconsistencies of rigor mortis. Then there's the delayed building collapse. And let's not forget the lack of blood and babies with pacifiers that weren't there a minute ago. And now we have ammo cans "suggestive" of what,this was actually a Hezbollah stronghold and the bodies were merely thrown in for effect? This goes beyond poor-man's forensics and lazy journalism to the stuff of moon-landing deniers and Bushitler 9/11 conspirasists.
It's not psosible that civilains got the shit end of the stick because bad stuff happens to them in guerilla war? It was a tragic mistake, but one made in legitimate attempts to nail Hezbollah? That's exctly what Israel's been saying, without the conspiracy theories, because that's the way some things happen in war. Why the need for this crap, which frankly sounds like something from the tinfoil crowd? It does no good and actually clouds the truth. And if that is being a gullible apologist for Hezbollah, guilty as charged.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 03:41 PM (UHKaK)
13
I wouldn't necessarily call this jornalism dude. It is the comment section of a blog. I doubt Bluto would use that pic as the smoking gun for a staged event. We all believe something bad happened. Or most of us do. The pictures of the dead children are heart wrending. Perhaps this forum is a much needed way for some of us to point a finger at the bad guy without the need for serious journalism. Besides the serious journo's aren't doing much better or more than what we are doing.
Posted by: Cmunk at August 01, 2006 03:54 PM (7teJ9)
14
Its journalism inasmuch as someone might actually read and believe this junk.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 03:59 PM (UHKaK)
15
Shorter, more honest grinnel: "Shut up and believe what the Old Media tells you. You have no right to question them."
To which I reply: Blow me.
To which I reply: Blow me.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 04:42 PM (vBK4C)
16
Yeah, grinnel's right; we should all get our news from al Jazeera like he does.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 01, 2006 04:44 PM (v3I+x)
17
Ha! Hey, you douchebags can believe whatever medium you'd like. But you might want to quit making shit up. You sound like crop-circle people, not the cool, insightful MSM alternative/watchdogs you'd like to believe you are. Just let me know when you find the Bat Boy in the background of one your Qana photos. I'd like to see that one.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 06:11 PM (oxMjD)
18
grinnel -
What facts has anyone here made up?
FACT: an IAF bomb either hit the building or hit near the building between midnight and 1:00 am. Whether the building was actually hit is yet to be determined.
FACT: there were numerous witnesses claiming that the building collapsed immediately after it was hit, thereby trapping dozens of people inside.
FACT: the IDF claims that the building remained standing for at least deven hours after the air strike
FACT: no one in Qana contacted the Red Cross, rescue workers in Tyre or the news media until SEVEN HOURS after the bomb was dropped by the IAF
Something clearly doesn't fit here. Given this very odd fact pattern coupled with the fact that the terrorists in the region are widely known to routinely stage fake news events (complete with fake casualties) for propaganda purposes, it seems completely unreasonable to take the terrorists' story at face value.
If you choose to respond, abd you think you have something worthwhile to say, how about you try doing so with facts and reason rather than loudmouth insults? If you're capable of it, it'd be far more impressive.
What facts has anyone here made up?
FACT: an IAF bomb either hit the building or hit near the building between midnight and 1:00 am. Whether the building was actually hit is yet to be determined.
FACT: there were numerous witnesses claiming that the building collapsed immediately after it was hit, thereby trapping dozens of people inside.
FACT: the IDF claims that the building remained standing for at least deven hours after the air strike
FACT: no one in Qana contacted the Red Cross, rescue workers in Tyre or the news media until SEVEN HOURS after the bomb was dropped by the IAF
Something clearly doesn't fit here. Given this very odd fact pattern coupled with the fact that the terrorists in the region are widely known to routinely stage fake news events (complete with fake casualties) for propaganda purposes, it seems completely unreasonable to take the terrorists' story at face value.
If you choose to respond, abd you think you have something worthwhile to say, how about you try doing so with facts and reason rather than loudmouth insults? If you're capable of it, it'd be far more impressive.
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 01, 2006 06:41 PM (c/4ax)
19
Eye, of course I'd like to respond. First, my insulting response was addressed to the insulting response from that wellhead of negativity Bluto. The guy's a jerk, plain and simple, incapable of reasoned debate. He thinks it makes him witty when it actually makes him boorish. So I write him off and respond-when I respond at all- to him in like fashion. Nothing more. But my apologies, if you require them, to you for using your thread in such a manner.
