September 04, 2006
Grim Milestone: Tens of Thousands Killed Since 9/11
UPDATE: Frequent commenter Garduneh Mehr, who's Christian family fled the Mullahs of Iran, points out my mistaking the number of Islamist attacks with the actual number killed. Bizzy Blog has the number of killed by acts of terror at 6,560.
This number is woefully low. For instance, in the past two years alone about 1,700 Thais have been killed because of an Islamic insurgency in the South of that country. And in August, the jihadis killed at least 1000.
So the real number must be way higher than I originally posted. In the tens of thousands.
That's right. Tens of thousands of innocents have been killed since 9/11. All of them were killed by Muslims in the name of Allah. Most of the victims were Muslim.
So, while the Left circulates the Grim Milestone meme that more Americans have now died since 9/11 than on it, please keep those numbers in mind.
Posted by: Rusty at
09:07 AM
| Comments (7)
| Add Comment
Post contains 160 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Rusty,
A correction if I may, if you're quoting the number from TheReligionOfPeace website, that is just the number of jihadist attacks around the globe. The number of innocents murdered in these attacks is many times that.
A correction if I may, if you're quoting the number from TheReligionOfPeace website, that is just the number of jihadist attacks around the globe. The number of innocents murdered in these attacks is many times that.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at September 04, 2006 09:28 AM (Bp6wV)
2
If there is a silver lining in this bloody black cloud of islam, it is that muslims kill each other with as great a frequency as they do us.
Thousands down, another billion or so to go.........
Thousands down, another billion or so to go.........
Posted by: n.a. palm at September 04, 2006 11:20 AM (Bjsvu)
3
I emailed Glenn at thereligionofpeace.com last March, and according to his list at that time, there were 22,867 killed and over 46,000 injured since (but not including) 9/11. Remember, that was 6 months ago and his list is compiled from reports in english language newspapers only.
Posted by: Jimmy the Dhimmi at September 04, 2006 12:04 PM (CI4Lt)
4
n.a. palm,
Unfortunately their birthrate is several times other peoples. This is no accident. They see a political and military advantage to having a large population; and they purposely have very large families. In fact, the caricature like concept of "family" in Islam and the Islamic treatment of women are meant to do two things:
a) Cater to the sexual appetites of Arab men
b) Breed more and more Jihadi's.
They basically bred themselves into power in Lebanon and are doing the same thing to Europe and India
Unfortunately their birthrate is several times other peoples. This is no accident. They see a political and military advantage to having a large population; and they purposely have very large families. In fact, the caricature like concept of "family" in Islam and the Islamic treatment of women are meant to do two things:
a) Cater to the sexual appetites of Arab men
b) Breed more and more Jihadi's.
They basically bred themselves into power in Lebanon and are doing the same thing to Europe and India
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at September 04, 2006 01:19 PM (Bp6wV)
5
N.A.Palm---I like the way you think!!!
Posted by: vilmar at September 04, 2006 02:04 PM (PQJoq)
6
n.a. palm, you're a racist. Your just like Hitler. You support the killing of so many people. Islam is a religion of peace. Now Garduneh Mehr just said the word jihadi. Well, if there are more and more jihadi bred, the world will become a better place. Now someone will post a bunch of hadiths that talk about how the Qu'ran says to fight jews. But here's what I have to say. When one wages jihad, do they take a gun and shoot themself to defeat the evil inside of them? NO. So when it says to fight the Jews does it mean to take a gun and kill them? No, because it never says kill the Jews. When you fight the Jews, it means to convince them that Muhammad is the prophet of God. Not with the sword, but the spoken word.
Posted by: Some Dude at September 07, 2006 07:52 PM (Iq9PC)
7
6,560 thats it? that figure is far to low and probably only account for US deaths. IF you read the daily papers and hear about the 50 plus iraqis that die every day due to civil violence it has to be far above that. I wouldnt put it beyond the realm of over a million people if you include every muslim related conflict in the last 100 yrs.
Posted by: steve at September 09, 2006 03:10 AM (Teqg8)
Terrorists Love the Left
If Islamofascism and the Religious Right have so much in common, then how come the terrorists never quote Pat Robertson? Instead, they are constanting quoting icons of the Left to support their positions. They even use clips from Fahrenheit 9/11 in this propaganda film.
And when American Taliban Adam Gadahn decides to name drop, it isn't Jerry Falwell that he cites for moral authority. It's George Galloway, Robert Fisk, and Seymour Hersh.
Posted by: Rusty at
08:48 AM
| Comments (20)
| Add Comment
Post contains 76 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Of course they love the left! Who the h&ll else would want to play the apologist to a bunch of barbarous brutes intent on murdering countless innocents just so they can gratify their sexual appetite of fornicating 72 virgins.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at September 04, 2006 10:07 AM (Bp6wV)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at September 04, 2006 10:08 AM (Bp6wV)
3
Really? I wonder how long Seymour Hersh's head would still be attached if they captured him.......
Posted by: n.a. palm at September 04, 2006 11:22 AM (Bjsvu)
4
They won't kill their useful idiots until they no longer have a use for them.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 04, 2006 12:01 PM (v3I+x)
5
A few problems with your analogy, Rusty. Didn't these Islamic militants used to kill Afghan communists during the Soviet-Afghan War. As I recall, the mujahideen ended up wiping out all the Soviet citizens and soldiers at a city one time, and wiping out an entire Soviet battallion another time. The "left" in this country is just as reactionary as the "right". Come on people, I'm tired of hearing how communists will team up with Islamists. If that were true, then why has the Iraqi Communist Party joined forces with the Americans in Iraq?
Posted by: heresy at September 04, 2006 01:10 PM (j7L48)
6
Garduneh Mehr, the Nazi-Soviet Pact did not last long. In fact, the Nazis invaded the Soviet Union during 1941 for "Operation Barbarossa". Of all the irony, the US joins forces with the Soviet Union. Imagine J. Edgar Hoover's shock when the American Communist Party supported the US war effort.
Posted by: heresy at September 04, 2006 01:15 PM (j7L48)
7
The United States' intelligence services, along with Middle Eastern intelligence, created, trained, and financed the jihadists. Period, end of discussion.
Posted by: heresy at September 04, 2006 01:25 PM (j7L48)
8
You dumb ass heretic, learn some fricking history. And this discussion continues, and you are not the one who decides.
Posted by: jesusland joe at September 04, 2006 01:30 PM (rUyw4)
9
"Period, end of discussion."
translation: I have my reality and I won't let facts get in the way of it.
translation: I have my reality and I won't let facts get in the way of it.
Posted by: Darleen at September 04, 2006 01:58 PM (cXz8w)
10
Heresy, not only are you a halfwit, but an ill-informed halfwit with poor reasoning ability at that. You're trying to use the events of a different time and place to try to convince us that we're not seeing what we're seeing, and you're stupid enough to think that we'll go for it. Jesus H., liberals are stupid.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 04, 2006 02:05 PM (v3I+x)
11
I think Darleen wins this one.
Posted by: greyrooster at September 04, 2006 04:20 PM (I4lN2)
12
Terorist love hollywood after all look how hollywood supports the terrorists with movies and the usial banter from the hollywood left and despite their recent condemnation of terrorism they still support them with propeganda and terrorists training movies like HOOT a real peice of eco-freak watermellon crap
Posted by: sandpiper at September 05, 2006 08:28 AM (uTBPj)
13
>>>Instead, they are constanting quoting icons of the Left to support their positions.
Good point. When jihadis start quoting rightwingers to support their positions then we'll talk. Meantime it's like they're channelling Michael Moore and Chumpsky.
Good point. When jihadis start quoting rightwingers to support their positions then we'll talk. Meantime it's like they're channelling Michael Moore and Chumpsky.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at September 05, 2006 10:54 AM (8e/V4)
14
Heresy -- yeah, it ended when Hitler betrayed the Soviets in 1941. Until that time, the US Commies supported Hitler and Stalin, and their "peace movement" resulted in the US being less prepared than it should have been for WWII.
Of course, the Nazis then turned on the Commies -- who then swithced sides and pretended tha they had always opposed Fascism, which is the twin of their own ideology.
Of course, the Nazis then turned on the Commies -- who then swithced sides and pretended tha they had always opposed Fascism, which is the twin of their own ideology.
Posted by: Rhymes With Right at September 06, 2006 08:46 AM (4nXaP)
15
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:12 PM (N7bKp)
16
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:12 PM (N7bKp)
17
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:13 PM (N7bKp)
18
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:13 PM (N7bKp)
19
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:13 PM (N7bKp)
20
How could I have missed this site? Found it through Robinik. Yep, the jihadis are right out of bankrupt Hollywood central casting. When they start quoting Pat, put out a bulletin. My theory to stop the terrorists is simple. Not simplistic. We drop a note to Tehran (sp) - the next time a terrorist bomb goes off, we'll drop a bomb on one of your cities. Sorry, don't want to kill innocent folks but since we are all considered fair game for the terrorists (read Iran, et al) then we have to defend ourselves. Some folks aren't giving us much choice.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Problem - I don't want one more person anywhere to die at the hands of terrorists, aided and abetted by their apologists in US.
Glad I found you.
Posted by: Beach Girl at September 10, 2006 07:13 PM (N7bKp)
Steyn on Reutersgate
Steyn. You just gotta love that guy. Sun Times:
Consider, for example, the bizarre behavior of Reuters, the once globally respected news agency now reduced to putting out laughably inept terrorist propaganda. A few days ago, it made a big hoo-ha about the Israelis intentionally firing a missile at its press vehicle and wounding its cameraman Fadel Shana. Shana was posed in an artful sprawl in a blood-spattered shirt. But it had ridden up and underneath his undershirt was spotlessly white, like a summer-stock Julius Caesar revealing the boxers under his toga. What's stunning is not that almost all Western media organizations reporting from the Middle East are reliant on local staff overwhelmingly sympathetic to one side in the conflict -- that's been known for some time -- but the amateurish level of fakery that head office is willing to go along with.Bizzyblog has the pic in question, although I'm not too sure about the meaning of the difference between the Spanish and English quote he mentions. Typically, Israeli statements to the foreign press are in English, not Hebrew.
Posted by: Rusty at
08:39 AM
| Comments (5)
| Add Comment
Post contains 182 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Not the greatest transition from Steyn to something else, but the point was that the BBC story's Spanish version appears to cast Israel in a more arrogant and careless light than the English version.
If that's part of a trend, it isn't enough to fisk the English versions. "We" need to have bloggers out there looking at the translated versions, or simply hope that other bloggers in other countries are pointing out the BS.
If that's part of a trend, it isn't enough to fisk the English versions. "We" need to have bloggers out there looking at the translated versions, or simply hope that other bloggers in other countries are pointing out the BS.
Posted by: Tom Blumer at September 04, 2006 09:34 AM (We5FN)
2
I am Spanish, and I guess that probably the fault might be put onto BBC translator
The point is that the mass media acting in Spain are mostly FOR Hizbollah. They do not even try to practise a half-way pose on the subject, but they clearly criticize Israel position and identify it with Evil American Imperialism. I ensure you that it is not one of the strongest reports on the news I have lately seen on the matter. Anyway, if any of you are interested on the matter, there are now some media trying to move aside from the politically-accepted point of view...
The point is that the mass media acting in Spain are mostly FOR Hizbollah. They do not even try to practise a half-way pose on the subject, but they clearly criticize Israel position and identify it with Evil American Imperialism. I ensure you that it is not one of the strongest reports on the news I have lately seen on the matter. Anyway, if any of you are interested on the matter, there are now some media trying to move aside from the politically-accepted point of view...
Posted by: Pablo at September 04, 2006 09:42 AM (VPvXe)
Posted by: Darth Vag at September 04, 2006 02:49 PM (HSkSw)
4
I really don't understand why people are still arguing over this, there simply is not enough information to go past the, "They were not the target" phase. Obviously them saying one or two missiles hit that truck is a lie, though it might have been collateral damage like that Bangkok post article said.
There are so many contradicting points that making heads or tails off all the lies is pointless, as the story is now irretrievably distorted by the MSM. Without an independent investigation of said vehicle this story is moot. Reuters at best trumped up a collateral damage story to specific targetting, or at worst simply is lying outright, though possibly not knowing the scale, as a couple more "Arab" stringers are laughing their heads off over the stupid media editors.
There are so many contradicting points that making heads or tails off all the lies is pointless, as the story is now irretrievably distorted by the MSM. Without an independent investigation of said vehicle this story is moot. Reuters at best trumped up a collateral damage story to specific targetting, or at worst simply is lying outright, though possibly not knowing the scale, as a couple more "Arab" stringers are laughing their heads off over the stupid media editors.
Posted by: Naieve at September 04, 2006 07:55 PM (+PWjE)
5
Elaine on Seinfeld said it all: fake, fake, fake
http://audiofiles2.jerryseinfeld.nl/fakes.mp3
There can be no doubt whatsoever that the story is fake. NONE. It isn't a matter of interpretation, or shading, or conflicting stories. It is fake.
There is more enough information to conclusively determine that the story told by the alleged victims is false. What really happened? Who knows, and who cares, because the story is false.
http://audiofiles2.jerryseinfeld.nl/fakes.mp3
There can be no doubt whatsoever that the story is fake. NONE. It isn't a matter of interpretation, or shading, or conflicting stories. It is fake.
There is more enough information to conclusively determine that the story told by the alleged victims is false. What really happened? Who knows, and who cares, because the story is false.
Posted by: Watergate at September 06, 2006 09:46 PM (BC1Xw)
August 31, 2006
Muslims Against Islamo-Fascism
A moderate Muslim I can finally agree with. Too often we hear the phrase 'moderate Muslim' as a descriptor immediately proceeding a diatribe against Western values. Perhaps there is hope after all. Omran Salman:
Rather than just condemn the plot and address the scourge of Islamic extremism, Muslim groups such as the Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR), the Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC) and the Muslim American Society (MAS) sought to both legitimize terror and portray Muslims as victims.Hat tip: Mike from MEMRI.Do these organizations really represent Muslims in the West? Hardly. It is their apologia of Islamic extremism, rather than discrimination or religious hatred in Western society, which most victimizes American Muslims.
The basic narrative of these self-described civil-rights groups is twofold: The United States provokes terrorism because of its foreign policy, and Muslims in the West face a backlash in the wake of terror....
Rather than help Muslims in America, most Muslim organizations hinder them. Self-appointed representatives downplay religious extremism and focus more on the image of Muslims rather than on the loss of innocent life. They remain silent on the assault waged on liberalism by Islamists. Most Muslims in America, though, fled the Middle East for the liberal values of their adopted country....
If these organizations wish to represent American Muslims, they should be at the forefront of defending both Muslims and non-Muslims against Islamic extremists who hate moderate Muslims almost as much if not more than Western governments. Terrorists deny the legitimacy of Western Muslims, arguing that their Western co-religionists just sit placidly while they, the true Muslims, are "waging jihad against infidels and crusaders."
It is wrong to argue so much over terminology and image that we lose sight of the real threat: Extremists who find motivation in religion to preach intolerance and wage war against Western values and peoples. This is the nonsense that causes Muslims to flee the Middle East. We should not defend its emergence here.
Posted by: Rusty at
12:42 PM
| Comments (2)
| Add Comment
Post contains 329 words, total size 2 kb.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 31, 2006 05:52 PM (wDEFg)
2
Muslims Against Islamo-Fascism = Nazi's against Hitler.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 01, 2006 10:27 AM (v3I+x)
National Guardsman Attacked by Leftist Douchebags
Words have consequences and these types of attacks are inevitable given the rhetoric of the increasingly not-so-fringe left .
At some point saying "I support the troops" while simultaneously jumping on every allegation against them that they routinely "massacre" civilians reaches the breaking point of psychological dissonance.
A rational and moral person cannot support troops which are baby killers. At some point, either you will reject the premise that our troops are bloodthirsty killers or you will hate them.
The victim's name is Alexander Powell and he has been instructed by his superior officers not to discuss the matter any further with the media.
The Pierce County Sheriff's Department is searching for five people who allegedly attacked a uniformed National Guardsmen walking along 138th Street in Parkland Tuesday afternoon.Hat tip: Editor in Pajamas who points out that the douchebags asked the victim if he had seen any action. The inference being that he was attacked because the SOBs actually thought that he was a baby killer.The soldier was walking to a convenience store when a sport utility vehicle pulled up alongside him and the driver asked if he was in the military and if he had been in any action.
The driver then got out of the vehicle, displayed a gun and shouted insults at the victim. Four other suspects exited the vehicle and knocked the soldier down, punching and kicking him.
“And during the assault the suspects called him a baby killer. At that point they got into the car and drove off and left him on the side of the road,†Detective Ed Troyer with the Pierce County Sheriff’s Department told KIRO 7 Eyewitness News.
The suspects were driving a black Chevy Suburban-type SUV.
I know it is hard for some of you to grasp, but people hate the United States and its soldiers because they actually believe we are the bad guys. I heard Howard Zinn on Dennis Prager's radio show yesterday. If you only believed half of what Zinn has to say, you'd spit on our soldiers too.
All the suspects are described as in their early 20s, many wearing red caps. Why all the red hats? Could it be.......
Posted by: Rusty at
08:39 AM
| Comments (48)
| Add Comment
Post contains 375 words, total size 3 kb.
1
I know of an anarchist group that wears red hats. They also claim to be environmentalists but why would they be in an SUV then?
Posted by: Catholicgauze at August 31, 2006 09:09 AM (Zu+b4)
2
Commies? Better Red than dead! As Jane used to (and still does) say.
Posted by: Rod Stanton at August 31, 2006 09:19 AM (EmrAy)
3
>>>five people who allegedly attacked a uniformed National Guardsmen
Five to one odds is about the numbers it takes to get a Lib to stop pretending he's a "pacifist." Get him alone though, and he's a Ghandi devotee.
Five to one odds is about the numbers it takes to get a Lib to stop pretending he's a "pacifist." Get him alone though, and he's a Ghandi devotee.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 31, 2006 09:27 AM (8e/V4)
4
Hey! I went to school there... OK, so you're probably right, there are a bunch of idiots there.
Posted by: HD Wanderer at August 31, 2006 09:34 AM (nA9AR)
5
My first thought was UW--way more idiots there--but they have that gay purple and blue thing going for them.
Posted by: Jihad Rusty Dirka Dirka at August 31, 2006 09:40 AM (JQjhA)
6
Hello - it's gay purple and gold, thank you very much.
And really, it couldn't have been anyone from Wazzu because they're usually to inebriated to accomplish anything. Am I right?
And really, it couldn't have been anyone from Wazzu because they're usually to inebriated to accomplish anything. Am I right?
Posted by: Editor at August 31, 2006 09:56 AM (adpJH)
7
by the way, Catholicgauze, i do like the "red anarchists" theory. It was the first one that popped in my head.
Posted by: Editor at August 31, 2006 10:00 AM (adpJH)
8
Pat Buchanan's against the war too. Sounds more like a bunch of skinhead, white supremacists types to me. You know, members of your base.
Posted by: Hesiod at August 31, 2006 10:01 AM (pOIx0)
9
Hmmm. Interesting.
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.>
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.>
Posted by: Hesiod at August 31, 2006 10:05 AM (pOIx0)
10
Hmmm. Interesting.
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.
Posted by: Hesiod at August 31, 2006 10:05 AM (pOIx0)
11
Hmmm. Interesting.
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.
"Mr. Gingrich's appearance at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) was scripted like a presidential campaign stop, with young supporters in red T-shirts passing out buttons and pamphlets.
Posted by: Hesiod at August 31, 2006 10:06 AM (pOIx0)
Posted by: Jihad Rusty Dirka Dirka at August 31, 2006 10:11 AM (JQjhA)
13
I want to hear what Brad has to say before I make up my mind on this. Looks bad, but I'll withold judgment. And Hesiod, I believe the guy was reported to have hair. Just so you know.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 31, 2006 10:19 AM (rUyw4)
14
And it's also not just about being against the war. The hardcore Left was against the war from the beginning, not because it wasn't in our nation's best interests (as Buchanan argues) but because it was "immoral" and because of "civilian casualties". In other words, because they belive our soldiers ARE baby killers.
Posted by: Jihad Rusty Dirka Dirka at August 31, 2006 10:39 AM (JQjhA)
Posted by: Hesiod at August 31, 2006 10:54 AM (pOIx0)
16
That's funny. The only member of the KKK currently in the Senate is Robert Byrd. What party affiliation is he, again?
Posted by: Lurking Observer at August 31, 2006 11:47 AM (/ZD7V)
17
Hesiod:
It would seem to me that someone that can stereotype someone by their hair color would also have no problems characterizing someone by their skin color too, and you say racists are the Republican base?
What a maroon.
It would seem to me that someone that can stereotype someone by their hair color would also have no problems characterizing someone by their skin color too, and you say racists are the Republican base?
What a maroon.
Posted by: davec at August 31, 2006 01:11 PM (QkWqQ)
18
I think it would be incorrect to group peaceful war opposers like myself in with these bigots.
Posted by: Baghwan at August 31, 2006 02:43 PM (Se0QB)
19
The hat is Crimson, asshole.
Posted by: Butch at August 31, 2006 02:57 PM (Sh5a7)
20
See - inebriated. Told ya, so.
Posted by: Editor at August 31, 2006 03:32 PM (adpJH)
Posted by: Butch at August 31, 2006 03:48 PM (Sh5a7)
Posted by: davec at August 31, 2006 05:12 PM (QkWqQ)
23
Wazzu suffers from a terminal proximity to U of I. It is not their fault morons from Northern Idaho trickle down from time to time and end up on campus. BTW, they are just across the border from Moscow. Huh? Bloody commies with their red hats.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 31, 2006 06:12 PM (n4VvM)
24
Stinkin' Vandals... Huh? Huh? Vandals? Moscow? Red hats? Now what I mean. Chup-chup. Photography. Your wife.
Posted by: Editor at August 31, 2006 06:24 PM (adpJH)
25
Why in the hell won't one of these shitheads stop me when I am walking? I have my Peace through Superior Firepower t-shirt on when I huff and puff, so maybe that is scaring them off. I still have my W bumper sticker on my truck, and that doesn't seem to help either, but mayhap my 10-gauge pump in the gun rack discourages anything but sour looks. I think I shall have to change my tactics.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 31, 2006 07:27 PM (rUyw4)
26
It is sort of a Brown shirt thing. I hope with all my heart these guys are caught. Maybe some time as the cell block beyatch will give them a better perspective on freedom, and civil rights.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 31, 2006 08:16 PM (n4VvM)
27
i doubt it. wazzu-the students at least-tend to be fairly conservative.
Posted by: Daniel at August 31, 2006 08:27 PM (lfV9X)
28
BTW, WSU is the party school of the two. Hands down. UW is the hippie school. Isn't UW the school who wanted to deny Pappy Boyington his props on campus?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 31, 2006 08:28 PM (n4VvM)
29
You got it SeeMonk, UW is the school who wanted to avoid honoring Boyington for being a "rich white male" and a "murderer". Higher education at its finest /sarcasm.
Whoever did this needs to be strung up by the balls and fast. I have never been punched by one of these anti-war types, but they have tried to corral me and pushed me around at various anti-war events early in the initial war with Iraq. I always found it funny how the 'pacifists' and the 'more open minded' who 'favor free speech and open discourse' seem to be the first to employ force to get their message across or if someone has a different viewpoint.
Whoever did this needs to be strung up by the balls and fast. I have never been punched by one of these anti-war types, but they have tried to corral me and pushed me around at various anti-war events early in the initial war with Iraq. I always found it funny how the 'pacifists' and the 'more open minded' who 'favor free speech and open discourse' seem to be the first to employ force to get their message across or if someone has a different viewpoint.
Posted by: Ranba Ral at August 31, 2006 11:13 PM (VvXII)
30
This story wasn't even mentioned on the 10:00 local news here (which routinely reports whenever people gather and wave flags above the Fort Lewis overpass). The few news reports online are conflicting (one says it happened Tuesday at 8:30, another said Tuesday afternoon). Something is not right with this report. If it really happened, it would be all over the news tonight.
Posted by: thehim at September 01, 2006 12:49 AM (vSxME)
31
There was one report that was subsequently pulled from the TV stations' website quoting a witness who claimed that there were at least three men in military uniforms involved in the scuffle.
Posted by: Hesiod at September 01, 2006 08:15 AM (pOIx0)
32
A good lefturd is a dead one.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 01, 2006 10:39 AM (v3I+x)
Posted by: Hesiod at September 01, 2006 02:59 PM (pOIx0)
34
Hesiod: Rhymes with Hymorrhoid. Sounds like hymorrhoid. Smells like a hymorrhoid. Probably is on the left side of the ass.
Posted by: greyrooster at September 01, 2006 07:50 PM (z6fDG)
35
No way the assailants were Cougs! The anti-war leftists confine themselves to the west side of the state. Pullman is 8 miles from Idaho. WSU is the drink beer/chase women/shoot coyotes at night with a mini-14 with hot rounds and spotlight kind of school. Er, not that I would know personally, of course. I um, read about this somewhere. Or something.
Posted by: Stormcleaver at September 01, 2006 11:42 PM (jIXSy)
36
No way the assailants were Cougs! The anti-war leftists confine themselves to the west side of the state. Pullman is 8 miles from Idaho. WSU is the drink beer/chase women/shoot coyotes at night with a mini-14 with hot rounds and spotlight kind of school. Er, not that I would know personally, of course. I um, read about this somewhere. Or something.
Posted by: Stormcleaver at September 01, 2006 11:43 PM (jIXSy)
37
No way the assailants were Cougs! The anti-war leftists confine themselves to the west side of the state. Pullman is 8 miles from Idaho. WSU is the drink beer/chase women/shoot coyotes at night with a mini-14 with hot rounds and spotlight kind of school. Er, not that I would know personally, of course. I um, read about this somewhere. Or something.
Posted by: Stormcleaver at September 01, 2006 11:44 PM (jIXSy)
38
No way the assailants were Cougs! The anti-war leftists confine themselves to the west side of the state. Pullman is 8 miles from Idaho. WSU is the drink beer/chase women/shoot coyotes at night with a mini-14 with hot rounds and spotlight kind of school. Er, not that I would know personally, of course. I um, read about this somewhere. Or something.
Posted by: Stormcleaver at September 01, 2006 11:50 PM (jIXSy)
39
Wow, sorry about the 4x post. PEBCAK error. I don't see a way to delete posts, so if some kind soul would see fit to delete the redundant posts, I would appreciate it.
Posted by: Stormcleaver at September 01, 2006 11:53 PM (jIXSy)
40
From the KIRO-TV website:
"A witness who came forward after the incident told KIRO 7 Eyewitness News a different story about what happened on Tuesday morning, but deputies said the witness later changed that story when they interviewed him.
The witness told police he saw several men in uniform beat a man in civilian clothes, but later changed his account to back the guardsman.
Investigators said the witness's stories were inconsistent with the guardsman's, and they are back to "square one" in the investigation."
Something sounds VERY fishy here.
"A witness who came forward after the incident told KIRO 7 Eyewitness News a different story about what happened on Tuesday morning, but deputies said the witness later changed that story when they interviewed him.
The witness told police he saw several men in uniform beat a man in civilian clothes, but later changed his account to back the guardsman.
Investigators said the witness's stories were inconsistent with the guardsman's, and they are back to "square one" in the investigation."
Something sounds VERY fishy here.
Posted by: Chris at September 02, 2006 09:31 AM (Kx3RJ)
41
White supremacists? Why would anyone think whites were supreme? Then again one could take a look at the rest of the world.
Posted by: greyrooster at September 02, 2006 10:14 AM (R6pNU)
Posted by: Hesiod at September 02, 2006 10:42 AM (oQvfV)
43
A question for those on the left or right is whether they are supporters of the principle that violence is wrong in being used against those with different political views.
Some of the posters on the right above show they are not supporters of that principle.
They're just base criminals who are enemies of the principles of the US.
Some of the posters on the right above show they are not supporters of that principle.
They're just base criminals who are enemies of the principles of the US.
Posted by: Craig at September 02, 2006 03:46 PM (s0wH0)
44
Heh. Lefturd idiots like hesiod think that they actually are going to be able to continue forever just like they are, but nothing stays the same forever, and one day soon, if there's any justice in the world, there'll be lefturd corpses decorating the overpasses. I just hope I have enough rope.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 02, 2006 04:33 PM (v3I+x)
45
We should turn IDAK(INSTANT DESTROYER AND KILLER)lose l mean CRUSH,KILL,DESTROY, or how about the DALEKS that would be EXTERMINATE,EXTERMINATE,EXTERMINATE
Posted by: sandpiper at September 03, 2006 07:54 PM (YIXxO)
46
Posters like I mentioned previously - and immediately following my post - are the enemies of America, who would follow the path away from the principles of democracy and freedom of thought and speech to the old ways of violence used for political control.
The only ones who belong in jail are they after they act, and in a civics class now.
The only ones who belong in jail are they after they act, and in a civics class now.
Posted by: Craig at September 06, 2006 10:47 AM (Z1Ezc)
47
I have been in the National Guard for more than 20 years now and, while this incident is sickening, I must say that general public support for those of us in the Guard has never been stronger.
I recently set up a site to provide "National Guard" logo t-shirts and other items and have found that not only do fellow National Guardsmen order items but so do employers and others just wanting to show their support.
Anyone interested can check it out at:
http://www.cafepress.com/guardlogostore
Maybe a few more people need to "show the colors" to prove that America in NOT represented by the idiots in this story.
I recently set up a site to provide "National Guard" logo t-shirts and other items and have found that not only do fellow National Guardsmen order items but so do employers and others just wanting to show their support.
Anyone interested can check it out at:
http://www.cafepress.com/guardlogostore
Maybe a few more people need to "show the colors" to prove that America in NOT represented by the idiots in this story.
Posted by: Robert at September 06, 2006 05:46 PM (mlofO)
48
Craig: You sound so sweet. I'm sure the terrorists will give you a break. Wake up and grow up.
Posted by: greyrooster at September 06, 2006 07:32 PM (5OGpF)
August 30, 2006
Americans Back the Wrong Profiling: Racial vs. Religious Profiling
I'm not sure what good racial profiling is. The last time I checked, Islam was not a race.
Most Americans expect a terrorist attack on the United States in the next few months and support the screening of people who look “Middle Eastern†at airports and train stations, a poll showed on Tuesday.....Plenty of Christians and Jews in the Middle East, very few of whom I'd guess are a security risk. And Pakistanis are not Middle Easterners. Neither are Afghanis or Indonesians.......By a 60 percent to 37 percent margin, respondents said authorities should single out people who look “Middle Eastern†for security screening at locations such as airports and train stations — a finding that drew sharp criticism by civil liberties groups.
Since the questions asked in the survey say nothing about Islam, why is it that CAIR is concerned?
“It’s one of those things that makes people think they are doing something to protect themselves when they’re not. They’re in fact producing more insecurity by alienating the very people whose help is necessary in the war on terrorism,†he said.True enough, we do need their help.....but when has CAIR ever offered to help?
Inasmuch as Muslims in America have not volunteered in great numbers to help fight the war then it no longer matters what they think. If killing Islamic fascist abroad and arresting them at home alienates Muslims--if it makes them feel picked on--then they are not our people. If you feel a closer kinship to my enemy than you do to me, then exactly why should I give a rat's ass if I offend you?
And if you're not helping already, if you already feel alienated, even when we don't single you out, then what harm can profiling you really do? I really don't see any downside to this, other than the obvious stupidity of calling it racial profiling.
I don't want racial profiling, I want religious profiling.
More at LGF
Posted by: Rusty at
10:20 AM
| Comments (12)
| Add Comment
Post contains 333 words, total size 2 kb.
1
While there might be some sense in using religion as a metric in profiling, it is pretty easy to fake or lie about your religion. Hypothetically, all a "middle eastern looking" terrorist would have to do is claim to be a Chaldean.
Posted by: galletador at August 30, 2006 10:40 AM (UaP6l)
2
I'll be a little more blunt than galletador: You are an idiot. Your comment on religious profiling is like saying "I don't want to profile civilians, I want to profile terrorists." Well, d'uh, but that's f**king impossible. You can deny you are a terrorist or your religion, you can't deny how you look.
Also, Pakistanis, Indonesians and Afghanis may not be "middle easteners" but I bet you I could pick them out of an airplane crowd, 9 times out of 10, either by looks or listening to thier voices.
And if you say only 9 times out of 10? I'd say that's one of the problems with profiling, it's subjective. While I'm for profiling, your comment is just inane.
Also, Pakistanis, Indonesians and Afghanis may not be "middle easteners" but I bet you I could pick them out of an airplane crowd, 9 times out of 10, either by looks or listening to thier voices.
And if you say only 9 times out of 10? I'd say that's one of the problems with profiling, it's subjective. While I'm for profiling, your comment is just inane.
Posted by: Petzel at August 30, 2006 11:06 AM (Lpswv)
3
Petzel:
Would profiling help? or would it just a make us focus on a stereotype while our enemies recruit people who do not meet our expectations for example:
Would profiling have found her:
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/530
Would this guy if he shaved his beard, fit a profile?
http://www.aeronautics.ru/img001/basayev1.jpg
http://altovolta.apostos.com/archives/basayev.jpg
That was the Chechen commander the Russians just killed
How about this guy:
http://www.laweekly.com/general/features/white-muslim/1144/
Does he fits a profile?
I have also seen a Muslim with a red beard/hair that was part of the Bosnian campaign, don't forget there are thousands of Bosnians that might not match the profiles too.
The British plot had three British converts [actual British people] supposedly too!
The intelligence community also know that Al-Qaeda is looking to recruit Islamic converts that are not from the middle-east so they are not profiled as easy.
It might be safer to just treat all with equal suspicion.
Would profiling help? or would it just a make us focus on a stereotype while our enemies recruit people who do not meet our expectations for example:
Would profiling have found her:
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/530
Would this guy if he shaved his beard, fit a profile?
http://www.aeronautics.ru/img001/basayev1.jpg
http://altovolta.apostos.com/archives/basayev.jpg
That was the Chechen commander the Russians just killed
How about this guy:
http://www.laweekly.com/general/features/white-muslim/1144/
Does he fits a profile?
I have also seen a Muslim with a red beard/hair that was part of the Bosnian campaign, don't forget there are thousands of Bosnians that might not match the profiles too.
The British plot had three British converts [actual British people] supposedly too!
The intelligence community also know that Al-Qaeda is looking to recruit Islamic converts that are not from the middle-east so they are not profiled as easy.
It might be safer to just treat all with equal suspicion.
Posted by: davec at August 30, 2006 01:14 PM (QkWqQ)
4
Profigling my ass. The only way to deal with muslims is to kill them. You cannot negotiate with them, you cannot reason with them, and you cannot appeal to their humanity; they are rabid dogs that should be shot and ground up for pig feed.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 30, 2006 01:52 PM (v3I+x)
5
I am for no overarching institutionally implemented directives that hinder good cops. Profiling one way or the other is just that.
Profiling is a word that segments out one component of the "gut" that cops have. When a cop sees something that is not right, they should be able to pursue what their gut tells them, without having to disengage a portion of themselves to analyze exactly what it is that is out of place that they are alerted to.
There are signals and communication that are conveyed on mentally undetectable levels, that people can still pick up on.
There are things that are out of place in Boise Idaho, that are not in Birmingham Alabama, and vice versa, and etc.
The local boys with badges need to be able to do what they need to be able to do so that they can sleep at night and look at themselves in the mirror.
EVERY factor that is available to the cop should be used to get the bad guys.
(cop = policeman, peace officer, airport screener, forest ranger, etc.)
Profiling is a word that segments out one component of the "gut" that cops have. When a cop sees something that is not right, they should be able to pursue what their gut tells them, without having to disengage a portion of themselves to analyze exactly what it is that is out of place that they are alerted to.
There are signals and communication that are conveyed on mentally undetectable levels, that people can still pick up on.
There are things that are out of place in Boise Idaho, that are not in Birmingham Alabama, and vice versa, and etc.
The local boys with badges need to be able to do what they need to be able to do so that they can sleep at night and look at themselves in the mirror.
EVERY factor that is available to the cop should be used to get the bad guys.
(cop = policeman, peace officer, airport screener, forest ranger, etc.)
Posted by: QC at August 30, 2006 02:09 PM (PX+vn)
6
Nothing wrong with profiling. I've been singled out a couple of times for extra scrutiny when flying despite being caucasian and non muslim. This is because I was a young man travelling alone. Some people are higher risk and deserve more scrutiny. And no one who is not a terrorist sympatiser objects to being inconvenienced by polite staff who have decided you need more atention.
Posted by: peter at August 30, 2006 02:46 PM (qjiox)
7
DaveC: While I agree that profiling is inexact, it is probably the most efficient tool we have available to us*. Yes, there are many Muslims who aren't brown or foreigners, and yes I know that the terrorists are looking for alternatives. However, to date, successful terrorists have been male, between 20 and 45, foreign, from the other side of the world/vaguely arab looking in some sense. So, how does profiling these folks hurt US citizens?
* I've arrived at this conclusion by seeing (first hand, as a significant part of my job) what a CF the TSA has become due to underfunding, poor management and, mainly, lack of attention from the admin. It infuriates me that Bush et al claim to be tough on terror, but are so pissed they had to create another federal agency that they have, in a fit of pique, decided play "I'll show them". It's not the TSA's fault, they are generally good people trying to do a monumental task with spit and baling wire. But the Bush admin has decided they are the retarded incestuous bastard child. Yeah, the feed it a little, but generally they keep it locked in the attic.
* I've arrived at this conclusion by seeing (first hand, as a significant part of my job) what a CF the TSA has become due to underfunding, poor management and, mainly, lack of attention from the admin. It infuriates me that Bush et al claim to be tough on terror, but are so pissed they had to create another federal agency that they have, in a fit of pique, decided play "I'll show them". It's not the TSA's fault, they are generally good people trying to do a monumental task with spit and baling wire. But the Bush admin has decided they are the retarded incestuous bastard child. Yeah, the feed it a little, but generally they keep it locked in the attic.
Posted by: petzel at August 30, 2006 03:49 PM (Lpswv)
8
I've linked to you here: http://consul-at-arms.blogspot.com/2006/08/re-americans-back-wrong-profiling.html
Posted by: Consul-At-Arms at August 30, 2006 04:21 PM (VgvVf)
9
Petzel:
I was never one to believe the DHS was a good idea, the criticism on the failing agencies was mostly to do with internal politics, backlogs and inefficient handling, by rolling all of these into the folds of a "super" agency it has just created even more internal politics, and inefficiencies -- now some people have ten managers instead of two, or have a boss who is not qualified to judge their performance or job.
The DHS should have been a separate entity where all domestic agencies departments could file security related reports, receive security bulletins, they would also only serve one purpose to fight terrorism on our shores with skilled operators like the F.B.I H.R.T / ICE S.R.T at their disposal and a central anti-terrorism based charter -- now the DHS is responsible for Hurricane response? that doesn't seem to be a good idea at all (and look how it worked out!) and seems to be one big slug of an agency, that doesn't even know how to organize it's internal structure -- much less a disaster response.
I was never one to believe the DHS was a good idea, the criticism on the failing agencies was mostly to do with internal politics, backlogs and inefficient handling, by rolling all of these into the folds of a "super" agency it has just created even more internal politics, and inefficiencies -- now some people have ten managers instead of two, or have a boss who is not qualified to judge their performance or job.
The DHS should have been a separate entity where all domestic agencies departments could file security related reports, receive security bulletins, they would also only serve one purpose to fight terrorism on our shores with skilled operators like the F.B.I H.R.T / ICE S.R.T at their disposal and a central anti-terrorism based charter -- now the DHS is responsible for Hurricane response? that doesn't seem to be a good idea at all (and look how it worked out!) and seems to be one big slug of an agency, that doesn't even know how to organize it's internal structure -- much less a disaster response.
Posted by: davec at August 30, 2006 05:36 PM (QkWqQ)
10
This is not a police action. Trying to believe it is will only cause us to lose. For example, A man in San. Fran. ran over 14 people killing one.
In a police action, there is no picture of the man, and no name. Before an investigation is done, the police shout no terrorism here. Maybe so, but in war terrorism would be considered, and looked into.
In a police action, there is no picture of the man, and no name. Before an investigation is done, the police shout no terrorism here. Maybe so, but in war terrorism would be considered, and looked into.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 30, 2006 06:10 PM (D2g/j)
11
Domestically, the Police are on the front-line of Anti-terrorism?
Posted by: davec at August 30, 2006 11:23 PM (QkWqQ)
12
Oh yea! Who is policing the police in New Orleans?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 31, 2006 07:47 AM (ILtBj)
August 29, 2006
Civil Liberties in a Time of War
As I have argued since day one on this blog: liberties are ordered and are always dependent on context. It's why a civil libertarian, like myself, can also call for more state intervention in the context of war. War changes everything. Apparently, an emminent legal scholar agrees. If you get the chance, be sure to listen to the whole thing.
Posted by: Rusty at
06:09 PM
| Comments (11)
| Add Comment
Post contains 67 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Considering the gravity of the threat, most if not all civil liberties are still in place. My parents, and my grand parents gave back many more liberties than have been asked of us today.
What we should be asking is, what can I do to help? I say we can help each other by watching out for each other. Sites like this are a great step. Imagine what would have been the outcome of WW2 if there had been a communication media as powerful as the web?
Most of all, we should be lending moral support to the Iraqi people as they begin the task of confronting Muqtada al-Sadr. My guess is the USA is calling in the chit on his ass. I hope so. Remove him, and the Sunni faction will need to fight the IGofI or capitulate.
What we should be asking is, what can I do to help? I say we can help each other by watching out for each other. Sites like this are a great step. Imagine what would have been the outcome of WW2 if there had been a communication media as powerful as the web?
Most of all, we should be lending moral support to the Iraqi people as they begin the task of confronting Muqtada al-Sadr. My guess is the USA is calling in the chit on his ass. I hope so. Remove him, and the Sunni faction will need to fight the IGofI or capitulate.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 29, 2006 07:30 PM (n4VvM)
2
I meant the UGofI Unitarian govt of Iraq
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 29, 2006 07:32 PM (n4VvM)
3
The only ones who've lost their civil liberties are the terrorists. My life and my liberties remain entirely unnafected by the Patriot Act, no matter how much the mindless zombies on the Left tell me otherwise. When you ask them how my liberties have suffered, it's obvious they don't have a clue and are just spouting mindless Leftwing platitudes.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 29, 2006 07:56 PM (8e/V4)
4
Somewhere there is a machine that must generate the talking points. Random enough to seem new every election cycle, But they are the same points every election cycle.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 29, 2006 08:05 PM (n4VvM)
5
I know this is off topic, but has any one heard of a guy running over 14 people in San. Fran.? I heard he had a Muslim name.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 29, 2006 08:36 PM (D2g/j)
6
You said it Monk! The enemy acts without conscience or hindrances of the media. What the left seems to overlook is that if we lose this global war the impacts to their civil liberties will be far greater then long lines at the airports. The monsters we fight behead people for no other reason then a 5 minute blurb on MSNBC and yet the left demonizes Bush's atempts to intercept their phone calls? If one can't see the a glaringly skewed values system here there is no point in debating the issue with them.
Posted by: USMC_shooter at August 29, 2006 08:36 PM (R57PZ)
7
Hey Rusty, have you been to my site lately? Just curious since I stalk yours daily.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 29, 2006 10:10 PM (n4VvM)
8
Well SeaMonk, that would be nice if we could sway Aldr Swar or Muktwawa Al-Assar or whoever, but I am afraid it might be like the Russian toy doll puzzle. You open one doll only to find another and then another and on and on. I would certainly give them moral support through the medium of cyberspace, but that is about the extent that I would want to expend my energies in that particular corner of the planet. If you must go and try to reason with them or to blast them, I wish you the best. Remember what the rooster said about duty to wife and family.
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 29, 2006 11:12 PM (Dd86v)
9
And Seamonk, if you want to lose weight so you can re-enlist, eat lots of pasta! Yeah, that's it! Lot's of pasta! But seriously, there are enough broken families and fatherless children on account of this war as it is!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 29, 2006 11:16 PM (Dd86v)
10
Both lawyers made good points. Very long winded. I think we need MI5 or a clone. What good does it do to arrest the NAZI after he's beaten our brains out with a lead Pipe (or blown up the Pentagon with an airliner)? I say catch 'em and kill 'em befor then even get the pipe!
Posted by: Rod Stanton at August 30, 2006 08:31 AM (Mt4sG)
11
So what kind of civil liberties have loyal, patriotic citizens been asked to give up? Other than having to empty my pockets and go through a metal detector in Federal buildings, and get the mirror-under-the-car and bomb-sniffing dog treatment at the airport, my life hasn't really been affected in any way. If liberals and muslims don't like the fact that they can't call Osama to wish him a happy ramadan, that's not my problem, and frankly, if they don't like it, they can get the hell out. This is our country, and we have the right to defend it and its people, and anyone who doesn't like that is an enemy and should be shot.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 30, 2006 09:12 AM (v3I+x)
Terrorists Pay for Junket for Democrat
Whoa. The Tamil Tigers are bad hombres. It looks like a Democrat in Congress actually took a trip paid for by this terrorist organization.
When we joke about Buddhist terrorists being a bit of an oxymoron it's not that there aren't Buddhist terrorists, they are just hard to find---and the Tamil Tigers are those terrorists. While the suicide mission is nothing new to the world, it may be possible to trace the modern iteration to the Tamil Tigers. So, in one sense, the Tamil Tigers actually may have inspired some of the tactics used by Islamist terrorists.
Chicago congressman Danny Davis and an aide took a trip to Sri Lanka last year that was paid for by the Tamil Tigers, a group that the U.S. government has designated as a terrorist organization for its use of suicide bombers and child soldiers, law-enforcement sources said.It gets worse. Much worse. Davis admits that he knew that the group funding the trip was associated with the terrorists.Davis’ seven-day trip came under scrutiny this week following the arrests of 11 supporters of the organization on charges of participating in a broad conspiracy to aid the terrorist group through money laundering, arms procurement and bribery of U.S. officials.
Posted by: Rusty at
09:23 AM
| Comments (12)
| Add Comment
Post contains 213 words, total size 2 kb.
1
Is he connected with any terrorist supporters in Chicago and Dearbornistan? Was he supposed to spin a good light on these terrorists in Congress?
Doc, why don't you start issuing Jawa fatwas on these idiots? MSM, Liberals, Democrats. They're probably all on Hizbullah, Hamas, CAIR, Iran and whoever else's payroll.
On a different note, with all the (fake) US cash Hizbullah is waving about, who's to say that Hiz and other groups like them, aren't paying these photogs, journalists, tv reporters, NGOs, Lebanese Red Cross, etc. to help them with their media propaganda? We can tell that the MSM is corrupt in their distortion of the facts so why not on the take as well. I wouldn't be surprised if this came out eventually too.
Doc, why don't you start issuing Jawa fatwas on these idiots? MSM, Liberals, Democrats. They're probably all on Hizbullah, Hamas, CAIR, Iran and whoever else's payroll.
On a different note, with all the (fake) US cash Hizbullah is waving about, who's to say that Hiz and other groups like them, aren't paying these photogs, journalists, tv reporters, NGOs, Lebanese Red Cross, etc. to help them with their media propaganda? We can tell that the MSM is corrupt in their distortion of the facts so why not on the take as well. I wouldn't be surprised if this came out eventually too.
Posted by: Stan the Infidel in Indonesia at August 29, 2006 09:21 AM (u2KKH)
2
That would have read better if I had put "on these terrorists to Congress?" Not that there are any terrorists in congress. wink wink
Posted by: Stan the Infidel in Indonesia at August 29, 2006 09:26 AM (u2KKH)
3
Democrats and terrorists of all stripes share a common enemy - America - and are forming alliances with terrorist organizations, whom they are assisting in our conquest. Democrats are traitors, and their actions bear out my words.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 29, 2006 10:03 AM (v3I+x)
4
Islamic extremeists and Dems persue the same demographic. The poor, uneducated and the young and ignorant. They foster chaos in order to advance their beliefs.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 29, 2006 11:20 AM (1E0XU)
5
Actually I think the Tamil Tigers are more Hindu than Buddhist. That IIRC is part of the problem becuase the majority Singhalese are Buddhist
Posted by: Francis at August 29, 2006 12:27 PM (ybFKc)
6
Whats this idiot doing rubbing elbows with known terrorists? he should be removed from office
Posted by: sandpiper at August 29, 2006 03:11 PM (n7v4a)
7
Hey!!!!!!!! You guys can't say anything bad about Danny Davis. Danny Davis is black. You bunch of racist, bigoted, KKK, Nazis. Call the deleters.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 29, 2006 04:06 PM (BInc2)
8
Why is this not all over the media? Enough with these idiots trying to do anything they can to harm America and nothing being said about it!
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 29, 2006 05:52 PM (0Pys3)
9
He is a traitor greyrooster he is meeting with terrorists
Posted by: sandpiper at August 29, 2006 10:32 PM (4v/PL)
10
My word! The rampant racism! I'm shocked Maxie! I tells you I am simply shocked!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 29, 2006 11:37 PM (Dd86v)
11
My God: Sandpiper must be a nazi.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 30, 2006 08:36 AM (WmiLs)
12
Danny (ugh, blacks shouldn't be called Danny) Davis and Willie Jefferson. Birds of a feather. Now the libs, Naacp, Al Sharpton, Jessie Jackson and Goodie Lt will come to their aid.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 30, 2006 08:42 AM (WmiLs)
August 28, 2006
Today I Converted to Islam
Today, I converted to Islam. Why? Because Islam is the religion of peace. There is no compulsion in religion, under Islam. Islam tolerates all religions. Muhammed (PBUH) was a shining example of tolerance and love. His example shows us the way.
The fact that I am being held hostage had nothing to do with my conversion. Force has never ever ever been used to convert people to Islam. If you hear otherwise, it is a Zionist lie. A lie I tell you! more...
Posted by: Rusty at
11:03 AM
| Comments (21)
| Add Comment
Post contains 87 words, total size 1 kb.
1
I'm calling "Carnival of the Conversions"... I'll have my offering up in a few.
Posted by: Editor at August 28, 2006 11:32 AM (adpJH)
2
We are all Muslim inside. The good people of the moon god just want to bring it out. Sort of like exorcising a demon. Just with an Islamic touch.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 28, 2006 11:50 AM (n4VvM)
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 28, 2006 11:52 AM (n4VvM)
Posted by: rightwingprof at August 28, 2006 12:10 PM (hj1Wx)
5
Welcome to the fold brother! Peace be upon thee! ;-)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 28, 2006 12:33 PM (gLMre)
6
Semen, that bunnie exorcist flick had me hopping with hysteria! Good find! ;-)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 28, 2006 12:37 PM (gLMre)
7
hi al peace up
i find no connection between islam nd terror
tht is so wrong im talkin as a muslim
must if muslims are against this insane ppl
nd one more thing i don't understand what doese jessica alba mean with her shirt sayin " i read mohammed comics "
some one explane it to me !!
thnx
i find no connection between islam nd terror
tht is so wrong im talkin as a muslim
must if muslims are against this insane ppl
nd one more thing i don't understand what doese jessica alba mean with her shirt sayin " i read mohammed comics "
some one explane it to me !!
thnx
Posted by: sweet at August 28, 2006 12:40 PM (Rw9fO)
8
Dude, you forgot to put the little black line over your eyes to conceal your true identity.
Posted by: Leopold Stotch at August 28, 2006 12:42 PM (pbMjF)
9
I will no longer cover up my true identity. Nor will I ever be called by my slave name.
I renounce the name Rusty Shackleford.
Please call me Osama Dirka Jihad!
I renounce the name Rusty Shackleford.
Please call me Osama Dirka Jihad!
Posted by: Rusty at August 28, 2006 12:43 PM (JQjhA)
10
Next thing I know, Rusty, uh.....Osama, you will be taking your coffee in a cave, as befits a true believer.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 28, 2006 01:01 PM (rUyw4)
11
From where the sun now stands, you will be forever known to mankind as Osama Dirka Jihad, or in the MSM, ODJ.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 28, 2006 01:01 PM (n4VvM)
Posted by: Jihad Rusty Dirka Dirka at August 28, 2006 01:02 PM (JQjhA)
13
Ahhh.........finally, I have recieved my first fatwa(I am jumping up and down, waving my arms, hitting myself in the face and on top of my head). I've seen the imams doing that, so I thought I would try it. Bad idea. I think I will now have me a cold beer.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 28, 2006 01:23 PM (rUyw4)
14
I applaud your wise decision. Canine Islam has greatly improved my life. Peace be upon you.
Posted by: Ayatollah Mugsy at August 28, 2006 02:22 PM (+QtqQ)
15
I suppose this means the Jawa Christmas party is now going to be called Holliday Fun or some bullshit like that.
Posted by: Brad at August 28, 2006 03:48 PM (Ignlt)
16
All this just to get some from those 72 virgins? What the koran doesn't tell you is that after your dead - no more woodies. Now what are you going to do!
Posted by: hondo at August 28, 2006 04:35 PM (XrexX)
17
To all holiday makers, who visit this free a fun loving Palestine on your ‘be a Muslim for the week excursions’ (note discounts for two weeks). Your stay will be exciting, you will be required to make one fingered promises to our leader and complementary statements to the fact we are lovely people, our story is worth reporting and nothing will be forced or be intimidating during your stay. Please note we only accept $US currency.
Posted by: Me at August 28, 2006 04:57 PM (VqG62)
18
The Prophet of Satan (Pigs Be Upon Him) welcomes your humble service.
Posted by: Marvin at August 28, 2006 08:34 PM (ZROkT)
19
Dirka, the Prophet (Pigs Be Upon Him) welcomes your service and asks have you killed your quota of infidels today?
Posted by: Marvin at August 28, 2006 08:36 PM (ZROkT)
20
haha 
marvin ! how many infidels you killed today...witty, really! on a serious note..let me share a reading from islamic history.. involving infidels.
"One morning , in Mecca, Muhammad, woke up and hurried to mosque, to say his morning prayers. this prayer has to be said before the sunrise, and the muslims hurry to the mosque, to reach in time. getting late would mean missing the prayer. Muhammad walked fast too, untill he found an infidel, an old and weak christian fellow walking in front of him.Although getting late for the most important of prayers, Muhammad slowed down his pace...did not cross him by walking faster than him...the reason?? by walking faster and crossing him, the old fellow will realize he is not as strong and young as few years ago, and this will bring sadness to his heart. All muslims shall learn from many such glorious examples of their history if they really believe that , "He (Muhammad) is sent as a blessing to all of human kind".
marvin ! how many infidels you killed today...witty, really! on a serious note..let me share a reading from islamic history.. involving infidels.
"One morning , in Mecca, Muhammad, woke up and hurried to mosque, to say his morning prayers. this prayer has to be said before the sunrise, and the muslims hurry to the mosque, to reach in time. getting late would mean missing the prayer. Muhammad walked fast too, untill he found an infidel, an old and weak christian fellow walking in front of him.Although getting late for the most important of prayers, Muhammad slowed down his pace...did not cross him by walking faster than him...the reason?? by walking faster and crossing him, the old fellow will realize he is not as strong and young as few years ago, and this will bring sadness to his heart. All muslims shall learn from many such glorious examples of their history if they really believe that , "He (Muhammad) is sent as a blessing to all of human kind".
Posted by: James at September 01, 2006 10:53 PM (L1qPu)
21
hey interesting forum...
here is what some infidels have said about prophet of islam, in history..
http://jews-for-allah.org/Why-Believe-in-Allah/What-non-Muslims-sayabout-Muhammad.htm#gibbon1
here is what some infidels have said about prophet of islam, in history..
http://jews-for-allah.org/Why-Believe-in-Allah/What-non-Muslims-sayabout-Muhammad.htm#gibbon1
Posted by: peck at September 01, 2006 11:48 PM (L1qPu)
The Doogie Howser of Terrorism
The longer I'm in academia, the more I realize how meaningless Ph.D.'s are. Last spring I was sitting in on a roundtable about terrorism with a bunch of 'experts' in academia. Biggest point of contention? Whether or not the word 'terrorism' ought to be used at all since 'one man's terrorist is another man's freedom-fighter'.
Your tax dollars at work.
So, who is the Doogie Howser of Terrorism? My friend, Evan Kohlman. Sun Sentinal:
Defense lawyers in a major South Florida terror case want to make sure jurors never hear from witness Evan Kohlmann....If Evan is Doogie Howser, I guess that makes me Arnold Jackson. You can read Doogies work at the Counterterrorism blog or at Global Terror Alert.He has no Ph.D., no faculty position and no real-life experience in the Middle East. Plus, there's the age thing. Kohlmann, who has testified five times for the government already, is just 27. He has been called the "Doogie Howser" of terrorism.
Kohlmann has fought off such attacks before.
Posted by: Rusty at
10:21 AM
| Comments (5)
| Add Comment
Post contains 173 words, total size 1 kb.
1
He's much more qualified than one Juan Cole.
Posted by: Mark at August 28, 2006 11:00 AM (38WZc)
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 28, 2006 11:41 AM (8e/V4)
3
The first thing I learned in grad school was not to be impressed that anyone had a PhD. The world is full of idiots with PhDs. A PhD is more a test of tenacity and masochism than intellect.
Posted by: rightwingprof at August 28, 2006 12:13 PM (hj1Wx)
4
They don't know what on earth to do once they leave their padded academia existence.
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 28, 2006 12:56 PM (gLMre)
Posted by: Jihad Rusty Dirka Dirka at August 28, 2006 01:00 PM (JQjhA)
August 21, 2006
BBC Staging Photos, Endangering Children
British taxdollars at work, staging Hezbollah propaganda photos, endangering the lives of children. BBC:
The shell is huge, bigger than the young boy pushed forward to stand reluctantly next to it while we get our cameras out and record the scene for posterity.The story is by Martin Asser.
Hat tip: Charles "Grand Master Flash" Johnson
Posted by: Rusty at
02:04 PM
| Comments (3)
| Add Comment
Post contains 59 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Maybe its a dud - maybe the BBC crew should give the kid a hammer to find out.
Rusty - on a different note - the BBC, the Euro MSM, and much of the European opposition to our actions IS NOT because they are pro-palestinian, pro-arab, pro-muslim etc - if fact, they hate these people, hold them in contempt, and once ruled them as colonial subjects ....
Their opposition is based solely on latent (and growing again) anti-Americanism.
Alliances are not permanent! They serve agreed upon purposes and shift with the winds of time!
In our history, we have fought numerous and often costly battles and wars with Britain, France, Germany, Austria, Italy, and Spain - add to that list their "allies of the moment" Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, Croatia, Albania - add to that list the fervent volunteers to the Nazi SS foreign divisions from the Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Sweden etc.
Oddly enough - we have never had a beef or bad blood with Poland, had a damn good relationship historically with Serbia (until recently), and oddest of all - never really had a personal throw down with the Russians.
We should take all this into consideration - and conduct our foreign policies and alliances with a weather vane - and not on myths.
Rusty - on a different note - the BBC, the Euro MSM, and much of the European opposition to our actions IS NOT because they are pro-palestinian, pro-arab, pro-muslim etc - if fact, they hate these people, hold them in contempt, and once ruled them as colonial subjects ....
Their opposition is based solely on latent (and growing again) anti-Americanism.
Alliances are not permanent! They serve agreed upon purposes and shift with the winds of time!
In our history, we have fought numerous and often costly battles and wars with Britain, France, Germany, Austria, Italy, and Spain - add to that list their "allies of the moment" Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, Croatia, Albania - add to that list the fervent volunteers to the Nazi SS foreign divisions from the Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Sweden etc.
Oddly enough - we have never had a beef or bad blood with Poland, had a damn good relationship historically with Serbia (until recently), and oddest of all - never really had a personal throw down with the Russians.
We should take all this into consideration - and conduct our foreign policies and alliances with a weather vane - and not on myths.
Posted by: hondo at August 21, 2006 07:01 PM (XrexX)
2
I am surprised the BBC vultures only took pictures as they gathered around the scene. I would have expected a circle-jerk from the BBC.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 21, 2006 07:16 PM (+nlyI)
3
You've missed the real point here. I just saw the BBC article posted by James Taranto of WSJ "Best of the Web". This is what I've written to him:
That ain’t no 1000lb bomb. I don’t know about the alleged “tailfins†on the roof – but it sure looks like an artillery shell and not a bomb. Difference is that only the IDF can drop a bomb, but if it’s not a bomb, indeed it could be a Hezbollah shell. Pls don’t take my word for it on the artillery shell vs bomb and the missing tailfins, but rather ask someone else who is an expert on that issue. I am very certain on the 1000lb part. It simply is not big enough.
Back to the bomb issue. I simply am not aware of any bomb that has a flat bottom like that one. Bombs are streamlined and aerodynamic. Artillery shells have flat bottoms…
And furthermore…
Now this shell vs bomb issue is quite important. Even your post uses the terms interchangeably. Bomb = IDF almost without dispute. Shell = inconclusive. An artillery shell could be carried into the room for a staged shot. We don’t after all get to see the Wily Coyote profile in the roof… The BBC well knows the difference between a bomb and a shell even if “Best of the Web Today†does not. They are using the terms interchangeably because they know it IS NOT a bomb, but can hide behind the ambiguity. This is deliberately confusing to the militarily ignorant who like “Best of the…†wouldn’t know the difference, but sense correctly that a bomb is what a plane drops. The phrase “The shell is huge, bigger than the young boy…†is just laughable. Clearly the boy is very very small – another tipoff that this is not a 1000lb bomb.
But don’t take my word for it. Let LGF (or Jawa) sort it out!
That ain’t no 1000lb bomb. I don’t know about the alleged “tailfins†on the roof – but it sure looks like an artillery shell and not a bomb. Difference is that only the IDF can drop a bomb, but if it’s not a bomb, indeed it could be a Hezbollah shell. Pls don’t take my word for it on the artillery shell vs bomb and the missing tailfins, but rather ask someone else who is an expert on that issue. I am very certain on the 1000lb part. It simply is not big enough.
Back to the bomb issue. I simply am not aware of any bomb that has a flat bottom like that one. Bombs are streamlined and aerodynamic. Artillery shells have flat bottoms…
And furthermore…
Now this shell vs bomb issue is quite important. Even your post uses the terms interchangeably. Bomb = IDF almost without dispute. Shell = inconclusive. An artillery shell could be carried into the room for a staged shot. We don’t after all get to see the Wily Coyote profile in the roof… The BBC well knows the difference between a bomb and a shell even if “Best of the Web Today†does not. They are using the terms interchangeably because they know it IS NOT a bomb, but can hide behind the ambiguity. This is deliberately confusing to the militarily ignorant who like “Best of the…†wouldn’t know the difference, but sense correctly that a bomb is what a plane drops. The phrase “The shell is huge, bigger than the young boy…†is just laughable. Clearly the boy is very very small – another tipoff that this is not a 1000lb bomb.
But don’t take my word for it. Let LGF (or Jawa) sort it out!
Posted by: Jeff Cole at August 25, 2006 05:14 PM (p49Ri)
The Leftist Fifth Column
Michael Barone on our covert enemies. RCP:
Our covert enemies are harder to identify, for they live in large numbers within our midst. And in terms of intentions, they are not enemies in the sense that they consciously wish to destroy our society. On the contrary, they enjoy our freedoms and often call for their expansion. But they have also been working, over many years, to undermine faith in our society and confidence in its goodness. These covert enemies are those among our elites who have promoted the ideas labeled as multiculturalism, moral relativism and (the term is Professor Samuel Huntington's) transnationalism....Barone misses a major point here. Although the Left did not argue for the Taliban, they did argue against the US going to war in Afghanistan. In fact, they always argue against the US. No matter what we do. Why? Because their hatred of Islamofascists is eclipsed by a much deeper hatred: hatred of America.Nevertheless, the default assumption of our covert enemies is that in any conflict between the West and the Rest, the West is wrong. That assumption can be rebutted by overwhelming fact: Few argued for the Taliban after Sept. 11. But in our continuing struggles, our covert enemies portray our work in Iraq through the lens of Abu Ghraib and consider Israel's self-defense against Hezbollah as the oppression of virtuous victims by evil men. In World War II, our elites understood that we were the forces of good and that victory was essential. Today, many of our elites subject our military and intelligence actions to fine-tooth-comb analysis and find that they are morally repugnant.
And by the Left, I do not mean liberals, but true Leftists. Think Chomsky.
Decision '08 & Dr. Sanity have more.
UPDATE: For the Leftist retards with no memory who are commenting.
Noam Chomsky, Feb. 1, 2002, the most cited Leftist intellectual on the planet:
One may reasonably ask just whose needs are served by these priorities, and what status they should have in reconstruction from the horrors of the past two decades.And Mother Jones in Jan. of 2002 decided to run that oh so importants story about a pacifist congregation of Christians. Even as we were in the middle of the war that the Left now claims they supported, the Left was arguing that oh-so-important question: should churches display the American flag.U.S. and British intellectual opinion, across the political spectrum, assured us that only radical extremists can doubt that “this is basically a just war.†Those who disagree can therefore be dismissed, among them, for example, the 1,000 Afghan leaders who met in Peshawar in late October in a U.S.-backed effort to lay the groundwork for a post-Taliban regime led by the exiled King. They bitterly condemned the U.S. war, which is “beating the donkey rather than the rider,†one speaker said to unanimous agreement.
Idiots.
No. I take that back.
Useful idiots.
Posted by: Rusty at
10:25 AM
| Comments (64)
| Add Comment
Post contains 487 words, total size 3 kb.
1
I refer you to one Assam Tamimi, a professor at a Manchester university, who has written a book on Western Imperialism and genocide, paid for by none other than the British taxpayer, whilst he waxes on at ExpoIslamia about the necessity for the destruction of Israel, Britain and America. Deport the bastard immediately, friends in Britain. Of course, I can't say too much, as we don't deport these bastards in the US yet, but the deportations will begin soon, I think, shortly after the next big attack. Many of these people will also willingly go, as it will not be safe for them in the US. The citizens here have just about had enough of their shit.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 11:12 AM (rUyw4)
2
Leftist magazines such as "The Nation" and "Mother Jones" supported the war in Afganistan. Who else is there with influence?
Posted by: drlloyd11 at August 21, 2006 12:04 PM (WxNeS)
3
Doesn't this strike you as contradictory:
"These covert enemies are those among our elites who have promoted the ideas labeled as multiculturalism ..."
It's difficult to remain 'covert' while openly promoting one's hatred of America. Even the Jawa Report had no trouble finding Chomsky! Of course he very publicly states his views on the use of military power.
Next we'll hear Ted Rall is 'covertly' opposing the US military, and using his cartoon to spread his secret, subversive ideas!
Barone's post is incoherent, and Jawa's comment on it seems pointless. Must be a slow news day.
"These covert enemies are those among our elites who have promoted the ideas labeled as multiculturalism ..."
It's difficult to remain 'covert' while openly promoting one's hatred of America. Even the Jawa Report had no trouble finding Chomsky! Of course he very publicly states his views on the use of military power.
Next we'll hear Ted Rall is 'covertly' opposing the US military, and using his cartoon to spread his secret, subversive ideas!
Barone's post is incoherent, and Jawa's comment on it seems pointless. Must be a slow news day.
Posted by: Colin at August 21, 2006 12:20 PM (673ys)
4
Oh, I don't know, Colin, you've had Tamimi espousing his particular brand of hatred over at the ExpoIslamia conference or whatever, and am I correct in saying that he and his flavor of Islamists and supporters are all feeding at the government tit. Are they not a Fifth Column along with the Leftists who support them? Some of the Leftists covertly support these Islamists in our midst, while some do it out in the open. The Respect Party comes to mind, with its promise to raise the Palestinian Flag on the island of Britain. Yep, there is a time bomb ticking as we enjoy another slow news day. Keep repeating that over and over, Colin.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 12:43 PM (rUyw4)
5
Dr Lloyd-
Not to mention other "leftist pubs" like Salon, and pretty much the ENTIRE editorial staff of the New York Times, Washington Post and LATimes. Guess these "leftists" aren't in the majority of the America-hating left, eh? ;-)
Keep in mind, this is Jawa-land. Folks in here create "facts" when reality infringes and use words like "freedom" much like an ostrich uses sand.
Wonder how many of the folks in here have actually read Chomsky and can accurately and cogently rebut any of his positions (without using google, of course)?
Gizout!
Not to mention other "leftist pubs" like Salon, and pretty much the ENTIRE editorial staff of the New York Times, Washington Post and LATimes. Guess these "leftists" aren't in the majority of the America-hating left, eh? ;-)
Keep in mind, this is Jawa-land. Folks in here create "facts" when reality infringes and use words like "freedom" much like an ostrich uses sand.
Wonder how many of the folks in here have actually read Chomsky and can accurately and cogently rebut any of his positions (without using google, of course)?
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 12:54 PM (FyFm5)
6
Can you cite a single instance of "the left" actually criticizing the invasion of Afghanistan? Iraq, yes. But, as a dyed-in-the-wool lefty, my recollection is that the country was pretty well united on the necessity to root out the Taliban and try to bringh Bin Laden to justice. It was the cynical oil grab in Iraq, at the cost of diverting resources from Afghanistan -- both the pursuit of Bin Lasnden and the creation of a viable Democracy -- which those of us on the left truly questioned.
Posted by: Walter Maroney at August 21, 2006 01:06 PM (em4Ld)
7
The 60% of Americans who support a withdrawal of the troops from Iraq are Lefties? They hate America?
Get a grip.
Get a grip.
Posted by: Devil's Advocate at August 21, 2006 01:06 PM (5a01y)
8
I read the rant from Michael Barone which, I am sure, sounds "intellectual" to anyone without even a precursory understanding of Philosophy. If you have taken even a couple of undergrad Phil courses, you know, of course, it is drivel.
Countries, like people, are not better or worse than other countries in any absolute sense. Imagine the difference in the attitude and respect of most other countries toward the US now, and 10 years ago. In ten years, the US has gone from the most highly respected country on Earth, to the country more people over the globe are frightened of as a threat to their peace and life. A bigger threat than Iran or Syria or NORTH KOREA. In ten years; what about in 50 or 100?
"Hatred of America" garbage posted above is not a danger to America. The danger to America is in those citizens who have fogotten that our responsibllities as Americans are to clean up America's messes before we worry about the rest of the world. It is incumbent on on all Americans to look at policy, and when misguided, vote to correct it. FIX America first is a better description than "blame America first."
"...cast out first the beam out of thine eye, and then thou wilt see clearly to cast out the mote out of the eye of thy brother." - Matheww 7:5 Perhaps the US should take a lesson from Jesus?
Countries, like people, are not better or worse than other countries in any absolute sense. Imagine the difference in the attitude and respect of most other countries toward the US now, and 10 years ago. In ten years, the US has gone from the most highly respected country on Earth, to the country more people over the globe are frightened of as a threat to their peace and life. A bigger threat than Iran or Syria or NORTH KOREA. In ten years; what about in 50 or 100?
"Hatred of America" garbage posted above is not a danger to America. The danger to America is in those citizens who have fogotten that our responsibllities as Americans are to clean up America's messes before we worry about the rest of the world. It is incumbent on on all Americans to look at policy, and when misguided, vote to correct it. FIX America first is a better description than "blame America first."
"...cast out first the beam out of thine eye, and then thou wilt see clearly to cast out the mote out of the eye of thy brother." - Matheww 7:5 Perhaps the US should take a lesson from Jesus?
Posted by: observer at August 21, 2006 01:13 PM (ktoqC)
9
The publications sited in this thread based any support for the operations in Afghanistan on purely stratigic factors.
They deny there is good, or evil(unless it's Bushitler- even then when cornered they claim he is not evil, just stupid, and then go on to lay accusations out that would require he be a super-genius).
They fail to understand that reality is a product of our belief, perception, and actions. They abdicate their role in reality.
Gizzard, telling that your statement on "facts" hinges on a myth. Ostriches don't stick their heads in the sand. They may, however, kick you to death.
They deny there is good, or evil(unless it's Bushitler- even then when cornered they claim he is not evil, just stupid, and then go on to lay accusations out that would require he be a super-genius).
They fail to understand that reality is a product of our belief, perception, and actions. They abdicate their role in reality.
Gizzard, telling that your statement on "facts" hinges on a myth. Ostriches don't stick their heads in the sand. They may, however, kick you to death.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 01:19 PM (PX+vn)
10
Chomsky's employer has been the recipient of
incredible largess from the Wahabi rulers of Saudi Arabia, a billion dollars or the better part,
so Saudi can do no wrong according to
Chomsky.For all his academic blather to cloud the any situation involving Islam, he remains
but an ordinary flak.
WD
incredible largess from the Wahabi rulers of Saudi Arabia, a billion dollars or the better part,
so Saudi can do no wrong according to
Chomsky.For all his academic blather to cloud the any situation involving Islam, he remains
but an ordinary flak.
WD
Posted by: WD at August 21, 2006 01:23 PM (G6Cjy)
11
"They" do this and "they" do that. And of course "they" hate america, hate our liberties and "they" would probably eat our children given half a chance. As other posters have challenged, name some "they's" of influence who were against the Afghanistan compaign. Do you understand that even the ARAB world, posturing leaders aside, not only expected us to take out AQ and the Taliban government as retribution for 9-11 but that we would have lost national honor had we not done so? Striking into Afghanistan was culturally acceptable...Iraq not so much. Speaking of taking out AQ and the Taliban, how about complaining about "they" who so distracted this nations powerful resources so that a 5 years later, the Taliban are retaking towns and provinces, Americans are still being killed in Afghanistan and OBL is sipping tea in his cave.
Posted by: jeff at August 21, 2006 01:24 PM (z/Bt9)
12
QC,
Ostrichs don't?
Hmmm, looks like you are right, courtesy of PBS Nature-
"Contrary to popular belief, ostriches do not bury their heads in the sand. If a predator threatens their nest, ostriches will lay their head against the sand to try to blend in with it."
Granted, my metaphor still works, given our revised understanding of ostrich behavior, but I concede it is rather weak. Will try harder next time, thanks!
Gizout!
Ostrichs don't?
Hmmm, looks like you are right, courtesy of PBS Nature-
"Contrary to popular belief, ostriches do not bury their heads in the sand. If a predator threatens their nest, ostriches will lay their head against the sand to try to blend in with it."
Granted, my metaphor still works, given our revised understanding of ostrich behavior, but I concede it is rather weak. Will try harder next time, thanks!
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 01:29 PM (FyFm5)
13
FTA:"Our covert enemies don't want the Islamo-fascists to win. But in some corner of their hearts, they would like us to lose."
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 01:40 PM (PX+vn)
14
a) Salon, The New Repubic and the NYT are not "Lefist" outlets. Rather, they are simply partisan Democratic outlets.
b) You're memory has found a hole, dug in, and gone to sleep.
b) You're memory has found a hole, dug in, and gone to sleep.
Posted by: Rusty at August 21, 2006 01:43 PM (JQjhA)
15
Does my hoping the "Christofascists" fail somehow make me less of an American?
By "fail", I mean that silly Armageddon/Rapture thingie...
Gizout!
By "fail", I mean that silly Armageddon/Rapture thingie...
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 01:44 PM (FyFm5)
16
No, but your usage of the word "Christofascists" simply reveals you are a) ignorant b) an asshole.
Ignorant we can fix.
Ignorant we can fix.
Posted by: Rusty at August 21, 2006 01:52 PM (JQjhA)
17
WD:
Bush has been the recipient of incredible largess from the Wahabi rulers of Saudi Arabia too.
Chomsky is to the left as Ayn Rand is to the right. The oft wrong-quoted creator of staw men.
Second, is anyone on the right actually bothered to read Chomsky; they would find a veritable gold mine of quotes on the necessary of mis-trust of government that may on the paleo-con right would agree with.
Bush has been the recipient of incredible largess from the Wahabi rulers of Saudi Arabia too.
Chomsky is to the left as Ayn Rand is to the right. The oft wrong-quoted creator of staw men.
Second, is anyone on the right actually bothered to read Chomsky; they would find a veritable gold mine of quotes on the necessary of mis-trust of government that may on the paleo-con right would agree with.
Posted by: sal at August 21, 2006 01:56 PM (VWDou)
18
Hey Rusty-
If the aforementioned outlets aren't "leftist", why do the folks in here always term them that?
While we are at it, do you have anything of fact or substance to support your questioning of my memory, which, to refresh *your* memory, remembers all of these supposedly "leftists" news outlets speaking out in favor of our involvement in Afghanistan?
Salon is a "partisan democratic" outlet, eh? Get back to us when you figure out what that means.
Gizout!
If the aforementioned outlets aren't "leftist", why do the folks in here always term them that?
While we are at it, do you have anything of fact or substance to support your questioning of my memory, which, to refresh *your* memory, remembers all of these supposedly "leftists" news outlets speaking out in favor of our involvement in Afghanistan?
Salon is a "partisan democratic" outlet, eh? Get back to us when you figure out what that means.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 02:00 PM (FyFm5)
19
Gizzout, not to speak for Rusty, but it's not "partisan democratic", rather it's "partisan Democratic"
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 02:20 PM (PX+vn)
20
Gizzard is busy doing what a gizzard does best, I see.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 02:25 PM (rUyw4)
21
Rusty, not useful, but useless idiots crossed my mind.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 02:44 PM (rUyw4)
22
Chomsky is an anarchist. This is by his own admission. An anarchist is like a radical leftist who doesn't have the balls to go all the way. So they spew their philosophy to the less gifted in hopes the poor dumb bastards will put on the explosive vests and do the dirty work for them.
I read some of his stuff once. Put me to sleep. Too much me, me, look at me, see how smart me am. He is the Terrel Owens of the Intellectual left elite.
I read some of his stuff once. Put me to sleep. Too much me, me, look at me, see how smart me am. He is the Terrel Owens of the Intellectual left elite.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 02:59 PM (7teJ9)
23
Sal, while you are correct that government has earned not only our distrust but our contempt it is a necessary evil, yet thankfully, we still have the right to bear arms should the need arise. And Chomsky isn't 100% wrong on everything - just 98% ;-)
Many people are fooled by Chomsky's eloquence. His expertise in linguistics and deep understanding of the syntax and semantics of language, the origins of words and the emotions they can evoke in ordinary people give him a vast arsenal of tools to put forth a convincing argument for good or evil. He's more than just difficult to argue with.
Often, while reading him one will harbor a feeling that there's something wrong with what he's saying, but won't know exactly how to rebut or disprove it. Others just accept what he says if the feeling they get from his essays fits their basic world view or opinion of a matter or they're simply easily swayed.
I'm one of those who can't always verbalize well what I mean or feel, but I know bullshit when I see it. While I admire so many highly intelligent people strictly for their intelligence, I prefer people of action and few words.
Many people are fooled by Chomsky's eloquence. His expertise in linguistics and deep understanding of the syntax and semantics of language, the origins of words and the emotions they can evoke in ordinary people give him a vast arsenal of tools to put forth a convincing argument for good or evil. He's more than just difficult to argue with.
Often, while reading him one will harbor a feeling that there's something wrong with what he's saying, but won't know exactly how to rebut or disprove it. Others just accept what he says if the feeling they get from his essays fits their basic world view or opinion of a matter or they're simply easily swayed.
I'm one of those who can't always verbalize well what I mean or feel, but I know bullshit when I see it. While I admire so many highly intelligent people strictly for their intelligence, I prefer people of action and few words.
Posted by: Oyster at August 21, 2006 03:04 PM (nD4t5)
24
You guys are funny what with the shrill posts about how everything is OK in Iraq and how anyone who thinks otherwise is a 'liberal' or 'leftist' or 'quitter'.
It is understandable, because, bottom line, your way of thinking is getting it's ass kicked. The country isn't with you. Now, more and more on the right are turning against you. Just today:
Restoring hope to the Iraqi people by radically diminishing the violence will help retrieve a situation that is getting worse by the week. It will take courage, initiative, boldness, and a more humble approach to the problems caused by our presence there.... But if we are not willing to do what is necessary to win, then the only sane, moral course of action is to bring the troops home as fast as humanly possible. Such a humiliation should not result in a single additional death or injury to the men and women who have performed so bravely and selflessly in the face of blunder after blunder by their superiors.
-Right Wing Nuthouse (http://rightwingnuthouse.com/archives/2006/08/20/iraq-quit-or-commit/)
"Writes Hugh Hewitt on his Townhall blog: Thus it is simply true: Any vote for any Democrat is a vote against victory and a vote for vulnerability. This kind of statement, like Vice President Cheney’s statement that voting for Ned Lamont is an aid to al Qaeda, is simply unhelpful, unnecessary and ultimately disturbing because they elevate the utterer of the phrase to the level of near perfection as they explain the rightness of their party’s position. Public policy positions have not been written in granite by the finger of God and therefore no one ought to be running around as those they are a prophet proclaiming the inerrant truth of their position while proclaiming all who disagree with them as apostates."
-PoliBlog (http://www.poliblogger.com/?p=10537)
It is understandable, because, bottom line, your way of thinking is getting it's ass kicked. The country isn't with you. Now, more and more on the right are turning against you. Just today:
Restoring hope to the Iraqi people by radically diminishing the violence will help retrieve a situation that is getting worse by the week. It will take courage, initiative, boldness, and a more humble approach to the problems caused by our presence there.... But if we are not willing to do what is necessary to win, then the only sane, moral course of action is to bring the troops home as fast as humanly possible. Such a humiliation should not result in a single additional death or injury to the men and women who have performed so bravely and selflessly in the face of blunder after blunder by their superiors.
-Right Wing Nuthouse (http://rightwingnuthouse.com/archives/2006/08/20/iraq-quit-or-commit/)
"Writes Hugh Hewitt on his Townhall blog: Thus it is simply true: Any vote for any Democrat is a vote against victory and a vote for vulnerability. This kind of statement, like Vice President Cheney’s statement that voting for Ned Lamont is an aid to al Qaeda, is simply unhelpful, unnecessary and ultimately disturbing because they elevate the utterer of the phrase to the level of near perfection as they explain the rightness of their party’s position. Public policy positions have not been written in granite by the finger of God and therefore no one ought to be running around as those they are a prophet proclaiming the inerrant truth of their position while proclaiming all who disagree with them as apostates."
-PoliBlog (http://www.poliblogger.com/?p=10537)
Posted by: Adam at August 21, 2006 03:54 PM (nlezP)
25
Observer: What in America should we fix?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 04:09 PM (VMww0)
26
Jeff: You're as bad as those you're ranting about. What then is your solution? Lose?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 04:12 PM (VMww0)
27
Your evidence that "True Leftists" argued against "the US going to war in Afghanistan" is the fact that Chomsky was against it, and that Mother Jones had a article about an argument in a church over whether they should display the flag?
Give me a break. The only way your argument that the Left in the U.S. opposed the war in Afghanistan works is if your definition of the "True Left" includes Chomskities, a few old-school communists, and no one else.
I think we can all see who the real idiot is here.
Give me a break. The only way your argument that the Left in the U.S. opposed the war in Afghanistan works is if your definition of the "True Left" includes Chomskities, a few old-school communists, and no one else.
I think we can all see who the real idiot is here.
Posted by: Monkey Faced Liberal at August 21, 2006 04:42 PM (ZUkHf)
28
Right on, Adam! The right-wing punditry is now running away from both George Bush and the lunatic, know-nothing, 33% fringe that still supports him.
New CNN poll: 61% of Americans oppose the war in Iraq. Why does a majority of Americans love the terrorists?
New CNN poll: 61% of Americans oppose the war in Iraq. Why does a majority of Americans love the terrorists?
Posted by: Devil's Advocate at August 21, 2006 04:44 PM (4bFLn)
29
Ah yes, when you can't argue the issues, just call the people who disagree with you un-American. It makes me wonder why people who support freedom of speech and discussion of issues are dismissed as America-haters, while those who oppose the rights enumerated in our Constitution and put us in debt to billions of dollars in a phony war are patriots.. I suppose George Will, Andrew Sullivan, and William F. Buckley are anti-American, too?
Posted by: David T. at August 21, 2006 04:54 PM (UsZ0H)
30
Come on David T, Devil's A, Monkeyface, and Adam, you guys don't want the Islamo-fascists to win. But in some corner of your hearts, you would like us to lose.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 05:11 PM (PX+vn)
31
Oyster-
While you certain brush a opaque canvas layered in intrique with respect to Noam, I really don't agree whatsoever.
Of course Chomsky is talented linguist, having defined much of the field himself at MIT and in his scholarship. But that doesn't disquise the underlying truth of much of what he says. Take for example, "Distorted Morality- America's War on Terror"- where he essentially disproves all of the hogwash the mass media and our government forces down our throats. His positions are simple and footnoted- exactly which ones do you find wrong, incorrect, or otherwise objectionable, and why. Sorry, but "gut feelings" aren't good enough for me in this critique, but if you have objections based on empricism, I am interested in hearing same.
Let's take the anti-Chomsky- Rush Limbaugh. He is eloquent, provocative, and talented as a orator/manipulator. He is also a blatant LIAR. I don't need my tummy to tell me this, I have reams of evidence of his unquestioned lies.
I really don't know why "action" rather than words, appeals to you so, Oyster. When action results in war, don't you think a higher standard is MANDATORY, or do you just want to see the explosions on CNN?
Gizout!
While you certain brush a opaque canvas layered in intrique with respect to Noam, I really don't agree whatsoever.
Of course Chomsky is talented linguist, having defined much of the field himself at MIT and in his scholarship. But that doesn't disquise the underlying truth of much of what he says. Take for example, "Distorted Morality- America's War on Terror"- where he essentially disproves all of the hogwash the mass media and our government forces down our throats. His positions are simple and footnoted- exactly which ones do you find wrong, incorrect, or otherwise objectionable, and why. Sorry, but "gut feelings" aren't good enough for me in this critique, but if you have objections based on empricism, I am interested in hearing same.
Let's take the anti-Chomsky- Rush Limbaugh. He is eloquent, provocative, and talented as a orator/manipulator. He is also a blatant LIAR. I don't need my tummy to tell me this, I have reams of evidence of his unquestioned lies.
I really don't know why "action" rather than words, appeals to you so, Oyster. When action results in war, don't you think a higher standard is MANDATORY, or do you just want to see the explosions on CNN?
Gizout!
Posted by: gizzard at August 21, 2006 05:14 PM (P0Rz4)
32
Jesusjoe-
You are RIGHT for once, I AM doing what gizzards do best- crushing little shitballs like you!
Thanks for the credit!
Gizout!
You are RIGHT for once, I AM doing what gizzards do best- crushing little shitballs like you!
Thanks for the credit!
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 05:21 PM (P0Rz4)
33
You're going to think silly when Armegeddon raptures your ass and leaves a smile where a crack used to be! ;-)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 21, 2006 06:26 PM (gLMre)
34
Calling it "Hatred of America" is a lie. It's rather a hatred of the U.S. Government as run by Bush. And this hatred is nothing compared to the right wing hatred of the U.S. Government. I live in the Pacific Northwest, and during the 90's I knew a lot of right wingers expecting, actually eager, to do battle with the U.S. Government. In fact one of their own blew up a government building in Oklahoma in the worst terrorist act after 9/11. There isn't a leftist that's done that. Chomsky is a wimp compared to the right winger haters I know.
Posted by: Ronsch at August 21, 2006 08:34 PM (c28/v)
35
Hey Jiz,
Limbaugh is a blow hard jackass just like Chomsky. Neither of them do anything except run their mouths and tell the rest of us what we are doing wrong. I don't listen to either of them. If you had half a brain, you would end your pseudointellectual worship Chomskass and try to form an opinion completely of your own. I want to warn you though, It requires independant thought, courage, and humility. Those three things may be hard for you to come by. Enjoy your stay in the world of the higher mind. I know I certainly enjoy mine.
Limbaugh is a blow hard jackass just like Chomsky. Neither of them do anything except run their mouths and tell the rest of us what we are doing wrong. I don't listen to either of them. If you had half a brain, you would end your pseudointellectual worship Chomskass and try to form an opinion completely of your own. I want to warn you though, It requires independant thought, courage, and humility. Those three things may be hard for you to come by. Enjoy your stay in the world of the higher mind. I know I certainly enjoy mine.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 08:58 PM (n4VvM)
36
QC, it is high time that you check yourself into a facility for the criminally insane.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
Posted by: Devil's Advocate at August 21, 2006 09:06 PM (h2HXW)
37
QC, it is high time that you check yourself into a facility for the criminally insane.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
Posted by: Devil's Advocate at August 21, 2006 09:07 PM (h2HXW)
38
QC, it is high time that you check yourself into a facility for the criminally insane.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
What part of the 61% of Americans who oppose the war don't you grasp?
According to your demented view, 61% of Americans are now hoping -- openly -- that we lose to the terrorists?
Where is Bin Laden, you delusional half - wit? Five years on and the Incompetents in Charge have not found him...
God saves us from the lunatic cretin and his fascist thugs who have taken over this country, thanks to a minority of shit-for-brains, know-nothing, ignorant, jingoistic, mentally - retarded, lower forms of life like you. The only things that motivate you to the polls are fear-mongering and race-baiting. You shit your diapers every time you hear the word "terror".
You, intellectual zeros, Creationist and Rapturist idiots, managed to keep the ideologically criminal moron in the WH in 2004, by whipping up the base and its primal, tribal, instincts. Aided and abetted by the equivalent of supermarket tabloids such as Fox news, and pill-popping, thrice divorced, child-molesting, scum like Limbaugh...
The country has finally woken up to the fact that you are a bunch of criminally insane cretins. Not only does the Emperor have no clothes, there is no Emperor behind the clothes.
Your President is a serial fuck - up, a spoiled, rich, immature, moronic, cowardly, brat, who never had to take responsibility for any of the messes that he ever created. Dumbya is a colossal failure as a human being, a businessman, a politician, and a President. His mom, dad, and his family's buddies, always cleaned up his messes. He was not even able to raise his daughters properly: the twins are vapid, drunken, and sluttish, little tarts like Paris Hilton, i.e., totally useless creatures.
It is really a shame that this once great country has been taken over by ignoramuses, religious crackpots, war-mongering Neo-cons, war-profiteers, crooks, and corrupt politicians.
And for some serious fumigating...
Thankfully, the November election will bring some enlightenment. This country is ripe for cultural and intellectual missionaries.
Posted by: Devil's Advocate at August 21, 2006 09:08 PM (C+UA7)
39
Seamonk-
Post examples, not rhetoric, please. Limbaugh IS a blow hard, but Chomsky sure isn't. Please prove me wrong if you have the balls.
Until then, be quiet, there is enough crosstalk in here.
Thanks!
Gizout!
Post examples, not rhetoric, please. Limbaugh IS a blow hard, but Chomsky sure isn't. Please prove me wrong if you have the balls.
Until then, be quiet, there is enough crosstalk in here.
Thanks!
Gizout!
Posted by: gizzard at August 21, 2006 09:21 PM (P0Rz4)
40
Better men than Chomsky lied about their age to fight in WW2. They are heroes. Chomsky is a coward and hides behind the mantle of Academia. And Jiz is his bitch.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 09:31 PM (n4VvM)
41
Rusty,
"And by the Left, I do not mean liberals, but true Leftists."
I think this marks the first time I can remember someone on the Right making a distinction between liberals and leftists. You are right to do so. Can you expand on this? What are the main differences that you see between the two? Just curious here.
"...our covert enemies portray our work in Iraq through the lens of Abu Ghraib..."
I've often thought that conservatives tend to see the Iraq war through the lens of WW2 righteousness and glory while liberals tend to view the war through the lens of the Vietnam War's moral and ethical murkiness. Both are equally wrong in that Iraq is neither a replay of WW2 or of Vietnam, but it is a conflict unique to itself. Given the stresses that our soldiers experience, it does not surprise me that things like Abu Ghraib happened. (This is in no way an endorsement of what happened at Abu Ghraib.)
But, if you think that our "covert enemies" view the Iraq war "through the lens of Abu Ghraib," through what lens do you think Iraqis, or muslims in general, view it? Given that, ostensibly, we are in Iraq to loosely remake Iraq’s government, and by extension, at least part of their society, in the image of America's, it seems that it is the Iraqis' perceptions that matter most.
"...and consider Israel's self-defense against Hezbollah as the oppression of virtuous victims by evil men."
Who cares what the American Left thinks - this is what millions of people in the Arab world think. If we are in a war for the hearts and minds of the Middle East, then I think Bush missed a huge opportunity provided by the Israel / Hezbollah conflict to prove that America is interested in promoting the betterment of the region's peoples. Never mind that the Bush Administration dragged its feet in pushing for a cease-fire, as they saw the conflict as an opportunity for Israel to neutralize Hezbollah; America was visibly absent from the humanitarian relief efforts that were needed immediately upon the cessation of hostilities. What the Middle East, and the rest of the world for that matter, sees is Hezbollah, and by extension, Hezbollah’s backers, but not America, leading the humanitarian relief efforts.
http://poljunk.gloriousnoise.com/2006/08/you_say_you_want_a_cedar_revolution.php#more
What sort of a message does this send to the very people Bush is trying to win over to America’s influence?
"And by the Left, I do not mean liberals, but true Leftists."
I think this marks the first time I can remember someone on the Right making a distinction between liberals and leftists. You are right to do so. Can you expand on this? What are the main differences that you see between the two? Just curious here.
"...our covert enemies portray our work in Iraq through the lens of Abu Ghraib..."
I've often thought that conservatives tend to see the Iraq war through the lens of WW2 righteousness and glory while liberals tend to view the war through the lens of the Vietnam War's moral and ethical murkiness. Both are equally wrong in that Iraq is neither a replay of WW2 or of Vietnam, but it is a conflict unique to itself. Given the stresses that our soldiers experience, it does not surprise me that things like Abu Ghraib happened. (This is in no way an endorsement of what happened at Abu Ghraib.)
But, if you think that our "covert enemies" view the Iraq war "through the lens of Abu Ghraib," through what lens do you think Iraqis, or muslims in general, view it? Given that, ostensibly, we are in Iraq to loosely remake Iraq’s government, and by extension, at least part of their society, in the image of America's, it seems that it is the Iraqis' perceptions that matter most.
"...and consider Israel's self-defense against Hezbollah as the oppression of virtuous victims by evil men."
Who cares what the American Left thinks - this is what millions of people in the Arab world think. If we are in a war for the hearts and minds of the Middle East, then I think Bush missed a huge opportunity provided by the Israel / Hezbollah conflict to prove that America is interested in promoting the betterment of the region's peoples. Never mind that the Bush Administration dragged its feet in pushing for a cease-fire, as they saw the conflict as an opportunity for Israel to neutralize Hezbollah; America was visibly absent from the humanitarian relief efforts that were needed immediately upon the cessation of hostilities. What the Middle East, and the rest of the world for that matter, sees is Hezbollah, and by extension, Hezbollah’s backers, but not America, leading the humanitarian relief efforts.
http://poljunk.gloriousnoise.com/2006/08/you_say_you_want_a_cedar_revolution.php#more
What sort of a message does this send to the very people Bush is trying to win over to America’s influence?
Posted by: JML at August 22, 2006 12:10 AM (988O+)
42
Gizzard, I asked a question of some posters- it was a yes or no question. None answered. I think I know the answer to the question by their silence. I did not ask the question of you, because you already have have answered it.
But that rant... it's pretty darn good... I'd give it an "A" in terms of actively demonstrating nearly every single reason the left has no political traction or future in this country. I would've given you an "A+" if you could have worked in all of the following terms: "Commander-in-thief", "Chimpy McHalliburton", "Dumbya", "Bu$Hitler", "Amerikkka", and "moron"... you did a very good job, but missed a few of them.
You claim to know how 61% of Americans feel about something... and phrase it in a contextless vague sorceless manner. I hope you know that 84% of Americans blah, blah, blah. While only 21% of housepets in europe blah, blah, blah.
I believed what I believed, and then you said that 61% of Americans don't believe what I believe, but I still believed the same thing. Maybe you'll go do something because everyone else is doing it, but not I.
You've gotta be under contract to RNC psy-ops dept. But I may go check out Arkham Asylum anyhows.
But that rant... it's pretty darn good... I'd give it an "A" in terms of actively demonstrating nearly every single reason the left has no political traction or future in this country. I would've given you an "A+" if you could have worked in all of the following terms: "Commander-in-thief", "Chimpy McHalliburton", "Dumbya", "Bu$Hitler", "Amerikkka", and "moron"... you did a very good job, but missed a few of them.
You claim to know how 61% of Americans feel about something... and phrase it in a contextless vague sorceless manner. I hope you know that 84% of Americans blah, blah, blah. While only 21% of housepets in europe blah, blah, blah.
I believed what I believed, and then you said that 61% of Americans don't believe what I believe, but I still believed the same thing. Maybe you'll go do something because everyone else is doing it, but not I.
You've gotta be under contract to RNC psy-ops dept. But I may go check out Arkham Asylum anyhows.
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 12:48 AM (LoKA7)
43
Gizzard,
You ask where Bin Laden is.
I answer it thusly: Do you understand that some strategeries only work if the enemy doesn't know your strategery?
You ask where Bin Laden is.
I answer it thusly: Do you understand that some strategeries only work if the enemy doesn't know your strategery?
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 12:55 AM (LoKA7)
44
Bah, fuck yall and your "enemy within" rhetoric.
Again,
Fuck yall and fuck your "enemy within" bullshit.
Again,
Fuck yall and fuck your "enemy within" bullshit.
Posted by: GreenGiant at August 22, 2006 10:21 AM (3Z+3l)
45
Seamonk-
Man, keep it coming with your knee-slappers like "Jiz" and "Chomkasshole"- such keen middle school humor nearly covers your complete lack of substance and utter, cowardly avoidance of the subject. Name calling IS so much easier- I understand.
It is too bad your inferiority complex undermines your reading comprehension. There is a universe out there of which you are patently ignorant.
Enough time wasted with you, g'bye.
Gizout!
Man, keep it coming with your knee-slappers like "Jiz" and "Chomkasshole"- such keen middle school humor nearly covers your complete lack of substance and utter, cowardly avoidance of the subject. Name calling IS so much easier- I understand.
It is too bad your inferiority complex undermines your reading comprehension. There is a universe out there of which you are patently ignorant.
Enough time wasted with you, g'bye.
Gizout!
Posted by: gizzard at August 22, 2006 10:24 AM (P0Rz4)
46
QC,
Not surprisingly, I am confused. To which of my rants do you refer? I think you are mistaken me with someone else.
Gizout!
Not surprisingly, I am confused. To which of my rants do you refer? I think you are mistaken me with someone else.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 22, 2006 10:31 AM (P0Rz4)
47
GreenGiant, very intellectual! We will take it under advisement. Meanwhile, return to your bong, where I'm sure you will make more sense to your fellow dopeheads.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 22, 2006 10:39 AM (rUyw4)
48
Giz, do you really believe the Chomsky bullshit, or are you just being obtuse?
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 22, 2006 10:42 AM (rUyw4)
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 11:18 AM (PX+vn)
50
DEVILS ADVOCATE, I asked a question of some posters, including you- it was a yes or no
question. None answered. I know the answer to the question by
your silence.
But that rant... it's pretty darn
good... I'd give it an "A" in terms of actively demonstrating nearly
every single reason the left has no political traction or future in
this country. I would've given you an "A+" if you could have worked in
all of the following terms:
"Commander-in-thief", "Chimpy McHalliburton", "Dumbya", "Bu$Hitler",
"Amerikkka", and "moron"... you did a very good job, but missed a few
of them.
You claim to know how 61% of Americans feel about
something... and phrase it in a contextless vague sorceless manner. I
hope you know that 84% of Americans blah, blah, blah. While only 21%
of housepets in europe blah, blah, blah.
I believed what I
believed, and then you said that 61% of Americans don't believe what I
believe, but I still believed the same thing. Maybe you'll go do
something because everyone else is doing it, but not I.
You ask where Bin Laden is.
I answer it thusly: Do you understand that some strategeries only work if the enemy doesn't know your strategery?
You've gotta be under contract to RNC psy-ops dept. But I may go check out Arkham Asylum anyhows.
question. None answered. I know the answer to the question by
your silence.
But that rant... it's pretty darn
good... I'd give it an "A" in terms of actively demonstrating nearly
every single reason the left has no political traction or future in
this country. I would've given you an "A+" if you could have worked in
all of the following terms:
"Commander-in-thief", "Chimpy McHalliburton", "Dumbya", "Bu$Hitler",
"Amerikkka", and "moron"... you did a very good job, but missed a few
of them.
You claim to know how 61% of Americans feel about
something... and phrase it in a contextless vague sorceless manner. I
hope you know that 84% of Americans blah, blah, blah. While only 21%
of housepets in europe blah, blah, blah.
I believed what I
believed, and then you said that 61% of Americans don't believe what I
believe, but I still believed the same thing. Maybe you'll go do
something because everyone else is doing it, but not I.
You ask where Bin Laden is.
I answer it thusly: Do you understand that some strategeries only work if the enemy doesn't know your strategery?
You've gotta be under contract to RNC psy-ops dept. But I may go check out Arkham Asylum anyhows.
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 11:20 AM (PX+vn)
51
Jesusland,
Would you mind being a tad more specific?
Do I believe Chomsky's position -
"Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well, there's a really easy way: stop participating in it."
Yes, I sure do.
Does he make positions I don't agree with? Yes he does. But, based on what I've read and the discussions I have seen, I believe more than I don't. I don't come from the "all or nothing" school of thought.
Do you really believe the "terrorists" "hate us for our freedom"???
Gizout!
Would you mind being a tad more specific?
Do I believe Chomsky's position -
"Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well, there's a really easy way: stop participating in it."
Yes, I sure do.
Does he make positions I don't agree with? Yes he does. But, based on what I've read and the discussions I have seen, I believe more than I don't. I don't come from the "all or nothing" school of thought.
Do you really believe the "terrorists" "hate us for our freedom"???
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 22, 2006 11:42 AM (P0Rz4)
52
Yeah, Giz, that was one of them, and when Chom says participating in terror, exactly what does he mean? Iraq, Israel, Saudi Arabia, ect. My curiosity is piqued.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 22, 2006 05:29 PM (rUyw4)
53
JJ, academics like chomskass cannot afford specifics.
Gizhole, Chomsucks has two sides. There is the side where morons pay him way too much to think about things we really don't need him to think about. Then there is the side where he tells the world what he really thinks. His mind for language is really huge, but his real self is, loathsome. And you are his bitch.
Gizhole, Chomsucks has two sides. There is the side where morons pay him way too much to think about things we really don't need him to think about. Then there is the side where he tells the world what he really thinks. His mind for language is really huge, but his real self is, loathsome. And you are his bitch.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 22, 2006 08:58 PM (n4VvM)
54
QC
Are you OK?
In answering the question by Devils Advocate "Where is Bin Laden, you answered the following:
"I answered thusly. Do you understand that some startegies only work if the enemy does't know your startegy?"
Say again? Some startegies? Not all, but just some ..... OK.
QC. Honestly let me give you some frendly advice, and this is no joke. Get a Doctor, you are not right in the head. I don't want to insult you or anithing, but your toughts are compleately incoherent, and disjointed.
"You claim to know what 61% of Americans think"
No QC. This are polls. You know? Polls don't you?. They are used by People like Bush, and others to get useful information. Like I said, you are rather confused.
Again, seek some help you do need it.
Are you OK?
In answering the question by Devils Advocate "Where is Bin Laden, you answered the following:
"I answered thusly. Do you understand that some startegies only work if the enemy does't know your startegy?"
Say again? Some startegies? Not all, but just some ..... OK.
QC. Honestly let me give you some frendly advice, and this is no joke. Get a Doctor, you are not right in the head. I don't want to insult you or anithing, but your toughts are compleately incoherent, and disjointed.
"You claim to know what 61% of Americans think"
No QC. This are polls. You know? Polls don't you?. They are used by People like Bush, and others to get useful information. Like I said, you are rather confused.
Again, seek some help you do need it.
Posted by: gil at August 22, 2006 09:40 PM (s6Usw)
55
I have been participating in friendly discussions in different blogs about Iraq for some time now. I notice that lately blogs that talk about the topic are getting an increasily lower quality of respondant from the Republican Right.
In fact the quality of Bloggers from the Right is getting down right pathetic. Is not even a challenge any longer. Half the time I am fielding insults, and the other half I am trying to make any sense of incoherent ideas.
When I respond, the Right comes back with fabrications, re-writing of History, conspiracy theories, standard party line talking points, and down right lies. No real debate, no original notions, no new ideas, no insight at all. It is impossible to debate like an adult with this new bunch.
I think that the smart Republicans, that used to defend Bush's policies are slowly just giving up and not participating in blogs like this. They got tired of getting their behid's kicked. I can understand that. It is becoming increasingly hard to defend Bush.
If the war keeps on going bad, by next year we are going to probably be reduced to argue with a gal that grunts, a guay that hawls, and the "smart" one that tell you that Bush is right because he talks to god.
I am going to have to start lowering my standards if I want to continue to enjoy my favorite sport. Spirited debate.
In fact the quality of Bloggers from the Right is getting down right pathetic. Is not even a challenge any longer. Half the time I am fielding insults, and the other half I am trying to make any sense of incoherent ideas.
When I respond, the Right comes back with fabrications, re-writing of History, conspiracy theories, standard party line talking points, and down right lies. No real debate, no original notions, no new ideas, no insight at all. It is impossible to debate like an adult with this new bunch.
I think that the smart Republicans, that used to defend Bush's policies are slowly just giving up and not participating in blogs like this. They got tired of getting their behid's kicked. I can understand that. It is becoming increasingly hard to defend Bush.
If the war keeps on going bad, by next year we are going to probably be reduced to argue with a gal that grunts, a guay that hawls, and the "smart" one that tell you that Bush is right because he talks to god.
I am going to have to start lowering my standards if I want to continue to enjoy my favorite sport. Spirited debate.
Posted by: gil at August 22, 2006 10:25 PM (s6Usw)
56
I have been participating in friendly discussions in different blogs about Iraq for some time now. I notice that lately blogs that talk about the topic are getting an increasily lower quality of respondant from the Republican Right.
In fact the quality of Bloggers from the Right is getting down right pathetic. Is not even a challenge any longer. Half the time I am fielding insults, and the other half I am trying to make any sense of incoherent ideas.
When I respond, the Right comes back with fabrications, re-writing of History, conspiracy theories, standard party line talking points, and down right lies. No real debate, no original notions, no new ideas, no insight at all. It is impossible to debate like an adult with this new bunch.
I think that the smart Republicans, that used to defend Bush's policies are slowly just giving up and not participating in blogs like this. They got tired of getting their behid's kicked. I can understand that. It is becoming increasingly hard to defend Bush.
If the war keeps on going bad, by next year we are going to probably be reduced to argue with a gal that grunts, a guay that hawls, and the "smart" one that tell you that Bush is right because he talks to god.
I am going to have to start lowering my standards if I want to continue to enjoy my favorite sport. Spirited debate.
In fact the quality of Bloggers from the Right is getting down right pathetic. Is not even a challenge any longer. Half the time I am fielding insults, and the other half I am trying to make any sense of incoherent ideas.
When I respond, the Right comes back with fabrications, re-writing of History, conspiracy theories, standard party line talking points, and down right lies. No real debate, no original notions, no new ideas, no insight at all. It is impossible to debate like an adult with this new bunch.
I think that the smart Republicans, that used to defend Bush's policies are slowly just giving up and not participating in blogs like this. They got tired of getting their behid's kicked. I can understand that. It is becoming increasingly hard to defend Bush.
If the war keeps on going bad, by next year we are going to probably be reduced to argue with a gal that grunts, a guay that hawls, and the "smart" one that tell you that Bush is right because he talks to god.
I am going to have to start lowering my standards if I want to continue to enjoy my favorite sport. Spirited debate.
Posted by: gil at August 22, 2006 10:26 PM (s6Usw)
57
gil, if you use the keyboard shortcut for "paste" you won't have to misquote people's comments in yours.
Firstly on the strategeries: yes, there are some strategies where you tell the enemy exactly what your going to do, and then you do it, and there is not at damn thing they can do about it.
Secondly. Your lie of not wanting to insult me. Feel free to lie, and to insult me, but I will point it out. Claiming to have the ability to diagnose some sort of issue that requires a doctor based on some internet comments, is beyond arrogant- and when coupled with your claim of not wanting to insult me, exposes you as a disengenuous liar. I bet you say things like "It's sad that you"... when there is nothing that you find "sad" about what your commenting on at all. It is just a set up for you to deliver a personal insult. It is very unoriginal, vapid and boring.
Firstly on the strategeries: yes, there are some strategies where you tell the enemy exactly what your going to do, and then you do it, and there is not at damn thing they can do about it.
Secondly. Your lie of not wanting to insult me. Feel free to lie, and to insult me, but I will point it out. Claiming to have the ability to diagnose some sort of issue that requires a doctor based on some internet comments, is beyond arrogant- and when coupled with your claim of not wanting to insult me, exposes you as a disengenuous liar. I bet you say things like "It's sad that you"... when there is nothing that you find "sad" about what your commenting on at all. It is just a set up for you to deliver a personal insult. It is very unoriginal, vapid and boring.
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 10:42 PM (LoKA7)
58
Jesusland,
Let's try this again, shall we.
I answered your questions, clearly and concisely.
You pussied big time. Pique yourself into an intelligent response before you ask questions, how much more clear wan we be?
Answer this simple question: Do you really believe the "terrorists" "hate us for our freedom"???
Gizout!
Let's try this again, shall we.
I answered your questions, clearly and concisely.
You pussied big time. Pique yourself into an intelligent response before you ask questions, how much more clear wan we be?
Answer this simple question: Do you really believe the "terrorists" "hate us for our freedom"???
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 01:03 AM (P0Rz4)
59
Seamonk,
Thanks for proving us right.
You are an suckling imbecile, incapable of discussion, or even rational discourse, assuming your lips disconnect nipple enough to breathe.
Very cute schoolyard insults, bet you've never won a real right in your life.
In any case, consider yourself plonked. After puberty, give us a call and we may reconsider. Vegas odds are long, though...
Gizout!
Thanks for proving us right.
You are an suckling imbecile, incapable of discussion, or even rational discourse, assuming your lips disconnect nipple enough to breathe.
Very cute schoolyard insults, bet you've never won a real right in your life.
In any case, consider yourself plonked. After puberty, give us a call and we may reconsider. Vegas odds are long, though...
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 01:10 AM (P0Rz4)
60
Seamonk,
Thanks for proving us right.
You are an suckling imbecile, incapable of discussion, or even rational discourse, assuming your lips disconnect nipple enough to breathe.
Very cute schoolyard insults, bet you've never won a real right in your life.
In any case, consider yourself plonked. After puberty, give us a call and we may reconsider. Vegas odds are long, though...
Gizout!
Thanks for proving us right.
You are an suckling imbecile, incapable of discussion, or even rational discourse, assuming your lips disconnect nipple enough to breathe.
Very cute schoolyard insults, bet you've never won a real right in your life.
In any case, consider yourself plonked. After puberty, give us a call and we may reconsider. Vegas odds are long, though...
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 01:10 AM (P0Rz4)
61
Ouch Jiz, your intellect underwhelms me. Why don't you plug your piehole and let the air clear. It is getting stuffy when you are near.
Booger eater, thhhhhhpt!
Booger eater, thhhhhhpt!
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 23, 2006 12:38 PM (n4VvM)
62
gizzard,
You lame-ass piece of doo-doo.
"opaque canvas layered in intrique" ?
WTF was that, but an "opaque canvas layered in intrique"?
You lame-ass piece of doo-doo.
"opaque canvas layered in intrique" ?
WTF was that, but an "opaque canvas layered in intrique"?
Posted by: Oyster at August 25, 2006 09:47 PM (YudAC)
63
Seemonk,
Please shut up. Someday, God forbid, you may have children and for their sake let's leave no more record of your inane rantings.
Gizout!
Please shut up. Someday, God forbid, you may have children and for their sake let's leave no more record of your inane rantings.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 26, 2006 03:29 AM (P0Rz4)
64
Christ, Oyster..
Is that really your response?
I "feel" there is something really wrong with what you are saying, Oy, but I just can't put my finger on it. Sounds familiar, doesn't it??
You lemmings are really close to a vote of "no confidence", just so you know..
Gizout!
Is that really your response?
I "feel" there is something really wrong with what you are saying, Oy, but I just can't put my finger on it. Sounds familiar, doesn't it??
You lemmings are really close to a vote of "no confidence", just so you know..
Gizout!
Posted by: gizzard at August 26, 2006 03:38 AM (P0Rz4)
On Londonistan
What to do with Muslims? Melanie Phillips has some answers.
Posted by: Rusty at
09:06 AM
| Comments (1)
| Add Comment
Post contains 12 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Oh Rusty
Forgot one more option in what to do with muslims - task NASA to find those aliens with the book - you remember the book - "HOW TO SERVE MUSLIMS"
Forgot one more option in what to do with muslims - task NASA to find those aliens with the book - you remember the book - "HOW TO SERVE MUSLIMS"
Posted by: hondo at August 21, 2006 08:21 PM (XrexX)
August 19, 2006
What to do with Muslims?
The last few days have been very depressing. Part of this depression is the result of an inner conflict I am having.
Every single Muslim I know is a great person. Every. Single. One.
Yet, nearly every single Muslim organization or group I know of can be counted on to support tyranny. Not all, but nearly.
Shirer quotes Goethe in the opening pages of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich as saying:
I have often felt a bitter sorrow at the thought of the German people, which is so estimable in the individual and so wretched in the generality.So, what do we do with a group of people who, as individuals, are wonderful? People who I would gladly accept as my neighbors. People who I would gladly call my friend.
What do you do when individuals are wonderful, but groups of those same individuals, dangerous?
What to do? What to do?
I really don't know.
In the past, I have argued that religious worker visas ought to be contingent upon reciprocation. The recent UK terror plot drives home the need for such action. Native born Muslims, both here and in Europe, often find religion in mosques which are led by foreign clerics. Countries, such as Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, which forbid proseletyzing are exporters of an Islam that is antithetical to Western liberalism.
But beyond this, what should we do? What can we do? We need real policies that aknowledge the threat, yet ones which are in line with our notions of religious freedoms.
I have no clue what we should do. A good start would be to aknowledge the problem. But from there......I'm open to suggestions. Ones that are both practical and moral.
Posted by: Rusty at
04:46 PM
| Comments (181)
| Add Comment
Post contains 290 words, total size 2 kb.
1
Truth be told, more than a few of the Muslims I have known personally have been vicious anti-Semites.
My former friends showed me realize that hatred is inseparable from Islam.
My former friends showed me realize that hatred is inseparable from Islam.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 19, 2006 05:08 PM (+nlyI)
2
For each mosque in a non muslim country a church and temples for budda etc in every muslim country... Not gonna happen though!
Posted by: RobC at August 19, 2006 05:28 PM (lwWxm)
3
For starters, acknowledge the problem:
Jihad is being waged on the West and terror is but a tactic.
Continue with what you are doing by fighting the propoganda war with the truth. Always, and relentlessly.
Write your politicians. Become a pain in the neck at dinner parties. Support the military.
If a radical islamist is given the opportunity to speak or rally, object.
Openly criticize Islam and Mohammed. They should be under the microscope.
Outlawing radical schools and other brainwashing facilities is ulimately needed.