Secondly, my gripe is with what is being extrapolated from the facts that are known by many, though certainly not all, throughout this blog. The thesis is that the bombing didn't actually take place and now a wholly questionable foundation is being built to support this nonsense. Their conclusions — or actually allusions -- are neither supported by the visual evidence or reason, no matter what they'd would like to extrapolate from what they are seeing.
It reminds me of "JFK" by Oliver Stone, in which people take the most ambiguous of details, interpret them any way they'd like and keep adding them to the total. After long enough, the most outrageous conclusions seem plausible.
Even ISRAEL is not denying the event took place, and as you well know they make no apologies to doing whatever it takes to shut down Hezbollah.
FACT. I don't know why the bomb hitting near or on the house would make a difference. The damage looked complete from the many photos I've seen so I think the distinction is irrelevant to me.
FACT: It is entirely believable that the building collapsed upon being hit or nearly hit.
FACT: Earlier today, I read comments from an IDF general at Ynet.com to the effect that the building remained standing for six to seven hours after the initial bombing. He couched and qualified his comments several times, even as he said "choosing his words carefully" until the facts were known. But he did mention he heard reports that the building remained standing. Now, I'm sorry to disagree with you, but I have not read this statement from this general anywhere else, and the IDF as a body has NOT taken the position of this general. They have said it was a terrible tragedy and took responsibility, but that Hezbollah was ultimately to blame.
FACT: No one in Qana reported the disaster for seven hours? I didn't know that. Where DO you get these details? OK, why? Staged event, right? Well, where is the Red Cross from Qana? Several hours away? Does Qana currently have access to communications? Were there other missiles landing in the area throughout the night? Or was it all quiet after that one? Did anyone at all try to rescue these people through the night? Or did no one at all? Yes, I would like to know the answers to these reasonable questions as they might shed light on why people might not call the Red Cross or the media for hours.
Here's my thing: no one in the free world -- the US, Britain, Israel--no one is questioning that the event took place. Did Hezbollah use the opportunity to garner outrage in their favor? Absolutely. They are as media savvy as anyone else, including American politicians who used images of 9/11 to garner support during the last elections.
Of course we don't know the definitive facts yet, and its plain that Hezbollah rung as much benefit as they could from this mistake. But to posit that this was a staged event and they loaded up a building with 60 freshly-dead bodies pushes the limits of reason by any measure of the word.
Secondly, my gripe is with what is being extrapolated from the facts that are known by many, though certainly not all, throughout this blog. The thesis is that the bombing didn't actually take place and now a wholly questionable foundation is being built to support this nonsense. Their conclusions — or actually allusions -- are neither supported by the visual evidence or reason, no matter what they'd would like to extrapolate from what they are seeing.
It reminds me of "JFK" by Oliver Stone, in which people take the most ambiguous of details, interpret them any way they'd like and keep adding them to the total. After long enough, the most outrageous conclusions seem plausible.
Even ISRAEL is not denying the event took place, and as you well know they make no apologies to doing whatever it takes to shut down Hezbollah.
FACT. I don't know why the bomb hitting near or on the house would make a difference. The damage looked complete from the many photos I've seen so I think the distinction is irrelevant to me.
FACT: It is entirely believable that the building collapsed upon being hit or nearly hit.
FACT: Earlier today, I read comments from an IDF general at Ynet.com to the effect that the building remained standing for six to seven hours after the initial bombing. He couched and qualified his comments several times, even as he said "choosing his words carefully" until the facts were known. But he did mention he heard reports that the building remained standing. Now, I'm sorry to disagree with you, but I have not read this statement from this general anywhere else, and the IDF as a body has NOT taken the position of this general. They have said it was a terrible tragedy and took responsibility, but that Hezbollah was ultimately to blame.
FACT: No one in Qana reported the disaster for seven hours? I didn't know that. Where DO you get these details? OK, why? Staged event, right? Well, where is the Red Cross from Qana? Several hours away? Does Qana currently have access to communications? Were there other missiles landing in the area throughout the night? Or was it all quiet after that one? Did anyone at all try to rescue these people through the night? Or did no one at all? Yes, I would like to know the answers to these reasonable questions as they might shed light on why people might not call the Red Cross or the media for hours.