Jihad is being waged on the West and terror is but a tactic.
Continue with what you are doing by fighting the propoganda war with the truth. Always, and relentlessly.
Write your politicians. Become a pain in the neck at dinner parties. Support the military.
If a radical islamist is given the opportunity to speak or rally, object.
Openly criticize Islam and Mohammed. They should be under the microscope.
Outlawing radical schools and other brainwashing facilities is ulimately needed.
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 19, 2006 05:32 PM (up9HT)
4
In my opinion it starts with holding the groups and islamic states that cause problems fully accountable. Muslims need to start realising that their actions can have very unpleasant consequences on individual, community and national levels. Once that realisation sets in, they're more likely to start policing themselves to root out the trouble makers. Sure they may not like it, they may still remain loyal solely to islam, but at least they'll be kept in line. Yeah, it sounds good on e-paper, but.............................
Posted by: Graeme at August 19, 2006 05:41 PM (gnR/S)
5
Well, let me tell you what to do: Take a long look at Islam because obviously you haven't given the religion of these "Wonderful people" any study. No offense, just pointing that out.
Islamic Imams and Clerics, ALL Imans and Clerics, teach from birth hatred of Jews and the death or servitude of all non-muslims. This is simply a requirement of Islam. They also teach their subjects to be docile and friendly in non-muslim countries until there are enough muslims to take over the country. The Imams and Clerics are not disputable. Their teachings must be followed.
Here's a few facts about Islam: Muhammad was a madman. He married and had sex with a 9 year old girl name Ayesha who was still playing with dolls and was years away from puberty. He like to take baths with her, she was his favorite wife. He was a proud terrorist and murderer. He commanded his followers to mutilate their victims by cutting off a right hand and left foot, for example. He had hallucinations. He created Islam and a god name Allah who is a dead ringer for Satan.
Islam is a complete doctrine encompassing all aspects of life and death including all laws and all politics. There is no room for any other doctrine or any other religion or political form of government. Islam teaches the complete, absolute and total domination of all the Earth. Islam glorifies death instead of life. In the Islamic Paradise, "martyrs" who die fighting for Islam are given either 72 virgin girls or 27 pretty boys, depending on their preference. Women are secondary creatures, and are compared to barnyard animals. Their only purpose is for sex, which is why they must be covered from head to foot, so no male except their owner will lust after them. Women are taught from birth that their entire body is a vagina. And all this is just for starters.
Your wonderful muslim friends will give you evasive answers to how they feel about Jews, Israels right to exist, Islamic terrorism, the war in Iraq. Try it and see what I mean. They aren't your friends, they'll lie to you and dodge away from the questions and twist the truth. Check it out for yourself.
Rastaman
www.islamanazi.com
Islamic Imams and Clerics, ALL Imans and Clerics, teach from birth hatred of Jews and the death or servitude of all non-muslims. This is simply a requirement of Islam. They also teach their subjects to be docile and friendly in non-muslim countries until there are enough muslims to take over the country. The Imams and Clerics are not disputable. Their teachings must be followed.
Here's a few facts about Islam: Muhammad was a madman. He married and had sex with a 9 year old girl name Ayesha who was still playing with dolls and was years away from puberty. He like to take baths with her, she was his favorite wife. He was a proud terrorist and murderer. He commanded his followers to mutilate their victims by cutting off a right hand and left foot, for example. He had hallucinations. He created Islam and a god name Allah who is a dead ringer for Satan.
Islam is a complete doctrine encompassing all aspects of life and death including all laws and all politics. There is no room for any other doctrine or any other religion or political form of government. Islam teaches the complete, absolute and total domination of all the Earth. Islam glorifies death instead of life. In the Islamic Paradise, "martyrs" who die fighting for Islam are given either 72 virgin girls or 27 pretty boys, depending on their preference. Women are secondary creatures, and are compared to barnyard animals. Their only purpose is for sex, which is why they must be covered from head to foot, so no male except their owner will lust after them. Women are taught from birth that their entire body is a vagina. And all this is just for starters.
Your wonderful muslim friends will give you evasive answers to how they feel about Jews, Israels right to exist, Islamic terrorism, the war in Iraq. Try it and see what I mean. They aren't your friends, they'll lie to you and dodge away from the questions and twist the truth. Check it out for yourself.
Rastaman
www.islamanazi.com
Posted by: Rastaman at August 19, 2006 05:53 PM (jyZtT)
6
Make Islamic radicalism socially unacceptable, the same way open racial prejudice and bigotry are combatted.
It's been so successfull that bigots-in-their-hearts have been forced to turn their attention to smokers, which is great, because nothing makes a smoke taste better than knowing that you're pissing people off while you enjoy yourself.
It's been so successfull that bigots-in-their-hearts have been forced to turn their attention to smokers, which is great, because nothing makes a smoke taste better than knowing that you're pissing people off while you enjoy yourself.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 19, 2006 05:59 PM (vBK4C)
7
Hmmm....some good points, Rusty, and I have to agree with what you said, for the most part, on individual Muslims I know. But ask yourself this question, "Is the life of my children, the life of my wife, the life of my country, or a way of life worth not making a few people mad"? Because bottom line, here is the real problem with Islam and its adherents. Islam is number 1, over government, over love, over relationships, over friendship, over every aspect of life, to the point of being a totalitarian philosophy, much worse even than communism of fascism, because it has the power of religion and emotionalism at its very core, and uses hate as a weapon justifying any actions taken against anything in the name of Islam. Submission to genocide, murder, rape, looting, slavery, terror, and every other atrocity imaginable in the name of Islam. It is impossible to exist freely with it once it reaches a certain percentage in every society it infiltrates. And before the PC Police try to arrest me, tell me this, yes, you can find individuals of any religion who are fundamentalists, but no other religion I know of other than Islam is completely ruled and governed by extremists.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 19, 2006 06:27 PM (rUyw4)
Posted by: Barry 0351 at August 19, 2006 06:27 PM (ds0+e)
Posted by: Darth Snakes On A Motherfucking Plane at August 19, 2006 06:34 PM (/qy9A)
10
What to do?
It starts at the public schools. We teach as adults American values, culture and history honestly and proudly. The children in the classroom will do their parts as they instruct each other on being an American. Public schools are a disaster in general in urban America. We must fix it now or we'll loose these muslims to their idiot parents and imams. Our country must teach its values while welcoming change to our values. No way do we owe apologies to any other country about being an American in American history.
Next, immigration policy must be biased against muslim countries. We bias our policies all the time, so this is nothing new. Simply let fewer and fewer in, every year. If we don't, one day, we'll awakened to the news that there are 10 million muslim immigrants in the US.
Third, we must engage in law enforcement within the muslim communities where there have been violent rhetoric.
That means we need to inflitrate these communities as if they are foreign lands to acquire sources and snitches.
Another suggestion is to change the laws in this land to make domestic terrorism or allegiance to foreign groups(al
Queda) an act of treason during war. With the usual penalties.
Ok, last one. We need a public debate about the history of the last internment this country did. During WWII, Japanese were interned to remote desert camps to eliminate the possibility of domestic terrorism and espionage. We need to revisit that whole history and probe its morality and efficacy. The time may not be far when another interment is desirable and urgent.
It starts at the public schools. We teach as adults American values, culture and history honestly and proudly. The children in the classroom will do their parts as they instruct each other on being an American. Public schools are a disaster in general in urban America. We must fix it now or we'll loose these muslims to their idiot parents and imams. Our country must teach its values while welcoming change to our values. No way do we owe apologies to any other country about being an American in American history.
Next, immigration policy must be biased against muslim countries. We bias our policies all the time, so this is nothing new. Simply let fewer and fewer in, every year. If we don't, one day, we'll awakened to the news that there are 10 million muslim immigrants in the US.
Third, we must engage in law enforcement within the muslim communities where there have been violent rhetoric.
That means we need to inflitrate these communities as if they are foreign lands to acquire sources and snitches.
Another suggestion is to change the laws in this land to make domestic terrorism or allegiance to foreign groups(al
Queda) an act of treason during war. With the usual penalties.
Ok, last one. We need a public debate about the history of the last internment this country did. During WWII, Japanese were interned to remote desert camps to eliminate the possibility of domestic terrorism and espionage. We need to revisit that whole history and probe its morality and efficacy. The time may not be far when another interment is desirable and urgent.
Posted by: changehappens at August 19, 2006 06:35 PM (hGibF)
11
The moral thing to do is to institute loyalty and language tests to all moslems such as what they are doing now in EuroLand. The ones who fail are expelled like what France under Interior Minister Sarkozy is doing. Oh, all illegals should be expelled forthwith. This will take care of a lot of these moslem cockroaches. Don't like what I'm proposing? Just wait for the next 9/11 then tell me I'm still wrong.
Posted by: Don Saar at August 19, 2006 06:40 PM (3HG6g)
12
The moral thing to do is to institute loyalty and language tests to all moslems such as what they are doing now in EuroLand. The ones who fail are expelled like what France under Interior Minister Sarkozy is doing. Oh, all illegals should be expelled forthwith. This will take care of a lot of these moslem cockroaches. Don't like what I'm proposing? Just wait for the next 9/11 then tell me I'm still wrong.
Posted by: Don Saar at August 19, 2006 06:40 PM (3HG6g)
13
The moral thing to do is to institute loyalty and language tests to all moslems such as what they are doing now in EuroLand. The ones who fail are expelled like what France under Interior Minister Sarkozy is doing. Oh, all illegals should be expelled forthwith. This will take care of a lot of these moslem cockroaches. Don't like what I'm proposing? Just wait for the next 9/11 then tell me I'm still wrong.
Posted by: Don Saar at August 19, 2006 06:41 PM (3HG6g)
14
Islam is a cult.
Islam is the most destructive cult ever in the history of man.
The people in the cult, must be either convinced to leave the cult and renounce the cult for life or be deported.
Now that will never happen, because they will not renounce the cult nor leave it and the U.S. (at this time) will not deport them.
We will not even deport illegals now.
But maybe, just maybe in the future, after thousands if not millions of Americans are murdered here on our mainland, something like this (or worse) will happen.
Unless we want to wind up like [e]urope is going to.
Papa Ray
West Texas
USA
Islam is the most destructive cult ever in the history of man.
The people in the cult, must be either convinced to leave the cult and renounce the cult for life or be deported.
Now that will never happen, because they will not renounce the cult nor leave it and the U.S. (at this time) will not deport them.
We will not even deport illegals now.
But maybe, just maybe in the future, after thousands if not millions of Americans are murdered here on our mainland, something like this (or worse) will happen.
Unless we want to wind up like [e]urope is going to.
Papa Ray
West Texas
USA
Posted by: Papa Ray at August 19, 2006 06:48 PM (B6ERo)
15
The same generalization could be made for us Americans. Individually human beings, in groups supporters of state terrorism, racism, sexism and on depending on your perspective,filters, beliefs etc.
They are people not cockroaches as in a previous post: dehumanizing the other leads to us becoming our own Mephistopheles.
Narrow stereotyping of and adversary leads one to underestimate them and to eventual defeat. So far Iraq and Lebanon would appear to support this hypothesis.
They are people not cockroaches as in a previous post: dehumanizing the other leads to us becoming our own Mephistopheles.
Narrow stereotyping of and adversary leads one to underestimate them and to eventual defeat. So far Iraq and Lebanon would appear to support this hypothesis.
Posted by: John at August 19, 2006 07:20 PM (+8+Uc)
16
Islam is an ideology of conquest developed soley for that purpose. Mohammed developed this religion as a counter to the Torah (and the Bible) and as a rallying call to the other anti-semitic arabs.
It's a bullshit religion that was founded in, and prospered though, the hatred of the jews.
Islam is the bizarro judaism.
It's an ideology which is neither peaceful, nor tolerant. Its followers state that it is so to automatically enable them to call its detractors bigots or intolerant.
It was designed to take advantage of hate and was developed to hide this hatred on the soft underbelly of civilization. Much like a leech.
I'm not a bigot. I'm not a hater. I don't hate muslims, but I certainly do not trust them. And Western society has been painted into a corner; forced to "accept" islam or be branded as such.
I'm not sure the details of an effective plan to rid the planet of a diabolically comic book-like scheme to rule the world (What are we going to do tonight, Brain?); but I do know that step #1 is to, as I've seen mentioned, spread the world.
Every force in the universe has a complementary force. Islam needs an anti-Islam. I'd like to think that the anti-Islam is "common sense"; but I'm dismayed that common sense is not enough, especially when I know people like Ibrahim Hooper exist.
The anti-Islam is Islam itself.
The more aware of Islam and its teachings westerners become, the more they will be able to challenge muslims and their jew-hating ideology.
Islam takes advantage of the laziness of westerners to understand their own religions, let alone one that is printed in Arabic (why do you think that it was for so long forbidden to print the Quran in anything but?).
Western civilization needs to recognize the threat, educate itself on that threat, and refuse to tolerate anything but the truth.
CAIR should be challenged.
The ACLU needs to be challenged.
Every single mosque and madrassa and Middle Eastern nation needs to be challenged.
Hold the light to Islam long enough and the cockroaches will scatter.
But we need to know what the hell we're talking about to challenge it.
That's where we fail.
That's where the power of Islam lies.
We need to realize that this is a battle for the control of the world. A battle our leftist friends just don't get. A battle that we cannot lose.
And Western civilization needs to REALIZE that losing is an option, here. We should not be so cocky to think that we cannot be defeated by people who live in caves.
And as much as I am loathe to make the following statement, I loathe more the possibilities of what might happen should a Quran replace our Constitution: If truth and reason cannot defeat this threat, ... it's lock and load time.
It's a bullshit religion that was founded in, and prospered though, the hatred of the jews.
Islam is the bizarro judaism.
It's an ideology which is neither peaceful, nor tolerant. Its followers state that it is so to automatically enable them to call its detractors bigots or intolerant.
It was designed to take advantage of hate and was developed to hide this hatred on the soft underbelly of civilization. Much like a leech.
I'm not a bigot. I'm not a hater. I don't hate muslims, but I certainly do not trust them. And Western society has been painted into a corner; forced to "accept" islam or be branded as such.
I'm not sure the details of an effective plan to rid the planet of a diabolically comic book-like scheme to rule the world (What are we going to do tonight, Brain?); but I do know that step #1 is to, as I've seen mentioned, spread the world.
Every force in the universe has a complementary force. Islam needs an anti-Islam. I'd like to think that the anti-Islam is "common sense"; but I'm dismayed that common sense is not enough, especially when I know people like Ibrahim Hooper exist.
The anti-Islam is Islam itself.
The more aware of Islam and its teachings westerners become, the more they will be able to challenge muslims and their jew-hating ideology.
Islam takes advantage of the laziness of westerners to understand their own religions, let alone one that is printed in Arabic (why do you think that it was for so long forbidden to print the Quran in anything but?).
Western civilization needs to recognize the threat, educate itself on that threat, and refuse to tolerate anything but the truth.
CAIR should be challenged.
The ACLU needs to be challenged.
Every single mosque and madrassa and Middle Eastern nation needs to be challenged.
Hold the light to Islam long enough and the cockroaches will scatter.
But we need to know what the hell we're talking about to challenge it.
That's where we fail.
That's where the power of Islam lies.
We need to realize that this is a battle for the control of the world. A battle our leftist friends just don't get. A battle that we cannot lose.
And Western civilization needs to REALIZE that losing is an option, here. We should not be so cocky to think that we cannot be defeated by people who live in caves.
And as much as I am loathe to make the following statement, I loathe more the possibilities of what might happen should a Quran replace our Constitution: If truth and reason cannot defeat this threat, ... it's lock and load time.
Posted by: yo at August 19, 2006 07:21 PM (fkcf6)
17
Isolation - have nothing to do with them. Lets face it - islam is more than just another religion - it is a social and political ideology that continues to give every indication of being incompatible and hostile not only to western civilization, but to every other variation on this planet.
Ban immigration from islamic countries and muslims from elsewhere - we have done it before and continue with incompatible ideologies - lets stop fooling ourselves that islam is just a religion.
Those here should leave. They are here for two reasons - 1) to make money ... it is not our job or responsiblitiy to provide ecomonic opportunities for them just because their "home" islamic paradises are inept shitholes.
2) to find freedom ... if they want to find and experience "freedom" (especially the alledgedly secular muslims) then let them fight for it in their own countries! This particular group irritates me - within its ranks are the muslims we know and generally like - but lets not forget - they are here to find freedom from and protection from OTHER MUSLIMS BACK IN THE OLD COUNTRY! I am tired of being their new benefactor and protector!
I'm sure muslims here would be pissed over that last statement - so what! Honestly - all the things they enjoy here in the west including openess of lifestyle and beliefs - they know damn well they would never enjoy back home and be branded as heretics or worse - just over stupid things like educating their daughters, not wearing burkas - or having a different opinion on any subject from the local iman.
Yeah! Your all here to enjoy western freedom and protection - my protection - me - hondo ... to protect you from ... ta da ... those OTHER MUSLIMS. Well, I'm tired of it.
We should end all economic activity with the islamic world. Besides oil, dates, and a few camels for our petting zoos - they really don't have much to offer - now do they - how pathetic.
We can easily be energy independent - its a technical problem only. Cost is the only thing standing in our way - it will probably cost more (note we can make synthetic fuels - but they cost more than gasoline even today) - and you can fully expect the muslim oil producers to drop their prices to muck up any attempt at transition.
We need to recognize that oil pricing is NOT truly free market. Once we get beyond that we can finally recognize that this is a national security issue. I will pay 4+ at the pump for American Syn oil - knowing full well some arab will show up at my door offering me a gallon at a buck & a quarter. I will tell him to fuck off. There will be some inflationary problems at first - but it will work itself out thru-out the economy in just a few years.
Israel is an issue - lets not kid ourselves. Muslims want only one thing here - Israel - the Jews out of Palestine - again. There is no middle ground - nothing to truly negotiate in the end. Anyone who thinks there is - is a naive fool - who things singing "Why Can't We Be Friends" is the solution to all global problems.
I made my choice - I support Israel and will always continue to do so (and I personally don't care for them much anyway).
The Lib/Left in America and the West has a decision to make. If they want to play this stupid anti-Israel pro-palestinian game ... then stand up and call for the desolution of the Jewish state and subsequent repatriation of the Jewish population to the West. That's what the muslims want - the only thing to them that counts - either have the balls to acknowledge it and join the chorus or STFU!
Personally I believe the Israelis should withdraw totally to the pre '67 borders - and then build the mother of all walls - and end their stupid dependancy on palestinian labor. Let the palestinians find their own employment herding goats and picking dates (or working for their arab neigbor masters as day labor and domestic help - which is what they have been doing for decades).
Fortify that wall bigtime - you have friends - money, guns, reinforcements - its out there -
don't be proud now.
Israel doesn't realize how lucky it is to be surrounded by hundreds of millions of arabs and muslims. If Israel was located in Asia (the real Asia) and surrounded by millions of say angry Chinese - they probably wouldn't have lasted more than a few years. They would have found themselves up against continuous assault of massive human waves committed to victory at any cost.
Instead - they find themselves fighting arabs! Enough talk of how good the IDF & Israel is - the real story is how bad and pathetic the arab muslims are. These jerkoffs don't fight for victory - they halfass fight for ceasefires - then spin it to their idiotic masses as something to be proud of!
60 freakin' years later - what have they to show for it? A few day or weeks now and then of inept fighting - then run away - then give slingshots to children and find some idiot to wear a suicide vest. What a cycle of stupidity!
Muslims may well be hopeless - especially the arab variety. Maybe best to treat them and their areas as Forever Wild Preserves - quarantined to the outside world - like a giant leper colony.
I know 300 years from now, one of my decendants (probably returning from a construction project on one of Saturn's moons) may want to stop by the Preserve - like a National Geographic type vacation - to watch the quaint natives herd goats - maybe pick up some handmade trinkets in the bazaar for the kids back home.
Wow! Did I go on! Rusty - think I can provoke 300+ responses with this?
Ban immigration from islamic countries and muslims from elsewhere - we have done it before and continue with incompatible ideologies - lets stop fooling ourselves that islam is just a religion.
Those here should leave. They are here for two reasons - 1) to make money ... it is not our job or responsiblitiy to provide ecomonic opportunities for them just because their "home" islamic paradises are inept shitholes.
2) to find freedom ... if they want to find and experience "freedom" (especially the alledgedly secular muslims) then let them fight for it in their own countries! This particular group irritates me - within its ranks are the muslims we know and generally like - but lets not forget - they are here to find freedom from and protection from OTHER MUSLIMS BACK IN THE OLD COUNTRY! I am tired of being their new benefactor and protector!
I'm sure muslims here would be pissed over that last statement - so what! Honestly - all the things they enjoy here in the west including openess of lifestyle and beliefs - they know damn well they would never enjoy back home and be branded as heretics or worse - just over stupid things like educating their daughters, not wearing burkas - or having a different opinion on any subject from the local iman.
Yeah! Your all here to enjoy western freedom and protection - my protection - me - hondo ... to protect you from ... ta da ... those OTHER MUSLIMS. Well, I'm tired of it.
We should end all economic activity with the islamic world. Besides oil, dates, and a few camels for our petting zoos - they really don't have much to offer - now do they - how pathetic.
We can easily be energy independent - its a technical problem only. Cost is the only thing standing in our way - it will probably cost more (note we can make synthetic fuels - but they cost more than gasoline even today) - and you can fully expect the muslim oil producers to drop their prices to muck up any attempt at transition.
We need to recognize that oil pricing is NOT truly free market. Once we get beyond that we can finally recognize that this is a national security issue. I will pay 4+ at the pump for American Syn oil - knowing full well some arab will show up at my door offering me a gallon at a buck & a quarter. I will tell him to fuck off. There will be some inflationary problems at first - but it will work itself out thru-out the economy in just a few years.
Israel is an issue - lets not kid ourselves. Muslims want only one thing here - Israel - the Jews out of Palestine - again. There is no middle ground - nothing to truly negotiate in the end. Anyone who thinks there is - is a naive fool - who things singing "Why Can't We Be Friends" is the solution to all global problems.
I made my choice - I support Israel and will always continue to do so (and I personally don't care for them much anyway).
The Lib/Left in America and the West has a decision to make. If they want to play this stupid anti-Israel pro-palestinian game ... then stand up and call for the desolution of the Jewish state and subsequent repatriation of the Jewish population to the West. That's what the muslims want - the only thing to them that counts - either have the balls to acknowledge it and join the chorus or STFU!
Personally I believe the Israelis should withdraw totally to the pre '67 borders - and then build the mother of all walls - and end their stupid dependancy on palestinian labor. Let the palestinians find their own employment herding goats and picking dates (or working for their arab neigbor masters as day labor and domestic help - which is what they have been doing for decades).
Fortify that wall bigtime - you have friends - money, guns, reinforcements - its out there -
don't be proud now.
Israel doesn't realize how lucky it is to be surrounded by hundreds of millions of arabs and muslims. If Israel was located in Asia (the real Asia) and surrounded by millions of say angry Chinese - they probably wouldn't have lasted more than a few years. They would have found themselves up against continuous assault of massive human waves committed to victory at any cost.
Instead - they find themselves fighting arabs! Enough talk of how good the IDF & Israel is - the real story is how bad and pathetic the arab muslims are. These jerkoffs don't fight for victory - they halfass fight for ceasefires - then spin it to their idiotic masses as something to be proud of!
60 freakin' years later - what have they to show for it? A few day or weeks now and then of inept fighting - then run away - then give slingshots to children and find some idiot to wear a suicide vest. What a cycle of stupidity!
Muslims may well be hopeless - especially the arab variety. Maybe best to treat them and their areas as Forever Wild Preserves - quarantined to the outside world - like a giant leper colony.
I know 300 years from now, one of my decendants (probably returning from a construction project on one of Saturn's moons) may want to stop by the Preserve - like a National Geographic type vacation - to watch the quaint natives herd goats - maybe pick up some handmade trinkets in the bazaar for the kids back home.
Wow! Did I go on! Rusty - think I can provoke 300+ responses with this?
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 07:22 PM (XrexX)
18
It doesn't matter what fine people some individual muslims are.
For the survival of the West, we're forced to deal with them as a bloc. And as a bloc, they mean to extinguish us.
Collateral damage.
For the survival of the West, we're forced to deal with them as a bloc. And as a bloc, they mean to extinguish us.
Collateral damage.
Posted by: Keith at August 19, 2006 07:35 PM (gofp3)
19
hondo for President!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 19, 2006 07:41 PM (rUyw4)
20
If a public school (k-12) in America has to have a 'islam history' type class (as Ive heard of them being implemented) then there should also be alternative religious courses in the same vein.
In other words, and in all things, Whats good for the goose is good for the gander. Period.
In other words, and in all things, Whats good for the goose is good for the gander. Period.
Posted by: JeepThang at August 19, 2006 07:42 PM (yZQoS)
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 07:43 PM (XrexX)
22
Dr. Shackleford,
Forgive me for sounding like a broken record, but the only thing Muslims genuinely understand is FORCE. Their psyche is such that they rally around power, not even leadership or charisma, only POWER. It seems to me the logical course of action is to show them once and for all that their false Arabic deity cannot protect even his own possessions. So...
a) Nuke Mecca, Median and Ryadh. This would cost you only 3 Trident missiles.
b) Declare a State of Emergency (in Canada there is a legal instrument called "The War Measures Act", you probably have a similar thing in the U.S.) and use this to circumvent the likes of ACLU.
c) Occupy and subjugate the entire Arabian peninsula thereby cutting off their funding. Yes, oil literally fuels Islamic terrorism.
d) Under the state of emergency implement a humane repatriation program for Muslim immigrants, thereby reversing Muslim immigration. Put it simply if they think Shariah law is a good thing then throw them the f&*k out.
...And then go on from there ....
Forgive me for sounding like a broken record, but the only thing Muslims genuinely understand is FORCE. Their psyche is such that they rally around power, not even leadership or charisma, only POWER. It seems to me the logical course of action is to show them once and for all that their false Arabic deity cannot protect even his own possessions. So...
a) Nuke Mecca, Median and Ryadh. This would cost you only 3 Trident missiles.
b) Declare a State of Emergency (in Canada there is a legal instrument called "The War Measures Act", you probably have a similar thing in the U.S.) and use this to circumvent the likes of ACLU.
c) Occupy and subjugate the entire Arabian peninsula thereby cutting off their funding. Yes, oil literally fuels Islamic terrorism.
d) Under the state of emergency implement a humane repatriation program for Muslim immigrants, thereby reversing Muslim immigration. Put it simply if they think Shariah law is a good thing then throw them the f&*k out.
...And then go on from there ....
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 19, 2006 07:49 PM (Bp6wV)
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 19, 2006 07:50 PM (Bp6wV)
24
Garduneh Mehr, I hope to buy you a beer sometime.
Posted by: Keith at August 19, 2006 07:50 PM (gofp3)
25
Rusty
Your last line said - practical and moral. I believe I have met those qualifiers. I fully believe it can be carried out with the minimum of any harsh actions.
Isolation, quarantine, segregation - call it what you like - but acknowledge that it is fundamentally beign.
Put a lib/left sematic spin on it ... call it the preservation of an alternative cultural lifestyle/society.
Your last line said - practical and moral. I believe I have met those qualifiers. I fully believe it can be carried out with the minimum of any harsh actions.
Isolation, quarantine, segregation - call it what you like - but acknowledge that it is fundamentally beign.
Put a lib/left sematic spin on it ... call it the preservation of an alternative cultural lifestyle/society.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 07:57 PM (XrexX)
26
Well-meaning people of "Asian" descent, I mean, of Arab origin should understand what the world is going through and be patient. Yes, THEY, the Muslims, must acknowledge what is happening and expect the extra scrutiny. Expect it, understand it and live with it in the knowledge that they are not being put into internment camps and people in general are trying their best to cope with the stress.
I knew these two Muslim girls in college who had boyfriends. They told me it was a secret that they had boyfriends and if their parents ever found out, it would be big trouble for them. Little did I know how correct their words were.
Rusty, I feel like we are doing everything we can. It's now their turn and leaning on CAIR and such organizations is a BIG MISTAKE.
I knew these two Muslim girls in college who had boyfriends. They told me it was a secret that they had boyfriends and if their parents ever found out, it would be big trouble for them. Little did I know how correct their words were.
Rusty, I feel like we are doing everything we can. It's now their turn and leaning on CAIR and such organizations is a BIG MISTAKE.
Posted by: RepJ at August 19, 2006 07:59 PM (L5LRS)
27
we should banish all muslim nations from all international organizations and from all foreign aid unless they reform and outlaw polygamy, misogyny, an endogamy.
we should banish all muslim nations from all international organizations and from all foreign aid unless they reform and outlaw polygamy, misogyny, an endogamy.
Posted by: reliapundit at August 19, 2006 08:04 PM (P1SKp)
28
Yeah I know some muslims too, and they're just as sweet as they can be, but just ask them what they think should be done with the Jews. Islam is hate. Islam is war. Islam is the death of civilization. There will be no possibility of peace as long as one muslim remains alive - we have to kill them all.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 19, 2006 08:17 PM (v3I+x)
29
Garduneh Mehr
I have never responded to you before - and usually ignore you. I remember your pompous pretentious attacks against two good friends of mine (greyrooster & maxie) over some of their beliefs (which I don't fully share). I didn't like it - yeah - especially coming from a foreigner.
I'm not interested in mass murder for your pleasure or personal goals. I'm not interested in utililizing Trident missiles (AMERICAN - MINE) to slaughter millions of men women & children in order to precipate a genicidal war against a segment of the human population you hate (I don't like them either - but I'm not your executioner or a wannabe fascist exterminator like you).
I'm not interested in subjugating anybody - I'm interested in isolation - and it is easily achievable - I'm not interested in extreme alternations in MY NATION (National State Of Emergency for roundup purposes) to suit a foreigner's goals and desires.
You want to play "Sympathy for The Devil" - drive a tank, hold a general's rank while the blitzkrieg raged ....
You do it in your own freakin' country - where ever that is! You can build camps, cremetoriums etc - knock yourself out!
Don't you ever think you can play your game here in America - whatever uniform you fancy to wear don't matter to me - crosshairs go in the same spot.
I got no love for islam - but I love myself and country to much to crawl down in the gutter with you.
I have never responded to you before - and usually ignore you. I remember your pompous pretentious attacks against two good friends of mine (greyrooster & maxie) over some of their beliefs (which I don't fully share). I didn't like it - yeah - especially coming from a foreigner.
I'm not interested in mass murder for your pleasure or personal goals. I'm not interested in utililizing Trident missiles (AMERICAN - MINE) to slaughter millions of men women & children in order to precipate a genicidal war against a segment of the human population you hate (I don't like them either - but I'm not your executioner or a wannabe fascist exterminator like you).
I'm not interested in subjugating anybody - I'm interested in isolation - and it is easily achievable - I'm not interested in extreme alternations in MY NATION (National State Of Emergency for roundup purposes) to suit a foreigner's goals and desires.
You want to play "Sympathy for The Devil" - drive a tank, hold a general's rank while the blitzkrieg raged ....
You do it in your own freakin' country - where ever that is! You can build camps, cremetoriums etc - knock yourself out!
Don't you ever think you can play your game here in America - whatever uniform you fancy to wear don't matter to me - crosshairs go in the same spot.
I got no love for islam - but I love myself and country to much to crawl down in the gutter with you.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 08:28 PM (XrexX)
30
"The only good Indians I ever saw was dead." -- General Philip Sheridan
"Nits make lice." -- General William T. Sherman
From http://www.abc.net.au/rn/arts/booktalk/stories/s1268910.htm, "We agree with Thomas Jefferson who’s come up with a magnificent idea—send the Indians to the west. Get them out of the areas where the white settlers are to be found. We’ll exchange territory. You give us your eastern lands and we’ll give you the west.’ The west can be desert; no trees, no grass…some of the Indians, especially the Seminoles, went out and took a look at it and said, ‘This is not what we want.’ ‘This is what you get because you cannot stay with us.’ ‘No,’ said Jackson, ‘you can. You can live here but not as Indians. You can live among us if you become cultural white men. That is, you understand our laws and our requirements, and you obey them." -- Summary of General Andrew Jackson's demands on the 'Five Civilized Tribes'
"Cherokee Agency, May 17, 1838
Major General Scott, of the United States' Army, announces to the troops assembled and assembling in this country, that, with them, he has been charged by the President to cause the Cherokee Indians yet remaining in North Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Alabama, to remove to the West, according to the terms of the Treaty of 1835 [Treaty of New Echota]. His Staff will be as follows: Lieutenant Colonel W.J. Worth, acting Adjutant General, Chief of the Staff; Major M.M. Payne, acting Inspector General; Lieutenants R. Anderson and E.D. Keyes, regular Aides-de-camp. Any order given orally, or in writing, by either of those officers, in the name of the Major General, will be respected and obeyed as if given by himself. The Chiefs of Ordnance, of the Quartermaster's Department and of the Commissariat, as also the Medical Director of the Army, will, as soon as they can be ascertained, be announced in orders.
To carry out the general object with the greatest promptitude and certainty, and with the least possible distress to the Indians, the country they are to evacuate is divided into three principal Military Districts, under as many officers of high rank, to command the troops serving therein, subject to the instructions of the Major General. The senior officer actually present in each district will receive instructions from the Major General as to the time of commencing the removal, and everything that may occur interesting to the service, in the district, will be promptly reported to the same sources. The Major General will endeavor to visit in a short time all parts of the Cherokee country occupied by the troops.
The duties devolved on the army, through the orders of the Major General and those of the commanders of districts, under him, are of a highly important and critical nature. The Cherokees, by the advances which they have made in Christianity and civilization, are by far the most interesting tribe of Indians in the territorial limits of the United States. Of the 15,000 of these people who are now to be removed (and the time within which a voluntary emigration was stipulated will expire on the 23rd instant) it is understood that about four-fifths are opposed, or have become averse to a distant emigration; and altho' none are in actual hostilities with the United States, or threaten a resistance by arms, yet the troops will probably be obliged to cover the whole country they inhabit, in order to make prisoners and to march or to transport the prisoners, by families, either to this place, to Ross's Landing, or Gunter's Landing, where they are to finally delivered over to the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration.
Considering the number and temper of the mass to be removed, together with the extent and fastnesses of the country occupied, it will readily occur, that simple indiscretions -- acts of harshness and cruelty, on the part of our troops, may lead, step by step, to delays, to impatience and exasperation, and in the end, to a general war and carnage -- a result, in the case of those particular Indians, utterly abhorrent to the generous sympathies of the whole American people. Every possible kindness, compatible with the necessity of removal, must therefore, be shown by the troops, and, if, in the ranks, a despicable individual should be found, capable of inflicting a wanton injury or insult on any Cherokee man, woman or child, it is hereby made the special duty of the nearest good officer or man, instantly to interpose, and to seize and consign the guilty wrench to the severest penalty of the laws. The Major General is fully persuaded that this injunction will not be neglected by the brave men under his command, who cannot be otherwise than jealous of their own honor and that of their country.
By early and persevering acts of kindness and humanity, it is impossible to doubt that the Indians may soon be induced to confide in the Army, and instead of fleeing to mountains and forests, flock to us for food and clothing. If however, through false apprehensions, individuals, or a party, here and there, should seek to hide themselves, they must be pursued and invited to surrender, but not fired upon unless they should made a stand to resist. Even in such cases, mild remedies may sometimes better succeed than violence; and it cannot be doubted that if we get possession of the women and children first, or first capture the men, that in either case, the outstanding members of the same families will readily come in on the assurance of forgiveness and kind treatment.
Every captured man, as well as all who surrender themselves, must be disarmed, with the assurance that their weapons will be carefully preserved and restored at, or beyond the Mississippi. In either case, the men will be guarded and escorted, except it may be, where the women and children are safely secured as hostages, but, in general, families, families, in our possession, will not be separated unless it be to send men, as runners, to invite others to come in.
It may happen that Indians will be found too sick, in the opinion of the nearest Surgeon, to be removed to one of the depots indicated above. In every such case, one or more of the family, or the friends of the sick person, will be left in attendance, with ample subsistence and remedies, and the remainder of the family removed by the troops. Infants, superannuated person, lunatics and women in a helpless condition, will all, in the removal, require peculiar attention, which the brave and humane will seek to adapt to the necessities of the several cases.
All strong men, women, boys and girls, will be made to march under proper escorts. For the feeble, Indians horses and ponies will furnish a ready resource, as well as for bedding and light cooking utensils -- all of which, as intimated in the Treaty, will be necessary to the emigrants both in going to, and after arrival at, their new homes. Such, and all other light articles of property, the Indians will be allowed to collect and to take with them, as also their slaves, who will be treated in like manner with the Indians themselves.
If the horses and ponies be not adequate to the above purposes, wagons must be supplied. Corn, oats, fodder and other forage, also beef cattle, belonging to the Indians to be removed, will be taken possession of by the proper departments of the Staff, as wanted, for the regular consumption of the Army, and certificates given to the owners, specifying in ever case the amount of forage and the weight of beef, so taken, on order that the owners may be paid for the same on their arrival at one of the depots mentioned above. All other moveable [sic] or personal property, left or abandoned by the Indians, will be collected by agents appointed for the purpose, by the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration, under a system of accountability, for the benefit of the Indian owners, which he will devise. The Army will give to those agents, in their operations, all reasonable countenance, aid and support.
White men and widows, citizens of the United States, who are, or have been intermarried with Indians, and thence commonly termed Indian countrymen; also such Indians as have been made denizens of particular States by special legislation, together with the families and property of all such persons, will not be molested or removed by the troops until a decision, on the principles involved, can be obtained from the War Department. A like indulgence, but only for a limited time, and until further orders, is tended to the families and property of certain Chiefs and head-men of the two great Indian parties, (on the subject of emigration) now understood to be absent in the direction of Washington on the business of their respective parties.
The order will be carefully read at the head of every company in the Army." -- General Winfield Scott's Order to United States Troops Assigned to the Cherokee Removal
"Nits make lice." -- General William T. Sherman
From http://www.abc.net.au/rn/arts/booktalk/stories/s1268910.htm, "We agree with Thomas Jefferson who’s come up with a magnificent idea—send the Indians to the west. Get them out of the areas where the white settlers are to be found. We’ll exchange territory. You give us your eastern lands and we’ll give you the west.’ The west can be desert; no trees, no grass…some of the Indians, especially the Seminoles, went out and took a look at it and said, ‘This is not what we want.’ ‘This is what you get because you cannot stay with us.’ ‘No,’ said Jackson, ‘you can. You can live here but not as Indians. You can live among us if you become cultural white men. That is, you understand our laws and our requirements, and you obey them." -- Summary of General Andrew Jackson's demands on the 'Five Civilized Tribes'
"Cherokee Agency, May 17, 1838
Major General Scott, of the United States' Army, announces to the troops assembled and assembling in this country, that, with them, he has been charged by the President to cause the Cherokee Indians yet remaining in North Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Alabama, to remove to the West, according to the terms of the Treaty of 1835 [Treaty of New Echota]. His Staff will be as follows: Lieutenant Colonel W.J. Worth, acting Adjutant General, Chief of the Staff; Major M.M. Payne, acting Inspector General; Lieutenants R. Anderson and E.D. Keyes, regular Aides-de-camp. Any order given orally, or in writing, by either of those officers, in the name of the Major General, will be respected and obeyed as if given by himself. The Chiefs of Ordnance, of the Quartermaster's Department and of the Commissariat, as also the Medical Director of the Army, will, as soon as they can be ascertained, be announced in orders.
To carry out the general object with the greatest promptitude and certainty, and with the least possible distress to the Indians, the country they are to evacuate is divided into three principal Military Districts, under as many officers of high rank, to command the troops serving therein, subject to the instructions of the Major General. The senior officer actually present in each district will receive instructions from the Major General as to the time of commencing the removal, and everything that may occur interesting to the service, in the district, will be promptly reported to the same sources. The Major General will endeavor to visit in a short time all parts of the Cherokee country occupied by the troops.
The duties devolved on the army, through the orders of the Major General and those of the commanders of districts, under him, are of a highly important and critical nature. The Cherokees, by the advances which they have made in Christianity and civilization, are by far the most interesting tribe of Indians in the territorial limits of the United States. Of the 15,000 of these people who are now to be removed (and the time within which a voluntary emigration was stipulated will expire on the 23rd instant) it is understood that about four-fifths are opposed, or have become averse to a distant emigration; and altho' none are in actual hostilities with the United States, or threaten a resistance by arms, yet the troops will probably be obliged to cover the whole country they inhabit, in order to make prisoners and to march or to transport the prisoners, by families, either to this place, to Ross's Landing, or Gunter's Landing, where they are to finally delivered over to the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration.
Considering the number and temper of the mass to be removed, together with the extent and fastnesses of the country occupied, it will readily occur, that simple indiscretions -- acts of harshness and cruelty, on the part of our troops, may lead, step by step, to delays, to impatience and exasperation, and in the end, to a general war and carnage -- a result, in the case of those particular Indians, utterly abhorrent to the generous sympathies of the whole American people. Every possible kindness, compatible with the necessity of removal, must therefore, be shown by the troops, and, if, in the ranks, a despicable individual should be found, capable of inflicting a wanton injury or insult on any Cherokee man, woman or child, it is hereby made the special duty of the nearest good officer or man, instantly to interpose, and to seize and consign the guilty wrench to the severest penalty of the laws. The Major General is fully persuaded that this injunction will not be neglected by the brave men under his command, who cannot be otherwise than jealous of their own honor and that of their country.
By early and persevering acts of kindness and humanity, it is impossible to doubt that the Indians may soon be induced to confide in the Army, and instead of fleeing to mountains and forests, flock to us for food and clothing. If however, through false apprehensions, individuals, or a party, here and there, should seek to hide themselves, they must be pursued and invited to surrender, but not fired upon unless they should made a stand to resist. Even in such cases, mild remedies may sometimes better succeed than violence; and it cannot be doubted that if we get possession of the women and children first, or first capture the men, that in either case, the outstanding members of the same families will readily come in on the assurance of forgiveness and kind treatment.
Every captured man, as well as all who surrender themselves, must be disarmed, with the assurance that their weapons will be carefully preserved and restored at, or beyond the Mississippi. In either case, the men will be guarded and escorted, except it may be, where the women and children are safely secured as hostages, but, in general, families, families, in our possession, will not be separated unless it be to send men, as runners, to invite others to come in.
It may happen that Indians will be found too sick, in the opinion of the nearest Surgeon, to be removed to one of the depots indicated above. In every such case, one or more of the family, or the friends of the sick person, will be left in attendance, with ample subsistence and remedies, and the remainder of the family removed by the troops. Infants, superannuated person, lunatics and women in a helpless condition, will all, in the removal, require peculiar attention, which the brave and humane will seek to adapt to the necessities of the several cases.
All strong men, women, boys and girls, will be made to march under proper escorts. For the feeble, Indians horses and ponies will furnish a ready resource, as well as for bedding and light cooking utensils -- all of which, as intimated in the Treaty, will be necessary to the emigrants both in going to, and after arrival at, their new homes. Such, and all other light articles of property, the Indians will be allowed to collect and to take with them, as also their slaves, who will be treated in like manner with the Indians themselves.
If the horses and ponies be not adequate to the above purposes, wagons must be supplied. Corn, oats, fodder and other forage, also beef cattle, belonging to the Indians to be removed, will be taken possession of by the proper departments of the Staff, as wanted, for the regular consumption of the Army, and certificates given to the owners, specifying in ever case the amount of forage and the weight of beef, so taken, on order that the owners may be paid for the same on their arrival at one of the depots mentioned above. All other moveable [sic] or personal property, left or abandoned by the Indians, will be collected by agents appointed for the purpose, by the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration, under a system of accountability, for the benefit of the Indian owners, which he will devise. The Army will give to those agents, in their operations, all reasonable countenance, aid and support.
White men and widows, citizens of the United States, who are, or have been intermarried with Indians, and thence commonly termed Indian countrymen; also such Indians as have been made denizens of particular States by special legislation, together with the families and property of all such persons, will not be molested or removed by the troops until a decision, on the principles involved, can be obtained from the War Department. A like indulgence, but only for a limited time, and until further orders, is tended to the families and property of certain Chiefs and head-men of the two great Indian parties, (on the subject of emigration) now understood to be absent in the direction of Washington on the business of their respective parties.
The order will be carefully read at the head of every company in the Army." -- General Winfield Scott's Order to United States Troops Assigned to the Cherokee Removal
Posted by: Rusty Shackelford, don't be another dithering James Buchanan! at August 19, 2006 09:03 PM (/OezW)
31
cheers, hondo.
Posted by: Tony at August 19, 2006 09:03 PM (e0qru)
32
"The only good Indians I ever saw was dead." -- General Philip Sheridan
"Nits make lice." -- General William T. Sherman
From http://www.abc.net.au/rn/arts/booktalk/stories/s1268910.htm, "We agree with Thomas Jefferson who’s come up with a magnificent idea—send the Indians to the west. Get them out of the areas where the white settlers are to be found. We’ll exchange territory. You give us your eastern lands and we’ll give you the west.’ The west can be desert; no trees, no grass…some of the Indians, especially the Seminoles, went out and took a look at it and said, ‘This is not what we want.’ ‘This is what you get because you cannot stay with us.’ ‘No,’ said Jackson, ‘you can. You can live here but not as Indians. You can live among us if you become cultural white men. That is, you understand our laws and our requirements, and you obey them." -- Summary of General Andrew Jackson's demands on the 'Five Civilized Tribes'
"Cherokee Agency, May 17, 1838
Major General Scott, of the United States' Army, announces to the troops assembled and assembling in this country, that, with them, he has been charged by the President to cause the Cherokee Indians yet remaining in North Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Alabama, to remove to the West, according to the terms of the Treaty of 1835 [Treaty of New Echota]. His Staff will be as follows: Lieutenant Colonel W.J. Worth, acting Adjutant General, Chief of the Staff; Major M.M. Payne, acting Inspector General; Lieutenants R. Anderson and E.D. Keyes, regular Aides-de-camp. Any order given orally, or in writing, by either of those officers, in the name of the Major General, will be respected and obeyed as if given by himself. The Chiefs of Ordnance, of the Quartermaster's Department and of the Commissariat, as also the Medical Director of the Army, will, as soon as they can be ascertained, be announced in orders.
To carry out the general object with the greatest promptitude and certainty, and with the least possible distress to the Indians, the country they are to evacuate is divided into three principal Military Districts, under as many officers of high rank, to command the troops serving therein, subject to the instructions of the Major General. The senior officer actually present in each district will receive instructions from the Major General as to the time of commencing the removal, and everything that may occur interesting to the service, in the district, will be promptly reported to the same sources. The Major General will endeavor to visit in a short time all parts of the Cherokee country occupied by the troops.
The duties devolved on the army, through the orders of the Major General and those of the commanders of districts, under him, are of a highly important and critical nature. The Cherokees, by the advances which they have made in Christianity and civilization, are by far the most interesting tribe of Indians in the territorial limits of the United States. Of the 15,000 of these people who are now to be removed (and the time within which a voluntary emigration was stipulated will expire on the 23rd instant) it is understood that about four-fifths are opposed, or have become averse to a distant emigration; and altho' none are in actual hostilities with the United States, or threaten a resistance by arms, yet the troops will probably be obliged to cover the whole country they inhabit, in order to make prisoners and to march or to transport the prisoners, by families, either to this place, to Ross's Landing, or Gunter's Landing, where they are to finally delivered over to the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration.
Considering the number and temper of the mass to be removed, together with the extent and fastnesses of the country occupied, it will readily occur, that simple indiscretions -- acts of harshness and cruelty, on the part of our troops, may lead, step by step, to delays, to impatience and exasperation, and in the end, to a general war and carnage -- a result, in the case of those particular Indians, utterly abhorrent to the generous sympathies of the whole American people. Every possible kindness, compatible with the necessity of removal, must therefore, be shown by the troops, and, if, in the ranks, a despicable individual should be found, capable of inflicting a wanton injury or insult on any Cherokee man, woman or child, it is hereby made the special duty of the nearest good officer or man, instantly to interpose, and to seize and consign the guilty wrench to the severest penalty of the laws. The Major General is fully persuaded that this injunction will not be neglected by the brave men under his command, who cannot be otherwise than jealous of their own honor and that of their country.
By early and persevering acts of kindness and humanity, it is impossible to doubt that the Indians may soon be induced to confide in the Army, and instead of fleeing to mountains and forests, flock to us for food and clothing. If however, through false apprehensions, individuals, or a party, here and there, should seek to hide themselves, they must be pursued and invited to surrender, but not fired upon unless they should made a stand to resist. Even in such cases, mild remedies may sometimes better succeed than violence; and it cannot be doubted that if we get possession of the women and children first, or first capture the men, that in either case, the outstanding members of the same families will readily come in on the assurance of forgiveness and kind treatment.
Every captured man, as well as all who surrender themselves, must be disarmed, with the assurance that their weapons will be carefully preserved and restored at, or beyond the Mississippi. In either case, the men will be guarded and escorted, except it may be, where the women and children are safely secured as hostages, but, in general, families, families, in our possession, will not be separated unless it be to send men, as runners, to invite others to come in.
It may happen that Indians will be found too sick, in the opinion of the nearest Surgeon, to be removed to one of the depots indicated above. In every such case, one or more of the family, or the friends of the sick person, will be left in attendance, with ample subsistence and remedies, and the remainder of the family removed by the troops. Infants, superannuated person, lunatics and women in a helpless condition, will all, in the removal, require peculiar attention, which the brave and humane will seek to adapt to the necessities of the several cases.
All strong men, women, boys and girls, will be made to march under proper escorts. For the feeble, Indians horses and ponies will furnish a ready resource, as well as for bedding and light cooking utensils -- all of which, as intimated in the Treaty, will be necessary to the emigrants both in going to, and after arrival at, their new homes. Such, and all other light articles of property, the Indians will be allowed to collect and to take with them, as also their slaves, who will be treated in like manner with the Indians themselves.
If the horses and ponies be not adequate to the above purposes, wagons must be supplied. Corn, oats, fodder and other forage, also beef cattle, belonging to the Indians to be removed, will be taken possession of by the proper departments of the Staff, as wanted, for the regular consumption of the Army, and certificates given to the owners, specifying in ever case the amount of forage and the weight of beef, so taken, on order that the owners may be paid for the same on their arrival at one of the depots mentioned above. All other moveable [sic] or personal property, left or abandoned by the Indians, will be collected by agents appointed for the purpose, by the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration, under a system of accountability, for the benefit of the Indian owners, which he will devise. The Army will give to those agents, in their operations, all reasonable countenance, aid and support.
White men and widows, citizens of the United States, who are, or have been intermarried with Indians, and thence commonly termed Indian countrymen; also such Indians as have been made denizens of particular States by special legislation, together with the families and property of all such persons, will not be molested or removed by the troops until a decision, on the principles involved, can be obtained from the War Department. A like indulgence, but only for a limited time, and until further orders, is tended to the families and property of certain Chiefs and head-men of the two great Indian parties, (on the subject of emigration) now understood to be absent in the direction of Washington on the business of their respective parties.
The order will be carefully read at the head of every company in the Army." -- General Winfield Scott's Order to United States Troops Assigned to the Cherokee Removal
"Nits make lice." -- General William T. Sherman
From http://www.abc.net.au/rn/arts/booktalk/stories/s1268910.htm, "We agree with Thomas Jefferson who’s come up with a magnificent idea—send the Indians to the west. Get them out of the areas where the white settlers are to be found. We’ll exchange territory. You give us your eastern lands and we’ll give you the west.’ The west can be desert; no trees, no grass…some of the Indians, especially the Seminoles, went out and took a look at it and said, ‘This is not what we want.’ ‘This is what you get because you cannot stay with us.’ ‘No,’ said Jackson, ‘you can. You can live here but not as Indians. You can live among us if you become cultural white men. That is, you understand our laws and our requirements, and you obey them." -- Summary of General Andrew Jackson's demands on the 'Five Civilized Tribes'
"Cherokee Agency, May 17, 1838
Major General Scott, of the United States' Army, announces to the troops assembled and assembling in this country, that, with them, he has been charged by the President to cause the Cherokee Indians yet remaining in North Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Alabama, to remove to the West, according to the terms of the Treaty of 1835 [Treaty of New Echota]. His Staff will be as follows: Lieutenant Colonel W.J. Worth, acting Adjutant General, Chief of the Staff; Major M.M. Payne, acting Inspector General; Lieutenants R. Anderson and E.D. Keyes, regular Aides-de-camp. Any order given orally, or in writing, by either of those officers, in the name of the Major General, will be respected and obeyed as if given by himself. The Chiefs of Ordnance, of the Quartermaster's Department and of the Commissariat, as also the Medical Director of the Army, will, as soon as they can be ascertained, be announced in orders.
To carry out the general object with the greatest promptitude and certainty, and with the least possible distress to the Indians, the country they are to evacuate is divided into three principal Military Districts, under as many officers of high rank, to command the troops serving therein, subject to the instructions of the Major General. The senior officer actually present in each district will receive instructions from the Major General as to the time of commencing the removal, and everything that may occur interesting to the service, in the district, will be promptly reported to the same sources. The Major General will endeavor to visit in a short time all parts of the Cherokee country occupied by the troops.
The duties devolved on the army, through the orders of the Major General and those of the commanders of districts, under him, are of a highly important and critical nature. The Cherokees, by the advances which they have made in Christianity and civilization, are by far the most interesting tribe of Indians in the territorial limits of the United States. Of the 15,000 of these people who are now to be removed (and the time within which a voluntary emigration was stipulated will expire on the 23rd instant) it is understood that about four-fifths are opposed, or have become averse to a distant emigration; and altho' none are in actual hostilities with the United States, or threaten a resistance by arms, yet the troops will probably be obliged to cover the whole country they inhabit, in order to make prisoners and to march or to transport the prisoners, by families, either to this place, to Ross's Landing, or Gunter's Landing, where they are to finally delivered over to the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration.
Considering the number and temper of the mass to be removed, together with the extent and fastnesses of the country occupied, it will readily occur, that simple indiscretions -- acts of harshness and cruelty, on the part of our troops, may lead, step by step, to delays, to impatience and exasperation, and in the end, to a general war and carnage -- a result, in the case of those particular Indians, utterly abhorrent to the generous sympathies of the whole American people. Every possible kindness, compatible with the necessity of removal, must therefore, be shown by the troops, and, if, in the ranks, a despicable individual should be found, capable of inflicting a wanton injury or insult on any Cherokee man, woman or child, it is hereby made the special duty of the nearest good officer or man, instantly to interpose, and to seize and consign the guilty wrench to the severest penalty of the laws. The Major General is fully persuaded that this injunction will not be neglected by the brave men under his command, who cannot be otherwise than jealous of their own honor and that of their country.
By early and persevering acts of kindness and humanity, it is impossible to doubt that the Indians may soon be induced to confide in the Army, and instead of fleeing to mountains and forests, flock to us for food and clothing. If however, through false apprehensions, individuals, or a party, here and there, should seek to hide themselves, they must be pursued and invited to surrender, but not fired upon unless they should made a stand to resist. Even in such cases, mild remedies may sometimes better succeed than violence; and it cannot be doubted that if we get possession of the women and children first, or first capture the men, that in either case, the outstanding members of the same families will readily come in on the assurance of forgiveness and kind treatment.
Every captured man, as well as all who surrender themselves, must be disarmed, with the assurance that their weapons will be carefully preserved and restored at, or beyond the Mississippi. In either case, the men will be guarded and escorted, except it may be, where the women and children are safely secured as hostages, but, in general, families, families, in our possession, will not be separated unless it be to send men, as runners, to invite others to come in.
It may happen that Indians will be found too sick, in the opinion of the nearest Surgeon, to be removed to one of the depots indicated above. In every such case, one or more of the family, or the friends of the sick person, will be left in attendance, with ample subsistence and remedies, and the remainder of the family removed by the troops. Infants, superannuated person, lunatics and women in a helpless condition, will all, in the removal, require peculiar attention, which the brave and humane will seek to adapt to the necessities of the several cases.
All strong men, women, boys and girls, will be made to march under proper escorts. For the feeble, Indians horses and ponies will furnish a ready resource, as well as for bedding and light cooking utensils -- all of which, as intimated in the Treaty, will be necessary to the emigrants both in going to, and after arrival at, their new homes. Such, and all other light articles of property, the Indians will be allowed to collect and to take with them, as also their slaves, who will be treated in like manner with the Indians themselves.
If the horses and ponies be not adequate to the above purposes, wagons must be supplied. Corn, oats, fodder and other forage, also beef cattle, belonging to the Indians to be removed, will be taken possession of by the proper departments of the Staff, as wanted, for the regular consumption of the Army, and certificates given to the owners, specifying in ever case the amount of forage and the weight of beef, so taken, on order that the owners may be paid for the same on their arrival at one of the depots mentioned above. All other moveable [sic] or personal property, left or abandoned by the Indians, will be collected by agents appointed for the purpose, by the Superintendent of Cherokee Emigration, under a system of accountability, for the benefit of the Indian owners, which he will devise. The Army will give to those agents, in their operations, all reasonable countenance, aid and support.
White men and widows, citizens of the United States, who are, or have been intermarried with Indians, and thence commonly termed Indian countrymen; also such Indians as have been made denizens of particular States by special legislation, together with the families and property of all such persons, will not be molested or removed by the troops until a decision, on the principles involved, can be obtained from the War Department. A like indulgence, but only for a limited time, and until further orders, is tended to the families and property of certain Chiefs and head-men of the two great Indian parties, (on the subject of emigration) now understood to be absent in the direction of Washington on the business of their respective parties.
The order will be carefully read at the head of every company in the Army." -- General Winfield Scott's Order to United States Troops Assigned to the Cherokee Removal
Posted by: Rusty Shackelford, don't be another dithering James Buchanan! at August 19, 2006 09:04 PM (/OezW)
33
Sorry about the double post.
Posted by: Rusty Shackelford, don't be another dithering James Buchanan! at August 19, 2006 09:07 PM (/OezW)
34
maxie
Killing them all doesn't work for me. I took being a professional soldier seriously - and really don't want to cross that line reference killing civilians, women and children. I know you - you may think your crazy - but I'm damn sure you have the same qualms too - you just conceal it (damn good at it too~!).
I looking for options - alternatives. I believe isolation quarantine is a viable possiblity.
Ya know - we (the west & the world) have spent decades hung up on "dialoge" as THE solution. Its a small world - talk - get to know each other - accommodate etc.
With muslims it all crap - doesn't work! But we have NOT tried isolation, quarantine, segregation of muslims in their own muslim world.
Let's face it maxie - neither you nor I give a flying fuck what a bunch of ragheads do in ragland! They can beat their wives, screw their daughters & goats whatever.
I want to give isolation a try! I don't want to cross that line! Remember maxie - that line - WE created it out of our history & culture - its important to us - its our line - its how we define ourselves - its our values - it doesn't have a God Damn thing to do with muslims and I don't want to destroy or shame it over crap like muslims until all options are truly explored!
Killing them all doesn't work for me. I took being a professional soldier seriously - and really don't want to cross that line reference killing civilians, women and children. I know you - you may think your crazy - but I'm damn sure you have the same qualms too - you just conceal it (damn good at it too~!).
I looking for options - alternatives. I believe isolation quarantine is a viable possiblity.
Ya know - we (the west & the world) have spent decades hung up on "dialoge" as THE solution. Its a small world - talk - get to know each other - accommodate etc.
With muslims it all crap - doesn't work! But we have NOT tried isolation, quarantine, segregation of muslims in their own muslim world.
Let's face it maxie - neither you nor I give a flying fuck what a bunch of ragheads do in ragland! They can beat their wives, screw their daughters & goats whatever.
I want to give isolation a try! I don't want to cross that line! Remember maxie - that line - WE created it out of our history & culture - its important to us - its our line - its how we define ourselves - its our values - it doesn't have a God Damn thing to do with muslims and I don't want to destroy or shame it over crap like muslims until all options are truly explored!
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 09:11 PM (XrexX)
35
Hondo, isolation how? Ring every Muslim country with military blockades? It is not do-able.
If you ignore vast regions containing oil and people that hate you, they will make friends with someone. Isolationisim isolates the isolationist.
If you ignore vast regions containing oil and people that hate you, they will make friends with someone. Isolationisim isolates the isolationist.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 09:22 PM (LoKA7)
36
QC,
There is a flaw in your argument where you say "they will make friends with someone". This is NOT possible. Islam is incorrigibly hostile to everyone and everything other than its own worthless self. The Muslim world is not capable of being friends with non-Muslims, the seemingly friendly veneers of the so-called "moderate" Muslims notwithstanding.
There is a flaw in your argument where you say "they will make friends with someone". This is NOT possible. Islam is incorrigibly hostile to everyone and everything other than its own worthless self. The Muslim world is not capable of being friends with non-Muslims, the seemingly friendly veneers of the so-called "moderate" Muslims notwithstanding.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 19, 2006 09:30 PM (Bp6wV)
37
There are a number of things that we do not understand as non-Muslims. Muslims are Muslim first, American, French, German, Saudi etc. second. While Muslims may be the greatest neighbor you could ever hope for, there are Islamic laws that deal with the infidel. They can never (in their hearts) consider themselves friends of an infidel (anyone who is not Muslim), they can lie to an infidel, any Muslim who truely befriends an infidel is considered an apostate (hence the ability for the insurgents to kill other Iraqis). The Quran says it is a sin to commit suicide yet to die on the battlefield is to die a martyr. So to kill yourself taking out the enemy (terrorists attacks) is to die a martyr.
Their sole purpose, as a Muslim to to conquer the world for Islam. They are waiting the return of the 12th Iman who will lead them to a conquering of the world for Iman. And they will no more turn their backs on Islam than would the Germans (many who were good people) would turn their backs on Hitler.
Islam, in and of itself, must be defeated because Muslims to stay Muslims must adhere to Islam and that is to destroy the non-believers.
Think of this way: we think (or many of us do) that if we teach Muslims a better way, if we show them the advantage of our way of democracy, if we bring them into the capitalist society and they start living well, if we educate them in both our universities and our social norms they will not hate us and will no longer want to destroy us but remember, most of the 9-11 hijackers were educated, had lived among us, were not from poor families (Mohammed Atta had an engineering degree) and yet they felt that Islam was more important than any other thing in their lives and was worth killing 3,000 Americans for.
I have great respect for Monsoor Ijaz who is often a Fox News commentator. He is an American, a Muslim and of Pakistani decent. You might be interested in a debate he had with Andrew McCarthy.
http://www.benadorassociates.com/article/19363
Unless you can change a philosophy that has existed since the 7the century, you can not change Islam.
When you have a cancer, it must be cut out. No atopical treatment will cure it.
Their sole purpose, as a Muslim to to conquer the world for Islam. They are waiting the return of the 12th Iman who will lead them to a conquering of the world for Iman. And they will no more turn their backs on Islam than would the Germans (many who were good people) would turn their backs on Hitler.
Islam, in and of itself, must be defeated because Muslims to stay Muslims must adhere to Islam and that is to destroy the non-believers.
Think of this way: we think (or many of us do) that if we teach Muslims a better way, if we show them the advantage of our way of democracy, if we bring them into the capitalist society and they start living well, if we educate them in both our universities and our social norms they will not hate us and will no longer want to destroy us but remember, most of the 9-11 hijackers were educated, had lived among us, were not from poor families (Mohammed Atta had an engineering degree) and yet they felt that Islam was more important than any other thing in their lives and was worth killing 3,000 Americans for.
I have great respect for Monsoor Ijaz who is often a Fox News commentator. He is an American, a Muslim and of Pakistani decent. You might be interested in a debate he had with Andrew McCarthy.
http://www.benadorassociates.com/article/19363
Unless you can change a philosophy that has existed since the 7the century, you can not change Islam.
When you have a cancer, it must be cut out. No atopical treatment will cure it.
Posted by: retire05 at August 19, 2006 09:34 PM (KRDPF)
38
Hondo, I'm not talking about the most expedient method for dealing with muslims, but the only method for dealing with them. They have been at war with us for almost 1500 years now. In that time we have gone from the dark ages to the space age and beyond, and have created the most advanced civilization in the history of humanity, with accomplishments too numerous to mention, but what have they done in that time? They still cut off people's heads and murder girls for "dishonoring" their families by getting raped. They are unevolved savages who are completely incompatible with modern civilization.
They cannot be tamed, they cannot be domesticated, they cannot be civilized, and they will never understand that killing people is last resort, not the first, to problem solving. Islam is death to civilization; if we don't kill them, they won't stop trying to kill us. I'd rather live in peace and spend my money on a nice sailboat and take vacations in exotic places rather than to have to spend it on arms and ammunition, but muslims will never stop trying to kill innocent people, and so we must fight them. We must kill them before they kill us.
Don't like it? Tough. I don't make the rules, but I damn sure understand them, and I'm not going to let some noble but archaic notion of fair play get me killed. Try to reason with them if you like, or appeal to their humanity, but you'll get farther reasoning with a rabid dog. A peaceful muslim is a dead one.
They cannot be tamed, they cannot be domesticated, they cannot be civilized, and they will never understand that killing people is last resort, not the first, to problem solving. Islam is death to civilization; if we don't kill them, they won't stop trying to kill us. I'd rather live in peace and spend my money on a nice sailboat and take vacations in exotic places rather than to have to spend it on arms and ammunition, but muslims will never stop trying to kill innocent people, and so we must fight them. We must kill them before they kill us.
Don't like it? Tough. I don't make the rules, but I damn sure understand them, and I'm not going to let some noble but archaic notion of fair play get me killed. Try to reason with them if you like, or appeal to their humanity, but you'll get farther reasoning with a rabid dog. A peaceful muslim is a dead one.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 19, 2006 09:43 PM (v3I+x)
39
Isolation? Easy!
No air traffic between muslim & non-muslim world (unless some idiot country wants it) - no communications linked (phone, internet etc.) - no trade (oil - WE WILL FIND ANOTHER WAY!) - no shipping - no governmental interactions (no embassies etc - why bother!) - no commercial business or investment - (Hell! We've done this before thru-out history) - no travel - (I don't want to go there - why should they want to come here - besides - why would we let them!) - all interactions thru international agencies - and by choice only! - if an international agency places a premimum on "inclusion" rather than shared agreed upon beliefs - then we go elsewhere.
Reference oil - WE ADAPT - WE OVERCOME - WE DO WHAT WE DO BEST - WE THINK - WE CREATE - NEW TECHNOLOGIES - NEW ENERGY SOURCES
Reference people who hate us - I don't give a flying fuck what they think or do in their lands - or in their bedouin tents - hate away if it makes them happy!
QC - here's a shock - I have travelled the world - no one likes muslims!
Don't confuse doing business with others as friendship! and business is business ...
Will say the Chinese do business with muslims? - Let's see - Muslims have oil - but America & Japan etc have new energy technologies - hmmmmm - muslims have dates and camels - but America has Wal-Mart plus billions in mutual investments and markets and trade - hmmmmmm - trust me - the Chinese are not stupid - nor much of the rest of the world for that matter!
Isolation isolates the isolationist? Hell yeah!! 1.2 billion muslims vs US and bulk of remaining 4.8 billion world population!!!! now exactly - who is being the isolationist?
No air traffic between muslim & non-muslim world (unless some idiot country wants it) - no communications linked (phone, internet etc.) - no trade (oil - WE WILL FIND ANOTHER WAY!) - no shipping - no governmental interactions (no embassies etc - why bother!) - no commercial business or investment - (Hell! We've done this before thru-out history) - no travel - (I don't want to go there - why should they want to come here - besides - why would we let them!) - all interactions thru international agencies - and by choice only! - if an international agency places a premimum on "inclusion" rather than shared agreed upon beliefs - then we go elsewhere.
Reference oil - WE ADAPT - WE OVERCOME - WE DO WHAT WE DO BEST - WE THINK - WE CREATE - NEW TECHNOLOGIES - NEW ENERGY SOURCES
Reference people who hate us - I don't give a flying fuck what they think or do in their lands - or in their bedouin tents - hate away if it makes them happy!
QC - here's a shock - I have travelled the world - no one likes muslims!
Don't confuse doing business with others as friendship! and business is business ...
Will say the Chinese do business with muslims? - Let's see - Muslims have oil - but America & Japan etc have new energy technologies - hmmmmm - muslims have dates and camels - but America has Wal-Mart plus billions in mutual investments and markets and trade - hmmmmmm - trust me - the Chinese are not stupid - nor much of the rest of the world for that matter!
Isolation isolates the isolationist? Hell yeah!! 1.2 billion muslims vs US and bulk of remaining 4.8 billion world population!!!! now exactly - who is being the isolationist?
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 10:14 PM (XrexX)
40
Garduneh and hondo, where I say "friends" it can be taken as "allies" (see Iran and North Korea). It is a figure of speech with much broader implications than going over on the weekend for a barbeque.
Hondo "some idiot country" is my point exactly. There are lots of idiot countries- and there are lots of bad guys in them that hate US and the Jews as much or more than you say they don't like Muslims.. "The world" is not US.
Hondo "some idiot country" is my point exactly. There are lots of idiot countries- and there are lots of bad guys in them that hate US and the Jews as much or more than you say they don't like Muslims.. "The world" is not US.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 10:25 PM (LoKA7)
41
Every German I have ever met is a nice, pleasant, wonderfull, intelligent person. So where the hell did the nazis come from? Deep inside the same people.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 19, 2006 10:26 PM (gT5i+)
42
Furthermore, isolationisim is immoral. We are the fuckin light of the world man! I am serious. I sleep at night knowing that our countries efforts in Iraq and the GWOT have the potential to free millions (billions?) of muslim girls that will otherwise be raised as slaves.
The isolation of Iraq hurt the least guilty the most. Saddam always had plenty, he never went hungry. Dude, we can't say fuck them and forget them- it is not right- there are many that are in it against their will. Don't go wobbly on this shit now. It is about a whole lot more than WMD and Mutherfuckers on a Plane.
Look in their eyes, and tell them that you are from the greatest country in the history of the planet, totally blessed by God, a land that is heaven compared to their reality... but you won't help. I'd rather die trying.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkREPocIwuE
The isolation of Iraq hurt the least guilty the most. Saddam always had plenty, he never went hungry. Dude, we can't say fuck them and forget them- it is not right- there are many that are in it against their will. Don't go wobbly on this shit now. It is about a whole lot more than WMD and Mutherfuckers on a Plane.
Look in their eyes, and tell them that you are from the greatest country in the history of the planet, totally blessed by God, a land that is heaven compared to their reality... but you won't help. I'd rather die trying.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkREPocIwuE
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 10:39 PM (LoKA7)
43
maxie
I don't want to tame them - I don't want to domesticate them - and I don't want to civilize them ..... I just don't want them - period!
If it is possible to isolate them in their bumfuck part of the world - out of sight - out of mind - with no contact whatsoever - then I want to look at those options - I don't feel anyone really has up to this point.
Consider it a wildlife preserve - and I don't care if they eat their children!
If they want to kill me they still have to come out of their "preserve" to come to me - and then maxie - I'll flip you for the first shot - we can keep score together.
Maxie - don't insult me - I'm not reasoning with them or appealing to their humanity. I'm writing them off as not worth my contact in any format.
I want to stick them all in the biggest hole I can find (the muslim world) - but don't want to kill them (at this time).
Who knows - I'm an optimist! Maybe 500 years from now we can peek into that hole and see if they have changed at least a lil' or invented toilet paper.
Maxie - trust me - we get them all into that hole - I ain't letting them out.
I don't want to tame them - I don't want to domesticate them - and I don't want to civilize them ..... I just don't want them - period!
If it is possible to isolate them in their bumfuck part of the world - out of sight - out of mind - with no contact whatsoever - then I want to look at those options - I don't feel anyone really has up to this point.
Consider it a wildlife preserve - and I don't care if they eat their children!
If they want to kill me they still have to come out of their "preserve" to come to me - and then maxie - I'll flip you for the first shot - we can keep score together.
Maxie - don't insult me - I'm not reasoning with them or appealing to their humanity. I'm writing them off as not worth my contact in any format.
I want to stick them all in the biggest hole I can find (the muslim world) - but don't want to kill them (at this time).
Who knows - I'm an optimist! Maybe 500 years from now we can peek into that hole and see if they have changed at least a lil' or invented toilet paper.
Maxie - trust me - we get them all into that hole - I ain't letting them out.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 10:40 PM (XrexX)
44
Seems to me that the "some of them are nice people" argument is badly flawed. NO country conducts its foreign policy and defense on the basis of how nice some foreigners are.
Policy deals with people en masse, as it must. As we did in WW2. There were surely some very fine people in Hamburg and Dresden (and Hiroshima) but...so what? Are we to be totally paralysed by the admirable qualities of some individuals?
Whatever solution the West arrives at to deal with islam, if it's to be effective will cause some innocent people to suffer.
There were three thousand innocents in the WTC, too.
Policy deals with people en masse, as it must. As we did in WW2. There were surely some very fine people in Hamburg and Dresden (and Hiroshima) but...so what? Are we to be totally paralysed by the admirable qualities of some individuals?
Whatever solution the West arrives at to deal with islam, if it's to be effective will cause some innocent people to suffer.
There were three thousand innocents in the WTC, too.
Posted by: Keith at August 19, 2006 10:50 PM (gofp3)
45
QC
No the world is not the US - but the world is money - and when it comes to money - business is business! Some (not all) of the muslim world have money - in the form of oil. But that's it - their only cash product - their only bargaining chip. They are the preverbial one-trick ecomonic pony in a very complex world.
Isolation is not immoral! They can build their islamic paradise to their hearts content without any interference or judgement from the west or anyone else.
Iraq - damn! Ya got me! I was ambivalent from the begining when GWB surprised me and honestly set forth such noble goals as to be our end result there. A noble belief system and ideals I share (yeah maxie - I'm still a sucker living on faith and optimism).
But damn! Was I aprehensive! I am reminded of Operation Marketbasket being just one bridge too far. But so far - I'm still committed to going the distance.
QC - note - the topic refers to an overall muslim solution.
Other than my "isolation" (hopefully beign) and various senerios involving a lot of killing - not much has be offered.
Rusty - this is not an easy question!
No the world is not the US - but the world is money - and when it comes to money - business is business! Some (not all) of the muslim world have money - in the form of oil. But that's it - their only cash product - their only bargaining chip. They are the preverbial one-trick ecomonic pony in a very complex world.
Isolation is not immoral! They can build their islamic paradise to their hearts content without any interference or judgement from the west or anyone else.
Iraq - damn! Ya got me! I was ambivalent from the begining when GWB surprised me and honestly set forth such noble goals as to be our end result there. A noble belief system and ideals I share (yeah maxie - I'm still a sucker living on faith and optimism).
But damn! Was I aprehensive! I am reminded of Operation Marketbasket being just one bridge too far. But so far - I'm still committed to going the distance.
QC - note - the topic refers to an overall muslim solution.
Other than my "isolation" (hopefully beign) and various senerios involving a lot of killing - not much has be offered.
Rusty - this is not an easy question!
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 11:06 PM (XrexX)
46
Hondo wants isolation.
Ronald Reagan: “We in America have learned bitter lessons from two world wars: It is better to be here [in Europe] ready to protect the peace, than to take blind shelter across the sea, rushing to respond only after freedom is lost. We've learned that isolationism never was and never will be an acceptable response to tyrannical governments with an expansionist intent.â€
Ronald Reagan: “We in America have learned bitter lessons from two world wars: It is better to be here [in Europe] ready to protect the peace, than to take blind shelter across the sea, rushing to respond only after freedom is lost. We've learned that isolationism never was and never will be an acceptable response to tyrannical governments with an expansionist intent.â€
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 19, 2006 11:15 PM (+nlyI)
47
Hondo your last post read like lyrics of a song. I am an American. I don't want you f-ing with my life. But that doesn't mean I want you dead. Just leave me the F- Alone!
GM, as Hondo said, we are noones big stick except our own.
And Hondo, you did go long.
GM, as Hondo said, we are noones big stick except our own.
And Hondo, you did go long.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 19, 2006 11:17 PM (n4VvM)
48
Seemonk
I'm a lil' confused by your post as to interpeting it. I know its a Saturday night - have you been drinking?
I'm a lil' confused by your post as to interpeting it. I know its a Saturday night - have you been drinking?
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 11:25 PM (XrexX)
49
Isolationism is the last thing we as a country can afford. That is a lib platform, and will indicate surrender to our rivals and enemies, like no other thing we ever could do. It is short sighted and fatalistic. The only thing it would achieve is the entry into the next global conflict. I want point something out to most of the tunnel vision geniuses out there. In order for the US to prevail in WW2 we had to beat three nations into submission. It cost over a million lives in combat troops alone. The way sides seem to be drawing up, the next one could literally be half of the world fighting the other half. If half of your head was decimated to a point where it could not support itself, do you think you would survive? Before the next shot is fired in this war agaist Islamic facism, I hope the balance is better than 50/50. Better as in the sane people who believe in life, love and the persuit of happiness rule out.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 19, 2006 11:26 PM (n4VvM)
50
I think he meant your post 43 reads like a song- he is right. I don't know what the rest means. Time for beers- maybe then it will make sense.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 11:29 PM (LoKA7)
51
That was how I interpreted you previous posts. I was not speaking those things to you. I agree. I spent the evening with a neighbor who's Italian buddy was in town. We talked quite a bit about politics. We both agree that we will and would fight but would prefer the asshats who want to kill us find another hobby.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 19, 2006 11:31 PM (n4VvM)
52
Yes this format doesn't space when I try to seperate topics. They tend to look like they run together.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 19, 2006 11:33 PM (n4VvM)
53
Darth Vag - sorry - your an idiot.
Not - repeat NOT isolate the United States from the rest of the world! Isolate the islamic world from the rest of the world!
I have written so much tonight on this and still you fail to pick up the blantantly obvious!
1) Much of the world also dislikes to outright hates muslims - they will however (like us) do business with them according to their needs. Guess what! When it comes to business - the US and a collection of world nations essentially can call all the shots - if they have a mind too.
2) The are more than 6 billion people on this planet - and only 1.2 billion are muslim .... hint hint
Not - repeat NOT isolate the United States from the rest of the world! Isolate the islamic world from the rest of the world!
I have written so much tonight on this and still you fail to pick up the blantantly obvious!
1) Much of the world also dislikes to outright hates muslims - they will however (like us) do business with them according to their needs. Guess what! When it comes to business - the US and a collection of world nations essentially can call all the shots - if they have a mind too.
2) The are more than 6 billion people on this planet - and only 1.2 billion are muslim .... hint hint
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 11:34 PM (XrexX)
54
Army has raised entry age limits to 42. I have not told my wife, but I am considering entry into the reserves. I need to find out what the physical requirements are. I have grown a little since 1996.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 19, 2006 11:35 PM (n4VvM)
55
SeeMonk, I have been playing with that idea also. It is more appealing to me as I approach that age limit than it was as a kid that resisted the temptation of a GI Bill reward, and Marine Corp pizza parties.
Grown.... up or out? lol!
Grown.... up or out? lol!
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 11:48 PM (LoKA7)
56
Seemonk
Haven't checked - may be age increase for prior service - it has bounced around pass couple of decades (35, 39). Its been an ongoing debate for a long time given concept of age limitations date back to WW2 era - a hell of a lot has changed as far as health and physical fitness in higher age brackets.
Take it you did do a lil' purely sociable drinking - tomarrow you will notice the slight decline in your writing skills about.
Oh, physical requirement #1 - stand up straight and don't fall down - give it a few days my friend ha hah hah.
Haven't checked - may be age increase for prior service - it has bounced around pass couple of decades (35, 39). Its been an ongoing debate for a long time given concept of age limitations date back to WW2 era - a hell of a lot has changed as far as health and physical fitness in higher age brackets.
Take it you did do a lil' purely sociable drinking - tomarrow you will notice the slight decline in your writing skills about.
Oh, physical requirement #1 - stand up straight and don't fall down - give it a few days my friend ha hah hah.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 11:50 PM (XrexX)
57
Interesting topic
Note not a single lib/lefty or muslim in fact has even come neared it. Interesting.
Note not a single lib/lefty or muslim in fact has even come neared it. Interesting.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 11:56 PM (XrexX)
58
The only people who seem to like Muslims as a group, are other Muslims, period. End
It's an unstoppable cancer that grows.
And the only way they can beat the US is using our very own laws and weaknesses in their favor. The Geneva Accords come to mind first, political correctness, second.
We're gonna get another bloody nose similar to 9/11, only worse, you can count on it. I just hope and pray America decides to wake up when it happens.
I also hope that it won't be too late.
It's an unstoppable cancer that grows.
And the only way they can beat the US is using our very own laws and weaknesses in their favor. The Geneva Accords come to mind first, political correctness, second.
We're gonna get another bloody nose similar to 9/11, only worse, you can count on it. I just hope and pray America decides to wake up when it happens.
I also hope that it won't be too late.
Posted by: dick at August 20, 2006 12:04 AM (DlvPG)
59
What the west does with the muslims will be decided by the behavior of the muslims.
QC: I have a hard time worrying about muslim women to teach the kids to hate, stand at rallies with signs saying our children will remember and strap bombs to themselves and the babies. I would just as soon be far away from them.
Maybe that's why muslim men treat them so.
QC: I have a hard time worrying about muslim women to teach the kids to hate, stand at rallies with signs saying our children will remember and strap bombs to themselves and the babies. I would just as soon be far away from them.
Maybe that's why muslim men treat them so.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 12:11 AM (2a6q3)
60
How was the fishing today - good bonita or what?
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 12:14 AM (XrexX)
61
QC: As a American white man I find your overt affection for other races and muslims quite distasteful. I'm primarily concerned about my country, religion and race.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 12:14 AM (2a6q3)
62
That bad huh.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 12:16 AM (XrexX)
63
I disagree, Dick, the "secular" American left loves Muslims. Just a quick perusal of Little Green Footballs shows that.
And hondo? Don't insult my friends Darth Vag and Garduneh Mehr again.
They are more than welcome to insult your friends, however, as much as they would like.
And hondo? Don't insult my friends Darth Vag and Garduneh Mehr again.
They are more than welcome to insult your friends, however, as much as they would like.
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief at August 20, 2006 12:19 AM (/qy9A)
64
man I get the giggles when I read this site.
only in america (and I love this place) can a government be anti abortion but pro war, so lets not suggest that our religious values are better than any one elses cause they are just as contradictory
oh, and don't get me started with the wtc. who decided to wipe out all the native americans on this land of "ours"... wasn't some muslim thats for sure.
laateedaa i'm american and I only focus on the truth when its convienant. its funny how history repeats itself. we are a nation of resource hogs.. i luv my suv, air conditioner, and movies on demand. just admit it folks we come up with any reason to "help" someone to make sure are living standards are maintained
and we wonder why our image is tarnished when we go abroad. its thanks to the trailer trash who happen to have a big voice with little education to back things up.
peacfull coexsistance.
gBA
b-bye
only in america (and I love this place) can a government be anti abortion but pro war, so lets not suggest that our religious values are better than any one elses cause they are just as contradictory
oh, and don't get me started with the wtc. who decided to wipe out all the native americans on this land of "ours"... wasn't some muslim thats for sure.
laateedaa i'm american and I only focus on the truth when its convienant. its funny how history repeats itself. we are a nation of resource hogs.. i luv my suv, air conditioner, and movies on demand. just admit it folks we come up with any reason to "help" someone to make sure are living standards are maintained
and we wonder why our image is tarnished when we go abroad. its thanks to the trailer trash who happen to have a big voice with little education to back things up.
peacfull coexsistance.
gBA
b-bye
Posted by: hillbilly bob at August 20, 2006 12:25 AM (3Vhvu)
65
hillbilly bob, I'm not an American-- (unless you count thinking like an American, admiring America and valuing freedom--but just being born in the wrong place as "American")--but your view of America is no better than that of most of the Arab world.
You don't bloody well DESERVE to be American.
America has brought more freedom, more prosperity and more hope to the world than any other country in history.
Sure, it's not perfect. Just effing miles ahead of any other.
You don't bloody well DESERVE to be American.
America has brought more freedom, more prosperity and more hope to the world than any other country in history.
Sure, it's not perfect. Just effing miles ahead of any other.
Posted by: Keith at August 20, 2006 12:36 AM (gofp3)
66
Greyrooster... I know you're no spring chicken- I don't hope to change your mind or heart, as I am sure you are quite set in your ways that have served you well to this point in your life. And I don't want to spend time arguing matters of race with an old racist on the internet.
But I also don't want to have someone on my side of an argument about a court decision that affects national security who starts screaming about "the blacks this" and "my white pride that". It is critical that we convince as many people as we can that we are correct. Your old racist heart may never change, but there are many people that will listen to persuasive arguments and take the words to heart and maybe change their mind.
If you aren't a liberal plant to make us look bad, then please argue for their side with all your racism intact, but supporting their liberal self hating positions. It will really help out the conservative cause.
There are ethnic groups, but only one race. The Human Race.
But I also don't want to have someone on my side of an argument about a court decision that affects national security who starts screaming about "the blacks this" and "my white pride that". It is critical that we convince as many people as we can that we are correct. Your old racist heart may never change, but there are many people that will listen to persuasive arguments and take the words to heart and maybe change their mind.
If you aren't a liberal plant to make us look bad, then please argue for their side with all your racism intact, but supporting their liberal self hating positions. It will really help out the conservative cause.
There are ethnic groups, but only one race. The Human Race.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 12:37 AM (LoKA7)
67
hillbilly bob, you got a little bit of self loathing going on there. Maybe you get some Jesus and you could forgive yourself.
There is a clear difference between the war on the unborn, and the war on terrorisim. You hold the two up so as to mock the position as mutually unteneable, but the oposite is true also. I bet you are against the war on terror, but are for killing as many babies in the name of "choice" as need be.
There is a clear difference between the war on the unborn, and the war on terrorisim. You hold the two up so as to mock the position as mutually unteneable, but the oposite is true also. I bet you are against the war on terror, but are for killing as many babies in the name of "choice" as need be.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 12:49 AM (LoKA7)
68
poor poor billybob
Boy's ashamed of being American - you could always move abroad. Interesting topic - note you don't have any specific comment on it.
A lots written here - no apparent indication of lil' education - quite the opposite in fact - Oh sorry! - typical response from you and your to all others that don't seem to share your believes - what is it? - a shared genetic thing among yours - like Gattaca - are you a Gattaca baby - and we lowly normals? That's OK - I like being normal - especially when your offered as an alternative.
It's cool - not a problem. You see - we inhabit the same continent, use the same currency, and speak the same primary language. But - we are alien to each other - I don't care about you and yours - and you don't care about me or mine. I can live with that.
You know - I have absolutely no problem if one day you and yours decide to establish your own lil' enclave - a nation - a world unto your own designed as you see fit. we could easily go our seperate ways peaceably - foreigners in a once same land. Hell - we are already more than half-way there!
You can be truly free of we trailerpark trash! Not fight in our wars nor we defend you in yours - and you can vacuum out your girlfriend or wife or whatever to your hearts delight. I wouldn't care.
Boy's ashamed of being American - you could always move abroad. Interesting topic - note you don't have any specific comment on it.
A lots written here - no apparent indication of lil' education - quite the opposite in fact - Oh sorry! - typical response from you and your to all others that don't seem to share your believes - what is it? - a shared genetic thing among yours - like Gattaca - are you a Gattaca baby - and we lowly normals? That's OK - I like being normal - especially when your offered as an alternative.
It's cool - not a problem. You see - we inhabit the same continent, use the same currency, and speak the same primary language. But - we are alien to each other - I don't care about you and yours - and you don't care about me or mine. I can live with that.
You know - I have absolutely no problem if one day you and yours decide to establish your own lil' enclave - a nation - a world unto your own designed as you see fit. we could easily go our seperate ways peaceably - foreigners in a once same land. Hell - we are already more than half-way there!
You can be truly free of we trailerpark trash! Not fight in our wars nor we defend you in yours - and you can vacuum out your girlfriend or wife or whatever to your hearts delight. I wouldn't care.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 01:01 AM (XrexX)
69
Hmmmmmm?
Topic "What to do with Muslims" by Dr Rusty Shackleford
I have no interest in you vinnie - or any of your topics - I leave you be in peace.
But you like to follow - n' play - so cute.
What's the matter - did I put a couple of holes in some sockpuppets? Notice they can't speak for themselves.
Topic "What to do with Muslims" by Dr Rusty Shackleford
I have no interest in you vinnie - or any of your topics - I leave you be in peace.
But you like to follow - n' play - so cute.
What's the matter - did I put a couple of holes in some sockpuppets? Notice they can't speak for themselves.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 01:10 AM (XrexX)
70
When dealing with Muslims remember one phrase: Al Taqiyya.
As well, until you learn that there is no substantial difference between the goals of a moderate Muslim and a militant Muslim - except for a small matter of timing - you have been completely deceived. In point of fact, you may already be suffering from being subjected to their goal of imposing dhimmitude upon you.
I can well understand most of the cognitive dissonance that people experience in facing this threat, for what must be done in order to defeat this threat is enough to make any civilized man cringe. Additionally, we often project our own values and sensibilities upon them, when in fact their religion and culture is so different from our own as to be absolutely alien.
Several of those commenting here have the right of it. We must kill them before they kill or enslave us all. The entire goal of Islam is to conquer the earth for Allah. Not convert it, conquer it. ...using whatever means are necessary...including befriending the infidels when they, the Muslim believers, are not in positions of power.
The moderate Muslim friends that you know today will tomorrow cut your throat, torture and rape your wife and child and kill your pets, while they shout with joy for being allowed to do such a good work for Allah.
Until you understand this, you know nothing at all about Islam or about the threat that we face.
Knowing what must be done makes my gut churn...but it must be done. Knowing that most Americans think that there is such a thing as a moderate Muslim frightens me, for such blind ignorance will get us all killed, and will destroy this nation forever.
As well, until you learn that there is no substantial difference between the goals of a moderate Muslim and a militant Muslim - except for a small matter of timing - you have been completely deceived. In point of fact, you may already be suffering from being subjected to their goal of imposing dhimmitude upon you.
I can well understand most of the cognitive dissonance that people experience in facing this threat, for what must be done in order to defeat this threat is enough to make any civilized man cringe. Additionally, we often project our own values and sensibilities upon them, when in fact their religion and culture is so different from our own as to be absolutely alien.
Several of those commenting here have the right of it. We must kill them before they kill or enslave us all. The entire goal of Islam is to conquer the earth for Allah. Not convert it, conquer it. ...using whatever means are necessary...including befriending the infidels when they, the Muslim believers, are not in positions of power.
The moderate Muslim friends that you know today will tomorrow cut your throat, torture and rape your wife and child and kill your pets, while they shout with joy for being allowed to do such a good work for Allah.
Until you understand this, you know nothing at all about Islam or about the threat that we face.
Knowing what must be done makes my gut churn...but it must be done. Knowing that most Americans think that there is such a thing as a moderate Muslim frightens me, for such blind ignorance will get us all killed, and will destroy this nation forever.
Posted by: Warren Bonesteel at August 20, 2006 01:20 AM (FshOV)
71
Gee, maybe they found better things to do than read your tripe?
Like I've been doing, and am going to do again, right now.
Feel free to be a legend in your own mind.
I am HONDO! Look at MEEEEE! I can comment at the Jawa Report!!!!
Take THAT! Sam Walton. And Bill Gates. And Warren Buffet.
Of course, you missed, as usual, the relevant part of Rusty's post. Key word: practical.
And before you snark about sock puppets, bear in mind that you don't have a login to compare IP addresses, but others do. Retard.
Nite nite, dork.
Like I've been doing, and am going to do again, right now.
Feel free to be a legend in your own mind.
I am HONDO! Look at MEEEEE! I can comment at the Jawa Report!!!!
Take THAT! Sam Walton. And Bill Gates. And Warren Buffet.
Of course, you missed, as usual, the relevant part of Rusty's post. Key word: practical.
And before you snark about sock puppets, bear in mind that you don't have a login to compare IP addresses, but others do. Retard.
Nite nite, dork.
Posted by: Vinnie - Editor In Chief at August 20, 2006 01:27 AM (/qy9A)
72
And rusty has my phone number - ask him - and give me a call. I'm taking bets you have a high pitch squeeky voice.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 01:35 AM (XrexX)
73
I agree with Rusty. What is the solution? Nuke em? Yeah that's our way; no. Bomb them with tulips and love? Well that will not work either. It's not the people; it's the hate that Islam breeds quicker than rabbits. And it has been around for more than 1400 hundred years; so a easy solution is no where in the offing. Isolate them? Concentration camps come to mind there. I'm no LLL moonbate either. All this hate. So we hate too; that is the answer? Hate defeats hate? No it begets a bloodbath. Fight fire with fire? I have found water is the most effective way to kill a fire. So far all our money we give them; doesn't work. All our education we give them; doesn't work. Our hand in peace; doesn't work. Our forgiveness; doesn't work. Military actions don't work; they want to die for allah, they want to have their women and children die for allah. There has to be another way. First by people acknowledging that it is not a religion of peace and it really isn't a religion.
The U.S. and the Western nations in general NEED TO KNOW WHAT ISLAM IS ALL ABOUT. That is the first and foremost step. Yet I don't see that happening completely either. They bury their heads in the sand and say "it is a religion so it must be peaceful". Not.
We also have to stop conceding to their demands, stop saying sorry when we have done nothing wrong. Say no to their wanting to transform the West into Islam. I say transform; because to say convert means there is some willingness on our part.
Rusty I agree it is a problem; of the likes never seen before.
The U.S. and the Western nations in general NEED TO KNOW WHAT ISLAM IS ALL ABOUT. That is the first and foremost step. Yet I don't see that happening completely either. They bury their heads in the sand and say "it is a religion so it must be peaceful". Not.
We also have to stop conceding to their demands, stop saying sorry when we have done nothing wrong. Say no to their wanting to transform the West into Islam. I say transform; because to say convert means there is some willingness on our part.
Rusty I agree it is a problem; of the likes never seen before.
Posted by: littlesue at August 20, 2006 02:40 AM (kLIJZ)
74
Before 9/11 muslims/islam had never even entered into my thoughts, I knew the words muslim and islam but that was the extent of my thoughts about them/it. Then within that week there was someone, probably OBL, spouting that they love death as much as we love life. That shocked me but then I came to the conclusion that if they want to die and be martyrs then why do they whine and bitch when someone sends them to meet allah, surely if they love death and maryrdom then they should all congregate somewhere and let someone send them on their way. That would be a win win situation for everyone, they get to be martyrs and we get to relax and not have to deal with them anymore.
I think the only way this is ever going to be settled is when we produce alternatives to oil, synthetic fuel is a huge step but pretty much every chemical, product whatever uses oil in its manufacture. So we find a new way to do this, we have no use for their oil and we make it cheaply enough so the likes of China etc buy our new improved fake oil instead of buying arab oil. We should also stop with the sharing of our technology, cut them off from the net, from radio and tv broadcasting, every single piece of technology should be barred from being sold to them. They have only become a threat since the west helped them up from the sand and mud huts. They use the fruits of our open society to attack us. Churchill said it right when he mentioned that the only thing that stopped islam from taking over the world was our superior technology, so stop fricking giving them the tools to kill us.
We could then leave them to wither on the vine, just like the japanese soldiers that were just left on the islands of the pacific to starve. That would deal with the enemy on the outside but then we are left with the enemy within. The only way they can be dealt with is either repatriation, internment or being made to relinquish their cult membership, though you would have to be very aware of taqiyya when they are renouncing their cult.
As for nuking mecca or whatever, if that was the choice our leaders made then they have my support, I can honestly say it would not bother me one single bit, I might even cheer in the street the way muslims did on 9/11. That actually sounds harsh but really their loss wouldnt bother me in the slightest, the same way as I dont give a f*ck about Dresden or Hiroshima. I just want to go back to the way I was on 10th sep 2001, when islam didnt even exist on my radar and if it means they all have to go for me to feel like that again then please someone send them on their way.
I think the only way this is ever going to be settled is when we produce alternatives to oil, synthetic fuel is a huge step but pretty much every chemical, product whatever uses oil in its manufacture. So we find a new way to do this, we have no use for their oil and we make it cheaply enough so the likes of China etc buy our new improved fake oil instead of buying arab oil. We should also stop with the sharing of our technology, cut them off from the net, from radio and tv broadcasting, every single piece of technology should be barred from being sold to them. They have only become a threat since the west helped them up from the sand and mud huts. They use the fruits of our open society to attack us. Churchill said it right when he mentioned that the only thing that stopped islam from taking over the world was our superior technology, so stop fricking giving them the tools to kill us.
We could then leave them to wither on the vine, just like the japanese soldiers that were just left on the islands of the pacific to starve. That would deal with the enemy on the outside but then we are left with the enemy within. The only way they can be dealt with is either repatriation, internment or being made to relinquish their cult membership, though you would have to be very aware of taqiyya when they are renouncing their cult.
As for nuking mecca or whatever, if that was the choice our leaders made then they have my support, I can honestly say it would not bother me one single bit, I might even cheer in the street the way muslims did on 9/11. That actually sounds harsh but really their loss wouldnt bother me in the slightest, the same way as I dont give a f*ck about Dresden or Hiroshima. I just want to go back to the way I was on 10th sep 2001, when islam didnt even exist on my radar and if it means they all have to go for me to feel like that again then please someone send them on their way.
Posted by: dave Clarke at August 20, 2006 04:51 AM (0Me5q)
75
So Vinnie, do you have to practice at being a prick, or does it come naturally?
Rusty, what the hell are you thinking letting this asshole have any control over your blog?
Rusty, what the hell are you thinking letting this asshole have any control over your blog?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 20, 2006 06:55 AM (v3I+x)
76
self loathing what the hell is that?? can you not read. and hondo you illegitament after thought, this Gattaca you speak of already exists its called the "haves and have nots".
as for your special little place for a foreigner free america i suppose that would work if we started to mass produce exponentualy to make up for the void in tax reveune shortfall that would occur without the foreingers you speak of....gosh.
I'm for a safe america. can you imagine the security we'd have if we stoppped the war machine abroad for one day. If homeland security had a days budget from the "war on terror" this place would be Fort Knox. But that doesn't put money in the hands of various Haliburton share holders does it.
anywho, i got some gaming to do and some tv to watch.
as for your special little place for a foreigner free america i suppose that would work if we started to mass produce exponentualy to make up for the void in tax reveune shortfall that would occur without the foreingers you speak of....gosh.
I'm for a safe america. can you imagine the security we'd have if we stoppped the war machine abroad for one day. If homeland security had a days budget from the "war on terror" this place would be Fort Knox. But that doesn't put money in the hands of various Haliburton share holders does it.
anywho, i got some gaming to do and some tv to watch.
Posted by: hillbilly bob at August 20, 2006 06:57 AM (3Vhvu)
77
You could title this article "What to do about Christians" and say the same things.
Posted by: idyll at August 20, 2006 07:53 AM (FanxS)
78
QC: What the hell you talking about. You're the newbe here. You've got a long way to go before you're one of we.
If any of my comment posts are not factual. Point them out. Until you can. Then you, not I are the one doing harm to the cause. Your calls of racism are no different than the liberals on the dark side. Either disprove my comments or continue your path to liberalism.
If any of my comment posts are not factual. Point them out. Until you can. Then you, not I are the one doing harm to the cause. Your calls of racism are no different than the liberals on the dark side. Either disprove my comments or continue your path to liberalism.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 08:04 AM (FTx5X)
79
Of course we could idyll, because everyone can see that Christians are hijacking airliners and murdering girls for getting raped. You are a fucking idiot and deserve to die with the rest of the scum.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 20, 2006 08:10 AM (v3I+x)
80
Hillbilly Bob: Who the hell you talking about with this (old hat) American Indian thing? My ancestors, your ancestors, the Indians ancestors, our ancestors? Just who do you mean is quilty of these evil things? Or are you just spinning your liberal bone head in circles.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 08:10 AM (FTx5X)
81
I do agree with the majority on one issue. Vinnie is a prick.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 08:13 AM (FTx5X)
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 08:33 AM (rUyw4)
83
I think Vinnie must be off his meds.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 08:35 AM (rUyw4)
84
The same retards that blame America and the west for using the majority of the worlds resources now say we are not the world. Can't have it both ways. Sooner or later, the world goes as America goes. Good and the bad.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 09:24 AM (FTx5X)
85
Mehr: Keith wants to buy you a beer. I want to kick your lowlife Iranian ass. Careful Keith may be baiting you and wish to kick your ass to.
I still don't trust you. I still believe you're a schill whose purpose is to take the heat off the real enemy. Iran.
Our tracker is back at school. When he's not busy I'll see about a hunting trip to Canada. I here the hunting is real good up there.
I still don't trust you. I still believe you're a schill whose purpose is to take the heat off the real enemy. Iran.
Our tracker is back at school. When he's not busy I'll see about a hunting trip to Canada. I here the hunting is real good up there.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 09:33 AM (FTx5X)
86
Upon reading these comments in a more sober light, I must retract my cheers for hondo. I supported you only in that I thought you and Rusty seemed able to have a decent conversation on a political topic with very extreme views yet behave in a civilized manner, without resorting to namecalling or demands that we "nuke the effing ragheads" as it were. I stand corrected.
Posted by: Tony at August 20, 2006 09:37 AM (e0qru)
87
QC: You never would have hacked it in the Marine Corps.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 09:37 AM (FTx5X)
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 09:39 AM (+nlyI)
89
One thing which could be done is to treat Islam as a political institution rather than a religion and to remove any tax exempt status that they may have. Require regular reporting of any contributions just as any other political party must do.
In conjunction with that, after they lose their religious status, we could assign them the same status as the KKK or other organizations like that and closely monitor their activities in the same manner.
In conjunction with that, after they lose their religious status, we could assign them the same status as the KKK or other organizations like that and closely monitor their activities in the same manner.
Posted by: George at August 20, 2006 09:46 AM (zV8vN)
90
I as an American bear no shame for what my predecessors had to do to make this country great.
I wasn't drinking last night. That was for Hondo.
Rusty's dilema is much like what many of our reletives had to go through in WW2. It is different these days however, because unlike WW2 where you could tell a Japanese person apart, many times you will know a person is a muslem because they told you in confidence. To then be biased against them for a religion goes against the first amendment.
However, the burden is not upon us to vindicate their religion. Our burden is to protect our borders and all land between. And to watch our neighbors back.
I wasn't drinking last night. That was for Hondo.
Rusty's dilema is much like what many of our reletives had to go through in WW2. It is different these days however, because unlike WW2 where you could tell a Japanese person apart, many times you will know a person is a muslem because they told you in confidence. To then be biased against them for a religion goes against the first amendment.
However, the burden is not upon us to vindicate their religion. Our burden is to protect our borders and all land between. And to watch our neighbors back.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 20, 2006 10:30 AM (n4VvM)
91
Support those commies like the PFLP. They're not so anti-semetic. And they have a good plan for the Palestinian economy. Socialism works for a developing 3rd world country.
Posted by: Some Dude at August 20, 2006 10:35 AM (Iq9PC)
92
Greyrooster, do you not see where a liberal would pose as a conservative with a racist heart, in order to drive as many people away from the conservative view as possible?... to attempt to have the conservative points hidden by the stench of racisim- driving away those on the fence of an issue to the liberal side?
You certainly do see this possibility, because either you are exactly what I am describing, or you have had social contact where the relationship was changed or ended because they were so turned off by the racisim.
QC may be new here, but sometimes people change their names... especially on a blog that takes on the enemies of freedom in such an in your face manner.
You certainly do see this possibility, because either you are exactly what I am describing, or you have had social contact where the relationship was changed or ended because they were so turned off by the racisim.
QC may be new here, but sometimes people change their names... especially on a blog that takes on the enemies of freedom in such an in your face manner.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 11:08 AM (LoKA7)
93
QC (or Hondo or whomever you are),
I think QB would be a better name for you.
Go off with Sully and sculk.
I think QB would be a better name for you.
Go off with Sully and sculk.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 11:20 AM (+nlyI)
94
Lost a comment I posted. Not sure what happened to it. Outside of sending all muslems to Mecca and then nuking the place, what has everyone else done about relationships with muslem friends, and co-workers? I know after thinking about it for a few minutes, I realize I don't speak with them much any longer. But I also realize, they don't speak with me much. And so is the way it will probably go.
Another thing, whether a person comes here the first time, or if it is their 100th time, there is no code of behavior for newbies of anyone of us who are here regularly. Say what you want when you want to.
Another thing, whether a person comes here the first time, or if it is their 100th time, there is no code of behavior for newbies of anyone of us who are here regularly. Say what you want when you want to.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 20, 2006 11:23 AM (n4VvM)
95
Darth Vag, I would take QB as a compliment, but I don't get "Go off with Sully and sculk"... it doesn't sound like a compliment though.
I aint Hondo- I am only me. My old name was long ago- only one name at a time.
I aint Hondo- I am only me. My old name was long ago- only one name at a time.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 11:27 AM (LoKA7)
96
My apologies, QC. I assumed you might be Hondo the booted, passive isolationist neoliberal after you wrote about changing your name.
I proved what Squiggie said on Laverne and Shirley "when you assume you make an ass out of u and me."
I proved what Squiggie said on Laverne and Shirley "when you assume you make an ass out of u and me."
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 12:10 PM (+nlyI)
97
Darth Vag
Your a funny guy! You write but you don't bother to read - that's OK. Yes everyone! - hondo is a passive isolationist neo-liberal. we know this because Darth Vag says so - and when Darth Vag speaks ....
So - Squigglie is your philosopher of choice - interesting depth.
Your a funny guy! You write but you don't bother to read - that's OK. Yes everyone! - hondo is a passive isolationist neo-liberal. we know this because Darth Vag says so - and when Darth Vag speaks ....
So - Squigglie is your philosopher of choice - interesting depth.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 12:23 PM (XrexX)
98
I like most people here and I'm sorry to see those who once talked kindly of and to each other begin to snipe at each other. I almost always agree with Hondo, but I agree more with SeeMonk on this one. Isolationism isn't the answer. Isolating ourselves OR isolating them. Because it is, in fact, a liberal point (even though they've "re-framed" the issue so it doesn't sound like it) and THAT should be the first clue that it's the wrong answer to the problem.
You can't isolate them because any small remnants of hope for democracy there will wither and die and they'll fester and breed and will soon flood across their borders in conquest again. Look how they kept to themselves for so long and the rest of the world ignored them - and now look at what has grown there out of neglect. It would only postpone the inevitable.
And we can't isolate ourselves because like it or not we need the world as much as they need us.
Do you really think that countries like India, which are democratic, could withstand the onslaught of the vast Muslim population within her borders at the prospect of being expelled? How would even Great Britain fare without becoming a police state? France would fall first - no doubt. The whole of the African continent - lost. Spain - done. Sweden, Denmark, even our neighbor, Canada, would suffer greatly. China and Russia would play both sides. That other democracies would be on our side is wishful thinking. Some of those democracies are very fragile and others will just not be willing to help maintain any isolation perimeter. How many helped us even maintain a zone around Iraq?
No, the whole world would sit back and watch us do all the dirty work while they criticize and subvert. We've already seen it in action.
You can't isolate them because any small remnants of hope for democracy there will wither and die and they'll fester and breed and will soon flood across their borders in conquest again. Look how they kept to themselves for so long and the rest of the world ignored them - and now look at what has grown there out of neglect. It would only postpone the inevitable.
And we can't isolate ourselves because like it or not we need the world as much as they need us.
Do you really think that countries like India, which are democratic, could withstand the onslaught of the vast Muslim population within her borders at the prospect of being expelled? How would even Great Britain fare without becoming a police state? France would fall first - no doubt. The whole of the African continent - lost. Spain - done. Sweden, Denmark, even our neighbor, Canada, would suffer greatly. China and Russia would play both sides. That other democracies would be on our side is wishful thinking. Some of those democracies are very fragile and others will just not be willing to help maintain any isolation perimeter. How many helped us even maintain a zone around Iraq?
No, the whole world would sit back and watch us do all the dirty work while they criticize and subvert. We've already seen it in action.
Posted by: Oyster at August 20, 2006 12:55 PM (YudAC)
99
Islam by itself is just a religion. All religions do start out as cults, but when a religion gets too powerful, then secterianism is sure to follow. It is the murderers that claim to do the work of their God that are the true culprits, so not every follower of a reliogion is violent.
If you want to stop terrorism, go after the intelligence services that spawns these terrorist organizations. I suggest before bashing Muslims in general, look at the father of Taliban and Osama's mercenaries, the Inter-Services Intelligence. If you ask me, the ISI and its militants are behind the terror attacks in Kashmir and in Pakistan. Without intelligence organizations, these terror groups would not exist. Check out this article.
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1743608,001302390000.htm
If you want to stop terrorism, go after the intelligence services that spawns these terrorist organizations. I suggest before bashing Muslims in general, look at the father of Taliban and Osama's mercenaries, the Inter-Services Intelligence. If you ask me, the ISI and its militants are behind the terror attacks in Kashmir and in Pakistan. Without intelligence organizations, these terror groups would not exist. Check out this article.
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1743608,001302390000.htm
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 20, 2006 12:58 PM (A9Xiy)
100
And just for the record, I like Hondo and I don't think he's a neo-liberal or an isolationist. He was only putting forth an idea. I think it's a bad idea, but hey ;-) does that mean I should reject him entirely because he has a disagreement with me or someone else? Just because I haven't commented here much lately doesn't mean I'm not reading. I've watched a gang mentality evolve here recently and I'm not going to point fingers, but it's uncomfortable to read the words of two different people that are essentially saying the same thing and see who defends which of them.
Posted by: Oyster at August 20, 2006 01:00 PM (YudAC)
101
Tony
The topic thread is simple - "What to do with muslims", but reality is far more difficult. It doesn't really lend itself to any truly viable and practical solution. Rusty and I can delve into and meet your creteria for decent conversation - but only for awhile till the calls for "kill them all and let god sort it out" arise - out of purely subconscious frustation.
The is no answer - you simply run with the topic - give up attempting to be philosphical and enlightening - and then enjoy the blog as a meeting place akin to a neighborhood bar.
I view isolation - the isolation of them - as a desireable alternative - but I know its really not a viable alternative.
The only real solution is between the muslims themselves - without outside interference or direction. (I will not seriously entertain extermination as a solution to human problems of interaction.)
There is a saying - time heals all wounds - but even there - muslim concept of time is soooo skewered.
I don't know Tony - I have no answer.
Darth says you got the hots for me - I think he's jealous. It's a Bar Tony - just relax, have a drink, and watch the ballgame.
The topic thread is simple - "What to do with muslims", but reality is far more difficult. It doesn't really lend itself to any truly viable and practical solution. Rusty and I can delve into and meet your creteria for decent conversation - but only for awhile till the calls for "kill them all and let god sort it out" arise - out of purely subconscious frustation.
The is no answer - you simply run with the topic - give up attempting to be philosphical and enlightening - and then enjoy the blog as a meeting place akin to a neighborhood bar.
I view isolation - the isolation of them - as a desireable alternative - but I know its really not a viable alternative.
The only real solution is between the muslims themselves - without outside interference or direction. (I will not seriously entertain extermination as a solution to human problems of interaction.)
There is a saying - time heals all wounds - but even there - muslim concept of time is soooo skewered.
I don't know Tony - I have no answer.
Darth says you got the hots for me - I think he's jealous. It's a Bar Tony - just relax, have a drink, and watch the ballgame.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 01:03 PM (XrexX)
102
Oyster
Good to have you back - don't be a stranger! And your right - my version of frustration with the issue is speaking. Difficult topic - isn't it?
Good to have you back - don't be a stranger! And your right - my version of frustration with the issue is speaking. Difficult topic - isn't it?
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 01:09 PM (XrexX)
103
The answer is simple - we have to treat radical Islam and Islamic countries (i.e. Iran, Syria, and maybe a few others) the same way we treated Japan in WWII. Jihad is "holy war". It's a WAR! America then was dealing with a rigid ideology that valued the destruction of the west over its own lives, much like the ideology it is dealing with now. I'm sure there were a lot of really great Japanese individuals in the USA at the time, but what was done (internment, the bomb, etc.) had to be done and, in the long haul, lowered the death count and did not significantly impair the relationship between Japan and America.
If anything, radical Islam is a lot more dangerous because of its incredible dispersion and trans-nationalism. I know some Muslims who are great people too, but we don't talk about politics. I have a feeling that relations might be less amicable if Israel was a common topic of discussion. And when you see statistics like only 7% of British Muslims consider themselves primarily British, it's a good indication of where their real loyalties would lie in an all-out war. I'm not sure what the statistic is in the U.S., but I think that Japanese in WWII tended to be much better assimilated than Muslims are today.
Imposing severe restrictions on immigration and travel from jihad-supporting Muslim countries is not tantamount to isolationism. There are hundreds of other countries America trades with and takes immigrants from every day. Isolationism is not a liberal position either - there are "open-borders" activists on both sides, but probably a lot more on the left.
Seal the borders with those countries, fight the war, then open the borders again. Don't allow unrestricted travel and immigration with countries that are actively trying to destroy yours. You can't apply peacetime principles in wartime, and denying that there is a war is only going to raise the body count at home.
All you can do as an individual is to cast your vote, educate the uneducated, and do your part in dismantling the identity politics that permits violent ideologies free reign.
If anything, radical Islam is a lot more dangerous because of its incredible dispersion and trans-nationalism. I know some Muslims who are great people too, but we don't talk about politics. I have a feeling that relations might be less amicable if Israel was a common topic of discussion. And when you see statistics like only 7% of British Muslims consider themselves primarily British, it's a good indication of where their real loyalties would lie in an all-out war. I'm not sure what the statistic is in the U.S., but I think that Japanese in WWII tended to be much better assimilated than Muslims are today.
Imposing severe restrictions on immigration and travel from jihad-supporting Muslim countries is not tantamount to isolationism. There are hundreds of other countries America trades with and takes immigrants from every day. Isolationism is not a liberal position either - there are "open-borders" activists on both sides, but probably a lot more on the left.
Seal the borders with those countries, fight the war, then open the borders again. Don't allow unrestricted travel and immigration with countries that are actively trying to destroy yours. You can't apply peacetime principles in wartime, and denying that there is a war is only going to raise the body count at home.
All you can do as an individual is to cast your vote, educate the uneducated, and do your part in dismantling the identity politics that permits violent ideologies free reign.
Posted by: Aaron G at August 20, 2006 01:20 PM (1xiB4)
104
Hondo: a homoerotic Louis L'Amour tale only partially redeemed by the presence of John Wayne in the film.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 01:33 PM (+nlyI)
105
George (comment 89 above),
I think your idea is one of the most practical of the lot while being the least morally objectionable. Yes, there is no reason why a democracy should abide someone who is out to destroy it.
Nevertheless your idea only addresses dealing with Muslims living within democracies. The issue of the Muslim world's virtual monopoly of oil combined with its desire to fund, manufacture and export terrorism must also be addressed.
I think your idea is one of the most practical of the lot while being the least morally objectionable. Yes, there is no reason why a democracy should abide someone who is out to destroy it.
Nevertheless your idea only addresses dealing with Muslims living within democracies. The issue of the Muslim world's virtual monopoly of oil combined with its desire to fund, manufacture and export terrorism must also be addressed.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 01:37 PM (Bp6wV)
106
Vinnie,
Thank you very much.