Here's my thing: no one in the free world -- the US, Britain, Israel--no one is questioning that the event took place. Did Hezbollah use the opportunity to garner outrage in their favor? Absolutely. They are as media savvy as anyone else, including American politicians who used images of 9/11 to garner support during the last elections.
Of course we don't know the definitive facts yet, and its plain that Hezbollah rung as much benefit as they could from this mistake. But to posit that this was a staged event and they loaded up a building with 60 freshly-dead bodies pushes the limits of reason by any measure of the word.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 07:47 PM (oxMjD)
20
Fact: this is the first thread on which I've responded to "grinell".
Fact: "grinell" started our relationship by calling me insane.
Fact: Amused, I responded in kind.
Fact: "grinell" then flew into a snit, and accused moi of instigating hostilities.
Logical deduction: "grinell" is delusional and/or a liar.
High-confidence supposition: "grinell" is a pussy.
High-confidence prediction: "grinell", as a delusional, lying pussy will not be happy on my threads.
Fact: "grinell" started our relationship by calling me insane.
Fact: Amused, I responded in kind.
Fact: "grinell" then flew into a snit, and accused moi of instigating hostilities.
Logical deduction: "grinell" is delusional and/or a liar.
High-confidence supposition: "grinell" is a pussy.
High-confidence prediction: "grinell", as a delusional, lying pussy will not be happy on my threads.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 08:12 PM (vBK4C)
21
No one in Qana reported the disaster for seven hours? I didn't know
that. Where DO you get these details?
That is, apparently, what the Red Cross report.
OK, why? Staged event, right?
Maybe. Don't know.
Well, where is the Red Cross from Qana? Several hours away?
In Tyre, 15 miles away.
that. Where DO you get these details?
That is, apparently, what the Red Cross report.
OK, why? Staged event, right?
Maybe. Don't know.
Well, where is the Red Cross from Qana? Several hours away?
In Tyre, 15 miles away.
Posted by: Pixy at August 01, 2006 08:42 PM (FRalS)
22
Fact: Yes, I addressed you as insane. Hyperbole, as I stated in the very next post. Unless of course you are. Then my original statement stands.
Fact: No snit here at all, equally bemused by the above retorts to insane; didn't respond with "douchebag" until invited to blow you, which, as a straight, I will gratefully pass on.
Fact: You are negative and boorish. I didn't even bring up condescending and self-impressed.
Fact: You get one, maybe two lines of semi-reasoned discourse from Bluto if you call him on his facts. Then you become a pussy (see above), a terrorist sympathizer, a Quisling, or, in the spirit of free and open debate, banned from posting.
Obvious deduction: As a blogger, you are far and away better at dishing it out then taking it.
Out.
Fact: No snit here at all, equally bemused by the above retorts to insane; didn't respond with "douchebag" until invited to blow you, which, as a straight, I will gratefully pass on.
Fact: You are negative and boorish. I didn't even bring up condescending and self-impressed.
Fact: You get one, maybe two lines of semi-reasoned discourse from Bluto if you call him on his facts. Then you become a pussy (see above), a terrorist sympathizer, a Quisling, or, in the spirit of free and open debate, banned from posting.
Obvious deduction: As a blogger, you are far and away better at dishing it out then taking it.
Out.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 09:34 PM (oxMjD)
23
grinell, you wound me. I called you neither "quisling", nor "terrorist sympathizer"...and I didn't ban you. I did call you a lying, delusional pussy, but only after explaining the logical steps that lead, inevitably, to that conclusion.
Btw, you referred to everybody on the thread who disagreed with you as "douchebags" - you seem to be dishing out quite a bit.
Did you think you were writing a letter to the editor, pinhead?
Btw, you referred to everybody on the thread who disagreed with you as "douchebags" - you seem to be dishing out quite a bit.
Did you think you were writing a letter to the editor, pinhead?
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 01, 2006 10:12 PM (vBK4C)
24
You're right, Bluto ... the douchebag retort was hurled largely at you. Apologies to all others who took offense.
>>>> Did you think you were writing a letter to the editor, pinhead?
Of course not; I never call editors douchebags. That's reserved for opinionated windbags with authority complexes.
>>>> Did you think you were writing a letter to the editor, pinhead?