Darth Vag,
I'm pleased to meet you.
Keith, thank you for the offer of the beer :-)
You take care my friend.
Thank you very much.
Darth Vag,
I'm pleased to meet you.
Keith, thank you for the offer of the beer :-)
You take care my friend.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 01:40 PM (Bp6wV)
107
billybob my boy!
There were actually 3 cryptic references in my comment to you. You obviously picked up Gattaca (but then again - it was a pop culture film). You did however miss the meaning of the eugenics aspect of it, as it refers to the lib/left propensity for assuming intellectual, social and moral superiority based on some inherent genetic quality (which of course, remains subjective and questionable).
Yes! billy boy - I am trailer park trash (proudly). It is amazing what a 6th grade education and Classic Commics can achieve! Interestingly enough - in the film - we were also referred to as a God Child - I kinda like that.
The other crypto-references were to "Stranger In A Strange Land" and "The Stranger" - both dealing with a special kind of alienation that we share (strange choice of words) between each other - and you with most on this blog here.
The foreigner in question - is you ... and I in relationship (or lack of) with you. We inhabit the same land - but that is about it.
We have no interest in each other, and hopefully one day, we can formalize our physical separation - all other creteria of separation have already been met.
lib/left ideology is obligatory - requiring no substansive thought beyond how it makes you feel. It is popular with the young due to it's ease of wear. It is also quite shallow and superficial - since it is a fashion to be worn.
Anarchistmanifesto (Ana) is a classic example. He defines himself by the names he references - "I am what they are". Quite empty and sad actually.
Point is - we are mutually indifferent to each other. You have no meaning in my life - as I in yours - save for your attempts at intrusion which are designed solely to reinforce your own self-image about yourself.
There were actually 3 cryptic references in my comment to you. You obviously picked up Gattaca (but then again - it was a pop culture film). You did however miss the meaning of the eugenics aspect of it, as it refers to the lib/left propensity for assuming intellectual, social and moral superiority based on some inherent genetic quality (which of course, remains subjective and questionable).
Yes! billy boy - I am trailer park trash (proudly). It is amazing what a 6th grade education and Classic Commics can achieve! Interestingly enough - in the film - we were also referred to as a God Child - I kinda like that.
The other crypto-references were to "Stranger In A Strange Land" and "The Stranger" - both dealing with a special kind of alienation that we share (strange choice of words) between each other - and you with most on this blog here.
The foreigner in question - is you ... and I in relationship (or lack of) with you. We inhabit the same land - but that is about it.
We have no interest in each other, and hopefully one day, we can formalize our physical separation - all other creteria of separation have already been met.
lib/left ideology is obligatory - requiring no substansive thought beyond how it makes you feel. It is popular with the young due to it's ease of wear. It is also quite shallow and superficial - since it is a fashion to be worn.
Anarchistmanifesto (Ana) is a classic example. He defines himself by the names he references - "I am what they are". Quite empty and sad actually.
Point is - we are mutually indifferent to each other. You have no meaning in my life - as I in yours - save for your attempts at intrusion which are designed solely to reinforce your own self-image about yourself.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 02:01 PM (XrexX)
108
The islamic problem won't go easy. Neither did the Japanese Empire or Nazi Germany. But in the end they did go, because they were totally and utterly defeated on the battlefield. In WWII, both in Europe and the Pacific, we finally made continuing the war too costly for the enemy, and the enemy caved.
But back then, the enemy had uniforms and military installations and their vehicles and planes had recognizable insignia. Today's islamic terrorists have none of these. They hide within the civilian population, like a parasite inside the host.
Attack the host. One of two things will happen. The host will expel the parasite, or will die along with it.
But back then, the enemy had uniforms and military installations and their vehicles and planes had recognizable insignia. Today's islamic terrorists have none of these. They hide within the civilian population, like a parasite inside the host.
Attack the host. One of two things will happen. The host will expel the parasite, or will die along with it.
Posted by: Barry at August 20, 2006 02:03 PM (kKjaJ)
109
I don't you hondo and you don't know me. How do you know who will "win" this war? I have a prediction: neither radical Islamic fundamentalists, neoliberals or the neocons will win.
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 20, 2006 02:20 PM (A9Xiy)
110
Oyster: I believe you're wrong. I see mass deportations as the only long term answer. Outlaw Islam and islamics in America. Other nations can and will make up their own minds. As with light bulbs, automobliles, airplanes and blue jeans. We show that it can be done and they all follow. Actually, it's just that simple.
QC: All I can say is you are a liar.
George: Not a bad idea.
Tony: Don't give up the ship. We used to act differently. That is before the liberals started name calling, blameing our president for the price of eggs in Korea and other such crap. Calling our troops baby killers, etc. We just started attacking back. With my personal racist views I am constantly attacked by those who cry when I attack back. I guess many of us are just tired of taking shit from idiot liberals and others.
I have noticed that the resident racist (me) has never called for the nukeing of anyone.
QC: All I can say is you are a liar.
George: Not a bad idea.
Tony: Don't give up the ship. We used to act differently. That is before the liberals started name calling, blameing our president for the price of eggs in Korea and other such crap. Calling our troops baby killers, etc. We just started attacking back. With my personal racist views I am constantly attacked by those who cry when I attack back. I guess many of us are just tired of taking shit from idiot liberals and others.
I have noticed that the resident racist (me) has never called for the nukeing of anyone.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 02:31 PM (kmZZC)
111
You do have a point, hondo. My fear is that radicalism will just become a fashion trend for people of all ages instead of working towards a better world. What is the point of having all the gifts of technology at our disposal while most of the world has none? We humans can not afford to be too affluent. The problem we face is not ideology, but each other. As humans, we fear and revolt one another, causing us to kill one another. By standards of civilization, we humans always have been truly primitive. If you look at the organization of other species, you will find their social structures are just as similar to ours.
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 20, 2006 02:33 PM (A9Xiy)
112
"I have noticed that the resident racist (me) has never called for the nuking of anyone"
That is rather strange, grayrooster. After all the crazy news I've read up on, nothing surprises me anymore. I have one more thing to say, most of the people I hang out with are at most moderate liberals. Most peopel I now are conservatives. Then again, aren't conseratives just yesterday's liberals?
That is rather strange, grayrooster. After all the crazy news I've read up on, nothing surprises me anymore. I have one more thing to say, most of the people I hang out with are at most moderate liberals. Most peopel I now are conservatives. Then again, aren't conseratives just yesterday's liberals?
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 20, 2006 02:41 PM (A9Xiy)
113
Darth Vag!
I am truly impressed! One who surmised the true origins of my handle! It was given to me in fact by a MSgt years ago in my first forray into recon.
So - do you view Louie L'Amour as a spinner of 19th/early 20th century homoerotic tales? Interesting take! Many would consider L'Amour's work the definitive classical literary example of "Americana" - though I often found Fenimore's work representing an earlier period containing more depth and passion (which I believe you would interpret as homoeroticism - Hawkeye was in fact a gay carefree wanderer).
I often associate L'Amour with another giant of the period in a different artistic format - Remington. Truly, his majestic paintings epitomized an era of myth and reality that came to be the definitive self-image to many of "Americana". I am curious Darth Vag - do you see gay-orientated themes in the works of Remington also?
Rusty! I am impressed and estatic! And to thing - I thought this just a simple blog akin to a neighborhood bar! Imagine! A discussion on 19th/early 20th century American literature and painting! I love it!
And if this be just a blog/bar, Darth Vag - maybe later you can sit next to me at the bar and discuss Post WW2 American Film Noir circa the late 40s into the 1950s. Fascinating work!
Oh! I can discuss other fields also - particlarly Engineering and Science - with a strong suit towards Civil and Natural Sciences (ie. Geology and Geophysics). We can discuss Alfred Wegener's original work reference Plate Tectonics and Continental Drift - plates sliding, bumping into each other, subduction etc. - very very homoerotic if you are of a mind to read into it - as clearly you are - interesting.
I am truly impressed! One who surmised the true origins of my handle! It was given to me in fact by a MSgt years ago in my first forray into recon.
So - do you view Louie L'Amour as a spinner of 19th/early 20th century homoerotic tales? Interesting take! Many would consider L'Amour's work the definitive classical literary example of "Americana" - though I often found Fenimore's work representing an earlier period containing more depth and passion (which I believe you would interpret as homoeroticism - Hawkeye was in fact a gay carefree wanderer).
I often associate L'Amour with another giant of the period in a different artistic format - Remington. Truly, his majestic paintings epitomized an era of myth and reality that came to be the definitive self-image to many of "Americana". I am curious Darth Vag - do you see gay-orientated themes in the works of Remington also?
Rusty! I am impressed and estatic! And to thing - I thought this just a simple blog akin to a neighborhood bar! Imagine! A discussion on 19th/early 20th century American literature and painting! I love it!
And if this be just a blog/bar, Darth Vag - maybe later you can sit next to me at the bar and discuss Post WW2 American Film Noir circa the late 40s into the 1950s. Fascinating work!
Oh! I can discuss other fields also - particlarly Engineering and Science - with a strong suit towards Civil and Natural Sciences (ie. Geology and Geophysics). We can discuss Alfred Wegener's original work reference Plate Tectonics and Continental Drift - plates sliding, bumping into each other, subduction etc. - very very homoerotic if you are of a mind to read into it - as clearly you are - interesting.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 02:54 PM (XrexX)
114
greyrooster
Yes! I have noticed from the start! A man who truly understands ....
Given all life throws at us - unending problems with no real solutions in sight - with misery, chaos, and conflict abound .... you have discovered the "truth".
A cool breeze, a calm water, a cold beer, and a fine fish on the hook .... and friends who can enjoy the lil' things in life (save for that guy you spoke of). What more can we truly ask for or expect in a screwed up world?
Yes! I have noticed from the start! A man who truly understands ....
Given all life throws at us - unending problems with no real solutions in sight - with misery, chaos, and conflict abound .... you have discovered the "truth".
A cool breeze, a calm water, a cold beer, and a fine fish on the hook .... and friends who can enjoy the lil' things in life (save for that guy you spoke of). What more can we truly ask for or expect in a screwed up world?
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 03:07 PM (XrexX)
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 03:12 PM (XrexX)
116
Rusty,
The "recent UK terror plot"?
Have any of the 21 been charged with a crime?
It's my understanding that they can't be held for longer than the next 5 days unless charges are brought against them.
My take...
This is just another BS story to keep us afraid and to give Bush and Blair a 5% bump in the polls.
Terror plot my ass.
I'm in Europe and will fly home on the 25th. I'm not afraid, I'm pissed because security is going to steal the wine I was going to bring back and drink it for themselves.
Oh yeah...
and the guy who killed the Benet girl is a pedophile so he must be a muslim. Right?
The "recent UK terror plot"?
Have any of the 21 been charged with a crime?
It's my understanding that they can't be held for longer than the next 5 days unless charges are brought against them.
My take...
This is just another BS story to keep us afraid and to give Bush and Blair a 5% bump in the polls.
Terror plot my ass.
I'm in Europe and will fly home on the 25th. I'm not afraid, I'm pissed because security is going to steal the wine I was going to bring back and drink it for themselves.
Oh yeah...
and the guy who killed the Benet girl is a pedophile so he must be a muslim. Right?
Posted by: Greg at August 20, 2006 03:20 PM (EsIlo)
117
Garduneh Mehr,
I agree that my earlier comment would only address some of the problem in Democracies. Other ideas:
1. Create a Manhattan-type project (similar to the one that developed the a-bomb in WWII) to develop alternate energy sources and completely revamp all western economies so that we can minimize the use of oil-based products. It is insane to fund this ideology with our own money.
2. Have governmental, higher education and other organizations sponsor debates and educational forums on Islam so that people can understand what this ideology it truly about.
3. Enlist women's groups to speak out about the demeaning, unequal and unfair treatment of Muslim women.
4. Encourage Muslims to leave Islam by educating them as to it's true nature.
5. Not allow any more mosques to be built in any western societies until churches, synagogues and temples are allowed to be built in Islamic countries. Demand the same freedoms for other religions in Islamic countries that Muslims have in western societies.
6. Tie any further foreign aid to Islamic countries to demonstrable improvement in equal rights for women, freedom of religions other than Islam to gather and worship without harassment, and the revision of Islamic school texts which tout Islamic hatred for non-Muslims.
7. Prosecute Imams and any other Muslims preaching hatred under existing hate speech and inciting violence laws.
8. Closely scrutinize any travel by Muslims into any western society.
9. Educate Muslims as to the true nature of Islam. Most Muslims are not Arabs, don't speak Arabic and don't have a clue what they are reciting during their prayers.
10. Shut down mosques that preach hatred and violence. Quickly deport any Imams that preach this way (let them appeal their deportations from over there, not here).
11. Don't give prisoners or any Muslim a copy of the Qu'ran. This is equivalent to giving a copy of "Mein Kampf" to a nazi.
These are just some ideas. I'm sure there are many more that the readers of this forum can come up with. Interesting discussion.
I agree that my earlier comment would only address some of the problem in Democracies. Other ideas:
1. Create a Manhattan-type project (similar to the one that developed the a-bomb in WWII) to develop alternate energy sources and completely revamp all western economies so that we can minimize the use of oil-based products. It is insane to fund this ideology with our own money.
2. Have governmental, higher education and other organizations sponsor debates and educational forums on Islam so that people can understand what this ideology it truly about.
3. Enlist women's groups to speak out about the demeaning, unequal and unfair treatment of Muslim women.
4. Encourage Muslims to leave Islam by educating them as to it's true nature.
5. Not allow any more mosques to be built in any western societies until churches, synagogues and temples are allowed to be built in Islamic countries. Demand the same freedoms for other religions in Islamic countries that Muslims have in western societies.
6. Tie any further foreign aid to Islamic countries to demonstrable improvement in equal rights for women, freedom of religions other than Islam to gather and worship without harassment, and the revision of Islamic school texts which tout Islamic hatred for non-Muslims.
7. Prosecute Imams and any other Muslims preaching hatred under existing hate speech and inciting violence laws.
8. Closely scrutinize any travel by Muslims into any western society.
9. Educate Muslims as to the true nature of Islam. Most Muslims are not Arabs, don't speak Arabic and don't have a clue what they are reciting during their prayers.
10. Shut down mosques that preach hatred and violence. Quickly deport any Imams that preach this way (let them appeal their deportations from over there, not here).
11. Don't give prisoners or any Muslim a copy of the Qu'ran. This is equivalent to giving a copy of "Mein Kampf" to a nazi.
These are just some ideas. I'm sure there are many more that the readers of this forum can come up with. Interesting discussion.
Posted by: George at August 20, 2006 03:21 PM (zV8vN)
118
Damn, Rooster is starting to make sense. Maybe security should take my wine away.
Mehr is a Jew, by the way.
Mehr is a Jew, by the way.
Posted by: Greg at August 20, 2006 03:36 PM (EsIlo)
119
Ah, hondo, I'm thinking of a cold, crisp fall morn when the leaves are in all the colors of brown, orange, gold, reds, yellows, and purples and the smell of bacon cooking, and the coffee is hot, and the day is beginning, and the quite just before the forest awakes. And that big 10-pointer, the one you have worked so hard to get, and you have outsmarted his pinpoint senses, and he is majestic and beautiful, and you let him walk, just because you want to know that he is still there for next year, for another chance to enjoy life to the fullest. How I love it!
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 04:16 PM (rUyw4)
120
cac, i need a mind map there hondo. to be or not to be, ying and yang, the melting pot i get so confused.
personally, i like "das experiment" or feel good american movies with flags and strutting. that makes me feel good on the inside
personally, i like "das experiment" or feel good american movies with flags and strutting. that makes me feel good on the inside
Posted by: hillbilly bob at August 20, 2006 04:18 PM (3Vhvu)
121
billyboy
Don't worry - you will get better at it when you get older. It does take time. I have a big unfair advantage - normally I don't slip into that aspect of my personna save private disscussion boards designed for denisons of particular fields.
This is a blog/bar - you are welcome - but you will be carded at the door in the future.
If you don't understand - don't worry - there is always tomarrow - and I don't care anyway.
Don't worry - you will get better at it when you get older. It does take time. I have a big unfair advantage - normally I don't slip into that aspect of my personna save private disscussion boards designed for denisons of particular fields.
This is a blog/bar - you are welcome - but you will be carded at the door in the future.
If you don't understand - don't worry - there is always tomarrow - and I don't care anyway.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 04:30 PM (XrexX)
122
JJ
So true - but greyrooster & I know another world ...
Nothing like an isolated quiet beach at dawn watching the sun rise.
Nothing like being with those truly close - far off the coast in late afternoon - and watching the sun slowly fall into the sea against the horizon.
Nothing like late-night adrift as sea - a clear sky beyond imagination filled with stars - interupted only by the streak of those falling to earth - the sounds of silence interupted solely by a distant unseen bell - or the splash in the dark distance reminding you that you are not alone in God's creation ...
Whoa! Getting too poetic here! Got a home - second (when finances work) will be mobile and floats.
So true - but greyrooster & I know another world ...
Nothing like an isolated quiet beach at dawn watching the sun rise.
Nothing like being with those truly close - far off the coast in late afternoon - and watching the sun slowly fall into the sea against the horizon.
Nothing like late-night adrift as sea - a clear sky beyond imagination filled with stars - interupted only by the streak of those falling to earth - the sounds of silence interupted solely by a distant unseen bell - or the splash in the dark distance reminding you that you are not alone in God's creation ...
Whoa! Getting too poetic here! Got a home - second (when finances work) will be mobile and floats.
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 04:46 PM (XrexX)
123
Hondo,
I am surprised you are enamoured with isolation. Although I do suspect some ambiguity in your meaning of isolation! Certainly you don't seem to be of the disposition to remain isolated in the closet.
Or maybe when you refer to isolation, you mean to isolate yourself for fear that others might be exposed to a communicable STD you carry? If you keep your Remington in your pants and avoid shooting it off into someone else, and if others don't oblige you to clean their Remingtons, you might be surprised about how unnecessary pure isolation is.
Your desire to separate yourself from Arabs clearly reveals details about your sexual persona. The fact you abhor hirsute Middle-Eastern men indicates that you are probably a smooth, hairless femme. Your desire to flee from them, without further confrontation, betrays an effiminate twist.
I bet you lisp when you launch into some flamboyant foray over post-WW2 American film noir. Hopefully you tone it down a bit with your earth science colleagues. And no, I don't desire to speak to you about any of your rock formations, or either of your stones.
Anyway, you have revealed yourself to not only be a passive, isolationist neo-liberal, but also gay. A passive gay is a bottom and that is certainly from where you dredge your politics! Gay, liberal and anti-Muslim is nothing new: you are not the first, nor was Pim Fortuyn, but perhaps old-man Gore Vidal was.
Perhaps you can tell us about other gay libs who are anti-Muslim? How about the Franks (Barney and Rich)? Frank-n-Furter?
I am surprised you are enamoured with isolation. Although I do suspect some ambiguity in your meaning of isolation! Certainly you don't seem to be of the disposition to remain isolated in the closet.
Or maybe when you refer to isolation, you mean to isolate yourself for fear that others might be exposed to a communicable STD you carry? If you keep your Remington in your pants and avoid shooting it off into someone else, and if others don't oblige you to clean their Remingtons, you might be surprised about how unnecessary pure isolation is.
Your desire to separate yourself from Arabs clearly reveals details about your sexual persona. The fact you abhor hirsute Middle-Eastern men indicates that you are probably a smooth, hairless femme. Your desire to flee from them, without further confrontation, betrays an effiminate twist.
I bet you lisp when you launch into some flamboyant foray over post-WW2 American film noir. Hopefully you tone it down a bit with your earth science colleagues. And no, I don't desire to speak to you about any of your rock formations, or either of your stones.
Anyway, you have revealed yourself to not only be a passive, isolationist neo-liberal, but also gay. A passive gay is a bottom and that is certainly from where you dredge your politics! Gay, liberal and anti-Muslim is nothing new: you are not the first, nor was Pim Fortuyn, but perhaps old-man Gore Vidal was.
Perhaps you can tell us about other gay libs who are anti-Muslim? How about the Franks (Barney and Rich)? Frank-n-Furter?
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 06:31 PM (+nlyI)
124
wow.. LOL. haven't seen this many responses to any post before. Looks like Rusty hit a nerve.
The trouble is, as someone said earlier, is that islam trumps everything else.. government, friendship, loyalty, love, family, children.. everything. Muslims will say and do anything to fit in until their numbers are great enough to take power. Then the imams will be dictating the actions of the muslim masses. And they will comply because islam trumps all. The only answer really is to get these people out of The West, just like Spain did 500 years ago. It's the same problem today and we need the same solution. And I'm not just talking about the "radicals". They ALL need to get out.
The trouble is, as someone said earlier, is that islam trumps everything else.. government, friendship, loyalty, love, family, children.. everything. Muslims will say and do anything to fit in until their numbers are great enough to take power. Then the imams will be dictating the actions of the muslim masses. And they will comply because islam trumps all. The only answer really is to get these people out of The West, just like Spain did 500 years ago. It's the same problem today and we need the same solution. And I'm not just talking about the "radicals". They ALL need to get out.
Posted by: Richard H. at August 20, 2006 06:37 PM (7KF8r)
125
"Our progress in degeneracy appears to me to be pretty rapid. As a nation, we began by declaring that 'all men are created equal.' We now practically read it 'all men are created equal, except Negroes.' When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read 'all men are created equal, except Negroes and foreigners and Catholics.' When it comes to this, I shall prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty - to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure and without the base alloy of hypocrisy."
-- Abraham Lincoln, Letter to Joshua F. Speed, August 24, 1855
-- Abraham Lincoln, Letter to Joshua F. Speed, August 24, 1855
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 07:08 PM (+nlyI)
126
Ahhh, Paulaner Hefe-Weizen, almost as good as a Widmere Bros. Hondo I am impressed. I never suspected the intellectual that dwells within your persona. Nice. Vag, you crack me up. Oyster, Thank you.
I like to refer back to a line from the movie the Godfather. Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. I solation in any way defeats this approach. We should embrace our enemies, but in a way an anaconda embraces it's prey. We are a smart nation. We are smarter than our politicians. The collective opinion of this thread is probably no different than the psyche of a typical human who ponders the very same topic. Ultimately we finish where we started.
Massive deportations would offer a superficial sense of satisfaction. But muslims are not a race. You cannot sniff out a muslim. What I suggest is we restore the ability to snoop on calls originating from outside of the US. Baby steps, before giant leaps.
Also I vote we raise a fund to pay for the MOAB that will be dropped in Damascus. As a tall man, I am ashamed of the behavior of the baby Assad.
I like to refer back to a line from the movie the Godfather. Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. I solation in any way defeats this approach. We should embrace our enemies, but in a way an anaconda embraces it's prey. We are a smart nation. We are smarter than our politicians. The collective opinion of this thread is probably no different than the psyche of a typical human who ponders the very same topic. Ultimately we finish where we started.
Massive deportations would offer a superficial sense of satisfaction. But muslims are not a race. You cannot sniff out a muslim. What I suggest is we restore the ability to snoop on calls originating from outside of the US. Baby steps, before giant leaps.
Also I vote we raise a fund to pay for the MOAB that will be dropped in Damascus. As a tall man, I am ashamed of the behavior of the baby Assad.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 20, 2006 07:22 PM (n4VvM)
127
Greg: How can one be so ignorant. What is your assumed connection that you bring up mehr is a Jew? Have Jews suddenly turned black? You never cease to amaze people with your stupidity. Who on this blog has ever been more pro Israel than I? Certainly not you.
Secondly, I serious doubt that a kiss ass little punt like Mehr is a Jew. Don't know where you would get such info. Not that it would matter to me. He would still be a sniveling little kiss ass Iranian dog. Vinnie's little butt boy faggot. Maybe they will invite you to their wedding.
Yea. I bet the little shit wishes he had'nt started shit.
Greg: How can one be so ignorant. What is your assumed connection that you bring up mehr is a Jew? Have Jews suddenly turned black? You never cease to amaze people with your stupidity. Who on this blog has ever been more pro Israel than I? Certainly not you.
Secondly, I serious doubt that a kiss ass little punt like Mehr is a Jew. Don't know where you would get such info. Not that it would matter to me. He would still be a sniveling little kiss ass Iranian dog. Vinnie's little butt boy faggot. Maybe they will invite you to their wedding.
Yea. I bet the little shit wishes he had'nt started shit.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 07:30 PM (IcUVJ)
128
Greyrooster:
Hmmm. I see in the span of 5 short sentences you mention ass, butt, shit two times and faggot...
What is the common theme there?
Perhaps you can hook up with Hondo?...?
Hmmm. I see in the span of 5 short sentences you mention ass, butt, shit two times and faggot...
What is the common theme there?
Perhaps you can hook up with Hondo?...?
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 07:37 PM (+nlyI)
129
Hi Rooster, It never occured to me that GM was either a Jew or gay. Neither do we know if he is Iranian. He does seem to drift between offers of helpfulness and psychotic convusions. Nonetheless, I want to reiterate my stance to GM, we are not a tool of the world to do anyone's dirty work, except the work America want to get done. If you want to see anything happen, you need to focus on the panty-waistes you live with in Canada. All the good Canadians are applying for American citizenship.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 20, 2006 07:41 PM (n4VvM)
130
George,
I like your ideas in your comment 117 as well. However, let me inform you, if I may, that many ex-Muslim women have indeed taken up what you are suggesting but entirely on their own initiative; for instance in Canada, an organization of Afghani immirgant women has been very active in supporting the deployment of Canadian troops in fighting the Taliban and they've been encouraging the men in their families to enlist with the Canadian Armed Forces and some of their men have indeed signed up where as trusted interpretters they've proven very useful to the Canadian forces. Another example was the campaign against the Shariah Law in Ontario which was successfully led by an Iranian-Canadian lady; and there are other examples.
Yes, why should Islam and Muslims be tolerated in democracies while in Saudi Arabia having a single page of the Bible folded in your pocket is considered a felony and the government of Iran considers leaving Islam a capital offence.
I like your ideas in your comment 117 as well. However, let me inform you, if I may, that many ex-Muslim women have indeed taken up what you are suggesting but entirely on their own initiative; for instance in Canada, an organization of Afghani immirgant women has been very active in supporting the deployment of Canadian troops in fighting the Taliban and they've been encouraging the men in their families to enlist with the Canadian Armed Forces and some of their men have indeed signed up where as trusted interpretters they've proven very useful to the Canadian forces. Another example was the campaign against the Shariah Law in Ontario which was successfully led by an Iranian-Canadian lady; and there are other examples.
Yes, why should Islam and Muslims be tolerated in democracies while in Saudi Arabia having a single page of the Bible folded in your pocket is considered a felony and the government of Iran considers leaving Islam a capital offence.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 07:42 PM (Bp6wV)
131
Ah Darth Vag - amusing
I notice that your comeback repetouir consists exclusively of sexually orientated themes - notably male erotica. You really need to broaden yourself lest you become perceived as a one-trick snap pony.
I think it is obvious by now that such an approach has absolutely no effect whats-so-ever on me, and your narrow variation on it is well - sorry - quiet flacid. You would be amazed (and blush) how a group of dirt dogs kickin' back in the AO by the fire can carry on across the spectrum in sexually charged themes and comradely insults. You fall far short - no pun intended.
You can rationalize two possible reasons for this lack of impact.
1) I am
or
2) I am quite secure in the sexual identity venue that you have no meaning to me.
Either way, there is a possible method of clarification.
I could get my hands on a Zodiac, some MREs, some of those drinks with the lil' umbrellas ... and we could go sailing together on a voyage of discovery off long Island! Like I said before, Rusty has my phone number - we could hook up.
But please! - leave the Star Wars persona (ie. mask n' light saber) at home. I really can't get into this kinky geeky stuff that some here seem to enjoy. Ta Ta!
I notice that your comeback repetouir consists exclusively of sexually orientated themes - notably male erotica. You really need to broaden yourself lest you become perceived as a one-trick snap pony.
I think it is obvious by now that such an approach has absolutely no effect whats-so-ever on me, and your narrow variation on it is well - sorry - quiet flacid. You would be amazed (and blush) how a group of dirt dogs kickin' back in the AO by the fire can carry on across the spectrum in sexually charged themes and comradely insults. You fall far short - no pun intended.
You can rationalize two possible reasons for this lack of impact.
1) I am
or
2) I am quite secure in the sexual identity venue that you have no meaning to me.
Either way, there is a possible method of clarification.
I could get my hands on a Zodiac, some MREs, some of those drinks with the lil' umbrellas ... and we could go sailing together on a voyage of discovery off long Island! Like I said before, Rusty has my phone number - we could hook up.
But please! - leave the Star Wars persona (ie. mask n' light saber) at home. I really can't get into this kinky geeky stuff that some here seem to enjoy. Ta Ta!
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 07:43 PM (XrexX)
132
Darth Vag, are you a sockpuppet, or perhaps just a puppet?
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 07:45 PM (rUyw4)
133
GM:
I gather from your knowledge of Persia you must have some connection there, although you don't strike me as a Jew, certainly not a Muslim.
Are you a Chaldean Catholic, a Zoroastrian or a member of another Persian minority group?
I gather from your knowledge of Persia you must have some connection there, although you don't strike me as a Jew, certainly not a Muslim.
Are you a Chaldean Catholic, a Zoroastrian or a member of another Persian minority group?
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 07:48 PM (+nlyI)
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 07:55 PM (+nlyI)
135
Surprise? Who's talking of Surprise? Chaos is no surprise. It has predictable characteristics. For one thing it carries away order and strengthens the forces at the extremes.
Isn't that what radicals are trying to do? Aren't they trying to shake things up so they can grab control?
That's what they think they are doing. Actually they're createing new extremists, new radicals and they are continuing the old process.
What about a radical who sees the complexities and comes at you that way?
That's no radical that's a rival for leadership.
But what do you do?
You co-opt them or kill them. That's how the struggle for leadership originated, at the grunt level.
Herbert.
Isn't that what radicals are trying to do? Aren't they trying to shake things up so they can grab control?
That's what they think they are doing. Actually they're createing new extremists, new radicals and they are continuing the old process.
What about a radical who sees the complexities and comes at you that way?
That's no radical that's a rival for leadership.
But what do you do?
You co-opt them or kill them. That's how the struggle for leadership originated, at the grunt level.
Herbert.
Posted by: Howie at August 20, 2006 07:59 PM (D3+20)
136
Hondo spelled backwards is odnoh.
Perhaps this palindrome you call a name is actually a question.
Odd, no?
Yes, indeed!
Perhaps this palindrome you call a name is actually a question.
Odd, no?
Yes, indeed!
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 08:12 PM (+nlyI)
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 08:15 PM (XrexX)
138
And you, Hondo, are a troll.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 08:22 PM (+nlyI)
139
Darth Vag,
Yes indeed I am Iranian from the Persian ethnicity and yes from a religious minority. My family were forced to leave Iran in 1980 owing to the barbarity of the Mullah regime.
Best
/GM
Yes indeed I am Iranian from the Persian ethnicity and yes from a religious minority. My family were forced to leave Iran in 1980 owing to the barbarity of the Mullah regime.
Best
/GM
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 08:37 PM (Bp6wV)
140
Darth baby
You really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes, now do you?
You really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes, now do you?
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 08:43 PM (XrexX)
141
Darth Vag,
FYI, there is an American gentleman blogger by the name (or pseudonym?) Alan Peters who knows Iran and Iranians even better than I do. I believe this gentleman is a veteran of the United States intelligence services and he is proficient in the Persian language. In his profile he claims to have had access to all levels of the Iranian government before 1979. Anyhow if you're interested you can see his blog at
http://noiri.blogspot.com
FYI, there is an American gentleman blogger by the name (or pseudonym?) Alan Peters who knows Iran and Iranians even better than I do. I believe this gentleman is a veteran of the United States intelligence services and he is proficient in the Persian language. In his profile he claims to have had access to all levels of the Iranian government before 1979. Anyhow if you're interested you can see his blog at
http://noiri.blogspot.com
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 08:53 PM (Bp6wV)
142
GM, why was your family forced to leave? Why Canada?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 20, 2006 08:55 PM (n4VvM)
143
Mehr: Why the fuck don't you Iranians find somewhere else to go. I still think all of you are spying for the moolas.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 09:15 PM (IcUVJ)
144
Greyrooster: Geezus, lighten the hell up.
Hondo: You call me baby, then you tell yourself that you really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes. Please, find someone your own sexual orientation to flirt with.
Hondo: You call me baby, then you tell yourself that you really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes. Please, find someone your own sexual orientation to flirt with.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 10:01 PM (+nlyI)
145
GM:
Thank you for the link. My sister-in-law is Persian and so are many of my friends. Here is Pink Floyd on the Pig mullah regime:
"When cometh the day we lowly ones,
trough quiet reflection and great dedication,
master the art of karate,
lo, we shall rise up,
and then we'll make the buggers eyes water."
Thank you for the link. My sister-in-law is Persian and so are many of my friends. Here is Pink Floyd on the Pig mullah regime:
"When cometh the day we lowly ones,
trough quiet reflection and great dedication,
master the art of karate,
lo, we shall rise up,
and then we'll make the buggers eyes water."
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 20, 2006 10:15 PM (+nlyI)
146
Darth
The boat trip is a still standing offer - I'll check the calendar for the next full moon. Ya never know.
BTW
Darth baby
You really don't don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes, now do you?
which you follow up with an immediate retort ...
Hondo: You call me baby, then you tell yourself that you really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes. ...
Ha Ha Ha Ha! Boy - this is truly hillarious! I know I'm not the only one seeing this!
Darth! Who loves ya baby!
The boat trip is a still standing offer - I'll check the calendar for the next full moon. Ya never know.
BTW
Darth baby
You really don't don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes, now do you?
which you follow up with an immediate retort ...
Hondo: You call me baby, then you tell yourself that you really don't have much to throw out without the homoerotic charged themes. ...
Ha Ha Ha Ha! Boy - this is truly hillarious! I know I'm not the only one seeing this!
Darth! Who loves ya baby!
Posted by: hondo at August 20, 2006 10:46 PM (XrexX)
147
Darth Vag,
Which one of Pink Floyd's albums is that from?
I'm a Floyd fan myself. And because of my life experience The Final Cut Album is very meaningful to me; e.g.
A place to stay.
Enough to eat.
Somwhere old heroes shuffle safely down the street,
where you can speak out loud about your doubts and fears,
and no one ever disappears,
you never hear their standard-issue kicking in you door.
You can relax on both sides of the tracks and maniacs don't blow holes in bandsman by remote control,
and everyone has recourse to the law,
and no one kills your children anymore,
no one kills your children anymore.
Night after night going round and round my brain,
this dream is driving me insane.
Yes, the good people of Canada and their good Queen have indeed given me such a shelter; an act of decency whose recompense can only come from God, for He has promised: "If you do this for the least of my children you have done this for me."
Which one of Pink Floyd's albums is that from?
I'm a Floyd fan myself. And because of my life experience The Final Cut Album is very meaningful to me; e.g.
A place to stay.
Enough to eat.
Somwhere old heroes shuffle safely down the street,
where you can speak out loud about your doubts and fears,
and no one ever disappears,
you never hear their standard-issue kicking in you door.
You can relax on both sides of the tracks and maniacs don't blow holes in bandsman by remote control,
and everyone has recourse to the law,
and no one kills your children anymore,
no one kills your children anymore.
Night after night going round and round my brain,
this dream is driving me insane.
Yes, the good people of Canada and their good Queen have indeed given me such a shelter; an act of decency whose recompense can only come from God, for He has promised: "If you do this for the least of my children you have done this for me."
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 20, 2006 11:04 PM (Bp6wV)
148
I can't believe this country still has Imams and mosques, let alone even entertaining the idea of allowing more. What a country of wussies! What bunch of knuckleheads ever let them come in the first place? Why not let the mafia establish meeting halls? Can't believe what the knuckleheads who run this country will do for a buck or to appear politically correct! I feel like cancelling my subscription sometimes! As for the rest of the useless chatter on this thread, that's about all I can say. Bunch of knuckleheads chattering away about there manhood or lack thereof and posting multiple times! I once was banned for having something to say on every thread. At least I kept it down to 1 or 2 comments a thread! Gheez! Waste of blog space, nothing to see here..... move along. I would give Rusty credit for drawing so many comments to his post, however about 90 % is mindless, kindergarten chatter. Have a nice day and thanks for playing!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 20, 2006 11:11 PM (gLMre)
149
Larry, just when I was beginning to think you might have a little sense, you come forward and prove me wrong. Damn.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 11:47 PM (rUyw4)
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 12:17 AM (TZa34)
151
Hondo and the rest of the people on this "blog" who agree that its a good idea to just drop a bomb at the root of Islam and think that the US has the last say in what happens in the world are all a bunch of redneck idiots.
Maybe you don't realize it, I am going on a guess here and thinking most of you are from the United States, that your COUNTRY is isolated from the rest of the world geographically. YOU don't get the whole picture of the situation going on in the arab world. All you see is the bullshit propaganda you see in CNN, SKY, BBC, FOX...
You back up Israel 100 percent of the way and everytime Palestine or lets say recently, Lebanon, gets military help from neighboring countries, you're immedietly informed that a certain nation has helped the "terrorist" organization. Where do you get such information? From your news media which all depict anyone helping Palestine or Lebanon as a terrorist.
I don't know why your country's balls shrink when such a thing happens and the media really hypes it up on the news as helping a terrorist, while America as been supplying Israel with missiles and shit for God knows how long, and thats totally acceptable?
Israel is slowly going from one nation to another, doing what it does best, and no one notices that all that Palestine is doing is trying to defend itself, all that Lebanon is doing is trying to defend itself.
You guys haven't got the slightest clue about Islam. First of all, look at Christianity. There has been so many alterations to that religion that now your people have lost faith in it. Most of you don't practice the religion anymore cause most probably it doesn't make sense to you.
If you've read the Da vinci Code, and you look at what its trying to point out as the truth, that truth is what is in Islam. First and foremost, Jesus is not the son of God, what a load of crap that was. It says he was just a prophet. Islam also recognizes that.
Anyway what I am trying to say is your interpretations of Islam and your reasons given for the spark of this middle east conflit are very baised, because I think you don't know the Arabic language, you don't know whats really written in the Quran. On the other hand, the Bible has had so many MAN MADE changes in it to suit your lifestyle that the truth has been altered in so many ways.
And for THAT reason alone, you don't have the right to decide whats best for the world, because frankly, most of the world doesn't like you. Since the invasion of Iraq to find those WMDs till this day you've lost the trust of many around the world. Where are those WMDs? All the CIA and FBI 'intelligence' couldn't find them in Iraq? Hiding in some caves maybe? Im sure...
I myself don't practice any religion but for you guys to decide that the second largest religious population in the world is nothing but based on death and war then you guys have been sadly blindsided by your media and your ignorance from the rest of the world.
Maybe you don't realize it, I am going on a guess here and thinking most of you are from the United States, that your COUNTRY is isolated from the rest of the world geographically. YOU don't get the whole picture of the situation going on in the arab world. All you see is the bullshit propaganda you see in CNN, SKY, BBC, FOX...
You back up Israel 100 percent of the way and everytime Palestine or lets say recently, Lebanon, gets military help from neighboring countries, you're immedietly informed that a certain nation has helped the "terrorist" organization. Where do you get such information? From your news media which all depict anyone helping Palestine or Lebanon as a terrorist.
I don't know why your country's balls shrink when such a thing happens and the media really hypes it up on the news as helping a terrorist, while America as been supplying Israel with missiles and shit for God knows how long, and thats totally acceptable?
Israel is slowly going from one nation to another, doing what it does best, and no one notices that all that Palestine is doing is trying to defend itself, all that Lebanon is doing is trying to defend itself.
You guys haven't got the slightest clue about Islam. First of all, look at Christianity. There has been so many alterations to that religion that now your people have lost faith in it. Most of you don't practice the religion anymore cause most probably it doesn't make sense to you.
If you've read the Da vinci Code, and you look at what its trying to point out as the truth, that truth is what is in Islam. First and foremost, Jesus is not the son of God, what a load of crap that was. It says he was just a prophet. Islam also recognizes that.
Anyway what I am trying to say is your interpretations of Islam and your reasons given for the spark of this middle east conflit are very baised, because I think you don't know the Arabic language, you don't know whats really written in the Quran. On the other hand, the Bible has had so many MAN MADE changes in it to suit your lifestyle that the truth has been altered in so many ways.
And for THAT reason alone, you don't have the right to decide whats best for the world, because frankly, most of the world doesn't like you. Since the invasion of Iraq to find those WMDs till this day you've lost the trust of many around the world. Where are those WMDs? All the CIA and FBI 'intelligence' couldn't find them in Iraq? Hiding in some caves maybe? Im sure...
I myself don't practice any religion but for you guys to decide that the second largest religious population in the world is nothing but based on death and war then you guys have been sadly blindsided by your media and your ignorance from the rest of the world.
Posted by: UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic at August 21, 2006 12:19 AM (wRqvn)
152
I know how you feel. I'm a D&D geek. One of my fellow players is Muslim. I'm Jewish. We're good friends. For those who would understand, our characters are always the best of friends, like brothers, even when I play a LG cleric and he plays a rogue. I like his thoughts on the Middle East: "Just get along, man!" There's also an Egyptian I've worked with for a number of years. Our relationship is of only co-workers, but we are chummy. The Middle East isn't even in the equation.
And yet, CAIR ...
And yet, CAIR ...
Posted by: hadsil at August 21, 2006 12:30 AM (QTpM5)
153
What to do with Muslims? Well, exterminate them. How? Ask the God of Zionism, Adolph H.
Posted by: Ajmal Kamal at August 21, 2006 12:55 AM (3cvAZ)
154
I'm a long way from saying we should nuke Iran, but your post is at best naive.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:"If you've read the Da vinci Code"
Hmmmm... no, but I've seen Easy Rider- I based my life on that movie man. If you could all just get on a Harley with an American flag teardrop gas tank filled with all our hopes and dreams... Oh, wait that's an admitted work of fiction- just like the Da Vinci Code.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:All you see is the bullshit propaganda you see in CNN, SKY, BBC, FOX...
Welcome to the worst website in the world you could have hoped to post this stupid evil crap. The Jawa Report made WORLD WIDE HEADLINES this month exposing the lies of the Hizbullah propogandists that infiltrated Reuters. And it was taken down with cyberattacks from Turkish Islamists the month before, so I am sure that every visit here is being watched by the same good guys that monitor international phone calls. Smile for the camera.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:Where are those WMDs?
Your blather could have stopped before here, but thank you for not, now suck on this: We have lots of planes and bombs and all kinds of weapons here in the United States. You may have noticed that we can move them around all over the world very efficiently, and no one can stop us. If we were the dishonest people that your cynical heart believes we would find WMD's all over Iraq-even if we had to fly them there ourselves(how can you not see this?). This is bigger than WMD's, it is about right and wrong, good vs. evil.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:"If you've read the Da vinci Code"
Hmmmm... no, but I've seen Easy Rider- I based my life on that movie man. If you could all just get on a Harley with an American flag teardrop gas tank filled with all our hopes and dreams... Oh, wait that's an admitted work of fiction- just like the Da Vinci Code.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:All you see is the bullshit propaganda you see in CNN, SKY, BBC, FOX...
Welcome to the worst website in the world you could have hoped to post this stupid evil crap. The Jawa Report made WORLD WIDE HEADLINES this month exposing the lies of the Hizbullah propogandists that infiltrated Reuters. And it was taken down with cyberattacks from Turkish Islamists the month before, so I am sure that every visit here is being watched by the same good guys that monitor international phone calls. Smile for the camera.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:Where are those WMDs?
Your blather could have stopped before here, but thank you for not, now suck on this: We have lots of planes and bombs and all kinds of weapons here in the United States. You may have noticed that we can move them around all over the world very efficiently, and no one can stop us. If we were the dishonest people that your cynical heart believes we would find WMD's all over Iraq-even if we had to fly them there ourselves(how can you not see this?). This is bigger than WMD's, it is about right and wrong, good vs. evil.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 01:05 AM (LoKA7)
155
FURTHERMORE,
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:"I myself don't practice any religion but for you guys to decide that
the second largest religious population in the world is nothing but
based on death and war"
Look at their society. They live in squalor, and they enslave their women and they kill for glory. 600 years. Nothing to make the world a better place. Islam is submission. Submission is slavery. Do you know what is like to be a slave?
You don't practice religion? Try that line in the Sudan. You wouldn't though, you would just bow to their swords. And then you would know what is like to live as a slave- to live in fear.
UrAllOverwhelminglyIdiotic:"I myself don't practice any religion but for you guys to decide that
the second largest religious population in the world is nothing but
based on death and war"
Look at their society. They live in squalor, and they enslave their women and they kill for glory. 600 years. Nothing to make the world a better place. Islam is submission. Submission is slavery. Do you know what is like to be a slave?
You don't practice religion? Try that line in the Sudan. You wouldn't though, you would just bow to their swords. And then you would know what is like to live as a slave- to live in fear.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 01:15 AM (LoKA7)
156
er whatever,
Actually myself and a number of others have made it quite clear we don't support the "drop the big'um" option. Don't want to hurt no kangaroos or camels for that matter.
Don't mind being called a redneck, though I am from NYC. Prefer though being called one by one - would bring a tear of gratitude to my eye.
Yes! I do admit! I fervently support the Jew Team. Kind of like a home team to me - have a few friends, and sons and daughters of friends in the field. Goooooo Jewboys! Win one (again) for Meyer! Pity they have to play in the low end of the minor leagues.
I and many others have made our decision - and we stand by it with total support come hell or high water. And, I know many prepared to back that up to the extreme - especially here in Jackson's "Hymietown".
The question however is you. What are you prepared to do? You have soooo many options available for physical interaction - its amazing! Join the struggle! Sign up to be in it! You chose a side - a team - you do have the option (easy to exercise) to suit up for the occassion - and take to the field.
Or are you going to stand on the sidelines - mouthing the words. Hey - if your whole stance is nothing more than posturing so to impress and score with some leftist babes in the local cafe - I understand - been there, done that.
If you truly believe passionately in something, you should always be prepared to physically fight for it. If your retort is you don't believe in fighting or "there are other ways" ... then you never really believed in the first place.
What's it gonna be boy?
Actually myself and a number of others have made it quite clear we don't support the "drop the big'um" option. Don't want to hurt no kangaroos or camels for that matter.
Don't mind being called a redneck, though I am from NYC. Prefer though being called one by one - would bring a tear of gratitude to my eye.
Yes! I do admit! I fervently support the Jew Team. Kind of like a home team to me - have a few friends, and sons and daughters of friends in the field. Goooooo Jewboys! Win one (again) for Meyer! Pity they have to play in the low end of the minor leagues.
I and many others have made our decision - and we stand by it with total support come hell or high water. And, I know many prepared to back that up to the extreme - especially here in Jackson's "Hymietown".
The question however is you. What are you prepared to do? You have soooo many options available for physical interaction - its amazing! Join the struggle! Sign up to be in it! You chose a side - a team - you do have the option (easy to exercise) to suit up for the occassion - and take to the field.
Or are you going to stand on the sidelines - mouthing the words. Hey - if your whole stance is nothing more than posturing so to impress and score with some leftist babes in the local cafe - I understand - been there, done that.
If you truly believe passionately in something, you should always be prepared to physically fight for it. If your retort is you don't believe in fighting or "there are other ways" ... then you never really believed in the first place.
What's it gonna be boy?
Posted by: hondo at August 21, 2006 01:21 AM (XrexX)
157
Beth, well, not hilarious- but it proves to me I am right and they are wrong.
I actually think that this kind of cognitive dissonance is a veil of supernatural origin. I think the same thing of Jew haters... It defies logical explanation, it is global, and has gone on for centuries... why do people hate the Jews? I really think the only explanation is supernatural.
I actually think that this kind of cognitive dissonance is a veil of supernatural origin. I think the same thing of Jew haters... It defies logical explanation, it is global, and has gone on for centuries... why do people hate the Jews? I really think the only explanation is supernatural.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 01:25 AM (LoKA7)
158
I'm no redneck either. But for someone who doesn't practice or even know about religion; to debunk The New Testament by using the 'fictional'
Da Vinci Code is simply moronic (that is the nicest term I could come up with).
So I will also assume he knows nothing about Islam. I agree with Beth and the rest he needs to go to the ME and say he doesn't believe in religion, he'll have a blast, literally.
For the record I don't agree with the 'nuke' thing either; people forget there's China and Russia just waiting in the wings to help them out and crush us too. Two for the price of one!!
I agree with QC a ride on a bike helps my husband.
Da Vinci Code is simply moronic (that is the nicest term I could come up with).
So I will also assume he knows nothing about Islam. I agree with Beth and the rest he needs to go to the ME and say he doesn't believe in religion, he'll have a blast, literally.
For the record I don't agree with the 'nuke' thing either; people forget there's China and Russia just waiting in the wings to help them out and crush us too. Two for the price of one!!
I agree with QC a ride on a bike helps my husband.
Posted by: littlesue at August 21, 2006 03:07 AM (kLIJZ)
159
QC;
As far as the hating of the Jews, you hit the nail on the head. Supernatural. It defies logic, or reason.
As far as the hating of the Jews, you hit the nail on the head. Supernatural. It defies logic, or reason.
Posted by: littlesue at August 21, 2006 03:13 AM (kLIJZ)
160
QC;
I agree with you this hating of the Jews and wanting to kill them defies logic, reason and down right compassion. Supernatural, I agree.
I agree with you this hating of the Jews and wanting to kill them defies logic, reason and down right compassion. Supernatural, I agree.
Posted by: littlesue at August 21, 2006 03:16 AM (kLIJZ)
161
When Mehr says he is a Persian from a religious minority he means he is a Jew.
I note that Mehr doesn't deny being a Jew.
He's a sneaky little shit who would have Americans shed our blood for his zionist fantasies.
No wonder that zionist shit, Vinnie, is so enamored with him.
I note that Mehr doesn't deny being a Jew.
He's a sneaky little shit who would have Americans shed our blood for his zionist fantasies.
No wonder that zionist shit, Vinnie, is so enamored with him.
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 05:35 AM (6Uv76)
162
Greg, get over it. We all know you're anti-semitic. We've known it for a long time. Or are you just trying to make new friends? "I note that Mehr doesn't deny being a Jew." You haven't denied being a moronic twit either.
Now, back to the topic... Hondo said it first and then SeeMonk said it. We are not anyone's personal mercenaries. We do not run off bombing anyone at the behest of anyone else.
And we're particularly tired of being told where to send money and aid and then being called stingy for it. Actually I would have given a month's salary to throw my money personally in Kofi's face Christmas before last than to send it anonymously and humbly to the Red Cross when the tsunami hit Indonesia.
So when assholes like "OverwhelminglyIdiotic" get all condescendingly smug with statements like "most of the world doesn't like you" he can just shove it where the sun don't shine next time he's the victim of an earthquake or a flood or a Muslim fanatic blows up one of his city's buildings or 'splodes himself and a few mothers and children in the local cafe.
Nobody likes us unless we're in pain. Nobody likes us unless we've been hurt. Everyone liked us when the WTC came down and 3000 of us died. WTF is up with that? If that's what it takes to be liked, then no thanks.
Now, back to the topic... Hondo said it first and then SeeMonk said it. We are not anyone's personal mercenaries. We do not run off bombing anyone at the behest of anyone else.
And we're particularly tired of being told where to send money and aid and then being called stingy for it. Actually I would have given a month's salary to throw my money personally in Kofi's face Christmas before last than to send it anonymously and humbly to the Red Cross when the tsunami hit Indonesia.
So when assholes like "OverwhelminglyIdiotic" get all condescendingly smug with statements like "most of the world doesn't like you" he can just shove it where the sun don't shine next time he's the victim of an earthquake or a flood or a Muslim fanatic blows up one of his city's buildings or 'splodes himself and a few mothers and children in the local cafe.
Nobody likes us unless we're in pain. Nobody likes us unless we've been hurt. Everyone liked us when the WTC came down and 3000 of us died. WTF is up with that? If that's what it takes to be liked, then no thanks.
Posted by: Oyster at August 21, 2006 06:52 AM (YudAC)
163
QC: I have many times in the past asked why people hate Jews. Best answer anyone ever had was that its in the bible? And that answer was given by one of the posters on this blog. Not much reason huh! I have my reasons for dislike of blacks. Can't find a reason to hate Jews.
Seemonk: You shuld beat the shit out of your brother.
Seemonk: You shuld beat the shit out of your brother.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 07:20 AM (4t6sV)
164
Oyster and Beth, you two show why the West is so much superior to Islam, because in Islam we would be without your voices of reason and intellect. Thank you.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 08:37 AM (rUyw4)
165
Beth,
I can smell your stale pussy all the way from JJ's house. Or is that anchovie?
Oh, my bad, it's JJ's pussy!
Why don't you go bake some cookies.
I can smell your stale pussy all the way from JJ's house. Or is that anchovie?
Oh, my bad, it's JJ's pussy!
Why don't you go bake some cookies.
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 08:58 AM (HeUa2)
166
Hi Rooster, which one of these chumps is my brother? If I were in the same room with Greg and the idiot fella, I would have to slap them as I would any frenchman.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 08:58 AM (7teJ9)
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 09:16 AM (HeUa2)
168
Jesusland Joe. What part of my speech do you disagree with? : Likewise, I was beginning to think there was hope for you.... until now! Oh, I guess it must be all those " well-mannered " muslim friends you have. Far as mosques and Imams in this country, duh! If I could only get my head out of this vice, the pain would stop!
I can't believe this country still has Imams and mosques, let alone even entertaining the idea of allowing more. What a country of wussies! What bunch of knuckleheads ever let them come in the first place? Why not let the mafia establish meeting halls? Can't believe what the knuckleheads who run this country will do for a buck or to appear politically correct! I feel like cancelling my subscription sometimes! As for the rest of the useless chatter on this thread, that's about all I can say. Bunch of knuckleheads chattering away about there manhood or lack thereof and posting multiple times! I once was banned for having something to say on every thread. At least I kept it down to 1 or 2 comments a thread! Gheez! Waste of blog space, nothing to see here..... move along. I would give Rusty credit for drawing so many comments to his post, however about 90 % is mindless, kindergarten chatter. Have a nice day and thanks for playing!
I can't believe this country still has Imams and mosques, let alone even entertaining the idea of allowing more. What a country of wussies! What bunch of knuckleheads ever let them come in the first place? Why not let the mafia establish meeting halls? Can't believe what the knuckleheads who run this country will do for a buck or to appear politically correct! I feel like cancelling my subscription sometimes! As for the rest of the useless chatter on this thread, that's about all I can say. Bunch of knuckleheads chattering away about there manhood or lack thereof and posting multiple times! I once was banned for having something to say on every thread. At least I kept it down to 1 or 2 comments a thread! Gheez! Waste of blog space, nothing to see here..... move along. I would give Rusty credit for drawing so many comments to his post, however about 90 % is mindless, kindergarten chatter. Have a nice day and thanks for playing!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 21, 2006 09:41 AM (gLMre)
169
Does Greg belong to you Rooster?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 09:41 AM (7teJ9)
170
Greg, you're the pussy.. I offered to meet you man-to-man, and what did you do? Chickened out. Refused to meet me. So who is the pussy here, you little shit? The offer still stands, coward!
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 10:13 AM (rUyw4)
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 11:11 AM (fKSca)
172
I'll tell you what, JJ.
Next time you come to Austin, I will meet you, even though I don't care for you.
I'll even buy the first 3 rounds and then we can decide if we want to kill each other.
You can reach me at:
Neuroman268@_yahoo.com
(Take out the underscore - this address is banned on the Jawa report)
I'm currently in Italy with only dial up and I can't access my yahoo account without waiting for 30 minutes.
I'll be back in the states on the 25th.
Next time you come to Austin, I will meet you, even though I don't care for you.
I'll even buy the first 3 rounds and then we can decide if we want to kill each other.
You can reach me at:
Neuroman268@_yahoo.com
(Take out the underscore - this address is banned on the Jawa report)
I'm currently in Italy with only dial up and I can't access my yahoo account without waiting for 30 minutes.
I'll be back in the states on the 25th.
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 11:25 AM (fKSca)
173
No worries, Greg, I'll be working in Arkansas for the next couple of months, but I will be heading down to my daddy's place in Kerrville for Christmas, sounds like a date. Austin will not be very much out of the way.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 11:49 AM (rUyw4)
174
And I ain't coming for no fucking drink with you, Greg.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 11:51 AM (rUyw4)
175
Have it your way, JJ.
You know how to reach me.
I'll be in Virginia for X-mas from 12-22 until 12-31.
Let me know if you want to ring in the new year or if the 21st works.
I'll be expecting you.
You know how to reach me.
I'll be in Virginia for X-mas from 12-22 until 12-31.
Let me know if you want to ring in the new year or if the 21st works.
I'll be expecting you.
Posted by: Greg at August 21, 2006 12:09 PM (3aRxi)
176
Can I come watch?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 21, 2006 12:12 PM (7teJ9)
177
Ain't going to be much to watch, SeeMonk, as I've had it with this little shit.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 12:27 PM (rUyw4)
178
Seemonk: Please accept my sincere apology. I do drink too much at times. Naw. I should rephrase that to sometimes I enjoy my wine to extremes. I was referring to Darth Fag. Sorry. I beg your pardon.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 05:00 PM (SRtFc)
179
I'm betting on Greg .... " That gap-toothed bitch wins the watermelon seed spitting contest every damn year! " Hard to compete with that sort of wisdom! ;-)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 21, 2006 07:54 PM (gLMre)
Posted by: hondo at August 21, 2006 08:13 PM (XrexX)
181
To Retire05:
I'm reading the link you provided in regards to the possibility of the reformation of Islam and find it lacking. Mansoor is operating on some automatic presumptions that are questionable (and questioned) right off the starting block and arguing from that point on. Andrew McCarthy is not even questioning those points but instead is arguing about Koranic text.
For instance; McCarthy argues about some Koranic text promoting violence and inhumane practices and Mansoor rebuts with how the bible was interpreted by man and was done so incorrectly while automatically accepting that Gabriel's words to an illiterate man are God's absolute words. And also with an unquetionable belief that biblical stories, completely changed in the Koran, are the correct ones.
For one thing the Koran is not taken at face value alone, as any devout or even "moderate" Muslim will tell you, but is put into context along with the Sunnah and Hadiths. The fact that Muslims should pattern their lives in the same manner of Mohammed as told in the Sunnah renders the Koran as only one third of the religion's tenets as the the other two thirds are laws and a biography interpreted and written by fallible men - exactly what Mansoor accuses has been done in the bible.
Nevertheless, the argument between them is lame. If one (in this case, Mansoor) is not willing to question even the most basic tenets, the rest is moot.
I'm not denying Mansoor's intentions, nor his dedication to secular values, but intentions are often gone awry. I know honorable men I'd love to have as neighbors, but it doesn't mean I want their ideas to succeed or become the law of the land.
I'm reading the link you provided in regards to the possibility of the reformation of Islam and find it lacking. Mansoor is operating on some automatic presumptions that are questionable (and questioned) right off the starting block and arguing from that point on. Andrew McCarthy is not even questioning those points but instead is arguing about Koranic text.
For instance; McCarthy argues about some Koranic text promoting violence and inhumane practices and Mansoor rebuts with how the bible was interpreted by man and was done so incorrectly while automatically accepting that Gabriel's words to an illiterate man are God's absolute words. And also with an unquetionable belief that biblical stories, completely changed in the Koran, are the correct ones.
For one thing the Koran is not taken at face value alone, as any devout or even "moderate" Muslim will tell you, but is put into context along with the Sunnah and Hadiths. The fact that Muslims should pattern their lives in the same manner of Mohammed as told in the Sunnah renders the Koran as only one third of the religion's tenets as the the other two thirds are laws and a biography interpreted and written by fallible men - exactly what Mansoor accuses has been done in the bible.
Nevertheless, the argument between them is lame. If one (in this case, Mansoor) is not willing to question even the most basic tenets, the rest is moot.
I'm not denying Mansoor's intentions, nor his dedication to secular values, but intentions are often gone awry. I know honorable men I'd love to have as neighbors, but it doesn't mean I want their ideas to succeed or become the law of the land.
Posted by: Oyster at August 22, 2006 07:46 AM (YudAC)
August 17, 2006
Judge Orders Wiretapping Program Shut, Nation Cheers
Thank you Judge Taylor for shutting down the international wiretapping program. I feel so much safer knowing that my Constitutionally protected right to chat with Ayman al Zawahiri about the weather in Waziristan is safe in your hands. Thank you for saving me from the evil hands of George W. Bush. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
I can finally breathe again after being oppressed for so long.
AP:
A federal judge ruled Thursday that the government's warrantless wiretapping program is unconstitutional and ordered an immediate halt to it.Hat tip: some anonymous dude.U.S. District Judge Anna Diggs Taylor in Detroit became the first judge to strike down the National Security Agency's program, which she says violates the rights to free speech and privacy.
Posted by: Rusty at
11:40 AM
| Comments (525)
| Add Comment
Post contains 131 words, total size 1 kb.
1
DATE: 09/09/2006 01:33:37 PM
Great work on website. http://www.tchezope.org/Members/de/poker-5.htm
DATE: 09/09/2006 01:33:37 PM
Great work on website. http://www.tchezope.org/Members/de/poker-5.htm
Posted by: Richard at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Brianna at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Robert at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Ange at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Barbara at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Jacob at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Matthew at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Herman at (KLBf6)
Posted by: John at (w+kZP)
Posted by: Robert at (Lbd2o)
11
DATE: 09/12/2006 01:29:39 PM
VERY GOOD I THINK http://learning.swc.hccs.edu/members/de/poker-21.htm
DATE: 09/12/2006 01:29:39 PM
VERY GOOD I THINK http://learning.swc.hccs.edu/members/de/poker-21.htm
Posted by: Lori at (3vJbW)
Posted by: Frank at (Lbd2o)
13
DATE: 09/13/2006 04:31:16 AM
Exciting website. http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-26.htm
DATE: 09/13/2006 04:31:16 AM
Exciting website. http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-26.htm
Posted by: Dale at (pu/Ki)
14
DATE: 09/13/2006 07:29:55 AM
Thank you... http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-27.htm
DATE: 09/13/2006 07:29:55 AM
Thank you... http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-27.htm
Posted by: Michael at (pu/Ki)
15
DATE: 09/13/2006 10:28:56 AM
Very nice site! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-28.htm
DATE: 09/13/2006 10:28:56 AM
Very nice site! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-28.htm
Posted by: Alexis at (pu/Ki)
16
DATE: 09/13/2006 04:33:09 PM
this site rocks! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-30.htm
DATE: 09/13/2006 04:33:09 PM
this site rocks! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-30.htm
Posted by: Christopher at (3vJbW)
17
DATE: 09/13/2006 10:30:34 PM
Good Luck! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-33.htm
DATE: 09/13/2006 10:30:34 PM
Good Luck! http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-33.htm
Posted by: Hailey at (eDAoq)
18
DATE: 09/14/2006 01:29:37 AM
Is very interesting http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-34.htm
DATE: 09/14/2006 01:29:37 AM
Is very interesting http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-34.htm
Posted by: Daniel at (3vJbW)
19
DATE: 09/14/2006 07:31:23 AM
Is very interesting http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-36.htm
DATE: 09/14/2006 07:31:23 AM
Is very interesting http://neumann.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/plone/Members/de/poker-36.htm
Posted by: Elizabeth at (3vJbW)
Posted by: Herman at (pu/Ki)
21
DATE: 09/14/2006 07:33:53 PM
It very interesting http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-39.htm
DATE: 09/14/2006 07:33:53 PM
It very interesting http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-39.htm
Posted by: Ange at (3vJbW)
22
DATE: 09/14/2006 10:31:30 PM
Thanks for taking http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-40.htm
DATE: 09/14/2006 10:31:30 PM
Thanks for taking http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-40.htm
Posted by: Anthony at (Lbd2o)
23
DATE: 09/15/2006 01:30:13 AM
Great work on website. http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-41.htm
DATE: 09/15/2006 01:30:13 AM
Great work on website. http://pen.bme.gatech.edu/Members/koz/1/poker-41.htm
Posted by: Anthony at (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Reginald at (3vJbW)
Posted by: Dale at (NHcav)
Posted by: Larry at (pu/Ki)
27
DATE: 09/15/2006 07:34:47 PM
Thanks for taking http://projects.objectrealms.net/Members/derik/poker-44.htm
DATE: 09/15/2006 07:34:47 PM
Thanks for taking http://projects.objectrealms.net/Members/derik/poker-44.htm
Posted by: Paul at (pu/Ki)
28
DATE: 09/16/2006 01:30:53 AM
this site rocks! http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/1.html
DATE: 09/16/2006 01:30:53 AM
this site rocks! http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/1.html
Posted by: Carol at (pu/Ki)
29
DATE: 09/16/2006 04:31:52 AM
Great work on website. http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/2.html
DATE: 09/16/2006 04:31:52 AM
Great work on website. http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/2.html
Posted by: Jacob at (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Anthony at (3vJbW)
Posted by: Richard at (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Emily at (3vJbW)
33
DATE: 09/16/2006 07:27:44 PM
Exciting website. http://www.bloopdiary.com/users/72599/poker-47.htm
DATE: 09/16/2006 07:27:44 PM
Exciting website. http://www.bloopdiary.com/users/72599/poker-47.htm
Posted by: Alton at (3vJbW)
Posted by: Donald at (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Zachary at (3vJbW)
36
DATE: 09/17/2006 04:27:38 AM
Very good website http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/6.html
DATE: 09/17/2006 04:27:38 AM
Very good website http://www.opensourcearmenia.com/Members/brr/6.html
Posted by: Samantha at (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Samantha at (Lbd2o)
Posted by: John at (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Hannah at (Lbd2o)
40
DATE: 09/24/2006 11:27:44 PM
It very interesting http://xoomer.alice.it/fe7/online-poker-software/
DATE: 09/24/2006 11:27:44 PM
It very interesting http://xoomer.alice.it/fe7/online-poker-software/
Posted by: Daniel at (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Jacob at (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Hailey at (Lbd2o)
43
Anyone else smell a rat? A Detroitistan rat with heart bleeding out its dhimmitude?
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2006608070381
Early odds in Vegas are 1:3 for it being over-ruled on appeal.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2006608070381
Early odds in Vegas are 1:3 for it being over-ruled on appeal.
Posted by: yo at August 17, 2006 11:53 AM (bLhPK)
44
lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head. what a stupidm move. i cannot believe she would do this. she needs to be put out of office immediately.
frank la may
frank la may
Posted by: frank la may at August 17, 2006 12:29 PM (Q9bFi)
45
And Judge Taylor was appointed by whom? This information usually leads me to a clear view of the judicial temperment of the aforementioned judge.
Posted by: MCPO Airdale at August 17, 2006 12:38 PM (3nKvy)
46
The _truly_ ironic thing here is that even the MSM has been loudly admitting that that is _exactly_ the sort of thing that allowed the would-be airline-bombers in Britain to be caught before they could enact their plot.
It really is as if the judges are on the side of You-Know-Who(pbuh - not!)
It really is as if the judges are on the side of You-Know-Who(pbuh - not!)
Posted by: crawdad at August 17, 2006 12:38 PM (ZC+yo)
47
Another airhead judge put on the bench by another liberal President I voted for, ONCE! Voted Ronnie in 80 and never once regreted it! But Bush and Jimmy - -ow! It hurts to be fooled by a liberal, whether he's GOP or Dem.
Posted by: Jo macDougal at August 17, 2006 12:42 PM (2vpLj)
48
All Bush has to do now is get WARRANTS through FISA. No biggie.
Posted by: Dave Johnson at August 17, 2006 12:56 PM (nzCS0)
49
How can any of you think that protecting the nation from attack is more important than protecting from fascism, which is what nearly all of your posts are supporting. A government that is not limited by the laws that are considered its most important, like the constitution, is not a democracy/republic, but a farce. Let us thank this judge for requiring our government to follow the law. If there isn't any evidence then we shouldn't be spying on anyone. Just read the fourth amendment and protect America from infringements on the rights of all.
Posted by: M Holmgren at August 17, 2006 12:57 PM (/+r0A)
50
Great! Now while the judge is on a roll, he needs to declare that Custom's searches at the boarder are unconstitutional as well without a search warrent. Any ACLU lawyer worth a nickel should be able to argue that point home to a sympathetic/pathetic judge.
Nobody seems to be discussing the possibility of the other country listening in on these same phone calls. You think Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, etc... are not listening in?
What a tool this judge is. Guess they will kill him last once they win the war.
The Company You Keep
Nobody seems to be discussing the possibility of the other country listening in on these same phone calls. You think Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, etc... are not listening in?
What a tool this judge is. Guess they will kill him last once they win the war.
The Company You Keep
Posted by: Fred Fry at August 17, 2006 12:58 PM (JXdhy)
51
M. Holmgren - To what law do you refer? Law on the books concerns domestic calls, this ruling is about international calls. Doesn't break any laws and is within the President's rights, just like when Clinton and Carter did it.
BTW: the Seahawks uniforms are teh gay!
BTW: the Seahawks uniforms are teh gay!
Posted by: MCPO Airdale at August 17, 2006 01:12 PM (3nKvy)
52
M Holmgren
You are a fucking idiot my friend. We are in a dog-eat-dog fight to the death with Islamic extremists, and all you are concerned about is civil liberties. Don't you get it yet? THESE PEOPLE TAKE ADVANTAGE OF OUR CIVIL LIBERTIES IN ORDER TO ATTACK US! Was your head corked up your ass on 9/11 or what? I give the government my full permission to monitor my emails, telephone calls, etc. if that is what it takes to keep me safe. This country, by and large, hasn't learned a damn thing since 9/11, and people are going to pay for it with their lives-again. We are too politically correct and worried about hurting people's feelings to ever win the war on terror, much less keep this country safe. Laws were made to be amended if need be, and I think the safety of this country is priority one,
unlike some people (you). So the next time you are wondering why the war on terror isn't over or how in the world those pesky terrorists killed so many people, look in the mirror, because your mentality is what is really dangerous here, not the NSA.
You are a fucking idiot my friend. We are in a dog-eat-dog fight to the death with Islamic extremists, and all you are concerned about is civil liberties. Don't you get it yet? THESE PEOPLE TAKE ADVANTAGE OF OUR CIVIL LIBERTIES IN ORDER TO ATTACK US! Was your head corked up your ass on 9/11 or what? I give the government my full permission to monitor my emails, telephone calls, etc. if that is what it takes to keep me safe. This country, by and large, hasn't learned a damn thing since 9/11, and people are going to pay for it with their lives-again. We are too politically correct and worried about hurting people's feelings to ever win the war on terror, much less keep this country safe. Laws were made to be amended if need be, and I think the safety of this country is priority one,
unlike some people (you). So the next time you are wondering why the war on terror isn't over or how in the world those pesky terrorists killed so many people, look in the mirror, because your mentality is what is really dangerous here, not the NSA.
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 01:13 PM (CtVG6)
53
Now my order to attack will be much easier to send.
Posted by: Osama bin-Laden at August 17, 2006 01:16 PM (YdcZ0)
54
Allowing the NSa to check on who I am calling overseas is not losing a civil liberty. Having my guns confiscated by law enforcement because of a catastrophe is losing a civil liberty. I believe it was the Dems behind that little incursion into facism. Not Bush.
I have nothing to hide.
I have nothing to hide.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:27 PM (7teJ9)
55
That judge did her job, within the framework of the US Constitution, the very Constitution we would like to see protected, and that the terrorists would like to see destroyed. If she had ruled the other way and was a Republican appointee, would you agree with left wingers that she is a political tool? Or would you shout down those left wing critics (who are you in this instance) and cheer the ruling?
This entire country is derived from that sacred document, and the separation of powers is the most important thing drafted into it. Respect the fact that the Executive cannot do just any old thing, just as the Congress cannot do just any old thing, just as the Judiciary cannot do just any old thing. The Judiciary is the last protector of that sacred document, the one we all love, the one we should be glad is AT WORK. Doesn't mean any of us have to like the result, just respect the process that led to the result, and not jump to unnecessary conclusions about political motivations. Such jumping can, and if occurring on a widespread basis, will lead the downfall of that very document and our free society - this is no exagerration.
If you ask Antonin Scalia, "what about legal precedent?" he would reply, "it's a problem." He gets it, the law is paramount and must be followed, even if we don't like it. There is such a thing as SC judicial review, afterall.
I am not arguing for or against unwarranted wiretapping, just for sane discourse. Respect the Judiciary, please - they are doing important work.
Erik Larsen
This entire country is derived from that sacred document, and the separation of powers is the most important thing drafted into it. Respect the fact that the Executive cannot do just any old thing, just as the Congress cannot do just any old thing, just as the Judiciary cannot do just any old thing. The Judiciary is the last protector of that sacred document, the one we all love, the one we should be glad is AT WORK. Doesn't mean any of us have to like the result, just respect the process that led to the result, and not jump to unnecessary conclusions about political motivations. Such jumping can, and if occurring on a widespread basis, will lead the downfall of that very document and our free society - this is no exagerration.
If you ask Antonin Scalia, "what about legal precedent?" he would reply, "it's a problem." He gets it, the law is paramount and must be followed, even if we don't like it. There is such a thing as SC judicial review, afterall.
I am not arguing for or against unwarranted wiretapping, just for sane discourse. Respect the Judiciary, please - they are doing important work.
Erik Larsen
Posted by: Erik at August 17, 2006 01:31 PM (GJGZT)
56
Of course when Al Qaida does come next, they'll say "Hey this is a cool place! They got secret wiretaps, torture, deportation to black sites and disappearances into some GULAG on the say-so of the Defender of the Faith.I think I kinda like it here. It's just like home."
Posted by: Archer at August 17, 2006 01:33 PM (3usgw)
57
The American Civil Liberties Union filed the lawsuit on behalf of journalists, scholars and lawyers who say the program has made it difficult for them to do their jobs.
Boo frickin' hoo. I wonder if these journalsists, scholars and lawyers will be willing to personally thank the families of (God forbid) the next group of terrorist attack victims for their sacrifice, so that they can do their jobs easier.
Boo frickin' hoo. I wonder if these journalsists, scholars and lawyers will be willing to personally thank the families of (God forbid) the next group of terrorist attack victims for their sacrifice, so that they can do their jobs easier.
Posted by: Graeme at August 17, 2006 01:34 PM (nP58M)
58
Do you believe in seperation of powers? Is the president above the laws or does he have to obey them like anybody else? Should some anonymous Government bureaucrat should be allowed to listen in to mine/your phone calls without you knowing about it?
Posted by: bshapiro at August 17, 2006 01:35 PM (BPamF)
59
bshapiro,
a) do believe in separation of powers
b) No, Pres. is not above law.
c) yes, some anonymous bureaucrat should be able to listen to your phone callse
d) provided those phone calls are overseas
e) in the context of war
f) you are a moron
g) see f
a) do believe in separation of powers
b) No, Pres. is not above law.
c) yes, some anonymous bureaucrat should be able to listen to your phone callse
d) provided those phone calls are overseas
e) in the context of war
f) you are a moron
g) see f
Posted by: Rusty at August 17, 2006 01:42 PM (JQjhA)
60
Ever heard of freedom? The Constitution? Ever wonder
why there's a little thing called "separation of powers"? Get a clue - it's the WARRANTLESS part of the searches that is unconstitutional. The President already had all the ability he needed to wiretap, provided he could be bothered to get a WARRANT to do so. But guess what, the Executive Branch unilaterally decided it didn't want to play by those rules and decided to break the law. Thank God someone stood up for the rights of Americans.
If you don't like the freedom and civil liberties we have here in the US, move to the Mideast where there's no shortage of countries are looking to eradicate freedom.
why there's a little thing called "separation of powers"? Get a clue - it's the WARRANTLESS part of the searches that is unconstitutional. The President already had all the ability he needed to wiretap, provided he could be bothered to get a WARRANT to do so. But guess what, the Executive Branch unilaterally decided it didn't want to play by those rules and decided to break the law. Thank God someone stood up for the rights of Americans.
If you don't like the freedom and civil liberties we have here in the US, move to the Mideast where there's no shortage of countries are looking to eradicate freedom.
Posted by: billybob at August 17, 2006 01:43 PM (OKOIV)
61
Archer, just like home: Soldiers prosecuted for torture in US vs. praise for torturers, Leftists calling dogs barking "torture" vs. cutting the heads off of people, women in America veiled, adultresses stoned, no freedom of religion.....JUST. LIKE. HOME.
You are a certifiable idiot.
You are a certifiable idiot.
Posted by: Rusty at August 17, 2006 01:45 PM (JQjhA)
62
to Jack's Smirking Revenge:
If we're in a "dog-eat-dog fight to the death with Islamic extremists," don't you think it would be prudent to institute a draft to adequately man our armed forces currently engaged in multiple theatres of war against said Islamic extremists, and to raise taxes to adequately fund that war effort?
No? Then apparently it's not much of a dog-eat-dog fight. Either that or the current Republican leadership is just not up to the task.
BTW: How'd that whole "disarming Hezbollah" thing work out for you? Obviously that's not much of a priority either....
If we're in a "dog-eat-dog fight to the death with Islamic extremists," don't you think it would be prudent to institute a draft to adequately man our armed forces currently engaged in multiple theatres of war against said Islamic extremists, and to raise taxes to adequately fund that war effort?
No? Then apparently it's not much of a dog-eat-dog fight. Either that or the current Republican leadership is just not up to the task.
BTW: How'd that whole "disarming Hezbollah" thing work out for you? Obviously that's not much of a priority either....
Posted by: Jim J at August 17, 2006 01:46 PM (8qrSa)
63
I'm really looking forward to the inevitable collapse of our society so that we can clean house and get rid of the liberal traitor scum.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 01:48 PM (v3I+x)
64
Those protections were put into place to protect the citizen from unfair prosecution. Not to protect a war time enemy or agents therof from surveilance. As long as it is not used in court and is reserved for military protection of the homeland it's fine. Information gathered that is not militarily relevant should be guarded or discarded to protect against it's use in court. Relevant information that identifies a credible and serious threat should be used to capture/kill the enemy and or disrupt enemy actions.
That is all.
That is all.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 01:57 PM (YdcZ0)
65
JO
The similarities between Bush and Carter are amazing.
Both campaigned as conservatives but once elected governed as liberals.
In Feb both praised the terrorists while condemning the Danes for their printing of the segregationist cartoons.
Both say that rather than disturb some mosquitoes in Alaska we should conserve oil and make gas from corn.
The similarities between Bush and Carter are amazing.
Both campaigned as conservatives but once elected governed as liberals.
In Feb both praised the terrorists while condemning the Danes for their printing of the segregationist cartoons.
Both say that rather than disturb some mosquitoes in Alaska we should conserve oil and make gas from corn.
Posted by: Rod Stanton at August 17, 2006 02:05 PM (8Nvnd)
66
What we need here is to check on the background of Anna Taylor. She does live in Detroit. The city with the largest population of muslims in the country.
Is she married to one.
Is her boyfriend one.
Is her lesbian lover one.
Is her sister married to one.
Is her mama married to one.
Or is she just to chickenshit to do her job.
Just think bitch. If Muslims ran things, you wouldn't be judge. Occasionallly everyone gets something right.
Is she married to one.
Is her boyfriend one.
Is her lesbian lover one.
Is her sister married to one.
Is her mama married to one.
Or is she just to chickenshit to do her job.
Just think bitch. If Muslims ran things, you wouldn't be judge. Occasionallly everyone gets something right.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 02:15 PM (jgE7Y)
67
I can't wait to watch all the right-wingers screaming their balls off when it's a democrat using these powers.
Posted by: Jason at August 17, 2006 02:17 PM (pErBU)
68
Thank you Judge Taylor for upholding the Constitution and rule of law this country was founded upon.
My prayers are with you, so that you can hold your ground on the baseless and personal attacks which are now coming your way.
The good news is these critics will only attack you from behind their keyboards and microphones.
Thanks again,
An American
My prayers are with you, so that you can hold your ground on the baseless and personal attacks which are now coming your way.
The good news is these critics will only attack you from behind their keyboards and microphones.
Thanks again,
An American
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 02:18 PM (VTtVl)
69
Erik: The process that led to here decision is called politics.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 02:19 PM (jgE7Y)
70
Carter appointed her in 1979.
She was first black woman apointed to judge to be appointed to the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan three years after she campaigned for Jimmy Carter's presidential bid.
SHE IS 73 YEARS OLD.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060807/NEWS05/608070381/1001/NEWS
GUYS GET HER PICTURE UP FROM ABOVE LINK- IT IS INSANE!
She was first black woman apointed to judge to be appointed to the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan three years after she campaigned for Jimmy Carter's presidential bid.
SHE IS 73 YEARS OLD.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060807/NEWS05/608070381/1001/NEWS
GUYS GET HER PICTURE UP FROM ABOVE LINK- IT IS INSANE!
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 02:25 PM (PX+vn)
71
The commie bitch will be overruled. The ACLU knew damn well who to take the suit to. Ditch the bitch.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 02:25 PM (jgE7Y)
72
No connection between blacks and muslims? Bullshit. The Greyrooster is right on track.
You ostrich types keep your head in the sand.
You ostrich types keep your head in the sand.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 02:28 PM (jgE7Y)
73
Without a warrant!
Without a warrant!
Get it through your thick skulls. You can eavesdrop on my calls if you have a warrant.
Without one is illegal.
Just as hijacking planes to crash into buildings full of citizens is illegal.
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what I understand you are saying:
If you eavesdrop on a call initiated or received by an American citizen with a warrant, the call initiator/ receiver will know a warrant is out to eavesdrop on their calls.
Are you saying this is public knowledge or are you saying that someone in the Justice dept. is letting those who have warrants out on them know this?
Without a warrant!
Get it through your thick skulls. You can eavesdrop on my calls if you have a warrant.
Without one is illegal.
Just as hijacking planes to crash into buildings full of citizens is illegal.
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what I understand you are saying:
If you eavesdrop on a call initiated or received by an American citizen with a warrant, the call initiator/ receiver will know a warrant is out to eavesdrop on their calls.
Are you saying this is public knowledge or are you saying that someone in the Justice dept. is letting those who have warrants out on them know this?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 02:35 PM (VTtVl)
74
Thank goodness at least one judge out there respects the constitution.
I suspect the more vociferous of you out there calling for her head would probably not be doing likewise if the judge were upbraiding a non republican candidate for similar actions.
Hypocrites.
I suspect the more vociferous of you out there calling for her head would probably not be doing likewise if the judge were upbraiding a non republican candidate for similar actions.
Hypocrites.
Posted by: Some guy at August 17, 2006 02:35 PM (i36qN)
75
billybob: "Get a clue - it's the WARRANTLESS part of the searches that is unconstitutional. The President already had all the ability he needed to wiretap, provided he could be bothered to get a WARRANT to do so."
How do you get a warrant if you don't know what you're looking for??? After the plane blows up, it's a little late.
3WES
How do you get a warrant if you don't know what you're looking for??? After the plane blows up, it's a little late.
3WES
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 17, 2006 02:37 PM (up9HT)
76
Stupid ole hag is too old to be on bench.
Robert you stupid leftard. Sometimes you don't have time to get a warrant from a black racist old hag of a judge.
If you phone sex fags have something to hide. Move your asses to Thailand.
Robert you stupid leftard. Sometimes you don't have time to get a warrant from a black racist old hag of a judge.
If you phone sex fags have something to hide. Move your asses to Thailand.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 02:41 PM (jgE7Y)
77
Jacks Smirking Revenge,
Dog-eat-dog fight against facists means the leader of the nation can do anything he sees fit?
That's great news for Saddam, who was also in this dog-eat-dog war against facists.
I guess the torture and killing of his enemies is A-OK with you if he says it was because of his dog-eat-dog war against facists.
So,. I already know you think Saddam should be found not guilty.
Do you think he should be given the chance to rule Iraq again?
Dog-eat-dog fight against facists means the leader of the nation can do anything he sees fit?
That's great news for Saddam, who was also in this dog-eat-dog war against facists.
I guess the torture and killing of his enemies is A-OK with you if he says it was because of his dog-eat-dog war against facists.
So,. I already know you think Saddam should be found not guilty.
Do you think he should be given the chance to rule Iraq again?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 02:44 PM (VTtVl)
78
greyrooster,
According to FISA, you have 72 hours after eavesdropping to get the warrant.
Convinced now that I've educated you?
According to FISA, you have 72 hours after eavesdropping to get the warrant.
Convinced now that I've educated you?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 02:48 PM (VTtVl)
79
After the next big attack, just declare a State of Emergency and be done with it. I can imagine when suicide bombers start hitting the states, we'll have to fight the ACLU to be able to pull aside Arab males wearing suicide belts in plain view. Obviously racial profiling.
I. Am. Sick. To. Death. of liberals and leftists whining about "civil rights" when we are at war with an enemy who does not recognize "civil rights" for anyone other than a Wahabi muslim. This is a direct threat to my liberty and safety and I demand that the government use all available technology to combat it.
Sorry, but as this war progresses, the days of privacy are over. Live with or you will not live at all.
I. Am. Sick. To. Death. of liberals and leftists whining about "civil rights" when we are at war with an enemy who does not recognize "civil rights" for anyone other than a Wahabi muslim. This is a direct threat to my liberty and safety and I demand that the government use all available technology to combat it.
Sorry, but as this war progresses, the days of privacy are over. Live with or you will not live at all.
Posted by: Scott at August 17, 2006 02:53 PM (NT6Nj)
80
We have so called Americans in this country marching, and supporting Hizballah. Should their overseas phone calls be listen to? I believe so. Should they be profiled at airports? Yes, this is war, not a police action. Leave Grandma, and the WWII vet. alone stupid.
BTW, Islam is insane, and what do we do with insane individuals? How many examples do you need? 9-11, Spain, France, 24 muslims in England, Canada 11 I think, sharp shooter dude in Virginia, Jeep Muslim, Lakawanna 6, and on, and on, and on...
BTW, Islam is insane, and what do we do with insane individuals? How many examples do you need? 9-11, Spain, France, 24 muslims in England, Canada 11 I think, sharp shooter dude in Virginia, Jeep Muslim, Lakawanna 6, and on, and on, and on...
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 17, 2006 02:55 PM (D2g/j)
81
Scott,
How to run the white flag right up the pole.
Personally, I love America and would rather not let the enemy dictate to us how we should live.
How to run the white flag right up the pole.
Personally, I love America and would rather not let the enemy dictate to us how we should live.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 02:56 PM (VTtVl)
82
Man, where did all the terrorist ass-kissers come from who comment here?
Some guy
Robert
Jason
Billybob
I'm looking forward to hearing the recording of your desperate 911 call after the next terrorist attack. Don't forget to tell the dispatcher if it gets a little hot on the 83rd floor and you can't breathe. Don't worry, Bitch Taylor will come and save your constitutional right-to-die at the hands of terrorists. If not, you can either burn in Hell flames or jump out the window.
Some guy
Robert
Jason
Billybob
I'm looking forward to hearing the recording of your desperate 911 call after the next terrorist attack. Don't forget to tell the dispatcher if it gets a little hot on the 83rd floor and you can't breathe. Don't worry, Bitch Taylor will come and save your constitutional right-to-die at the hands of terrorists. If not, you can either burn in Hell flames or jump out the window.
Posted by: Doug at August 17, 2006 02:57 PM (pQg3/)
83
To Jim
Who said anything about a draft being a necessity to win this war? We dropped 2 nuclear bombs on Japan at the end of WW2, and they said enough is enough. Done deal. We knowingly killed give or take 250,000 civilians in order to end a war against a determined enemy who would stop at nothing to defeat us. Do you think these Islamic extremists are any less determined? Many would say that Hiroshima and Nagagsaki were retribution for Pearl Harbor. At least Pearl Harbor was a military target! They attacked civilians on 9/11! Where is the retribution for the 3,000 dead office workers that were in the Twin Towers? We haven't even caught the asshole responsible for it yet because we have to respect Pakistan's borders and be careful not offend the Muslim's religious sensitivities. Bollocks. I'm not saying by any means we should nuke every country in the Middle East, although it seems like a good idea sometimes. I'm just saying we should take the gloves off and defeat this enemy so that our great grandchildren are not walking a beat in Baghdad. Enough is enough. I try to be as objective as possible on everything that comes my way, but the more I read blogs from you idiots the more I think liberalism really is a mental disorder.
Who said anything about a draft being a necessity to win this war? We dropped 2 nuclear bombs on Japan at the end of WW2, and they said enough is enough. Done deal. We knowingly killed give or take 250,000 civilians in order to end a war against a determined enemy who would stop at nothing to defeat us. Do you think these Islamic extremists are any less determined? Many would say that Hiroshima and Nagagsaki were retribution for Pearl Harbor. At least Pearl Harbor was a military target! They attacked civilians on 9/11! Where is the retribution for the 3,000 dead office workers that were in the Twin Towers? We haven't even caught the asshole responsible for it yet because we have to respect Pakistan's borders and be careful not offend the Muslim's religious sensitivities. Bollocks. I'm not saying by any means we should nuke every country in the Middle East, although it seems like a good idea sometimes. I'm just saying we should take the gloves off and defeat this enemy so that our great grandchildren are not walking a beat in Baghdad. Enough is enough. I try to be as objective as possible on everything that comes my way, but the more I read blogs from you idiots the more I think liberalism really is a mental disorder.
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 02:57 PM (CtVG6)
84
Man, where did all the terrorist ass-kissers come from who comment here?
Some guy
Robert
Jason
Billybob
I'm looking forward to hearing the recording of your desperate 911 call after the next terrorist attack. Don't forget to tell her if it gets a little hot on the 83rd floor and you can't breathe. Don't worry, Bitch Taylor will come and save you! If not, you can either burn in Hell flames or jump out the window.
Some guy
Robert
Jason
Billybob
I'm looking forward to hearing the recording of your desperate 911 call after the next terrorist attack. Don't forget to tell her if it gets a little hot on the 83rd floor and you can't breathe. Don't worry, Bitch Taylor will come and save you! If not, you can either burn in Hell flames or jump out the window.
Posted by: Doug at August 17, 2006 02:59 PM (pQg3/)
85
Robert, you don't understand how this works. There is no tape recorder, or man in a suit with headphones listening to the tape. Do a google search on "eschelon and carnivore".
EVERY phone call goes through computers. These computers can record every one of them. If a they suspect you, they can pull up files of your calls from previous to you being a suspect.
This ability is not unique to the govt (it's scale is though), I could get a job with a phone company and record all kinds of calls... or I could walk down to my companies phone closet and record them all. The ability exists, someone will do it, power vaccuums are filled.
EVERY phone call goes through computers. These computers can record every one of them. If a they suspect you, they can pull up files of your calls from previous to you being a suspect.
This ability is not unique to the govt (it's scale is though), I could get a job with a phone company and record all kinds of calls... or I could walk down to my companies phone closet and record them all. The ability exists, someone will do it, power vaccuums are filled.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 02:59 PM (PX+vn)
86
America was built on the Constitution. If you're not defending the Constitution, you're not defending America. And if you're American and actively campaigning against the Constitution, you're a traitor.
Which makes most of you Republifucks traitors.
From the Revolutionary War to present day, our soldiers have fought and died to protect the ideals this country was built on. Those who oppose the Constitution disgust me.
Which makes most of you Republifucks traitors.
From the Revolutionary War to present day, our soldiers have fought and died to protect the ideals this country was built on. Those who oppose the Constitution disgust me.
Posted by: MattM at August 17, 2006 02:59 PM (Xc7iG)
87
America was built on the Constitution. If you're not defending the Constitution, you're not defending America. And if you're American and actively campaigning against the Constitution, you're a traitor.
Which makes most of you Republifucks traitors.
From the Revolutionary War to present day, our soldiers have fought and died to protect the ideals this country was built on. Those who oppose the Constitution disgust me.
Which makes most of you Republifucks traitors.
From the Revolutionary War to present day, our soldiers have fought and died to protect the ideals this country was built on. Those who oppose the Constitution disgust me.
Posted by: MattM at August 17, 2006 03:01 PM (Xc7iG)
88
I willing to let government agents listen to my phone conversations if it means the arrest/imprisonment/execution of terrorists, but they'll need lots of coffee to keep them awake.
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 17, 2006 03:03 PM (gZnyq)
89
You are a fucking idiot my friend. We are in a dog-eat-dog fight to the death with Islamic extremists,
No, YOU are behind your fucking KEYBOARD, you pussy.
"I give the government my full permission to monitor my emails, telephone calls, etc. if that is what it takes to keep me safe."
Move to Iran, I think you'd like it there, more in line with your values, you bedwetting pussy.
"I'm really looking forward to the inevitable collapse of our society so that we can clean house and get rid of the liberal traitor scum."
Do you ever have anything of intelligence to add? The broken record murder fantasy is getting old.
"shutting down the international wiretapping program"
She's done nothing of the sort, but I didn't expect much honesty from you anyway, Rusty.
No, YOU are behind your fucking KEYBOARD, you pussy.
"I give the government my full permission to monitor my emails, telephone calls, etc. if that is what it takes to keep me safe."
Move to Iran, I think you'd like it there, more in line with your values, you bedwetting pussy.
"I'm really looking forward to the inevitable collapse of our society so that we can clean house and get rid of the liberal traitor scum."
Do you ever have anything of intelligence to add? The broken record murder fantasy is getting old.
"shutting down the international wiretapping program"
She's done nothing of the sort, but I didn't expect much honesty from you anyway, Rusty.
Posted by: Angryflower at August 17, 2006 03:07 PM (Bss6w)
90
MattM, abolishionists campaigned against the constitution- and got it changed. Your short sighted comments should disgust you. (In case you don't know "abolishionists" were the folks that got slavery outlawed- by a Republican president)
There is no provision in the constitution dealing with computerized recording of cross border electronic communications.
Suck it.
There is no provision in the constitution dealing with computerized recording of cross border electronic communications.
Suck it.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 03:07 PM (PX+vn)
91
QC,
Yes you could...and that would also be illegal (thankfully).
You could also hijack a plane and fly it into buildings full of citizens..and that too would be illegal (thankfully).
Doug,
Hopefully I won't have to make that desperate call to the 911 operator.
But if I did, at least I'd know I didn't "cut and run" on my founding fathers and the thousands who have died to uphold my American beliefs.
Yes you could...and that would also be illegal (thankfully).
You could also hijack a plane and fly it into buildings full of citizens..and that too would be illegal (thankfully).
Doug,
Hopefully I won't have to make that desperate call to the 911 operator.
But if I did, at least I'd know I didn't "cut and run" on my founding fathers and the thousands who have died to uphold my American beliefs.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 03:08 PM (VTtVl)
92
Aunt Fester added
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 03:09 PM (YdcZ0)
93
Onr question for you fox sheep.If bin laden is in a cave in pakistan,why
are they tapping my phone here dekalb?
are they tapping my phone here dekalb?
Posted by: tommy at August 17, 2006 03:10 PM (Qd6ws)
94
One question for you fox sheep.If bin laden is in a cave in pakistan,why
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
Posted by: tommy at August 17, 2006 03:11 PM (Qd6ws)
95
One question for you fox sheep.If bin laden is in a cave in pakistan,why
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
Posted by: tommy at August 17, 2006 03:11 PM (Qd6ws)
96
Robert
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 03:12 PM (CtVG6)
97
One question for you fox sheep.If bin laden is in a cave in pakistan,why
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
Posted by: tommy at August 17, 2006 03:13 PM (Qd6ws)
98
One question for you fox sheep.If bin laden is in a cave in pakistan,why
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
are they tapping my phone here in dekalb?
Posted by: tommy at August 17, 2006 03:13 PM (Qd6ws)
99
One question for Tommy. Do you know how to operate a mouse?
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 03:14 PM (YdcZ0)
100
Robert, you are paying Bell South or Qwest, or some third party to carry your calls, and they are connecting with some other party to complete your international calls.
Your privacy in this case is an illusion that exists if everyone involved agrees to play by some pretend unenforceable rules. Illegal??? You call Pakistan on a phone, and it is illegal for our side to record it, but what are the Paki laws? Think it through man. It sucks, but think it through.
Your privacy in this case is an illusion that exists if everyone involved agrees to play by some pretend unenforceable rules. Illegal??? You call Pakistan on a phone, and it is illegal for our side to record it, but what are the Paki laws? Think it through man. It sucks, but think it through.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 03:15 PM (PX+vn)
101
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickenshit,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickenshit,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:18 PM (Qd6ws)
102
Good lord there are a lot of right wing scumbags on this site!!! Lets start with the basics...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
Posted by: madmatt at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (J8hqn)
103
"Aunt Fester"... Howie, you're on fire!
(although, I never make fun of hair loss- too easy of a karmic target)
(although, I never make fun of hair loss- too easy of a karmic target)
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (PX+vn)
104
Once again the far right misses the point. This isn't about them. It's about us. Do we live under the rule of law or do we live in a dictatorship? It's as simple as that. The President has knowingly and repeatedly violated the law of the land; he's admitted it. His TSP does nothing to protect the nation that couldn't be achieved through the simple expedient of getting a warrant. The government has requested over 10,000 warrants from the FISA court and been denied four times in thirty-seven years. The FISA judges will meet and sign warrants at 3 AM in their living rooms. FISA itself provides for emergency wiretaps whose only requirement is that the government get a (retroactive!) warrant within 72 hours.
The judge is a true patriot. The President broke the law and induced others to break it too. If he thinks he needs warrantless wiretapping, he should ask Congress to amend the law and give him that power. In our open and free system of government, that's thw way it works. But in fact, at the same time that Bush was getting ready to break the law, he was assuring everyone that FISA was fine and he didn't need any more tools.
I can't reconcile how impeachment is justified by perjury in a civil suit about actions from before one's administration, yet it is somehow not not justified by Presidential acts that break the law and violate the Constitution to the detriment of all citizens, and don't even accomplish anything extra...
The judge is a true patriot. The President broke the law and induced others to break it too. If he thinks he needs warrantless wiretapping, he should ask Congress to amend the law and give him that power. In our open and free system of government, that's thw way it works. But in fact, at the same time that Bush was getting ready to break the law, he was assuring everyone that FISA was fine and he didn't need any more tools.
I can't reconcile how impeachment is justified by perjury in a civil suit about actions from before one's administration, yet it is somehow not not justified by Presidential acts that break the law and violate the Constitution to the detriment of all citizens, and don't even accomplish anything extra...
Posted by: Bernard Gilroy at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (tBQ/I)
105
Robert
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (CtVG6)
106
Robert
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
You are an idiot as well. Does Webster's dictionary actually define a dog-eat-dog fight as meaning the leader of a nation can do anything he sees fit? Quit looking so deeply into everything and over interpreting words. You liberals are always trying to find the conspiracy aspect in everything. Go put your tin foil hat back on loser. If you don't think that we have to completely destroy these Islamic extremists, go over to Iraq yourself and negotiate our way out of this peacefully. I'll see what happens to you on Ogrish.com. And no, I don't think Saddam should be reinstalled you jamook. I see things for what they are: Bush is trying to protect this country, not install himself as a fascist leader for life. He's done in '08 remember? I didn't vote for Bush (or anyone else) and I think Rush Limbaugh is a douchebag, so you can put those assumptions up your ass as well...
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (CtVG6)
107
Good lord there are a lot of right wing scumbags on this site!!! Lets start with the basics...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
Posted by: madmatt at August 17, 2006 03:21 PM (J8hqn)
108
Good lord there are a lot of right wing scumbags on this site!!! Lets start with the basics...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
Posted by: madmatt at August 17, 2006 03:21 PM (J8hqn)
109
Good lord there are a lot of right wing scumbags on this site!!! Lets start with the basics...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
Posted by: madmatt at August 17, 2006 03:23 PM (J8hqn)
110
Good lord there are a lot of right wing scumbags on this site!!! Lets start with the basics...
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
1. they hate us for our freedoms so you capitulate and give up our freedoms...who is the traitor?
2. you want to eavesdrop, get a warrent, you have three days after you start tapping.
3. for all the white supremacists on this page, can't you try and win an argument without using the color of the judge? is clarence thomas incompetent now (yes actually, but it isn't due to his skin color)
4. if clinton had listened to your rightwing bullshit calls you would be screaming mad!
5.www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=2034505 proof that there are plenty of bug***k insane "christians" out there as well
6. Find binladin so you pussies can stop wetting yourselves
7.greyrooster you are one stupid scary wackjob...
8. 911 happened when rethugs were in the whitehouse and controlled both houses, and after GWB got a memo saying "bin Ladin Determined to attack the US" and it is liberals who have a problem protecting the country...take your heads from your pucker and smell the shit that the bushies feed you!
Posted by: madmatt at August 17, 2006 03:23 PM (J8hqn)
111
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:23 PM (Qd6ws)
112
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:23 PM (Qd6ws)
113
If you Bush Federalists want complete security without the regard for law or the Constitution, move to China.
Here's a wild and crazy concept. Let's elect representative leaders to protect our laws and obey them, while keeping us resonably safe. I think I will call this outlandish concept: Democracy.
Here's a wild and crazy concept. Let's elect representative leaders to protect our laws and obey them, while keeping us resonably safe. I think I will call this outlandish concept: Democracy.
Posted by: liberul elite hippy at August 17, 2006 03:26 PM (YClF7)
114
To Tommy in Dekalb: Probably because yer calling the sleeper cell Taliban Pizza place in Clarkston!
I bet yer still crying because Cynthia McKinney is out!
I bet yer still crying because Cynthia McKinney is out!
Posted by: Bryherb at August 17, 2006 03:26 PM (dHE1c)
115
Actually under FISA, you can eavsdrop on international calls with terrorists without a warrant and then present casue to the FISA court after the fact.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 03:27 PM (pBKzg)
116
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:28 PM (Qd6ws)
117
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:28 PM (Qd6ws)
118
to jacks smirking revenge: so your sooooo damn scared that
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
you will let the govt. monitor all you communications?
you ignorant fox sheep,thats just what they want,comlpiant sheep morons like you,bush-cheney are laughung at sheep like you.
I suppose you were crapping your pants about the egyptian
students that were on the loose.chickens****
,your no safer
than before,show some guts!!
Posted by: tom at August 17, 2006 03:28 PM (Qd6ws)
119
Actually under FISA, you can eavsdrop on international calls with terrorists without a warrant and then present casue to the FISA court after the fact.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 03:30 PM (pBKzg)
120
Tom,
The point is I don't have anything to hide. I don't do or say anything "terroristy" or frequent kiddy-porn websites, so the thought of the government monitoring my emails or phone calls doesn't really bother me. And if those 11 Egyptians are planning something untoward, we'll see who the fox sheep (?) really is. I'll be zeroing my weapon, and you'll be hiding in the local YMCA holding hands with the rest of the man bear pigs (?).
The point is I don't have anything to hide. I don't do or say anything "terroristy" or frequent kiddy-porn websites, so the thought of the government monitoring my emails or phone calls doesn't really bother me. And if those 11 Egyptians are planning something untoward, we'll see who the fox sheep (?) really is. I'll be zeroing my weapon, and you'll be hiding in the local YMCA holding hands with the rest of the man bear pigs (?).
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 03:32 PM (CtVG6)
121
Wow Jack- Hasn't anyone warned you that cowardice coupled with ignorance and anger is a very unstable mix?
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 03:35 PM (FyFm5)
122
Chief Justice Warren, 1967: “Implicit in the term ‘national defense’ is the notion of defending those values and ideas which set this nation apart.â€
I like that.
I like that.
Posted by: grinnel at August 17, 2006 03:37 PM (UHKaK)
123
Why can't these lefturds learn to push the button once?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:38 PM (jgE7Y)
124
Why can't these lefturds learn to push the button once?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:38 PM (jgE7Y)
125
Why can't these lefturds learn to push the button once?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:39 PM (jgE7Y)
126
The Brits use an aggressive surveillance program that only needs a suspicion to act. They prevented the next 9-11. When WE try to do the same thing - to protect ourselves against a ruthless enemy - liberals go insane. You give up some minor civil rights during war time to protect our fellow citizens. What purpose do you think the Bush admin has to "spy" on phone calls as you call it? Just nothing to do, and figure it would be a good time? LET GO OF YOUR CONSTANT anger against BUSH and try to see the big picture. I will give up some privacy to protect even liberal idiots who don't care if my family is on those planes. We MUST thwart these attacks - the enemy within , liberals, just DONT GET IT, stuck in a theoretical world. So if he got a "warrant" that would make it ok with you? IS that all it takes to appease your arguement? He wanted to keep it all secret, until the NYTIMES and the other liberal enemies within exposed it.
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 03:41 PM (eB7xO)
127
Tried it. Nothing extra happened.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:42 PM (jgE7Y)
128
The Brits use an aggressive surveillance program that only needs a suspicion to act. They prevented the next 9-11. When WE try to do the same thing - to protect ourselves against a ruthless enemy - liberals go insane. You give up some minor civil rights during war time to protect our fellow citizens. What purpose do you think the Bush admin has to "spy" on phone calls as you call it? Just nothing to do, and figure it would be a good time? LET GO OF YOUR CONSTANT anger against BUSH and try to see the big picture. I will give up some privacy to protect even liberal idiots who don't care if my family is on those planes. We MUST thwart these attacks - the enemy within , liberals, just DONT GET IT, stuck in a theoretical world. So if he got a "warrant" that would make it ok with you? IS that all it takes to appease your arguement? He wanted to keep it all secret, until the NYTIMES and the other liberal enemies within exposed it.
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 03:42 PM (eB7xO)
129
My bad Jacks Smirking Revenge.
Thank God you're not one of those short-thinkers who voted for Bush, or who don't realize Rush's schtick is to protect his moneyed interests (It's amazing this schtick fools anyone).
Like most things Bush has tried in his career, his attempt to protect this country is also a miserable failure.
("I'll see the 3000 Americans killed on 9/11, and raise you another 2600+ US soldiers killed in Iraq").
It's good to know you don't believe Bush can break the law just because there is a war going on (again, a lot of short thinkers feel he can).
You also sound like you know the difference between Islamists and Islamist facists. Again, lots of short thinkers can't tell the difference.
Hell, I'll bet you know that ALL religious extremists are a threat to this great country.
Sounds like we have more in common, than differences.
So why the personal attacks on me?
Thank God you're not one of those short-thinkers who voted for Bush, or who don't realize Rush's schtick is to protect his moneyed interests (It's amazing this schtick fools anyone).
Like most things Bush has tried in his career, his attempt to protect this country is also a miserable failure.
("I'll see the 3000 Americans killed on 9/11, and raise you another 2600+ US soldiers killed in Iraq").
It's good to know you don't believe Bush can break the law just because there is a war going on (again, a lot of short thinkers feel he can).
You also sound like you know the difference between Islamists and Islamist facists. Again, lots of short thinkers can't tell the difference.
Hell, I'll bet you know that ALL religious extremists are a threat to this great country.
Sounds like we have more in common, than differences.
So why the personal attacks on me?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 03:43 PM (VTtVl)
130
The Brits use an aggressive surveillance program that only needs a suspicion to act. They prevented the next 9-11. When WE try to do the same thing - to protect ourselves against a ruthless enemy - liberals go insane. You give up some minor civil rights during war time to protect our fellow citizens. What purpose do you think the Bush admin has to "spy" on phone calls as you call it? Just nothing to do, and figure it would be a good time? LET GO OF YOUR CONSTANT anger against BUSH and try to see the big picture. I will give up some privacy to protect even liberal idiots who don't care if my family is on those planes. We MUST thwart these attacks - the enemy within , liberals, just DONT GET IT, stuck in a theoretical world. So if he got a "warrant" that would make it ok with you? IS that all it takes to appease your arguement? He wanted to keep it all secret, until the NYTIMES and the other liberal enemies within exposed it.
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 03:43 PM (eB7xO)
131
Oh, I guess the BA in Political Science with a minor in Middle East politics (I know, I know-I'm lying) would make me ignorant...and the rifle under my bed would make me a coward...and the fact that I don't take jabs from anyone much less liberal retards like Tom and Robert makes me angry...right? Maybe its just that I don't take things lying down like you, man. Do you walk around with a mattress tied to your back? Enough with this schoolyard babble. Looks like the libtards have taken over this thread. JSR out.
Posted by: Jacks Smirking Revenge at August 17, 2006 03:44 PM (CtVG6)
132
My bad Jacks Smirking Revenge.
Thank God you're not one of those short-thinkers who voted for Bush, or who don't realize Rush's schtick is to protect his moneyed interests (It's amazing this schtick fools anyone).
Like most things Bush has tried in his career, his attempt to protect this country is also a miserable failure.
("I'll see the 3000 Americans killed on 9/11, and raise you another 2600+ US soldiers killed in Iraq").
It's good to know you don't believe Bush can break the law just because there is a war going on (again, a lot of short thinkers feel he can).
You also sound like you know the difference between Islamists and Islamist facists. Again, lots of short thinkers can't tell the difference.
Hell, I'll bet you know that ALL religious extremists are a threat to this great country.
Sounds like we have more in common, than differences.
So why the personal attacks on me?
Thank God you're not one of those short-thinkers who voted for Bush, or who don't realize Rush's schtick is to protect his moneyed interests (It's amazing this schtick fools anyone).
Like most things Bush has tried in his career, his attempt to protect this country is also a miserable failure.
("I'll see the 3000 Americans killed on 9/11, and raise you another 2600+ US soldiers killed in Iraq").
It's good to know you don't believe Bush can break the law just because there is a war going on (again, a lot of short thinkers feel he can).
You also sound like you know the difference between Islamists and Islamist facists. Again, lots of short thinkers can't tell the difference.
Hell, I'll bet you know that ALL religious extremists are a threat to this great country.
Sounds like we have more in common, than differences.
So why the personal attacks on me?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 03:48 PM (VTtVl)
133
Actually under FISA, you can eavsdrop on international calls with terrorists without a warrant and then present casue to the FISA court after the fact.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
The amount of ignorance that you wingers spew is amazing. Noone is saying not to survey the terrorists. We just have a law passed by Congress that adressess how to do it within the confines of the Fourth Amendment, which even goes so far as allowing the procurment of a warrant after the fact. The amount of fear you people have and live with is amazing. And the reality is you should be much more afraid of an executive branch that thinks they can ignore acts of congress and the plain language of the constituition, if history is any indication of approporate levels and sources of fear.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 03:49 PM (pBKzg)
134
The don't believe we are at war. They thing their enemy is us.
How can they listen to this and not know who their enemy is? I don't know if this woman is liberal/conservative or what. But she is my compatriot. Damn strait it's my duty to make the bastards pay through the nose for this. It is war.
Doi's call
How can they listen to this and not know who their enemy is? I don't know if this woman is liberal/conservative or what. But she is my compatriot. Damn strait it's my duty to make the bastards pay through the nose for this. It is war.
Doi's call
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 03:50 PM (YdcZ0)
135
Jack, my guess is you probably take it lying on your belly, but that image is rather grotesque, so let's not go there.
Did you also minor in "Reactionary Redneckism" at whatever correspondance school you "attended"?
Did you also minor in "Reactionary Redneckism" at whatever correspondance school you "attended"?
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 03:52 PM (FyFm5)
136
Don't you just love it when some commie liberal blog sends these leftards over to our blog in mass. Fine with me but the chicken shits will run off before being converted to the good side.
To all you liberal turd balls. No one here is against the constitution. You democrats are so used to lying to get your way you can't stop.
What we are saying is that we differ with the interpretation of a black ancient liberal judge appointed by the dumbest president in history. One who lives in an area with a high concentration of muslims. No one is being fooled. We know why the ACLU took their suit to this particular judge.
Hate your President if you must. You democrats ran a better man. Yea, right.
Quit lying or more on.
To all you liberal turd balls. No one here is against the constitution. You democrats are so used to lying to get your way you can't stop.
What we are saying is that we differ with the interpretation of a black ancient liberal judge appointed by the dumbest president in history. One who lives in an area with a high concentration of muslims. No one is being fooled. We know why the ACLU took their suit to this particular judge.
Hate your President if you must. You democrats ran a better man. Yea, right.
Quit lying or more on.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:58 PM (jgE7Y)
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 03:58 PM (PX+vn)
138
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5658950
What would FDR have done? what would Truman have done? What would Kennedy have done? what would Johnson have done? I'll tell you, they would have stomped a mudhole the terrorist's ass and walked it dry.
You people are not Democrats or liberals you are traitors! Traitors to your party's traditions, traitors to our nation and traitors to Melissa Doi.
All because you are not leading the fight. Like little children you turn on your brothers because you havn't gotten your way. You want the oval office and you are willing to betray your nation because you don't have it you bull headed little pussy children.
What would FDR have done? what would Truman have done? What would Kennedy have done? what would Johnson have done? I'll tell you, they would have stomped a mudhole the terrorist's ass and walked it dry.
You people are not Democrats or liberals you are traitors! Traitors to your party's traditions, traitors to our nation and traitors to Melissa Doi.
All because you are not leading the fight. Like little children you turn on your brothers because you havn't gotten your way. You want the oval office and you are willing to betray your nation because you don't have it you bull headed little pussy children.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 04:03 PM (YdcZ0)
139
greyrooster,
I saw you used the adjective "black" to describe the judge. I'm sure that's important.
Isn't it littledick?
I saw you used the adjective "black" to describe the judge. I'm sure that's important.
Isn't it littledick?
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 04:03 PM (VTtVl)
140
Warrant? I said I was going to get that during one of my many 5 week war-time vacations. I'm just waiting for a rainy day.... Fore! ( The man who would be king presiding over culture of corruption )
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 04:05 PM (gLMre)
141
Typical leftard answer always addressing someones dick. All you friggin faggots are the same. If you can't see the reasoning of bringing up the fact that she is black you're living in the 70's. Blacks from a black area usually vote along with the blacks. Blacks are normally democrats. Why. Because they whine just like you. Same as you faggots vote democratic. Blacks and faggots like you are usually the first to demean our president. Why? because he doesn't follow your sissy assed agenda. In your case because he's against gay marriage. Nice try piss ant. But being a man I don't need to kiss black ass. or suck it in your case.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 04:12 PM (jgE7Y)
142
The left speaks quite a lot about the Constitution and upholding it yet they are do not wish to defend it.
The decision in this case says that journalists, etc are not permitted to do their jobs because the surveilance might keep their sources from talking. explain to me how this is a bad thing.
The Constitution is for American citizens. If an overseas call comes in to the US it does not automatically have that protection nor do those on the call. If a call comes in from overseas from a number associated with terrorists than not only should the govt be allowed to monitor it IT SHOULD BE EXPECTED to monitor it.
Another argument in this case is that the taps violate freedom of speech. I don't see this at all. Just because you have freedom of speech does not mean that you can be irresponsible with it. You may not yell "fire" in a crowded room. And you certainly may not commit treason. If a US citizen is plotting with a member of a terrorist organization outside of the US he is a traitor. If he is not a citizen he is simply a terrorist criminal.
And those who claim that we right wingers would be pissed if this was a democrat in office are inexplicably incorrect. If the left is so upset about these infringements on our rights than I suggest they dig up FDR's corpse and defecate on it. How about JFK? How about Carter? How about Clinton? I don't hear the right screeching about them. Why is the left's outrage only about George W. Bush?