Of course not; I never call editors douchebags. That's reserved for opinionated windbags with authority complexes.
Posted by: grinnel at August 01, 2006 11:17 PM (oxMjD)
25
Wrong, grinell, you call anyone who has the temerity to disagree with you "douchebags". You did it here, and are trying to weasel out of it.
Btw, sock puppets are so low-class - but expected from a delusional, lying pussy, such as yourself.
How many Appleton cheeseheads do you think we get here, anyway?
Btw, sock puppets are so low-class - but expected from a delusional, lying pussy, such as yourself.
How many Appleton cheeseheads do you think we get here, anyway?
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 02, 2006 12:32 AM (vBK4C)
26
...to posit that this was a staged event and they loaded up a building with 60 freshly-dead bodies pushes the limits of reason by any measure of the word.
grinnel -
Given that international terrorist groups (PLO, Hamas) in and around Israel are well-known to stage fake "massacres" for propaganda purposes, how can you possibly claim that it "pushes the limits of reason" to believe that an international terrorist group just north of Israel has staged a fake massacre? If this "massacre" is a fake, it differs from the prior fake massacres only in terms of its scale. Please explain how it "pushes the limits of reason" to entertain the idea that this particular "massacre" may also be a fake.
BTW, if you keep fucking with Bluto, he's likely to whip out his huge manhood of logic and beat you about the head with it until you start crying. It differs from my huge unstoppable bagel of logic and reason in a number of respects, not the least of which is the loud slapping sound it makes everytime it hits you on the side of your face.
grinnel -
Given that international terrorist groups (PLO, Hamas) in and around Israel are well-known to stage fake "massacres" for propaganda purposes, how can you possibly claim that it "pushes the limits of reason" to believe that an international terrorist group just north of Israel has staged a fake massacre? If this "massacre" is a fake, it differs from the prior fake massacres only in terms of its scale. Please explain how it "pushes the limits of reason" to entertain the idea that this particular "massacre" may also be a fake.
BTW, if you keep fucking with Bluto, he's likely to whip out his huge manhood of logic and beat you about the head with it until you start crying. It differs from my huge unstoppable bagel of logic and reason in a number of respects, not the least of which is the loud slapping sound it makes everytime it hits you on the side of your face.
Posted by: The All Seeing Eye at August 02, 2006 02:20 AM (I9YKk)
27
Surpassed only by the loud slapping sound of his manly member as it hits you on the side of your face ...... :-o
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 02, 2006 11:46 AM (gLMre)
28
How many Appleton cheeseheads do you get? I don't know, I live in Green Bay.
Posted by: grinnel at August 02, 2006 01:31 PM (UHKaK)
29
Your IP gets routed through Appleton, and, coincidentally, matches the IPs of a couple other sock puppets.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 02, 2006 02:13 PM (vBK4C)
30
>>>> Please explain how it "pushes the limits of reason" to entertain the idea that this particular "massacre" may also be a fake.
Well, let's see. I started by running a quick Google search on the term "staged massacre?" I received about 315 individual results. Let's see what we've got ...
Milosevic Says Kosovo Massacre Staged by Rebels
WorldNetDaily: Probe: Famous 'martyrdom' of Palestinian boy 'staged'
Iraqi Rebels Staged "Massacre", Liberals Bought the Lie
NATO is preparing a staged massacre of Albanian refugees
The Dread Pundit Bluto: US Commanders: Shi'ites Staged 'Massacre'
Bosnian Muslims staged the massacre
IDF films staged Palestinian `burials' - Haaretz - Israel News
Hizb-ut-Tahrir member claims Andijan massacre was staged by Uzbek ...
Kind of a pattern isn't it? If this was the first I'd heard of a "staged massacre" by a group who didn't like bad press, I might be a bit more willing to buy into the elaborate conspiracy theory currently circulating about Qana from rightwing blogs. Is it possible this thing went down this way? Sure, anything at all is possible. Though the fact Israel has accepted blame and expressed regret takes a little of that edge off. Of course that it was staged is nearing gospel proportions here ...
And quit foisting your homo-erotic fantasies with Bluto onto me ... like I said, I'm not into that. Thanks anyway.
Well, let's see. I started by running a quick Google search on the term "staged massacre?" I received about 315 individual results. Let's see what we've got ...