The enemy that we are dealing with here is ugly and viscious. Those of you who go out of your way in the name of "civil right" when you honestly don't mean it are empowering the enemy. This war is only going to get worse. And with allies like the left in this country terrorist organizations will steamroll us with ridiculous ease.
What it comes down to is that same irrational hatred of George W. Bush. It is a sickness, this hate. I never liked Clinton but I don't recall ever coming remotely close to this kind of verbal diarrhea and mental constipation during his horrific tenure.
Seriously ... the American left needs to start being part of the solution instead of only criticising. If you hate the surveillance program so much then come up with an alternative. Seriously ... how do you in the left suggest that we combat these people that want to kill us all or make us convert? Because, quite frankly, I have no desire to wear a burka and will kill anyone who tries to force it on me. Well? How about it? What is the left's brilliant plan?
Incidentally I don't think ANY of you on the left are concerned about this being an issue of waarants. Not in the least.
The decision in this case says that journalists, etc are not permitted to do their jobs because the surveilance might keep their sources from talking. explain to me how this is a bad thing.
The Constitution is for American citizens. If an overseas call comes in to the US it does not automatically have that protection nor do those on the call. If a call comes in from overseas from a number associated with terrorists than not only should the govt be allowed to monitor it IT SHOULD BE EXPECTED to monitor it.
Another argument in this case is that the taps violate freedom of speech. I don't see this at all. Just because you have freedom of speech does not mean that you can be irresponsible with it. You may not yell "fire" in a crowded room. And you certainly may not commit treason. If a US citizen is plotting with a member of a terrorist organization outside of the US he is a traitor. If he is not a citizen he is simply a terrorist criminal.
And those who claim that we right wingers would be pissed if this was a democrat in office are inexplicably incorrect. If the left is so upset about these infringements on our rights than I suggest they dig up FDR's corpse and defecate on it. How about JFK? How about Carter? How about Clinton? I don't hear the right screeching about them. Why is the left's outrage only about George W. Bush?
The enemy that we are dealing with here is ugly and viscious. Those of you who go out of your way in the name of "civil right" when you honestly don't mean it are empowering the enemy. This war is only going to get worse. And with allies like the left in this country terrorist organizations will steamroll us with ridiculous ease.
What it comes down to is that same irrational hatred of George W. Bush. It is a sickness, this hate. I never liked Clinton but I don't recall ever coming remotely close to this kind of verbal diarrhea and mental constipation during his horrific tenure.
Seriously ... the American left needs to start being part of the solution instead of only criticising. If you hate the surveillance program so much then come up with an alternative. Seriously ... how do you in the left suggest that we combat these people that want to kill us all or make us convert? Because, quite frankly, I have no desire to wear a burka and will kill anyone who tries to force it on me. Well? How about it? What is the left's brilliant plan?
Incidentally I don't think ANY of you on the left are concerned about this being an issue of waarants. Not in the least.
Posted by: Alisa at August 17, 2006 04:13 PM (ds0+e)
143
Umm, QC, a telecommunications expert like you profess to be surely should be seen with Skoal drool on her chin.
Guess what- I can also say "idiot"!
"Jawas" are too cute and innocent (occasional robbery excepted, of course) to be referenced by this 'blog- I think "Kowardly Klan against the Konstitution" fits much better. Rooster sure seems like the perfect racist fool to serve as "Grand Wizard".
Getter done, ladies!
Guess what- I can also say "idiot"!
"Jawas" are too cute and innocent (occasional robbery excepted, of course) to be referenced by this 'blog- I think "Kowardly Klan against the Konstitution" fits much better. Rooster sure seems like the perfect racist fool to serve as "Grand Wizard".
Getter done, ladies!
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 04:13 PM (FyFm5)
144
"Allowing the NSa to check on who I am calling overseas is not losing a civil liberty."
And asking the President to get court approval is not a big burden either.
Keep in mind that we are whining about the fact that the administration must now follow the law and get a warrant, not that they are not allowed to do their jobs and track terrorists.
And asking the President to get court approval is not a big burden either.
Keep in mind that we are whining about the fact that the administration must now follow the law and get a warrant, not that they are not allowed to do their jobs and track terrorists.
Posted by: Adam at August 17, 2006 04:15 PM (nlezP)
145
There it is again, another nuanced liberal perspective. JUST if he gets a warrant - if it wasnt the warrant, it would be something else. If he can get the warrant, whats the diff to you? Sounds like just more angry anti bush.
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 04:18 PM (eB7xO)
146
Grovelingdog: You know. The more I think about it. I honestly believe I would rather be a Grand Wizard than the leftist coward you are. At least they claim to be pro American. You leftist dogs are merely mouths for everything that would turn America into a grovelingdog like yourself. Get some balls punk. And keep kissing or sucking on those black asses. Makes you think your safe don't it. Ah, but they'll burn your car along with the rest.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 04:22 PM (jgE7Y)
147
Yes they get so invloved in thier complex thoughts that the common sense simplicty that overrides them is beyond their capacity. If there is a fox in the henhouse you shoot the damn thing. You don't fuss over the morality of it. If you do your kids get no eggs. See simple.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 04:25 PM (YdcZ0)
148
The dead elephant in the room:
Warrants.
There is absolutely no reason why the Bush administration could not have run their program, without getting warrants from FISA.
Up to 72 hours after the fact.
Period.
The Bush administration chose to avoid them, when instead they could easily have solved this problem by
a) getting warrants, or
b) encrypt the identities of everyone surveilled WITHOUT warrants, then look for patterns, and when they see a suspicious pattern, THEN getting a warrant.
Oops.
So. It's not judge who messed up. It's the fault of the people who put the program into place, without doing it right.
Period.
Put the blame where it rests. Don't blame the messenger for the mess.
Warrants.
There is absolutely no reason why the Bush administration could not have run their program, without getting warrants from FISA.
Up to 72 hours after the fact.
Period.
The Bush administration chose to avoid them, when instead they could easily have solved this problem by
a) getting warrants, or
b) encrypt the identities of everyone surveilled WITHOUT warrants, then look for patterns, and when they see a suspicious pattern, THEN getting a warrant.
Oops.
So. It's not judge who messed up. It's the fault of the people who put the program into place, without doing it right.
Period.
Put the blame where it rests. Don't blame the messenger for the mess.
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 04:32 PM (QAh+h)
149
Ha ha! The anti-american GWB and his whole dirty plan...goin' down. God bless the American Judicial system, eh? And America.
Posted by: Tula Zee Patriot at August 17, 2006 04:37 PM (hxlZc)
150
How do you know they don't do that? You are making an assumption. So next you will want to know all the details in public? Do you work for the NYT?
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 04:37 PM (YdcZ0)
151
greyrooster,
So now you realize that Katherine Harris tossing 98,000 black voters in Florida off the voting rolls might just have helped W win the election by 543 votes in 2000?
I know, we're not supposed to bring up something that happened more than 4 years ago unless it 9/11, Chappaquiddick, or Clinton.
BTW, the dry cleaner called. Your white robe and hood are ready for you.
Any of you righties want to side yourself with this unAmerican racist?
Also greyrooster, post back how high you jumped when you read this: Boo!!!
Stopthedonkey at 4:18,
Make stuff up if you feel it helps you make your point.
So now you realize that Katherine Harris tossing 98,000 black voters in Florida off the voting rolls might just have helped W win the election by 543 votes in 2000?
I know, we're not supposed to bring up something that happened more than 4 years ago unless it 9/11, Chappaquiddick, or Clinton.
BTW, the dry cleaner called. Your white robe and hood are ready for you.
Any of you righties want to side yourself with this unAmerican racist?
Also greyrooster, post back how high you jumped when you read this: Boo!!!
Stopthedonkey at 4:18,
Make stuff up if you feel it helps you make your point.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 04:38 PM (VTtVl)
152
jim. You don't get it. There is no privacy on a phone. It's like standing on your roof and screaming to your neighbor across the streed at the top of your lungs. Sound that travels several thousand miles and across national borders.... how does privacy apply here?
If you owned the phones on both ends, and all the copper and telco's in between, and the land the copper was strung on, and secured it physically - then you would have a private call.
If you owned the phones on both ends, and all the copper and telco's in between, and the land the copper was strung on, and secured it physically - then you would have a private call.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 04:39 PM (PX+vn)
Posted by: Bill Faith at August 17, 2006 04:44 PM (n7SaI)
154
As I had long suspected, young Mr. Bush has now been determined to be a criminal - and a rather common one at that. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978,states in pertinent part at Title 50, Chapter 36, Subchapter I § 1809 Criminal sanctions:
A person is guilty of an offense if he intentionally—
(1) engages in electronic surveillance under color of law except as authorized by statute; . . .
Penalties
An offense described in this section is punishable by a fine of not more than $10,000 or imprisonment for not more than five years, or both.
For each count. Dust off some cells in Leavenworth.
A person is guilty of an offense if he intentionally—
(1) engages in electronic surveillance under color of law except as authorized by statute; . . .
Penalties
An offense described in this section is punishable by a fine of not more than $10,000 or imprisonment for not more than five years, or both.
For each count. Dust off some cells in Leavenworth.
Posted by: robert lewis at August 17, 2006 04:45 PM (+J4wd)
155
Robert at 4:38 STOP just STOP hating your own country so much - blame TERRORISTS. ITS TERRORISTS that want to kill you NOT BUSH. Just read that a few times Robert I know it will take time. TERRORISTS are the problem. STOP fearing your own government, inept as they are, are TRYING to protect you against a ruthless enemy. STOP blaming BUSH and start blaming TERRORISTS. For all of our good.
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 04:46 PM (eB7xO)
156
QC,
So its legal for me to listen in on your phone calls?
Cool.
What's your phone number, just curious.
So its legal for me to listen in on your phone calls?
Cool.
What's your phone number, just curious.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 04:47 PM (VTtVl)
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 04:52 PM (YdcZ0)
158
Robert, feel free to listen in to all of my international phone calls (all 1 of them ever). But you must have the mad skillz to find out the numbers.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 04:54 PM (PX+vn)
159
On the subject of warrants: since 1978 about 15,000 warrants have been granted. 4 of 5 have been denied. Geeze - I guess it was just too much bother to get warrants within 72 hours of initiating the wiretap. I guess keeping us safe just wasn't worth all that trouble. It was just so much easier to break the law - and make excuses.
Not taht much different from a tax cheat, I guess.
Not taht much different from a tax cheat, I guess.
Posted by: robert lewis at August 17, 2006 04:55 PM (+J4wd)
160
QC,
You are factually incorrect. There is an expectation of privacy for phone calls. In one instance, the High Court has held there is no expectation of privacy in the phone numbers you call, but there is certainly, without a doubt, an expectation of privacy and a privacy right to the contents of any conversation. That is why the police have to get a warrantto tap a phone line.
Want to try again?
You are factually incorrect. There is an expectation of privacy for phone calls. In one instance, the High Court has held there is no expectation of privacy in the phone numbers you call, but there is certainly, without a doubt, an expectation of privacy and a privacy right to the contents of any conversation. That is why the police have to get a warrantto tap a phone line.
Want to try again?
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 04:56 PM (pBKzg)
161
On the subject of warrants: since 1978 about 15,000 warrants have been granted. 4 of 5 have been denied. Geeze - I guess it was just too much bother to get warrants within 72 hours of initiating the wiretap. I guess keeping us safe just wasn't worth all that trouble. It was just so much easier to break the law - and make excuses.
Not that much different from a tax cheat, I guess.
Not that much different from a tax cheat, I guess.
Posted by: robert lewis at August 17, 2006 04:56 PM (+J4wd)
162
Queeecy- It is apparently YOU who doesn't get it. Rather than let you continue to embarass yourself, why not learn what "expectation of privacy" is, and while I am feeling charitable, here are a few additions cites-
Bill of Rights, particularly the fourth and fifth amendments, and Am.Jur.2d Telecommunications § 209 (1974).
Grand Wizard Greygirl- Just curious, do you hate Jews as much as you despise blacks and Eurasians? Do you talk and act as brave as you post, or is this just the typical cowardly expression of your anger over you personal lack of success and satisfaction in your life.
OF COURSE you'd rather be a Grand Wizard, and THANKS for clearing that up- you get to wear a MASK! I wonder, do you cuddle with inflatable Rummy and W lifesized, anatomically-correct dolls when you snuggle beneath your blankey?
Bill of Rights, particularly the fourth and fifth amendments, and Am.Jur.2d Telecommunications § 209 (1974).
Grand Wizard Greygirl- Just curious, do you hate Jews as much as you despise blacks and Eurasians? Do you talk and act as brave as you post, or is this just the typical cowardly expression of your anger over you personal lack of success and satisfaction in your life.
OF COURSE you'd rather be a Grand Wizard, and THANKS for clearing that up- you get to wear a MASK! I wonder, do you cuddle with inflatable Rummy and W lifesized, anatomically-correct dolls when you snuggle beneath your blankey?
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 04:59 PM (FyFm5)
163
Ah you see you are onto something. The Police have to. To be prosecute you have to. Military intelligence is not the same thing.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 05:02 PM (YdcZ0)
164
robert lewis,
With this Administrations luck, the warrant to listen in on Howard Dean's phone calls would be one of the few they wouldn't be able to get.
Maybe, this is why they try to listen in illegally.
With this Administrations luck, the warrant to listen in on Howard Dean's phone calls would be one of the few they wouldn't be able to get.
Maybe, this is why they try to listen in illegally.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 05:04 PM (VTtVl)
165
It's hard reading these comments. I'm a Navy vet, having spent 10 years of my life defending the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic - including the first Gulf War 15 years or so ago as well as two tours in Somalia. I spent that time because I felt that the Constitution was worth defending, as well as the Citizens that it represented.
I didn't spend that decade in order to see a whiny bunch of ball-less pussies fall all over themselves to see who can be quickest to give up their civil rights in order to feel 'safe'. My God, life isn't safe and it never has been - and never will be. The best we can hope for is to defend our way of life and that is embodied in the document so many of you are so ready to let go.
Franklin had it right - "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
As for me, all of you who are so very ready to forfeit your liberty for safety, please feel free to leave the country to those of us who are actually Americans.
I didn't spend that decade in order to see a whiny bunch of ball-less pussies fall all over themselves to see who can be quickest to give up their civil rights in order to feel 'safe'. My God, life isn't safe and it never has been - and never will be. The best we can hope for is to defend our way of life and that is embodied in the document so many of you are so ready to let go.
Franklin had it right - "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
As for me, all of you who are so very ready to forfeit your liberty for safety, please feel free to leave the country to those of us who are actually Americans.
Posted by: Brent at August 17, 2006 05:05 PM (VBB8E)
166
LAK and Grovertdog, I just can't find any reference to "INTERNATIONAL phone calls" in your wonderfully linked sources.
I know my enemies... I bet you guys think Hizbullah is legitimate, and should retain it's arms- but are opposed to the Minutemen Civil Border Patrol.
I know my enemies... I bet you guys think Hizbullah is legitimate, and should retain it's arms- but are opposed to the Minutemen Civil Border Patrol.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 05:07 PM (PX+vn)
167
Robert you are not only a faggot but a liar when you call me unAmerican. Lying is a thing with you commies. Never changes. Kiss asses and lie. How boring a life you mother fuckers must lead. How come you faggot lie so much? What's wrong with racism. You kiss black asses and I've never met a black that wasn't a racist. Doesn't make sense to me.
I do think you to be a coward. Probably why you feel you need to kiss up to blacks. Since their are none where I live and play I don't have to kiss their asses. If it wasn't blacks you would be kissing other asses so doesn't matter.
The truth is, you leftards are the anti-Americans. Your cause is to do anything to demean our elected president whether or not you hurt the nation. That to me is traitorous. So I call you a traitor. And for now fuck you. My grandson just arrived.
I do think you to be a coward. Probably why you feel you need to kiss up to blacks. Since their are none where I live and play I don't have to kiss their asses. If it wasn't blacks you would be kissing other asses so doesn't matter.
The truth is, you leftards are the anti-Americans. Your cause is to do anything to demean our elected president whether or not you hurt the nation. That to me is traitorous. So I call you a traitor. And for now fuck you. My grandson just arrived.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 05:07 PM (jgE7Y)
168
why are conservatives so afraid of terrorists that they are willing to surrender their unalienable rights? great at chest thumping...but can't wait to surrender at the first threat. wusses.
Posted by: jay k. at August 17, 2006 05:08 PM (yu9pS)
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 05:10 PM (FyFm5)
170
The amount of bigotry and lack of understanding of basic constitutional principles by the right wingers on this site is hard to fathom. Congress passes a bill explicitly dealing with the government monitoring of international phone calls, and crafts it such that it is as expansive as the 4th amendment allows, and then teh President decides to ignore this law and the constitution. First he argues that he was granted such power implicitly when Congress passes its grant of war powers. But that can't be the case, since Congress amended the Patriort Act and renewed and amended FISA to include foreign terrorists, not just agents of a soverign foriegn states, AFTER the grant of war powers. So relying on implict Congressional intent gets you nowhere. What is left is to argue that the commander in cheif clause in teh COnstitution somehow trups bothe the 4th Amendment and the basic separation of powers and checks and balances at teh core of our system of government. That is just a silly argument. Y'all wingers simply have no idea what you are talking about. You can't even begin to get passed the ignorant notion that just because people want the President to stay within the rule of law, those same people love terrorists or want all intelligence gathering and anti-terrorism efforts to stop. It is a ridiculous, disingenuous argument. Nothing short of ignorant, fearful reactionary foolishness.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 05:12 PM (pBKzg)
171
jim. You don't get it. There is no privacy on a phone. .... how does privacy apply here?
QC, it applies because...that's the law.
I mean, we can have a discussion about whether or not that SHOULD be the way it is. But the bottom line is, that IS how it is right now.
The law of this land requries a warrant for telephone surveillance. And, once again, all the Bush admin had to do to be compliant with the law, was to either a) get warrants, or b) work out a way to clearly keep from knowing specific identities and conversations, so they wouldn't need the warrants.
They did neither, and so they broke the law.
That really is the beginning and the end of it.
QC, it applies because...that's the law.
I mean, we can have a discussion about whether or not that SHOULD be the way it is. But the bottom line is, that IS how it is right now.
The law of this land requries a warrant for telephone surveillance. And, once again, all the Bush admin had to do to be compliant with the law, was to either a) get warrants, or b) work out a way to clearly keep from knowing specific identities and conversations, so they wouldn't need the warrants.
They did neither, and so they broke the law.
That really is the beginning and the end of it.
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 05:13 PM (QAh+h)
172
QC,
FISA pertains directly to domestic to international communications, and was written up to the bounds of teh 4th amendment. The right to privacy exists for a citizen no matter who he is calling, internationally or across the street. This is not disputable ore questionabe. There is no dispute GWB can listen in on fully foreign phone calls by aliens all he wants. You should not need to be told this, nor should you be asking for citations to the basic constituitional principle that citizens of the U.S. are the ones afforded constitutional protection.
Methinks you are ignorant of law.
FISA pertains directly to domestic to international communications, and was written up to the bounds of teh 4th amendment. The right to privacy exists for a citizen no matter who he is calling, internationally or across the street. This is not disputable ore questionabe. There is no dispute GWB can listen in on fully foreign phone calls by aliens all he wants. You should not need to be told this, nor should you be asking for citations to the basic constituitional principle that citizens of the U.S. are the ones afforded constitutional protection.
Methinks you are ignorant of law.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 05:17 PM (pBKzg)
173
Oh! Katherine Harris was instrumental in saving this nation. God bless her.
Brent: 10 years as a navy puss. What couldn't hack it? No one spends 10 years and doesn't stay for 20. I think you're the pussy. Franklyn also said no mans life, liberty or property is safe when congress is in session. Meaning stupid cowardly, piss ant liberal can screw America up with the rulings.
Groveling dog: You don't fool anyone. You're a sissy and you know it. As I said. Grand Wizard would be better than turning butts up and being a commie bastard like yourself.
Do you hate Jews. Why do you leftards wish not to help them. A cowardly act. But as I said before you're a sissy hiding behind a computer. Keep groveling dog.
News for the lefturds. You will lose again.
Brent: 10 years as a navy puss. What couldn't hack it? No one spends 10 years and doesn't stay for 20. I think you're the pussy. Franklyn also said no mans life, liberty or property is safe when congress is in session. Meaning stupid cowardly, piss ant liberal can screw America up with the rulings.
Groveling dog: You don't fool anyone. You're a sissy and you know it. As I said. Grand Wizard would be better than turning butts up and being a commie bastard like yourself.
Do you hate Jews. Why do you leftards wish not to help them. A cowardly act. But as I said before you're a sissy hiding behind a computer. Keep groveling dog.
News for the lefturds. You will lose again.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 05:22 PM (jgE7Y)
174
Hey Fascist, get a clue.
Quoting the late Chief Justice Earl Warren, Taylor wrote: "Implicit in the term 'national defense' is the notion of defending those values and ideas which set this nation apart ... It would indeed be ironic if, in the name of national defense, we would sanction the subversion of ... those liberties ... which make the defense of the nation worthwhile."
Quoting the late Chief Justice Earl Warren, Taylor wrote: "Implicit in the term 'national defense' is the notion of defending those values and ideas which set this nation apart ... It would indeed be ironic if, in the name of national defense, we would sanction the subversion of ... those liberties ... which make the defense of the nation worthwhile."
Posted by: TGintheUSA at August 17, 2006 05:27 PM (UJUQ9)
175
LAK, unignorize me. This is your chance. Link me
to the law requiring a warrant for international communications
surveillance. Show me some of that "out reach" to the underprivileged that the left is
always talking about. Come on, I'm disenfranchised.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 05:28 PM (PX+vn)
176
Greygirl-
Just curious, is your grandson named "Mandingo"?
Also- do you think your rantings about cowards, sissys, gays, blacks, whatever do anything to lend yourself credibilty? You Archie Bunker types are so precious. Chickenshit and ignorant, but precious.
Greygirl's logic- "terrorists" hate us for our freedom so BY ALL MEANS, LET'S GIVE UP THE FREEDOM!
Chickenshit really sums it up.
Just curious, is your grandson named "Mandingo"?
Also- do you think your rantings about cowards, sissys, gays, blacks, whatever do anything to lend yourself credibilty? You Archie Bunker types are so precious. Chickenshit and ignorant, but precious.
Greygirl's logic- "terrorists" hate us for our freedom so BY ALL MEANS, LET'S GIVE UP THE FREEDOM!
Chickenshit really sums it up.
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 05:34 PM (FyFm5)
177
Anyone who forgoes their constitutionally protected rights for the fake GWOT is a fool and a coward.
Posted by: John Gillnitz at August 17, 2006 05:40 PM (eHLUP)
178
QC,
I'm not sure what you are asking for. The executive branch can listen in on completely international communications all they want without a warrant. It is called spying. However if the call is not fully international and is going to or from a US citizen, then a warrant is always needed. If the surveillance realtes to intelligence gathering then FISA applies, and even allows the procurement of a warrant after the listeneing is done, but it always requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen.
Educated yourself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Act#Provisions_of_FISA
I'm not sure what you are asking for. The executive branch can listen in on completely international communications all they want without a warrant. It is called spying. However if the call is not fully international and is going to or from a US citizen, then a warrant is always needed. If the surveillance realtes to intelligence gathering then FISA applies, and even allows the procurement of a warrant after the listeneing is done, but it always requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen.
Educated yourself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Act#Provisions_of_FISA
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 05:49 PM (pBKzg)
179
Greyrooster is a total pussy.
Posted by: X at August 17, 2006 05:50 PM (L33Ii)
180
I have read the Constitution. It does not have anything about phones in it. Of course, there were no phones back then. But there was common sense, which seems to be lacking in the left.
If, we are all Americans here, why does our country allow so many Muslims into this country? If we use common sense, we all know most of those who are terrorists, or support terrorists should be monitored, and or, not allowed in this country. They want us dead, and have stated such.
I suggest ALL Americans pull together, and look at the real problem. Islam.
If, we are all Americans here, why does our country allow so many Muslims into this country? If we use common sense, we all know most of those who are terrorists, or support terrorists should be monitored, and or, not allowed in this country. They want us dead, and have stated such.
I suggest ALL Americans pull together, and look at the real problem. Islam.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 17, 2006 05:52 PM (D2g/j)
181
And let's not forget the plain language of the constitution:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 05:54 PM (pBKzg)
182
X,
How is it going in Britain? Our you folks tripping over yourselves to not call a spade a spade? How many Muslims did you guys round up, and question? How does it feel to be a new world order prick without weapons? I bet you think the state is greater than the man, and will save you.
Eat shit X, and have a great day.
How is it going in Britain? Our you folks tripping over yourselves to not call a spade a spade? How many Muslims did you guys round up, and question? How does it feel to be a new world order prick without weapons? I bet you think the state is greater than the man, and will save you.
Eat shit X, and have a great day.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 17, 2006 06:00 PM (D2g/j)
183
Interestingly enough, the British stopped the terrorist plot and arrested the suspects with fully legal wiretaps and good ol' fashioned solid police work. And they didn't even invade Iraq to do it.
Boy, what a bunch of saps, eh?
Boy, what a bunch of saps, eh?
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 06:04 PM (QAh+h)
184
Just figured out why groveling dog is so worried about what others think of blacks. His mama one and is still tying to find which one is his daddy.
A black faggot.
A black faggot.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 06:10 PM (Sc2TP)
185
So what happens if the government eavesdrops on communications that don't lead to anything? Sure, they have 3 days afterwards to get a warrant, but how can a judge justify giving a warrant for eavesdropping on someone unconnected to terrorism? Would the government have then broken the law?
Posted by: Cornmeal at August 17, 2006 06:12 PM (GArik)
186
LAK, your wikipedia link says that the President has inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches:
"However, in a third case, the special review court for FISA, the
equivalent of a Circuit Court Of Appeals, opined differently should
FISA limit the President's inherent authority for warrantless searches
in the foreign intelligence area. In In re Sealed Case, 310
F.3d 717, 742 (Foreign Intel. Surv. Ct. of Rev. 2002) the special court
stated “[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
that the President did have inherent authority to conduct warrantless
searches to obtain foreign intelligence information . . . . We take for
granted that the President does have that authority and, assuming that
is so, FISA could not encroach on the President’s constitutional power".
Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications.
"However, in a third case, the special review court for FISA, the
equivalent of a Circuit Court Of Appeals, opined differently should
FISA limit the President's inherent authority for warrantless searches
in the foreign intelligence area. In In re Sealed Case, 310
F.3d 717, 742 (Foreign Intel. Surv. Ct. of Rev. 2002) the special court
stated “[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
that the President did have inherent authority to conduct warrantless
searches to obtain foreign intelligence information . . . . We take for
granted that the President does have that authority and, assuming that
is so, FISA could not encroach on the President’s constitutional power".
Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 06:13 PM (PX+vn)
187
You "people" are ASSHATS!!
Posted by: t at August 17, 2006 06:17 PM (7GwEE)
188
Oh jeez, looks like some lefties found this site whose favorite word is "fascist". I wonder if any of them can tell me what isn't fascist about a religion full of people who want to establish a world-wide theocracy and will use force by any means to do so? And no, I'm not talking about Christianity (anyone who thinks such that about Christians is down right delusional).
What isn't horrific about governments which condone the religious killings of gays and raped girls and Buddhist monks and African animists and anyone else not Muslim.
And the lefties are scared of Republicans????
I think I see more than one landing in the cuckoo's nest.
What isn't horrific about governments which condone the religious killings of gays and raped girls and Buddhist monks and African animists and anyone else not Muslim.
And the lefties are scared of Republicans????
I think I see more than one landing in the cuckoo's nest.
Posted by: RepJ at August 17, 2006 06:23 PM (rqlgb)
189
I don't know, Leatherneck. I'm not in Britain. I've never even left the country. Maybe you are confusing me with someone else?
Posted by: X at August 17, 2006 06:27 PM (L33Ii)
190
QC,
You need better reading skills. The issue was warrantles observation of foreign nationals. A number of foreign Defendants have tried to argue the provisions in FISA that allow surveillance without a court order of non-citizens is unconstitutional. FISA, ALWAYS requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen. Or did you not read the statue? Relying on Wiki commentary is not terribly honest, if yuo ignore thes rest of the article. FISA without a doubt requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen.
Read the statute itself. You must get a court order if there is a "likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party;"
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sec_50_00001802----000-.html
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sec_50_00001804----000-.html
trying to lie about the coontent of a law is not very becoming of you or anyone QC.
You need better reading skills. The issue was warrantles observation of foreign nationals. A number of foreign Defendants have tried to argue the provisions in FISA that allow surveillance without a court order of non-citizens is unconstitutional. FISA, ALWAYS requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen. Or did you not read the statue? Relying on Wiki commentary is not terribly honest, if yuo ignore thes rest of the article. FISA without a doubt requires a warrant if one of the parties is a US citizen.
Read the statute itself. You must get a court order if there is a "likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party;"
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sec_50_00001802----000-.html
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sec_50_00001804----000-.html
trying to lie about the coontent of a law is not very becoming of you or anyone QC.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 06:38 PM (pBKzg)
191
And QC,
Are you really attempting to argue the 4th Amendment does not apply outside the home????? That can't be as that is simply not the case. The 4th amendment applies to phone taps, searches of the person outside the home, searches of cars, all sorts of instances outside the home. Stop trying to argue about topics about which you clearly understand very little. Read a COn Law book before you go off arguing the 4th Amendmnet does not apply outside the home. You reveal yourself to be a bit of a fool.
Are you really attempting to argue the 4th Amendment does not apply outside the home????? That can't be as that is simply not the case. The 4th amendment applies to phone taps, searches of the person outside the home, searches of cars, all sorts of instances outside the home. Stop trying to argue about topics about which you clearly understand very little. Read a COn Law book before you go off arguing the 4th Amendmnet does not apply outside the home. You reveal yourself to be a bit of a fool.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 06:43 PM (pBKzg)
192
Queeecy-
Try reading the WHOLE Wikipedia item again. It is clear you aren't the brightest bulb in box, but we are willing to try to help you out.
Your quote was with respect to a specific post-FISA case. The point of the case you refer to is the position taken by the FISA court of review which stated that, IF the President has the inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches to obtain foreign intelligence information, FISA could not encroach on the President's constitutional power. This case was specific and by no means says "President has inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches" as you erroneously inferred.
Try reading the WHOLE Wikipedia item again. It is clear you aren't the brightest bulb in box, but we are willing to try to help you out.
Your quote was with respect to a specific post-FISA case. The point of the case you refer to is the position taken by the FISA court of review which stated that, IF the President has the inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches to obtain foreign intelligence information, FISA could not encroach on the President's constitutional power. This case was specific and by no means says "President has inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches" as you erroneously inferred.
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 06:48 PM (FyFm5)
193
Greyrooster, would you say that you are a fine example of conservative Republican thinking, and that all Americans should think like you?
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 06:49 PM (QAh+h)
194
Hey Greygirl-
Keep on with your lunatic ravings, and I just may decide not to pay my social security tax this month. Without that direct deposit check, they'd likely kick you out of your double-wide.
Were you always a breathless bigot, Greygirl, or was this a change of heart that coincided with Alzheimer's setting in?
Keep on with your lunatic ravings, and I just may decide not to pay my social security tax this month. Without that direct deposit check, they'd likely kick you out of your double-wide.
Were you always a breathless bigot, Greygirl, or was this a change of heart that coincided with Alzheimer's setting in?
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 07:00 PM (FyFm5)
195
LAK, you suggested wikipedia, not I. I stand by what I wrote- the subject of the case is not disclosed. It is secret.
From the law links you finally provided to this ignorant, disenfranchised individual of color, I think Bush is fine.
I can envision several ways to gather this information outside the borders of the US- which renders FISA mute.
From the law links you finally provided to this ignorant, disenfranchised individual of color, I think Bush is fine.
I can envision several ways to gather this information outside the borders of the US- which renders FISA mute.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 07:16 PM (PX+vn)
196
LAK I didn't mention the 4th amendment, you said "And
let's not forget the plain language of the constitution" so I pointed
out what I pointed out, and you cannot refute- but attempt to obscure with subterfuge.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 07:19 PM (PX+vn)
197
ummm ~ aren't you republican types supposed to be for small government? Exactly how does unlimited executive power fit into your scheme of freedom from unwarranted govt. intrusion into our private lives?
You trust the govt. with unlimited power all of a sudden?
You trust the govt. with unlimited power all of a sudden?
Posted by: Bernie at August 17, 2006 07:21 PM (Po7qS)
198
Grovertdog, I am quite stupid, I am getting lucky even getting on the internet (or maybe I'm not lucky- it led me to you, or rather you to I).
I summarized and then quoted the article directly:
“[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
that the President did have inherent authority to conduct warrantless
searches to obtain foreign intelligence information . . . . We take for
granted that the President does have that authority and, assuming that
is so, FISA could not encroach on the President’s constitutional power".
that's not my writing.
I summarized and then quoted the article directly:
“[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
that the President did have inherent authority to conduct warrantless
searches to obtain foreign intelligence information . . . . We take for
granted that the President does have that authority and, assuming that
is so, FISA could not encroach on the President’s constitutional power".
that's not my writing.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 07:24 PM (PX+vn)
199
"I wonder if any of them can tell me what isn't fascist about a religion full of people..."
There is a difference between theology and fascism though both are a form of authoritarianism. Shotgun Dick and Rummy are fascists. Pat Robertson is the product of theocracy.
"And the lefties are scared of Republicans????"
No. Just idiots with more power, greed, fear, and anger then compassion, foresight, and reason.
There is a difference between theology and fascism though both are a form of authoritarianism. Shotgun Dick and Rummy are fascists. Pat Robertson is the product of theocracy.
"And the lefties are scared of Republicans????"
No. Just idiots with more power, greed, fear, and anger then compassion, foresight, and reason.
Posted by: John Gillnitz at August 17, 2006 07:26 PM (6G+OS)
200
QC, that quote was the 4th amendment, fool. The wiki cite was fine, it also accurately describes FISA's warrant requirement in the event one of the parties is a US citizen. You just used the commentary to say something misleading.
Don't you know the 4th Amendment when you read it? Christ, who are you people? You really need to educate yourself before you pipe up about issues about which you clearly have no clue.
The 4th Amendment to the U.S. COnstitution:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Come on, admit it. You must feel a little stupid not knowing what you were talking about was the 4th amendment?
Don't you know the 4th Amendment when you read it? Christ, who are you people? You really need to educate yourself before you pipe up about issues about which you clearly have no clue.
The 4th Amendment to the U.S. COnstitution:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Come on, admit it. You must feel a little stupid not knowing what you were talking about was the 4th amendment?
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 07:30 PM (6HZQ9)
201
"From the law links you finally provided to this ignorant, disenfranchised individual of color, I think Bush is fine."
Oh really how so? FISA indisputably requires a warrant with a US ciizen on one end of the line. The argument can be made that the President's inherent authority under the Commander in Chief clause somehow trumps the rest of the constitution and Congressional Acts, but within the confines of FISA, there is no dispute.
"I can envision several ways to gather this information outside the borders of the US- which renders FISA mute."
I think you mean "moot," not "mute." Did you go to college QC? Honestly.
Oh really how so? FISA indisputably requires a warrant with a US ciizen on one end of the line. The argument can be made that the President's inherent authority under the Commander in Chief clause somehow trumps the rest of the constitution and Congressional Acts, but within the confines of FISA, there is no dispute.
"I can envision several ways to gather this information outside the borders of the US- which renders FISA mute."
I think you mean "moot," not "mute." Did you go to college QC? Honestly.
Posted by: LAK at August 17, 2006 07:36 PM (6HZQ9)
202
Wow! Busy all day and just stopping at Jawa now ... 152 comments in a matter of hours!
I knew this particular story would be bringing them all at of the woodwork! The lib/left loves stuff like this.
This ruling has nothing to do with wiretaps, the NSA, terrorism etc. It is just one obscure judge's dabble in BDS. Just another (meaningless) stab at the Bush Administration as a backdoor approach to everything they oppose and fear. A lil' something to feed and fire up the BDS fringe crowd - and in the end - an empty shell.
The judge's ruling will be set aside pending appeal which they (the plaintiffs - ACLU etc) will lose. The program will continue as is.
Don't bother arguing with them - this is just another 15 minutes for them - let them have their brief momment which will of cause fade into further frustration.
I knew this particular story would be bringing them all at of the woodwork! The lib/left loves stuff like this.
This ruling has nothing to do with wiretaps, the NSA, terrorism etc. It is just one obscure judge's dabble in BDS. Just another (meaningless) stab at the Bush Administration as a backdoor approach to everything they oppose and fear. A lil' something to feed and fire up the BDS fringe crowd - and in the end - an empty shell.
The judge's ruling will be set aside pending appeal which they (the plaintiffs - ACLU etc) will lose. The program will continue as is.
Don't bother arguing with them - this is just another 15 minutes for them - let them have their brief momment which will of cause fade into further frustration.
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 07:41 PM (XrexX)
203
Quite an assumption for you to make that I did not know what you were quoting. I stated that I was not discussing it (meaning in the broad deceptive way that you wanted to), because you are trying to apply the 4th to international telecommunications, and it does not.
I do feel stupid, but it is for conversing with someone that is just looking to call names, mock me and fight with me rather than attack ideas and positions... but such is another day with the American left.
I do feel stupid, but it is for conversing with someone that is just looking to call names, mock me and fight with me rather than attack ideas and positions... but such is another day with the American left.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 07:43 PM (PX+vn)
204
Give me liberty or death.
You wusses can spend your time cowering in fear of terrorists. I want my liberty and I'm not going to give it up because any terrorist threat. True patriots do not give into fear.
You wusses can spend your time cowering in fear of terrorists. I want my liberty and I'm not going to give it up because any terrorist threat. True patriots do not give into fear.
Posted by: Monkey In Chief at August 17, 2006 07:44 PM (/3UZf)
205
I really don't see what all this fuss is about, as this decision by this judge is likely to be overturned on appeal. You can say what you want, but the Executive Branch, with Clinton as an example, has the inherent power to listen to overseas conversations between Americans and people in foreign countries. Most legal scholars agree on this power. What happened in Detroit with this particular judge is what happens in California with the 9th Circuit. Most of their controversial decisions are overturned, just like this judge's will be. This is just another example of judge-shopping by the ACLU. Sorry to disappoint you libs and leftists. I will be more than willing to take the heat if I am proven wrong. Time will tell.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 07:51 PM (rUyw4)
206
"I think you mean "moot," not "mute." Did you go to college QC? Honestly."
I am humbled by your awesome proof-reading skills. Good guess on what
I really meant there, if you can figure out that tremendous gaffe, I but you
can deal with most internet writing fairly well.
Your focusing on my typo is an attempt at obscuring communication. You
know what was meant, but point and dance and sing like a child.
I don't care to tell you anything about my educational background- if I went to
college or not... does it matter? I am an American and a dumb
hick... my vote and voice count just the same as anyone else’s'.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 07:51 PM (PX+vn)
207
Quite an assumption??????
I quote the 4th Amendment, then you say:
"Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications."
Then I correct you noting that as a matter of FACT and LAW, you are wrong, that the 4th Amendment applies outside the home and in international communications (FISA would not have been necessary if it didn't)
then you say:
"LAK I didn't mention the 4th amendment, you said 'And
let's not forget the plain language of the constitution' so I pointed
out what I pointed out, and you cannot refute- but attempt to obscure with subterfuge."
I mean are you kidding me? The mistake is your brain. You're an ignorant idiot, you were caught in your ignorance and now you try to weasel out of accountability.
But I suppose this whole debate is "mute"
I quote the 4th Amendment, then you say:
"Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications."
Then I correct you noting that as a matter of FACT and LAW, you are wrong, that the 4th Amendment applies outside the home and in international communications (FISA would not have been necessary if it didn't)
then you say:
"LAK I didn't mention the 4th amendment, you said 'And
let's not forget the plain language of the constitution' so I pointed
out what I pointed out, and you cannot refute- but attempt to obscure with subterfuge."
I mean are you kidding me? The mistake is your brain. You're an ignorant idiot, you were caught in your ignorance and now you try to weasel out of accountability.
But I suppose this whole debate is "mute"
Posted by: LAK` at August 17, 2006 07:53 PM (6HZQ9)
208
Stopthedonkey,
As an American, I have more than one enemy (as I assume you do).
My main enemies are those who hate my freedoms.
That would be both, the terrorists AND the Bush/ Cheney Administration.
As an American, I have more than one enemy (as I assume you do).
My main enemies are those who hate my freedoms.
That would be both, the terrorists AND the Bush/ Cheney Administration.
Posted by: Robert at August 17, 2006 08:13 PM (nUUdf)
209
This ruling has nothing to do with wiretaps, the NSA, terrorism etc.
Uh, sure. Except the ruling directly refers to, er, the warrantless wiretapping program of the NSA, that the Bush administration claims are needed to fight terrorism.
So...huh????
Uh, sure. Except the ruling directly refers to, er, the warrantless wiretapping program of the NSA, that the Bush administration claims are needed to fight terrorism.
So...huh????
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 08:14 PM (QAh+h)
210
Wow, Queeece, either you are very talented at pretending to be obtuse, or you just DON'T get it. Don't you have enough self-respect to admit when you fucked up?
This has been an interesting day- with out a doubt I've never found a blog inhabited by more dim-witted, reactionary, chickenhawks in my life.
You guys remind me of an often modified quotation:
"They say that Patriotism is the last refuge, to which a scoundrel clings. Steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you King"
I'll leave you traitors to freedom and democracy to your circle jerk. G'bye.
This has been an interesting day- with out a doubt I've never found a blog inhabited by more dim-witted, reactionary, chickenhawks in my life.
You guys remind me of an often modified quotation:
"They say that Patriotism is the last refuge, to which a scoundrel clings. Steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you King"
I'll leave you traitors to freedom and democracy to your circle jerk. G'bye.
Posted by: Grovertdog at August 17, 2006 08:15 PM (FyFm5)
211
Men, I do believe we have discovered the bravest, smartest bunch of libs and leftists this side of the EU. Give me liberty or give me death, calling us cowards, accusing us of being their enemy, etc. I tell you, I am scared! Scared, I say. So scared of these liberals. I better head out to the trailer park, circle all the trailers, get out granny's shotgun, and prepare for the attack of the paper bag fighters. As in couldn't fight their way out of a paper sack. You boys come on back when you grow up to be men, and then we'll consider what you have to say. Meanwhile, you better go ask daddy to borrow his car. You're late for your pot party.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 08:22 PM (rUyw4)
212
Wow why are you guys still in the US? I mean with all of us "leftards" undermining your safety wouldn't a country that monitors its people and honors those that kill Arabs be more to your suited to your tastes, say Israel? You kill and discriminate against Arabs with near impunity. Go ahead put your money where your ?s are. But I have a feeling that's getting a little too real for ya.
I would say Iraq but 1. my country has already been shamed by your kind there and 2. I believe some Marines have already lived out your favorite wet dream.
I would say Iraq but 1. my country has already been shamed by your kind there and 2. I believe some Marines have already lived out your favorite wet dream.
Posted by: mnbat at August 17, 2006 08:40 PM (2cK1O)
213
Wow why are you guys still in the US? I mean with all of us "leftards" undermining your safety wouldn't a country that monitors its people and honors those that kill Arabs be more to your suited to your tastes, say Israel? You kill and discriminate against Arabs with near impunity. Go ahead put your money where your ?s are. But I have a feeling that's getting a little too real for ya.
I would say Iraq but 1. my country has already been shamed by your kind there and 2. I believe some Marines have already lived out your favorite wet dream.
I would say Iraq but 1. my country has already been shamed by your kind there and 2. I believe some Marines have already lived out your favorite wet dream.
Posted by: mnbat at August 17, 2006 08:41 PM (2cK1O)
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 17, 2006 08:44 PM (dpUkO)
215
Who the fuck left the moonbat cage open???
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 17, 2006 08:46 PM (dpUkO)
216
Let me just remind you all of something that I think is being missed here:
There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON why the Bush administration needed to run this NSA program without warrants.
Understand?
NONE.
There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON why the Bush administration needed to run this NSA program without warrants.
Understand?
NONE.
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 08:46 PM (QAh+h)
217
Just put that in caps, 'cause y'all seemed to be missing it.
Posted by: jim at August 17, 2006 08:55 PM (QAh+h)
218
Mnbat is another one of those Islam boys posing on the internet. Trying to act like he is an American, and dissing on Israel, as if one small state for the Jews is too much to ask for. You Arabs have millions of square miles of land to live on, conquered from Christians by the way, and you don't want the Jews to have a few hundred square miles to live on. Selfish, you bastards are. Now leave Israel alone, before something really bad happens to you.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 09:03 PM (rUyw4)
219
Man, that Greyrooster's got a lot of hate going. Gotta feel sorry for a guy that's got that kindof outlook.
Personally, I'm not that worried about a bunch of second-rate terrorists. I'm much more worried about forfeiting the freemdoms my brother, father, and grandfater risked their lives to win and defend. Now there's all sorts of people that want to give those freedoms away because someday, someway, somwhere we might, maybe get attacked by terrorists again. I die in a terrorist attack, so be it. But I'd rather die knowing Americans had the guts to demand we stay a free country rather sacrifice away those freedoms to cower in some fake safety.
Hey, it's a dangerous world out there. Get used to it.
Personally, I'm not that worried about a bunch of second-rate terrorists. I'm much more worried about forfeiting the freemdoms my brother, father, and grandfater risked their lives to win and defend. Now there's all sorts of people that want to give those freedoms away because someday, someway, somwhere we might, maybe get attacked by terrorists again. I die in a terrorist attack, so be it. But I'd rather die knowing Americans had the guts to demand we stay a free country rather sacrifice away those freedoms to cower in some fake safety.
Hey, it's a dangerous world out there. Get used to it.
Posted by: jong at August 17, 2006 09:12 PM (cdeBX)
220
Wow! Look at the comments fly! Good work Rusty!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 09:16 PM (gLMre)
221
Jim says: There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON why the Bush administration needed to run this NSA program without warrants.Jim is an idiot or thinks everyone else is a sucker.There is no reason the for the NSA to do that. They are not law enforcement.
He is taking advantage of the fact that most people have little understanding of modern digitized phone systems and methods for extracting data from those system. You can search for many things without crossing the line that he's bitching about. And until hits or leads are returned no privacy has been violated. These leads can then be checked to determine if they are indeed a true hit of a false hit. Then followup survielance could be done and after 3 days if the need arises you get a warrant.
Jim wants you to imagine an evil government agent listening to him order a bag of herbal remedy with a big old 1965 reel to reel tape recorder and headphones. DOESN'T HAPPEN, I JUST PUT THAT IN CAPS BECAUSE YOU ARE A FUCKHEAD.
I don't know how it works but with just a minimum of imagination. I bet I could build a system that could both obey the law and catch what I wanted. No human would ever see the incredibly vast giant fucking great majority of data that passed through it. That data goes poof never to return.
But no dumbass wants to know how it works so he can tell our enemies. He doesn't no more know it's a violation than I know it isn't but he's damn sure determined to make that information public during wartime. A war declared not by us. Our enemy has openly vowed to kill us again. If dipshit Jim belives it's not a war that is irrelevant. Our enemy, who has sworn to kill Jim's smelly ass, does.
It's our job to protect him or at least a side effect of protecting ourselves. Whether he apprecitates it or deserves it or not. He doesn't.
He is taking advantage of the fact that most people have little understanding of modern digitized phone systems and methods for extracting data from those system. You can search for many things without crossing the line that he's bitching about. And until hits or leads are returned no privacy has been violated. These leads can then be checked to determine if they are indeed a true hit of a false hit. Then followup survielance could be done and after 3 days if the need arises you get a warrant.
Jim wants you to imagine an evil government agent listening to him order a bag of herbal remedy with a big old 1965 reel to reel tape recorder and headphones. DOESN'T HAPPEN, I JUST PUT THAT IN CAPS BECAUSE YOU ARE A FUCKHEAD.
I don't know how it works but with just a minimum of imagination. I bet I could build a system that could both obey the law and catch what I wanted. No human would ever see the incredibly vast giant fucking great majority of data that passed through it. That data goes poof never to return.
But no dumbass wants to know how it works so he can tell our enemies. He doesn't no more know it's a violation than I know it isn't but he's damn sure determined to make that information public during wartime. A war declared not by us. Our enemy has openly vowed to kill us again. If dipshit Jim belives it's not a war that is irrelevant. Our enemy, who has sworn to kill Jim's smelly ass, does.
It's our job to protect him or at least a side effect of protecting ourselves. Whether he apprecitates it or deserves it or not. He doesn't.
Posted by: Darth Odie at August 17, 2006 09:23 PM (YdcZ0)
222
jong, WTF? You don't appear to be an American. Or at least not one who had a brother, father, and grandfather in the military. Surely your English would be better if you were born here. Another Muslim poser.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 09:24 PM (rUyw4)
223
Did groveling dog go back to buggering his mama. Or is he letting his commie friends do it tonight.
Hey Jong head. Don't judge me and I won't judge you. You don't know me. Nor do I desire to know you. So keep your fucking mouth out of my business. You commies talk shit. Like all liberal socialist assholes. Go back to playing with each other. Only way you commie bastards can get off.
Hey Jong head. Don't judge me and I won't judge you. You don't know me. Nor do I desire to know you. So keep your fucking mouth out of my business. You commies talk shit. Like all liberal socialist assholes. Go back to playing with each other. Only way you commie bastards can get off.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 09:37 PM (z5G5b)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 09:38 PM (gLMre)
225
Just dawned on me how much these commie bastards sound alike. Every one of them says the same thing. Must have been coached by the same leftard. Or perhaps the DNC. Their bullshit about giving up freedoms to be safe. How dangerous it is. How they don't fear the terrorists. Same shit. Over and Over. I'm convinced they are muslim huggers and anti-american. Pure trash. Using the same race thing. Same every one but they are ignorant. Bla, bla. Merely a bunch of socialist assholes sent here from some Jew hating pro muslim blog. Piss on them and the trashy whores that gave birth to them.
Probably pissed becaused their friend in Thailand got caught.
Good night all.
Probably pissed becaused their friend in Thailand got caught.
Good night all.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 09:49 PM (z5G5b)
226
When you call tech support, where does it go? Overseas. Even if you are on the up and up on everything you do, it's soooo easy to "misunderstand" what you are doing.....
Where was all this "ohhh...tap and track everyone" when our children were (and still are) getting abducted and killed by pr0n psycos. Then you guys were all for "privacy" and "stay out of my business"...because it wasn't your kid.
What's the difference now? How many women and children in this country alone are raped, murdered, abducted? BY OUR OWN PEOPLE?! And it still happens...(more than what died in 9/11...btw...not saying 9/11 wasn't bad, it was..)
Oh well. I guess it's OK....Considering that in all reality, if we got hit again, where would it be? (Oh right, Indiana...they have the biggest targets)....and I bet that the amount of people who die are STILL less than what happens every day, by our own citizens.....
Am I worried about an attack? NO, because I don't choose to live in an area that is the tiara of America....will it affect my job? NO! Will it affect my home? NO! Not any worse than this whole stupid 2.99$ a gal for gas....and rising cost of homes, and blahblahblah....because of this "war" is....
Where was all this "ohhh...tap and track everyone" when our children were (and still are) getting abducted and killed by pr0n psycos. Then you guys were all for "privacy" and "stay out of my business"...because it wasn't your kid.
What's the difference now? How many women and children in this country alone are raped, murdered, abducted? BY OUR OWN PEOPLE?! And it still happens...(more than what died in 9/11...btw...not saying 9/11 wasn't bad, it was..)
Oh well. I guess it's OK....Considering that in all reality, if we got hit again, where would it be? (Oh right, Indiana...they have the biggest targets)....and I bet that the amount of people who die are STILL less than what happens every day, by our own citizens.....
Am I worried about an attack? NO, because I don't choose to live in an area that is the tiara of America....will it affect my job? NO! Will it affect my home? NO! Not any worse than this whole stupid 2.99$ a gal for gas....and rising cost of homes, and blahblahblah....because of this "war" is....
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 09:58 PM (Iv3aA)
227
So what you are saying is you feel no loyalty to the people of NYC. Your countrymen. Them dying doesn't affect you so, "screw them" Right? That's what I thought. Who's your daddy?
We are the boys from Bumfuct Egypt.
We sleep in caves and ditches.
We wipe our ass with broken glass.
And satisfy your hoosier bitches.
Nice try babypiss
We are the boys from Bumfuct Egypt.
We sleep in caves and ditches.
We wipe our ass with broken glass.
And satisfy your hoosier bitches.
Nice try babypiss
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 10:03 PM (nWBkt)
228
greyrooster: You are right. They do all sound alike.
The endless lament we were hearing for a "cease fire" in Lebanon has now been replaced with the endless lament for wiretaps with "warrants."
The left won't listen to reason: "cease-fire" without victory means "reload" and overseas wiretaps with "warrants" don't and can't exist because spies don't know who/what they are listening for until they hear it.
I put the left in 2 camps. Either they're not serious about our situation or they are anti-American.
The endless lament we were hearing for a "cease fire" in Lebanon has now been replaced with the endless lament for wiretaps with "warrants."
The left won't listen to reason: "cease-fire" without victory means "reload" and overseas wiretaps with "warrants" don't and can't exist because spies don't know who/what they are listening for until they hear it.
I put the left in 2 camps. Either they're not serious about our situation or they are anti-American.
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 17, 2006 10:08 PM (up9HT)
229
Make sure you get your supply of "Depends", you retarded, Chickenhawk, morons. The stench of cowardice is akin to the smell of diarrhea.
Did you look under your bed for terrorists this morning?
You, the 33%ers who support the psychopathic imbecile in the WH are pathetic losers who cannot deal with real life.
Not to worry, however, shit-oozing morons, when the sane part of the electorate -- all 66% of them -- gets its way in November, we won't send you to Gitmo even though you are treators to Democracy. But you will pay for your imbecile following of the preposterous Frat Boy and his Maffia henchmen.
Did you look under your bed for terrorists this morning?
You, the 33%ers who support the psychopathic imbecile in the WH are pathetic losers who cannot deal with real life.
Not to worry, however, shit-oozing morons, when the sane part of the electorate -- all 66% of them -- gets its way in November, we won't send you to Gitmo even though you are treators to Democracy. But you will pay for your imbecile following of the preposterous Frat Boy and his Maffia henchmen.
Posted by: Evil Progressive at August 17, 2006 10:11 PM (ELcqj)
230
Yes thaty's why ILL became it's own state. Once you get up toward Indy the population in Indianna gets about 80 percent Orville Redenbacher. City of big shoulders and the bootleggers down south had to leave.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 10:13 PM (D3+20)
231
Clearly based on the attraction of this "topic" to all the lil' lib/left drop-bys - the ruling was never really about the NSA & wiretaps - duh! And you know exactly what I mean!
Lil' ruling stayed - appealed - overturned - so it goes.
Just another 15 minutes of BDS.
Lil' ruling stayed - appealed - overturned - so it goes.
Just another 15 minutes of BDS.
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 10:16 PM (XrexX)
232
I have a question.
When OKC got hit by an F5 tornado, do you know what most of the responses were? "Don't live in Tornado Alley"! Was that your response as well?
When NOLA got hit by Katrina, what was your thoughts? "Don't live on the coast"?
Yes, these are are all things that were beyond our control, although not human controlled as was 9/11....
What's the difference? I'm just wondering....
When OKC got hit by an F5 tornado, do you know what most of the responses were? "Don't live in Tornado Alley"! Was that your response as well?
When NOLA got hit by Katrina, what was your thoughts? "Don't live on the coast"?
Yes, these are are all things that were beyond our control, although not human controlled as was 9/11....
What's the difference? I'm just wondering....
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 10:17 PM (Iv3aA)
233
I like to think we have all treated for Democracy. Also you are not a traitor to democracy in America. You are a free thinker. You are a traitor in America if you try to subvert the Govt, and provide aid and comfort to her enemies. Sort of like when you inhibit the ability of the US to monitor her enemies. If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about. By hide, I mean specifically, if you are not subverting the govt, or aiding and abetting our enemies. If you are hiding traitorous actions and get caught and convicted , I wish for you to hang by the neck from piano wire until dead.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 10:21 PM (n4VvM)
234
Is that really Evil Progressive? I remember he was much better than that. Weak.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 10:21 PM (nWBkt)
235
Evil Progressive, you may become suicidal this November... hide all the sharp objects in your home, and stock up on the prozac.
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 10:21 PM (Haws4)
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 10:24 PM (Haws4)
237
Wow...ya'll need Jesus!
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 10:26 PM (Iv3aA)
238
Put down the bong babypiss. You are playing inside your own mind. Stay on topic.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 10:26 PM (nWBkt)
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 10:27 PM (Haws4)
240
I'm all for sky marshalls....I'm all for guidelines, heck, I'm pretty sure that it's OK to use your gut to do "profiling" of a sort, but what is going to happen the first time you call Dell tech support, and the only thing that someone monitoring knows is you called overseas...
Then, let's suppose that they track your emails, and although most of them seem harmless, let's say you said something to the effect to someone about killing xx person, or hack yy person, even in jest.... Now, you are a suspect for terror activity....
It's already happened....to a teenage kid who was doing a report for English....I guess it won't matter to you, until it happens to you....
Until then, enjoy!
Then, let's suppose that they track your emails, and although most of them seem harmless, let's say you said something to the effect to someone about killing xx person, or hack yy person, even in jest.... Now, you are a suspect for terror activity....
It's already happened....to a teenage kid who was doing a report for English....I guess it won't matter to you, until it happens to you....
Until then, enjoy!