Milosevic Says Kosovo Massacre Staged by Rebels
WorldNetDaily: Probe: Famous 'martyrdom' of Palestinian boy 'staged'
Iraqi Rebels Staged "Massacre", Liberals Bought the Lie
NATO is preparing a staged massacre of Albanian refugees
The Dread Pundit Bluto: US Commanders: Shi'ites Staged 'Massacre'
Bosnian Muslims staged the massacre
IDF films staged Palestinian `burials' - Haaretz - Israel News
Hizb-ut-Tahrir member claims Andijan massacre was staged by Uzbek ...
Kind of a pattern isn't it? If this was the first I'd heard of a "staged massacre" by a group who didn't like bad press, I might be a bit more willing to buy into the elaborate conspiracy theory currently circulating about Qana from rightwing blogs. Is it possible this thing went down this way? Sure, anything at all is possible. Though the fact Israel has accepted blame and expressed regret takes a little of that edge off. Of course that it was staged is nearing gospel proportions here ...
And quit foisting your homo-erotic fantasies with Bluto onto me ... like I said, I'm not into that. Thanks anyway.
Posted by: grinnel at August 02, 2006 08:31 PM (oxMjD)
31
Wow, that's really weak, grinell. Why don't you explain the "pattern", and then name some groups who like bad press.
Then you could google "Pallywood".
Then you could google "Pallywood".
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 03, 2006 09:44 AM (vBK4C)
32
Why weak? I cited just a few examples of past "staged massacres" that were either ultimately proven to be as authentic as a massacre gets or were never in any way proven to be staged.
Fact: There is no empirical evidence to back these claims of a staged massacre up. And that’s been my contention all along. If anyone wants to establish doubt about ANY event that happens on ANY day, it's no problem whatsoever to find reams of "evidence" to support whatever theory is being pushed. Of course it'll be exclusively anecdotal, supported by shaky interpretations, rumors and conclusions based not on fact but emotion, but hell, does that matter? In this case, its Hezbollah, and they’re the bad guys.
Now, before you brandish your standard "un-American terrorist supporter" sword, this is not in defense of Hezbollah; it's entirely possible that evidence may yet be produced that proves clearly this was a staged event by Hezbollah.
This is in defense of truthful reporting even in a form as low as blogging.
I hold innuendo and it supporters in as low esteem as I do the crackpots who continue to cite piece after "damning" piece of the Bush family's involvement in 9/11 — and not because I hold any love for George Bush.
Fact: There is no empirical evidence to back these claims of a staged massacre up. And that’s been my contention all along. If anyone wants to establish doubt about ANY event that happens on ANY day, it's no problem whatsoever to find reams of "evidence" to support whatever theory is being pushed. Of course it'll be exclusively anecdotal, supported by shaky interpretations, rumors and conclusions based not on fact but emotion, but hell, does that matter? In this case, its Hezbollah, and they’re the bad guys.
Now, before you brandish your standard "un-American terrorist supporter" sword, this is not in defense of Hezbollah; it's entirely possible that evidence may yet be produced that proves clearly this was a staged event by Hezbollah.
This is in defense of truthful reporting even in a form as low as blogging.
I hold innuendo and it supporters in as low esteem as I do the crackpots who continue to cite piece after "damning" piece of the Bush family's involvement in 9/11 — and not because I hold any love for George Bush.
Posted by: grinnel at August 03, 2006 03:44 PM (UHKaK)
33
Also: from Wikipedia re:"Pallywood"
"The extent and impact of such alleged manipulation is highly controversial and is part of a broader debate about media manipulation on both sides of the conflict."
"The extent and impact of such alleged manipulation is highly controversial and is part of a broader debate about media manipulation on both sides of the conflict."
Posted by: grinnel at August 03, 2006 04:35 PM (UHKaK)
34
Grinnel: Better watch the spelling. They'll really get you on that.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 04:35 PM (XqAoh)
35
Grinnel: Thank you for your visit. Stick around.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 07:41 PM (XqAoh)
36
Please excuse all seeing idiot. Merely, an academic meathead whose mommy doesn't let out often. Of course, you've already figured that out. This jerk doesn't know if you agree with him or not. Sooner or later Rusty will figure his value. Which is nothing.
Posted by: Greyrooster at August 03, 2006 07:51 PM (XqAoh)
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