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 10:35 PM (Iv3aA)
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 10:38 PM (Iv3aA)
242
Babywhiz, I am no fan of big brother.
But let's say someone calls from Detroit to Pakistan, and our guys (that we count on to be the good guys) can't listen in.
And lets say the Pakistani telco is run by the local Islamic power broker and they monitor every word and record it because they are not bound by US law... we are at a distinct self imposed advantage.
Oh, and lets say further that the call was from an FBI agent tracking Bin Laden to a field operative in Pakistan.
How is monitoring international electronic communication without a warrant a violation of any civil right?
But let's say someone calls from Detroit to Pakistan, and our guys (that we count on to be the good guys) can't listen in.
And lets say the Pakistani telco is run by the local Islamic power broker and they monitor every word and record it because they are not bound by US law... we are at a distinct self imposed advantage.
Oh, and lets say further that the call was from an FBI agent tracking Bin Laden to a field operative in Pakistan.
How is monitoring international electronic communication without a warrant a violation of any civil right?
Posted by: QC at August 17, 2006 10:50 PM (Haws4)
243
You can't both be a conservative *and* think that this warrant-less wiretapping is good. History has shown that power given is power abused, and if it's not Bush it'll be the next President or the next...
The judges are just enforcing the laws that Congress writes, often at the request of the President. What's bad about the Bush administration is that on yet-another-issue they have the law and regulations so confused that the whole bureaucracy is convulsing trying to figure it out.
That's a failure of leadership. Nobody can figure out *why* they've taken this approach-- Congress has been a rubber stamp and judges are especially deferential any time the country is at war.
Anyway don't get pissy with this judge. She is doing her job reading the *law*. There's an appellate system so it's not like she's got the end-all-be-all power on this either. The failure is squarely on Bush and Congress for muddling this.
The judges are just enforcing the laws that Congress writes, often at the request of the President. What's bad about the Bush administration is that on yet-another-issue they have the law and regulations so confused that the whole bureaucracy is convulsing trying to figure it out.
That's a failure of leadership. Nobody can figure out *why* they've taken this approach-- Congress has been a rubber stamp and judges are especially deferential any time the country is at war.
Anyway don't get pissy with this judge. She is doing her job reading the *law*. There's an appellate system so it's not like she's got the end-all-be-all power on this either. The failure is squarely on Bush and Congress for muddling this.
Posted by: kevo at August 17, 2006 10:52 PM (DO/f8)
244
Dr. Rusty Shackleford,
Don't panic. Your concern is irrational.
The phone call which you describe in your post always was and still is subject to perfectly constitutional wiretapping. This decision would only prevent unconstitutional wiretapping, and the only difference between the two is that the latter isn't usable as evidence against you.
It doesn't make you more or less likely to be monitored. It doesn't increase or decrease the level of any potential monitoring. Your government will still protect you. They'll just do it by the book, like Dragnet instead of the A-Team.
Don't panic. Your concern is irrational.
The phone call which you describe in your post always was and still is subject to perfectly constitutional wiretapping. This decision would only prevent unconstitutional wiretapping, and the only difference between the two is that the latter isn't usable as evidence against you.
It doesn't make you more or less likely to be monitored. It doesn't increase or decrease the level of any potential monitoring. Your government will still protect you. They'll just do it by the book, like Dragnet instead of the A-Team.
Posted by: Railroad Stone at August 17, 2006 11:06 PM (51E0l)
245
1.) He told Congress of the program.
2.) The reason a president can do this during wartime is that to get a warrant he needs probable cause - something that he might not have in case of AlQaeda operatives - who dont care about our nuanced laws.
3.) A president has every right to surveil communications outside of the country. Other presidents have done it WITHOUT an islamo fascist threat.
STOP liberals it makes me so sad to see how consumed you are with the WRONG enemy. Will it take another attack before you see who to blame?
2.) The reason a president can do this during wartime is that to get a warrant he needs probable cause - something that he might not have in case of AlQaeda operatives - who dont care about our nuanced laws.
3.) A president has every right to surveil communications outside of the country. Other presidents have done it WITHOUT an islamo fascist threat.
STOP liberals it makes me so sad to see how consumed you are with the WRONG enemy. Will it take another attack before you see who to blame?
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 17, 2006 11:09 PM (YkSas)
246
baby whiz??? Is that when Shar Pei pupy takes a little leak on the carpet? As opposed to the monster whizes I'm finding more and more each morning?
Hondo - you have carpenter ants - I have a 12 week-old excrement machine - wanna trade?
Hondo - you have carpenter ants - I have a 12 week-old excrement machine - wanna trade?
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 17, 2006 11:10 PM (dpUkO)
247
QC - I do see your point. In fact, I would much rather prefer that they do profiling WITH the wiretapping.
That way, not only is the general, law abiding public is left alone, but, it gives less data for the government to sift through....(have you ever tried to read weblogs on 100 people? Imagine doing this for the entire population of America...It seems to me tossing a blanket of "follow everyone" will allow critical information to not make it to the right people in time to prevent an attack...)
Of course, my theory has always been to take a crop duster to the Middle East and just spray them all down with prozac...maybe those people would just calm down! (haha...ok, maybe not...)
That way, not only is the general, law abiding public is left alone, but, it gives less data for the government to sift through....(have you ever tried to read weblogs on 100 people? Imagine doing this for the entire population of America...It seems to me tossing a blanket of "follow everyone" will allow critical information to not make it to the right people in time to prevent an attack...)
Of course, my theory has always been to take a crop duster to the Middle East and just spray them all down with prozac...maybe those people would just calm down! (haha...ok, maybe not...)
Posted by: babywhiz at August 17, 2006 11:12 PM (Iv3aA)
248
Barney
NO MORE EXCREMENT MACHINES! Been there - done that. And don't think its gonna stop in one way or another until the very least the 1300 week - and possibly longer.
NO MORE EXCREMENT MACHINES! Been there - done that. And don't think its gonna stop in one way or another until the very least the 1300 week - and possibly longer.
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 11:18 PM (XrexX)
249
Greyrooster... Ha, more like Gayrooster.
Posted by: X at August 17, 2006 11:19 PM (L33Ii)
250
Why worry about Osama Bin Laden destroying our freedom and the Constitution? Bush and the Republicans have already done that for us. The nation is not supporting Bush because he is more dangerous to freedom than Osama. We fought and won the Cold War to prevent the fascists from taking over the free world. Folks, the fascists have now taken over the free world. We've met the enemy and it's us. If Bush really wanted to fight terrorism, he wouldn't have us in Iraq, where we're manufacturing terrorists by the dozen every hour.
Posted by: Vaughn at August 18, 2006 12:37 AM (EcUqY)
251
I keep hearing the same tired argument: " The moonbats would leave us defenseless while Osama Bin Laden makes calls all over the US, awakening sleeper cells ". The moonbats are not missing the point like these ranters. The point is: " Court order ". A recurring pattern of this particular presidency is clandestine good old boys my way or the highway. Power neccessitates maturity and wisdom, otherwise one looks like a clown. %-) 33%
Fore! L o ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 0
Fore! L o ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 0
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 18, 2006 12:45 AM (gLMre)
252
Are you really that stupid?
The judge's ruling specifically stated the FISA-based wiretapping was still OK. If there is a suspected terrorist involved, a FISA court will approve the warrant.
What more do you want?
The plotters in England were located using legal wiretaps.
Why do you want our government to do illegal things, when the legal things work just fine?
Oh, wait, I get it. You don't give a damn about legal or illegal. You don't really give a damn about terrorism.
You just care about Republican versus Democrat, and will whore your credibility, your honor, your very soul, to do whatever it takes for your side to win.
You are a despicable coward.
The judge's ruling specifically stated the FISA-based wiretapping was still OK. If there is a suspected terrorist involved, a FISA court will approve the warrant.
What more do you want?
The plotters in England were located using legal wiretaps.
Why do you want our government to do illegal things, when the legal things work just fine?
Oh, wait, I get it. You don't give a damn about legal or illegal. You don't really give a damn about terrorism.
You just care about Republican versus Democrat, and will whore your credibility, your honor, your very soul, to do whatever it takes for your side to win.
You are a despicable coward.
Posted by: Biff Usually at August 18, 2006 01:30 AM (XfMhz)
253
So, how many of you have had your phones monitored? I just want to know how many freedoms you've lost!
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 01:54 AM (0Pys3)
254
It's great watching all you "true patriots" sputter, fume and moan about how we'll all die in a terrorist attack now that the (P)resident has to obey the law (what a funny concept for a democracy anyway, eh, that no one is above the law). Maybe you could do a Coulter, pretend to send anthrax to make a point, maybe advocate killing editors that don't agree with you, get the threat level raised to triple-red, and maybe throw in a military coup to ensure your destruction of our Constitution.
It's fun to see you all twisting in the wind(bags).
It's fun to see you all twisting in the wind(bags).
Posted by: Neal at August 18, 2006 05:27 AM (kRqVX)
255
Something else for you liberals to bitch about!
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 06:23 AM (0Pys3)
256
We've already decided that X is a muslim immigrant. So what that primative dog says really doesn't count. Just a piece of shit cheering for the dark side.
Everyone needs to scroll up to STOP THE DONKEY's post as he has hit the nail on the head.
If my government wishes to listen to my telephone conversations in an effort to protect my family, my neighbors and my country then they are welcome. I am not plotting against this nation. Don't do the phone sex thing. Don't attempt to seduce children. I am not a friend of the commies or terrorists. Why should I fear wiretapping to find the killers? Only those with something to hide need to fear. Seems like these leftist libtards have something to hide.
The left, home of the weird and queer. If another major attack comes perhaps those like me will have the opportunity to meet some of these traitors face to face. Meanwhile, remember that these leftards are nothing but social outcasts. The ones that didn't go to the prom. Are'nt one of the team. Never invited to any of the good parties, etc. You know what I mean. Nerds then, traitors now. Piss on them.
Everyone needs to scroll up to STOP THE DONKEY's post as he has hit the nail on the head.
If my government wishes to listen to my telephone conversations in an effort to protect my family, my neighbors and my country then they are welcome. I am not plotting against this nation. Don't do the phone sex thing. Don't attempt to seduce children. I am not a friend of the commies or terrorists. Why should I fear wiretapping to find the killers? Only those with something to hide need to fear. Seems like these leftist libtards have something to hide.
The left, home of the weird and queer. If another major attack comes perhaps those like me will have the opportunity to meet some of these traitors face to face. Meanwhile, remember that these leftards are nothing but social outcasts. The ones that didn't go to the prom. Are'nt one of the team. Never invited to any of the good parties, etc. You know what I mean. Nerds then, traitors now. Piss on them.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 18, 2006 06:56 AM (BjTJ6)
257
Seems like the commie bastards have moved on to another blog. Wish we could trace which blog they hang on. They're to cowardly to mention it.
Hey, All seeing idiot, Good lt and Vinnie. Thanks for the help.
Knew it the whole time.
Hey, All seeing idiot, Good lt and Vinnie. Thanks for the help.
Knew it the whole time.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 18, 2006 07:04 AM (BjTJ6)
258
Ah thank you greyrooster to brining the debate down to the level that constitutional issues should be debated: over who went to prom. You're a real stitch there!
Anywho, that's two judges who think your Bush is as illegal as a Mexican melon picker. Cheers!
Anywho, that's two judges who think your Bush is as illegal as a Mexican melon picker. Cheers!
Posted by: Warrants at August 18, 2006 07:07 AM (WfL1d)
259
BTW, do the Jawa's know that you're representing their views here?
Posted by: Warrants at August 18, 2006 07:08 AM (WfL1d)
260
The problem is that greyrooster and his bunch of nancyboys and sissies are such chickenshits they expect a draft dodgin' coward like George W. Bush or Dick Cheney to PROTECT them, andn they're willing to give up everything - including the Constitution our forefathers fought and died for - to anyone who will promise they won't let the big bad terrorists beat up on the sissies.
I say fuck the terrorists - I ain't afraid of no stinking terrorist. Do you know how many Israelis were killed by terrorists from Jan 1 2000 to June 30, 2006? 1,100.
Do you know how many New Yorkers were killed by other New Yorkers in the same time period? 7,500. Terrorists wouldn't even be a blip in the statistics in NYC!
It's time for gutless creeps like greyrooster to stand up, pick up a gun, and be prepared to protect the Constitution, instread of cowering, wetting the bed and whining for the government to take care of them.
I say fuck the terrorists - I ain't afraid of no stinking terrorist. Do you know how many Israelis were killed by terrorists from Jan 1 2000 to June 30, 2006? 1,100.
Do you know how many New Yorkers were killed by other New Yorkers in the same time period? 7,500. Terrorists wouldn't even be a blip in the statistics in NYC!
It's time for gutless creeps like greyrooster to stand up, pick up a gun, and be prepared to protect the Constitution, instread of cowering, wetting the bed and whining for the government to take care of them.
Posted by: robert lewis at August 18, 2006 07:11 AM (CYQ3y)
261
The biggest problem with the illegal wiretapping is that mistakes are bound to be made, to people who are law abiding. Or let's say that one of the guys monitoring is using it for the wrong reasons (aka, let's spy on that hot chick, or let's harass my ex-wife).
These things happen, as we see at the local level all the time. If we got a 100% guarantee that this type of tapping would NEVER be used against another American for personal gain, harassment, or other human jealousy type traits, then I would be OK, if done with profiling. (aka only illegally spy on the ones that are most likely people who fit the terrorist profile.)
(PS, the rest of us are heading to work, is why the so-called "left wing blabber" is dying down.....which I find funny that I am grouped as that, since I vote Republican....)
These things happen, as we see at the local level all the time. If we got a 100% guarantee that this type of tapping would NEVER be used against another American for personal gain, harassment, or other human jealousy type traits, then I would be OK, if done with profiling. (aka only illegally spy on the ones that are most likely people who fit the terrorist profile.)
(PS, the rest of us are heading to work, is why the so-called "left wing blabber" is dying down.....which I find funny that I am grouped as that, since I vote Republican....)
Posted by: babywhiz at August 18, 2006 07:16 AM (Iv3aA)
262
Do you know how many Americans were killed by terrorists in one day? Almost 3,000. Maybe that will get your attention! Oh, nevermind. You're too busy worrying about how illegal it is for President Bush to protect us that you don't have time to worry about "stinking terrorists"!
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 07:24 AM (0Pys3)
263
If somebody misuses the monitoring system then they need to be prosecuted, but don't let the good things that can come from this be stopped because you're afraid of it being misused.
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 07:31 AM (0Pys3)
264
Robert, you stupid shit, Greyrooster served two stints in the Marines and fought in Vietnam. And he could still whip your dumb ass.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 18, 2006 07:32 AM (rUyw4)
265
Greyrooster, you are funny. That is some convincing work of performance art you got going there.
Posted by: Adam at August 18, 2006 07:59 AM (nlezP)
266
Talk to people who actually were anti war in the 60's. They'll tell you they didn't stand for anything except they didn't want to fight. They called US soldiers babykillers and spat upon them becuase they were selfish. They cared nothing for their nation's future or the terrible funk that followed. All they cared about was themselves. It's the smae now as demonstrated above. They say Melissa Doi? Screw her dead ass! pass the popcorn.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 08:28 AM (YdcZ0)
267
I think the most amazing thing about the postings is how easily it is to tell Dems from Repubs. Dems try to reason, show the illegality aspects, you know, try to engage in rational recourse.
The Repubs, for some strange reason, have no rational, or even the ability to engage in rational discussion. 'Dumbshit', 'chickenshit', name-calling, the usual Republican mouth-movements, boy are we impressed with your arguments.
If someone were to read these posts, each and every one, and assign a school grade level based on content, spelling, logic, etc., it would be a cinch how the results would look. Try it yourself: first, look at the posts with all small letters, or all capital letters; what does that tell you about the poster? Mis-spelling elementary words? You guessed it!
Logic vs. name-calling: who do you think is thinking straight on the issues?
The Repubs, for some strange reason, have no rational, or even the ability to engage in rational discussion. 'Dumbshit', 'chickenshit', name-calling, the usual Republican mouth-movements, boy are we impressed with your arguments.
If someone were to read these posts, each and every one, and assign a school grade level based on content, spelling, logic, etc., it would be a cinch how the results would look. Try it yourself: first, look at the posts with all small letters, or all capital letters; what does that tell you about the poster? Mis-spelling elementary words? You guessed it!
Logic vs. name-calling: who do you think is thinking straight on the issues?
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 08:33 AM (kRqVX)
268
Catnick: Interesting, but evidence above refutes your observation. This from one Democrat's post:
"Make sure you get your supply of "Depends", you retarded, Chickenhawk, morons. The stench of cowardice is akin to the smell of diarrhea.
Did you look under your bed for terrorists this morning?
You, the 33%ers who support the psychopathic imbecile in the WH are pathetic losers who cannot deal with real life.
Not to worry, however, shit-oozing morons, when the sane part of the electorate -- all 66% of them -- gets its way in November, we won't send you to Gitmo even though you are treators to Democracy. But you will pay for your imbecile following of the preposterous Frat Boy and his Maffia henchmen."
"Make sure you get your supply of "Depends", you retarded, Chickenhawk, morons. The stench of cowardice is akin to the smell of diarrhea.
Did you look under your bed for terrorists this morning?
You, the 33%ers who support the psychopathic imbecile in the WH are pathetic losers who cannot deal with real life.
Not to worry, however, shit-oozing morons, when the sane part of the electorate -- all 66% of them -- gets its way in November, we won't send you to Gitmo even though you are treators to Democracy. But you will pay for your imbecile following of the preposterous Frat Boy and his Maffia henchmen."
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 18, 2006 08:40 AM (gZnyq)
269
Hey you bunch of idiots, do some reading. This was over the DOMESTIC TAPPING ISSUE!!! Do you even have the intellect to know what the word "DOMESTIC" means?? Sheesh man, go do some reading on the background of the issue before you rant about it! Cause right now, you really have no clue!
Posted by: Carl M at August 18, 2006 08:41 AM (nT6U/)
270
Yes you are thinking yourself strait into defeat. You have thought yourself right on over to the other side. The only people who care are criminals, and stupid ones at that, who use phones to do their "business". Some idiot above is worried that someone might use this "power" to harrass an ex wife. That shows just who might actually do something like that? Your own imagination is revlealed. You might be likely to do that, abuse a system, so you want someone to stop you? Never mind you are imagining a system you know nothing about. You want it revealed so you can what? Interview terrorists. Alien Civil Liberties Union indeed. If you all were patriots and got and interview you would have the NSA on the line at the same time. Fools and or traitors. I'm beginning to think Improbulus Maximus is more correct than I thought. They have no concern other than for their own selfishness.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 08:50 AM (YdcZ0)
271
Greyrooster served two stints in the Marines and fought in Vietnam. And he could still whip your dumb ass
Uh, greyrooster may CLAIM that - let's see some proof. As to kicking my ass - let's just say that technically a greyrooster is just an aging gallus gallus domesticus in desparate need of Viagara, and so as far as I'm concerned he can kiss my ass and shut his ignorant pie-hole. He is without exception rude, stupid and uninformed.
Uh, greyrooster may CLAIM that - let's see some proof. As to kicking my ass - let's just say that technically a greyrooster is just an aging gallus gallus domesticus in desparate need of Viagara, and so as far as I'm concerned he can kiss my ass and shut his ignorant pie-hole. He is without exception rude, stupid and uninformed.
Posted by: robert lewis at August 18, 2006 08:52 AM (+J4wd)
272
Get em YBP/
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 08:54 AM (YdcZ0)
273
Also when you can't win attack the spelling or typing or rooster. We're used to that.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 09:03 AM (YdcZ0)
274
To Youngbourbonpro (I like the name!): It's a trend in the posts that I'm looking at, not one or another individual posts. There is no doubt that there are idiots on all sides of the issue (how well we both know that), but a 'straw poll' will still bear me out.
Thanks for listening.
Thanks for listening.
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 09:07 AM (kRqVX)
275
Looks like a lot of people here suffer from JDS, Judicial Derangement Syndrome, the refusal to admit that the President is a felon, despite multiple felonies.
See y'all in November, or as I like to call "Subpoena Fest 2007"
See y'all in November, or as I like to call "Subpoena Fest 2007"
Posted by: JDS at August 18, 2006 09:09 AM (WfL1d)
276
No it's obviously your deranged looking judge that suffers from JDS. Of course the Alien Civil Liberties Union filed where they hoped to draw a judge favorable to their case. So they won the judge lottery. We'll see what higher courts say on appeal.
If she puts a lightbulb in her mouth I bet it comes on.
If she puts a lightbulb in her mouth I bet it comes on.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 09:15 AM (YdcZ0)
277
Ever wonder how the judges feel after all the attacks from the Republicans these past few years? Think they're likely to side with the administration?
Keep calling judges bad names, lightbulb jokes, whatever, but keep in mind you are slagging 1/3 of our Constitution (which is online if you've never seen it), the entire Judicial branch of the government. Of course, that's only if you view the Constitution as something other than Republican toilet paper.
Keep calling judges bad names, lightbulb jokes, whatever, but keep in mind you are slagging 1/3 of our Constitution (which is online if you've never seen it), the entire Judicial branch of the government. Of course, that's only if you view the Constitution as something other than Republican toilet paper.
Posted by: neal at August 18, 2006 09:20 AM (kRqVX)
278
Judges are supposed to put that aside and judge without malice. If not they are failing in their duty.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 09:24 AM (YdcZ0)
279
Youngbourbonprofessional, here's an example of what I mean:
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head. what a stupidm move. i cannot believe she would do this. she needs to be put out of office immediately.
frank la may"
Note the spelling errors, the extra letters in words, etc.
Would you say this is a Democrat or a Republican?
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head. what a stupidm move. i cannot believe she would do this. she needs to be put out of office immediately.
frank la may"
Note the spelling errors, the extra letters in words, etc.
Would you say this is a Democrat or a Republican?
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 09:24 AM (kRqVX)
280
Youngbourbonprofessional, here's an example of what I mean:
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head. what a stupidm move. i cannot believe she would do this. she needs to be put out of office immediately.
frank la may"
Note the spelling errors, the extra letters in words, etc.
Would you say this is a Democrat or a Republican?
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head. what a stupidm move. i cannot believe she would do this. she needs to be put out of office immediately.
frank la may"
Note the spelling errors, the extra letters in words, etc.
Would you say this is a Democrat or a Republican?
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 09:25 AM (kRqVX)
281
I thought the left was carrying the banner and looking out for the oridinary less educated people? Now you see what they really think of them. They pay them lip service to use their vote. When actually they don't like "people of the soil". To use one of their PC terms for redneck.
But when it comes down to it the rednecks are always the ones they call in to man the trench. Their freedom to be fools came at the expense of a lot of common men's blood.Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 09:29 AM (YdcZ0)
282
This old whore is a traitor, and when the war comes home, I hope she gets doused with gas and burned alive on her own courthouse steps.
No mercy for enemies, less for traitors.
No mercy for enemies, less for traitors.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 09:30 AM (v3I+x)
283
Catnick, you double posted... does this mean you can't use a mouse?
The libs stand around alienating half the country complaining about "rednecks", "hicks", "bible thumpers", and "morons", then wonder why they lost yet another election. BRILLIANT!!!
The libs stand around alienating half the country complaining about "rednecks", "hicks", "bible thumpers", and "morons", then wonder why they lost yet another election. BRILLIANT!!!
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 09:37 AM (Haws4)
284
Catnick: Judging from the content, if I only have those two choices from which to choose, I would say it comes from a Republican. But posts are usually done in a hurry, like email, with little or no regard to grammar. I see this on posts from both camps. Do the Republicans do it more? I don't know. However, I tend to not judge a comment's merit on such a thing, though, any more than I would if the poster accidentally posted the same comment more than one.
Talk to you later.
Talk to you later.
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 18, 2006 09:47 AM (gZnyq)
285
Jim is an idiot or thinks everyone else is a sucker.There is no reason the for the NSA to do that.
OH, boy. That's your position, that the NSA doesn't need to get warrants to listen in on US citizens in the US?
The Judge appears to differ. The Electronic Freedom Foundation appears to differ. The Congress and the Senate differ - the GOP is proposing bills that would make it legal for the NSA to listen in without warrants.
Funny, the only people who say the law definitely wasn't broken is the Bush administation and SOME of it's lawyers - while others are just avoiding the subject.
Let's see what an actual former NSA employee has to say:
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9000515
"As part of FISA, the NSA has to get warrants to analyze and maintain collections of data involving U.S. citizens."
The rest of your post is completely irrelevant to the subject at hand.
My point, which you failed to address, is that there is no valid reason why the NSA could not have gotten warrants.
Look, point blank - the Bush administration is playing you for a sucker. They are playing on your fear and making you excuse everything they do. We were able to get through two world wars and 40 years of nuclear Cold War, destruction of the entire human race staring us in the face, without domestic spying to this degree.
Don't let the Bush administration take advantage of you like this.
OH, boy. That's your position, that the NSA doesn't need to get warrants to listen in on US citizens in the US?
The Judge appears to differ. The Electronic Freedom Foundation appears to differ. The Congress and the Senate differ - the GOP is proposing bills that would make it legal for the NSA to listen in without warrants.
Funny, the only people who say the law definitely wasn't broken is the Bush administation and SOME of it's lawyers - while others are just avoiding the subject.
Let's see what an actual former NSA employee has to say:
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9000515
"As part of FISA, the NSA has to get warrants to analyze and maintain collections of data involving U.S. citizens."
The rest of your post is completely irrelevant to the subject at hand.
My point, which you failed to address, is that there is no valid reason why the NSA could not have gotten warrants.
Look, point blank - the Bush administration is playing you for a sucker. They are playing on your fear and making you excuse everything they do. We were able to get through two world wars and 40 years of nuclear Cold War, destruction of the entire human race staring us in the face, without domestic spying to this degree.
Don't let the Bush administration take advantage of you like this.
Posted by: jim at August 18, 2006 09:57 AM (P93Dy)
286
The posts in response to my 'double-posting' truly illustrate my point. Thanks to those who responded to the double-posting rather than the message itself (as I thought you would). Need I say more?
And if anyone, like youngbourbonprofessional, would like to criticize, might I suggest that you make sure you say 'once' instead of 'one', as in your last sentence, "more than one".
Anyway, I appreciate all of you proving how accurate my observations have been. Keep the logic at bay, whatever the cost!
And if anyone, like youngbourbonprofessional, would like to criticize, might I suggest that you make sure you say 'once' instead of 'one', as in your last sentence, "more than one".
Anyway, I appreciate all of you proving how accurate my observations have been. Keep the logic at bay, whatever the cost!
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 10:04 AM (kRqVX)
287
"As part of FISA, the NSA has to get warrants to analyze and maintain collections of data involving U.S. citizens."
Data capture is not analysis or maintenace. You have to decide what data to capture before you analyize or maintain.
Data capture is not analysis or maintenace. You have to decide what data to capture before you analyize or maintain.
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 10:05 AM (YdcZ0)
288
Too right, catnick. I've gone through, and by golly, if you match the words said to the spelling and grammar, then yes, you are quite correct in being able to see the difference.
Thanks for pointing this out. I'll help in deciphering bushit from people who don't have a clue how to spell democracy.
Thanks for pointing this out. I'll help in deciphering bushit from people who don't have a clue how to spell democracy.
Posted by: Neal at August 18, 2006 10:10 AM (kRqVX)
289
Catnick: Calm down.
You misjudged my comment about posting twice. My point was that people on both sides do this, and one shouldn't disregard a person's statement merely based upon this.
You misjudged my comment about posting twice. My point was that people on both sides do this, and one shouldn't disregard a person's statement merely based upon this.
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 18, 2006 10:17 AM (gZnyq)
290
Actually, youngbourbonpro, we agree on more things than we might think.
Thank you for the ideas, that's what these blogs should be about.
Thank you for the ideas, that's what these blogs should be about.
Posted by: catnick at August 18, 2006 10:37 AM (kRqVX)
291
YBP, these idiots somehow think an education from one of our traitor-inducing institutions of higher learning somehow make them better than others, decrying the very logic they espouse. What a bunch of imbeciles they are, living in glass houses and throwing stones. They all seem so sure of winning in November, and then proceeding to plunge the nation into crises with a series of trials, etc. I don't believe they will win in November, and even if the Democrats do win, I doubt that they will be interested in pursuing impeachment and trial in the Senate. That would not be in the nation's best interest, but if they do choose to plunge the nation in crises, I do have my ranch with generator, livestock, food stocked-up, and plenty of guns and ammuntion. Hey, we rednecks are always prepared to hunt and fish. We love it.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 18, 2006 10:43 AM (rUyw4)
292
Catnick: You're welcome.
JJ: Agreed. And a ranch life with hunting and fishing sounds good to me right about now. Shall I start planning a vacation in Texas!?
JJ: Agreed. And a ranch life with hunting and fishing sounds good to me right about now. Shall I start planning a vacation in Texas!?
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 18, 2006 10:51 AM (gZnyq)
293
Wow Jesusland Joe, your hatred of "traitor-inducing institutions" is exactly why people go to college - to learn the kind of critical thinking skills that keep this nation away from Fascism. My grandfathers fought long and hard to keep Fascism from taking over the world, and I'm not about to let some dumb-cks screw that up because they're wetting the bed over a few terrorists. Those grandfathers of mine and their generation didn't have to undermine the very pillars of our society to fight evil, and neither do we.
You remind me of my 8th grade history class where we learned about Nazi Germany and the question kept coming up "How did the German people let this happen?" You're the answer: they let ignorance and fear run their lives. You make me sick, and it sickens me more that you consider yourself a patriot.
You remind me of my 8th grade history class where we learned about Nazi Germany and the question kept coming up "How did the German people let this happen?" You're the answer: they let ignorance and fear run their lives. You make me sick, and it sickens me more that you consider yourself a patriot.
Posted by: Traitor-induced Instutionite at August 18, 2006 11:12 AM (WfL1d)
294
Wow, what a cicle jerk. Get a productive hobby people, and stop jerking yourselves off. Although admittedly I myself have spent too much time reading this entertaining thread, I have a feeling some of these people spend all day everyday hitting that refresh button, waiting to launch their next tirade, confusing the issue further to the point of incomprehension.
Turn off your computer. Talk to your husband/wife/kids/friends/neighbors. Go outside and enjoy some of that good stuff. Live.
I also have to say that I love the Jesus commenters spewing the hate - what is that Jesus would do again? Posers. I know real Jesus lovers, and you make a bad name for all of them. For shame.
Turn off your computer. Talk to your husband/wife/kids/friends/neighbors. Go outside and enjoy some of that good stuff. Live.
I also have to say that I love the Jesus commenters spewing the hate - what is that Jesus would do again? Posers. I know real Jesus lovers, and you make a bad name for all of them. For shame.
Posted by: Erik at August 18, 2006 11:29 AM (xsYJt)
Posted by: Robert at August 18, 2006 11:57 AM (VTtVl)
296
The comments on this thread by the lefties just proves which side they are on. They are on the side of the terrorists. They seem to have a death wish and desire to be blown to pieces. I don't share their death wish even if this one judge does. Don't worry, though. The decision is in appeal and will be overturned quickly.
What do you say, lefties? Is one person killed by terrorism one too many or not?
What do you say, lefties? Is one person killed by terrorism one too many or not?
Posted by: RepJ at August 18, 2006 12:03 PM (Ok807)
297
Traitor-induced Instutionite said, "How did the German people let this
happen?" You're the answer: they let ignorance and fear run their
lives."
It's quite arrogant to claim to know the answer this question- it has vexed many men for many years.
It is also quite wrong to claim this is the full answer. Hatred of the "other" is most certainly part of the answer to this question. If you go around blaming the Jews, or the Rednecks for your problems, you might be a Nazi.
happen?" You're the answer: they let ignorance and fear run their
lives."
It's quite arrogant to claim to know the answer this question- it has vexed many men for many years.
It is also quite wrong to claim this is the full answer. Hatred of the "other" is most certainly part of the answer to this question. If you go around blaming the Jews, or the Rednecks for your problems, you might be a Nazi.
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 12:09 PM (PX+vn)
298
Catprick: Ha, ha. Says it all. Why talk to commies? Have to get back to work. Something the leftards here apparently don't know about.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 18, 2006 12:39 PM (BjTJ6)
299
The Brits, who do such a great job of thwarting death upon our citizens, dont need warrants to surveil terrorists. Are they in a police state? How liberals - does it hurt you SO BAD (and they aren't looking at YOUR phone calls) - they look at datapoints - they aren't listening to words. But even if they did - your phone activity is monitored by the phone company, they know who you call , right? Sounds like the same thing as library records. If someone in my town is taking out books about nuclear bombs and calling pakistan twice a month , we need to know about it. Liberals always love to jump to HITLER or NAZI GERMANY - that's the rational arguement? Yes, its just like Nazi Germany here - because the NSA looks at datapoints through thousands of phone records. Do you hear how dumb you sound liberals?
Posted by: Stopthedonkey at August 18, 2006 12:57 PM (eB7xO)
300
http://patterico.com/2006/08/17/5017/ideologue-leftist-judge-rules-nsa-program-unconstitutional/
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 01:18 PM (YdcZ0)
301
Christ you people are evil. Christ almightyl, truly deeply and madly evil.
Posted by: Once More Into The Breach at August 18, 2006 02:19 PM (WfL1d)
302
Christ you people are evil. Christ almightyl, truly deeply and madly evil.
Posted by: Once More Into The Breach at August 18, 2006 02:19 PM (WfL1d)
303
OK, so obviously you are comfortable placing your trust in G.W.Bush - comfortable assuming that your Republican led government can be trusted to wiretap without warrants. Comfortable trusting the executive branch to operate without oversight, without checks and balances.
Well what about *the next president*?
Are you as comfortable trusting a President Hilary Clinton to operate without checks and balances?
(I doubt she could win, but that's besides the point)
Well what about *the next president*?
Are you as comfortable trusting a President Hilary Clinton to operate without checks and balances?
(I doubt she could win, but that's besides the point)
Posted by: Ryan Biggs at August 18, 2006 02:19 PM (prAU7)
304
Has anyone noticed what a senile fuck this graygoose is? S/he doesn't seem to understand that he doesn't have to hide under his bed from the Commies anymore.
After reading this thread, I think s/he is just joshing. No one that stupid knows how to type methinks. What a funny place this is! Fake Christians, Fake Patriots, and Fake toughguys all in one package. I may just become a regular!!!
GizOut!
After reading this thread, I think s/he is just joshing. No one that stupid knows how to type methinks. What a funny place this is! Fake Christians, Fake Patriots, and Fake toughguys all in one package. I may just become a regular!!!
GizOut!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 02:39 PM (FyFm5)
305
Welcome to the smokey pool room of the internet. Did you bring any good insults with you?
Posted by: Howie at August 18, 2006 02:49 PM (YdcZ0)
306
The comments on this thread by the lefties just proves which side they are on. They are on the side of the terrorists. They seem to have a death wish and desire to be blown to pieces.
Do you really honestly think that?
Seriously. Take a deep breath. Do you honestly think that when I wake up this morning, I say "Wow! What a beautiful day. I can't wait to go and work for the Communist/Islamofascist/Democratic Front, so they can off me and everyone I love. Let me see what my orders are today from the Streisand Compound."
In case you do, the answer's no.
Wow.
Do you really honestly think that?
Seriously. Take a deep breath. Do you honestly think that when I wake up this morning, I say "Wow! What a beautiful day. I can't wait to go and work for the Communist/Islamofascist/Democratic Front, so they can off me and everyone I love. Let me see what my orders are today from the Streisand Compound."
In case you do, the answer's no.
Wow.
Posted by: jim at August 18, 2006 03:20 PM (QAh+h)
307
jim - you waking up, prying yourself from some hairy ass, and picking the manpubs from your teeth are areas I don't care to think about.
Spit out the cock, take a shower and then lets chat...
Spit out the cock, take a shower and then lets chat...
Posted by: Greg Marmalard at August 18, 2006 03:31 PM (R4293)
308
No, Jim, you probably think that Bush is Hitler and that he and the JOOOOOOZZZ are plotting to turn the world into a barren wasteland for the sake of BIG OIL!!!
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 03:43 PM (v3I+x)
309
Something for Grey and Greg Marmalard to think about, assuming they are capable-
There is a proven significant correlation between latent homosexuality and aggressive homoerotic insults. It is hard not to notice that the homosexual lifestyle and particularly its physical and sexual aspects seem to occupy a great deal of your time.
Perhaps you two should consider coming out of the closet? Perhaps you two SHARE a closet??
Gizout!
There is a proven significant correlation between latent homosexuality and aggressive homoerotic insults. It is hard not to notice that the homosexual lifestyle and particularly its physical and sexual aspects seem to occupy a great deal of your time.
Perhaps you two should consider coming out of the closet? Perhaps you two SHARE a closet??
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 04:00 PM (FyFm5)
310
"Give me liberty or give me death" - Patrick Henry
"Take away my liberty and don't let bad people hurt me!" - every one on this comment section who are proving themselves COWARDS to let Bush scare them with fairy tales about terrorists. PUSSIES!
"Take away my liberty and don't let bad people hurt me!" - every one on this comment section who are proving themselves COWARDS to let Bush scare them with fairy tales about terrorists. PUSSIES!
Posted by: Anon at August 18, 2006 04:08 PM (+sXvg)
311
"This old whore is a traitor, and when the war comes home, I hope she gets doused with gas and burned alive on her own courthouse steps.
No mercy for enemies, less for traitors."
Behold the true right wing, psycopathic future Timothy McVeighs in waiting, if they could only get the balls to actually do something besides wet their pants behind a keyboard.
Greyrooster - "Did groveling dog go back to buggering his mama."
I dunno, did you go back to buggering your grandson? Is he as much of a fucking pantywaste as you and IM?
No mercy for enemies, less for traitors."
Behold the true right wing, psycopathic future Timothy McVeighs in waiting, if they could only get the balls to actually do something besides wet their pants behind a keyboard.
Greyrooster - "Did groveling dog go back to buggering his mama."
I dunno, did you go back to buggering your grandson? Is he as much of a fucking pantywaste as you and IM?
Posted by: Angryflower at August 18, 2006 04:09 PM (Bss6w)
312
I'd like to thank GREYROOSTER for showing us the true face of extreme conservatism. Reading his posts reminds me why, despite all the fuzzy thinking and wishy-washy cowardice exhibited by much of the left, I remain a proud liberal and a sworn enemy of right-wing fascism. The naked visage of hatred that he shows in his posts re-inspire me to keep up the Good Fight.
Posted by: louisms at August 18, 2006 04:28 PM (axwNB)
313
A 30 second post does NOT occupy a great deal of my time.
Now on the other hand, skull-fucking your mother...If only it paid overtime!
Aggresive homoerotic insults???
CLASSIC!
Like perhaps: "did you go back to buggering your grandson"?
Now on the other hand, skull-fucking your mother...If only it paid overtime!
Aggresive homoerotic insults???
CLASSIC!
Like perhaps: "did you go back to buggering your grandson"?
Posted by: Greg M. at August 18, 2006 04:45 PM (R4293)
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 05:06 PM (PX+vn)
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 05:07 PM (PX+vn)
316
Well, Greggie, don't sell yourself short. The snippets of wisdom you post, while brief, undoubtedly come after great and intense periods of introspection and thoughtful analysis. Two exciting posts from you today, Greggie, one involving public hair and sucking cock, the other "skullfucking". Bravo, Greggie, BRAVO!
How proud your parents must be of you, as well as Jesus. They'll be even more proud if you ever attain that GED.
Funny, funny group we've stumbled upon in here. Guess they've been bored since Jerry Springer's TV show was cancelled.
Gizout!
How proud your parents must be of you, as well as Jesus. They'll be even more proud if you ever attain that GED.
Funny, funny group we've stumbled upon in here. Guess they've been bored since Jerry Springer's TV show was cancelled.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 05:25 PM (FyFm5)
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 05:40 PM (FyFm5)
318
jim - you waking up, prying yourself from some hairy ass, and picking the manpubs from your teeth are areas I don't care to think about.
Really? Seems like you must enjoy thinking about that sort of thing. In quite some loving detail.
Maybe there's something there for you to look at. You wouldn't be the first closeted gay Republican, by a long shot.
Not that there's anything wrong that. The gay part, anyway....
Really? Seems like you must enjoy thinking about that sort of thing. In quite some loving detail.
Maybe there's something there for you to look at. You wouldn't be the first closeted gay Republican, by a long shot.
Not that there's anything wrong that. The gay part, anyway....
Posted by: jim at August 18, 2006 06:02 PM (QAh+h)
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 06:09 PM (0Pys3)
320
Jim,
I concur with your observations. It seems some of these unfortunates transfer their repressed sexuality into unfocused hostility and confused rage. I wonder if they are a danger to themselves? Do we have an obligation to report such sociopaths to the authorities, or should we just wait for God to punish those who ignore "judgement is mine, sayeth the Lord"?
Gizout!
I concur with your observations. It seems some of these unfortunates transfer their repressed sexuality into unfocused hostility and confused rage. I wonder if they are a danger to themselves? Do we have an obligation to report such sociopaths to the authorities, or should we just wait for God to punish those who ignore "judgement is mine, sayeth the Lord"?
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 06:10 PM (FyFm5)
321
I've learned some stuff from this blog. Does it matter if your a commie, anarchist, Republican, Muslim or Ddemocrat? Ideas do not kill people, the people are the ones with those ideas that go around and kill everyone that does not not agree with them.
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 18, 2006 06:12 PM (MR4EZ)
322
I've learned some stuff from this blog. Does it matter if your a commie, anarchist, Republican, Muslim or Democrat? Ideas do not kill people, the people are the ones with those ideas that go around and kill everyone that does not not agree with them.
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 18, 2006 06:12 PM (MR4EZ)
323
Check this story out before any of you start to bash me. I have just one question to ask all of you, what is a "terrorist" doing buying a cake? That terror plot is starting to sound fishy.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=17562590&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=buying-cakes-before-arrest--name_page.html
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=17562590&method=full&siteid=94762&headline=buying-cakes-before-arrest--name_page.html
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 18, 2006 06:20 PM (MR4EZ)
324
frank la may said:
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head."
An email directed at Paul Joseph Watson read:
"You should be shot for treason you irresponsible piece of garbage."
So, who are the real terrorists here?
"lets hope the first bomb that comes here is dropped on this judges head."
An email directed at Paul Joseph Watson read:
"You should be shot for treason you irresponsible piece of garbage."
So, who are the real terrorists here?
Posted by: anarchistmanifesto at August 18, 2006 06:44 PM (MR4EZ)
325
I've been cancelled???
Posted by: Jerry Springer at August 18, 2006 06:46 PM (dpUkO)
326
PiVgirl,
Please pardon my misspelling of "pubic"- but I am tickled I amused a spellcop.
Just curious, I've been trying to find anything of worthwhile substance you may have posted here and to date, have been unsuccessful.
But in the meantime, care to explain this little ditty you shared:
"If somebody misuses the monitoring system then they need to be prosecuted, but don't let the good things that can come from this be stopped because you're afraid of it being misused."
I mean, seriously, and with all due respect, are you a MORON?
And, again, PLEASE answer the question that has been posted over and over in this 'blog and ignored by you and your foaming-at-the-mouth buddies: What was the problem or inadequacy with FISA that required the president and attorney general to decide to break the law? Don't get me wrong, I know that you and the rest of the right wing cowards in here believe Bush=God and IS the law, and you need to believe Daddy will protect you, but since we ARE a "Nation of Laws, not a Nation of Men", I was hoping you could shed some light here.
Gizout!
Please pardon my misspelling of "pubic"- but I am tickled I amused a spellcop.
Just curious, I've been trying to find anything of worthwhile substance you may have posted here and to date, have been unsuccessful.
But in the meantime, care to explain this little ditty you shared:
"If somebody misuses the monitoring system then they need to be prosecuted, but don't let the good things that can come from this be stopped because you're afraid of it being misused."
I mean, seriously, and with all due respect, are you a MORON?
And, again, PLEASE answer the question that has been posted over and over in this 'blog and ignored by you and your foaming-at-the-mouth buddies: What was the problem or inadequacy with FISA that required the president and attorney general to decide to break the law? Don't get me wrong, I know that you and the rest of the right wing cowards in here believe Bush=God and IS the law, and you need to believe Daddy will protect you, but since we ARE a "Nation of Laws, not a Nation of Men", I was hoping you could shed some light here.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 18, 2006 07:04 PM (FyFm5)
327
Gizzard, you have done nothing but sling insults, so calling someone a homosexual didn't seem like you were trying to help them. People don't use words that they respect as weapons.
FISA doesn't work with Escheleon or Carnivore. Look it up. It has nothing to do with what you think a wire tap is.
FISA doesn't work with Escheleon or Carnivore. Look it up. It has nothing to do with what you think a wire tap is.
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 07:15 PM (PX+vn)
328
Gizzard,
I'm not usually a spell-cop, but it was one of your "buddies" that brought up the spelling thing. I just thought "public hair" was funny!
Somebody said the monitoring of phones could be misused, ie, harassing exes,etc. If that is done than those people should be dealt with. I don't think what President Bush is doing is illegal. I think during a time of war things have to be done to protect the country. What if he did get warrants? I'm sure you and others like you would find something else wrong. I really don't think it's the warrants you guys are whining and complaining about. You need to take a look at what you really want! The holier-than-thou attitude from liberals is ridiculous! What freedoms and rights are you guys losing. You can still use the phone and basically do everything that you were doing before. We're more at risk of losing our rights and freedoms from liberals. Unless, of course, you're an illegal alien or terrorist.
I'm not usually a spell-cop, but it was one of your "buddies" that brought up the spelling thing. I just thought "public hair" was funny!
Somebody said the monitoring of phones could be misused, ie, harassing exes,etc. If that is done than those people should be dealt with. I don't think what President Bush is doing is illegal. I think during a time of war things have to be done to protect the country. What if he did get warrants? I'm sure you and others like you would find something else wrong. I really don't think it's the warrants you guys are whining and complaining about. You need to take a look at what you really want! The holier-than-thou attitude from liberals is ridiculous! What freedoms and rights are you guys losing. You can still use the phone and basically do everything that you were doing before. We're more at risk of losing our rights and freedoms from liberals. Unless, of course, you're an illegal alien or terrorist.
Posted by: pivalleygirl at August 18, 2006 08:14 PM (0Pys3)
329
Our nation’s transition from a free democracy to a Banana Republic under the benighted presidency of George W. Bush takes another leap toward completion with the nomination of General Michael Hayden as the new head of the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Porter Goss, who only 16 months ago was installed as CIA chief with glowing words from Bush, has, for all practical purposes, simply disappeared from the public eye with virtually no explanation. But that’s the way things are done in Banana Republics, aren’t they?
The sudden announcement that Goss is gone and Hayden is in comes as Bush’s approval rating hits its lowest point yet. The latest USA TODAY-Gallup poll shows just 31 percent of the American people approve of the job Bush is doing as president. Put another way, that means 7 out of 10 Americans disapprove of Bush’s so-called leadership of the nation—and that has Capitol Hill Republicans very worried about their own chances in the coming elections.
None of this should come as much of a surprise to those who’ve been keeping tabs on the state of the nation throughout the Bush regime. Iraq and Afghanistan have turned out to be the quagmires many predicted at the beginning of Bush’s preemptive invasions. The Taliban are resurgent in Afghanistan, where they are busy dropping helicopters out of the sky and killing Americans. And far from the rosy prediction that we would be greeted as liberators by cheering crowds of flower-throwing Iraqis, the U.S. invasion has toppled that nation into open civil war. In desperation over the casualties and costs—which have ballooned to nearly a trillion dollars—many in Congress are now talking openly of dividing that hapless country into three autonomous regions.
But wait, peace and unity weren’t the reasons we went to war in Iraq in the first place, now were they? No, you remember, it was Weapons of Mass Destruction—Saddam was supposed to have WMDs, and by golly we had the proof. Satellite photos of weapons-production facilities, underground bunkers, mobile bio-warfare labs—all there just as plain as day in the photos poor old Colin Powell had to present to the United Nations and the people of America. To say nothing of the “mushroom clouds†that would spring from the purchase of yellow-cake uranium from Niger.
As we now know, those were all lies—lies concocted by the highest levels of the Bush administration, which forced its so-called intelligence agencies to support them with complicit “evidence.†Which is exactly where General Hayden comes into the picture, and why Americans should never allow him to lead the CIA.
Hayden, unlike virtually all other four-star Air Force generals, attained his rank without ever having been a pilot. Instead he got where he is because, as The New York Times wrote in a scathing editorial this week: “What General Hayden knows is gadgets, not people.†It was General Hayden who was director of the National Security Agency during the lead-up to the Iraq invasion. The “intelligence†and satellite photos Powell foisted on the world were a product of the “gadgets†with which Hayden is so familiar—and the “intelligence†they produced proved to be horribly wrong.
Then again, what’s so different about just another Bush blunder in his long line of same? Remember, it was George W. Bush who strutted across the deck of an aircraft carrier with a “Mission Accomplished†banner strung out behind him. It was George W. Bush who told FEMA Director Michael Brown during the Katrina disaster debacle: “You’re doing a heck of a job, Brownie.†And it is George W. Bush who is now rewarding the man whose agency helped provide the significantly flawed “intelligence†that led the nation into war.
If that isn’t enough reason to reject Hayden outright, how about the general’s part in the ongoing scandal over warrantless spying on Americans being perpetrated by the National Security Agency? Guess who used his knowledge of “gadgets†to eavesdrop on your e-mails, Internet use and phone calls? Yep, you got it, General Michael Hayden was the man who put that little piece of perfidy in motion—and defended it when it was finally exposed. Constitutional rights, congressional checks and balances, open government? Ha! All those quaint notions that were so revered during the nation’s first 200 years have been thrown out the window by Hayden and his White House bosses. They don’t need no stinking warrants, they don’t need no stinking badges, and they don’t need no stinking free press—they’ve got “gadgets†to do everything they need, and the Constitution be damned.
If this isn’t bad enough, consider the phrase Hayden used to describe the new CIA job. As reported by National Public Radio, Hayden said: “There’s probably no post more important in preserving our security and our values as people than the CIA.â€
Now why would the head of the CIA ever think his job was to preserve “our values as people� Like most folks, you probably thought the CIA was supposed to be gathering and analyzing information and presenting it in an objective manner to policymakers—with the key word being “objective.†The “intelligence†is not supposed to be massaged to fit a specific political agenda or purpose. So how is it that the CIA is now in the business of “preserving our values�
Another question you might ask is whose values those would be? The “values†of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Rice? The “values†of Halliburton and Exxon? Don’t know about you, but those sure aren’t my values.
Putting a military general in charge of the CIA is a very bad idea. But when the populace turns against them, Banana Republic dictators surround themselves with military men, use their security agencies to secretly wiretap citizens, and “disappear†their enemies without warrants or due process of law. If all this is starting to sound just a little too familiar, welcome to the new Banana Republic of Bush.
The sudden announcement that Goss is gone and Hayden is in comes as Bush’s approval rating hits its lowest point yet. The latest USA TODAY-Gallup poll shows just 31 percent of the American people approve of the job Bush is doing as president. Put another way, that means 7 out of 10 Americans disapprove of Bush’s so-called leadership of the nation—and that has Capitol Hill Republicans very worried about their own chances in the coming elections.
None of this should come as much of a surprise to those who’ve been keeping tabs on the state of the nation throughout the Bush regime. Iraq and Afghanistan have turned out to be the quagmires many predicted at the beginning of Bush’s preemptive invasions. The Taliban are resurgent in Afghanistan, where they are busy dropping helicopters out of the sky and killing Americans. And far from the rosy prediction that we would be greeted as liberators by cheering crowds of flower-throwing Iraqis, the U.S. invasion has toppled that nation into open civil war. In desperation over the casualties and costs—which have ballooned to nearly a trillion dollars—many in Congress are now talking openly of dividing that hapless country into three autonomous regions.
But wait, peace and unity weren’t the reasons we went to war in Iraq in the first place, now were they? No, you remember, it was Weapons of Mass Destruction—Saddam was supposed to have WMDs, and by golly we had the proof. Satellite photos of weapons-production facilities, underground bunkers, mobile bio-warfare labs—all there just as plain as day in the photos poor old Colin Powell had to present to the United Nations and the people of America. To say nothing of the “mushroom clouds†that would spring from the purchase of yellow-cake uranium from Niger.
As we now know, those were all lies—lies concocted by the highest levels of the Bush administration, which forced its so-called intelligence agencies to support them with complicit “evidence.†Which is exactly where General Hayden comes into the picture, and why Americans should never allow him to lead the CIA.
Hayden, unlike virtually all other four-star Air Force generals, attained his rank without ever having been a pilot. Instead he got where he is because, as The New York Times wrote in a scathing editorial this week: “What General Hayden knows is gadgets, not people.†It was General Hayden who was director of the National Security Agency during the lead-up to the Iraq invasion. The “intelligence†and satellite photos Powell foisted on the world were a product of the “gadgets†with which Hayden is so familiar—and the “intelligence†they produced proved to be horribly wrong.
Then again, what’s so different about just another Bush blunder in his long line of same? Remember, it was George W. Bush who strutted across the deck of an aircraft carrier with a “Mission Accomplished†banner strung out behind him. It was George W. Bush who told FEMA Director Michael Brown during the Katrina disaster debacle: “You’re doing a heck of a job, Brownie.†And it is George W. Bush who is now rewarding the man whose agency helped provide the significantly flawed “intelligence†that led the nation into war.
If that isn’t enough reason to reject Hayden outright, how about the general’s part in the ongoing scandal over warrantless spying on Americans being perpetrated by the National Security Agency? Guess who used his knowledge of “gadgets†to eavesdrop on your e-mails, Internet use and phone calls? Yep, you got it, General Michael Hayden was the man who put that little piece of perfidy in motion—and defended it when it was finally exposed. Constitutional rights, congressional checks and balances, open government? Ha! All those quaint notions that were so revered during the nation’s first 200 years have been thrown out the window by Hayden and his White House bosses. They don’t need no stinking warrants, they don’t need no stinking badges, and they don’t need no stinking free press—they’ve got “gadgets†to do everything they need, and the Constitution be damned.
If this isn’t bad enough, consider the phrase Hayden used to describe the new CIA job. As reported by National Public Radio, Hayden said: “There’s probably no post more important in preserving our security and our values as people than the CIA.â€
Now why would the head of the CIA ever think his job was to preserve “our values as people� Like most folks, you probably thought the CIA was supposed to be gathering and analyzing information and presenting it in an objective manner to policymakers—with the key word being “objective.†The “intelligence†is not supposed to be massaged to fit a specific political agenda or purpose. So how is it that the CIA is now in the business of “preserving our values�
Another question you might ask is whose values those would be? The “values†of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Rice? The “values†of Halliburton and Exxon? Don’t know about you, but those sure aren’t my values.
Putting a military general in charge of the CIA is a very bad idea. But when the populace turns against them, Banana Republic dictators surround themselves with military men, use their security agencies to secretly wiretap citizens, and “disappear†their enemies without warrants or due process of law. If all this is starting to sound just a little too familiar, welcome to the new Banana Republic of Bush.
Posted by: Trouble in the Banana Republic at August 18, 2006 09:09 PM (uMa6H)
330
Trouble in the Banana Republic, in the future you should link to a source rather than quoting it in whole... especially in the comments section of a blog.
http://www.missoulanews.com/News/News.asp?no=5704
http://www.missoulanews.com/News/News.asp?no=5704
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 09:27 PM (LoKA7)
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 09:29 PM (LoKA7)
332
To summarize the above cut and paste job by Banana's-
1. Navel gazing.
2. Questions without answers, or attempting answers because they require a sense of self.
3. Start new paragraph go to step 1.
1. Navel gazing.
2. Questions without answers, or attempting answers because they require a sense of self.
3. Start new paragraph go to step 1.
Posted by: QC at August 18, 2006 09:40 PM (LoKA7)
333
Good job QC - exposing the turd for what it is - a piece of shit thief.
Another asshole who hates Bush more that it loves it's country!
Another asshole who hates Bush more that it loves it's country!
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 18, 2006 10:15 PM (dpUkO)
334
I do love my country! I'm pretty sure that just because I disagree with some things being said and done, doesn't mean I love it less!
Imagine if we took that theory with our children, hubby, or wife! Wow....
Imagine if we took that theory with our children, hubby, or wife! Wow....
Posted by: MadamSim at August 18, 2006 11:19 PM (Iv3aA)
335
Dumbfuck! Never said you didn't love your country...
Posted by: Barney Coppersmith at August 19, 2006 12:09 AM (dpUkO)
336
This is classic
Kinda Sums Up This Blog...haha....(yes, this is a jab at both sides...hehe...and no, I didn't create it...)
Kinda Sums Up This Blog...haha....(yes, this is a jab at both sides...hehe...and no, I didn't create it...)
Posted by: babywhiz at August 19, 2006 12:23 AM (Iv3aA)
337
QC,
No offense, but I have read this entire thread, and between what happened to you earlier regarding the whole issue surrounding the tap/warrant/legality issue and your statement that all I do is insult, I must respectfully suggest your reading comprehension skills are impaired. Or, perhaps like most of us you have a lot going on and just aren't paying attention.
No insults here QC- just observation based on the facts.
In any case, there are some extremely unstable idiots inhabiting this place and I would be very careful before I put faith or trust in their ironicly flawed definition of patriotism if I were you. Don't get me wrong, the left side has them too, and in no small numbers, but speaking generally, they are usually a hell of a lot smarter and less bigoted.
With that, I say goodnight.
Gizout!
No offense, but I have read this entire thread, and between what happened to you earlier regarding the whole issue surrounding the tap/warrant/legality issue and your statement that all I do is insult, I must respectfully suggest your reading comprehension skills are impaired. Or, perhaps like most of us you have a lot going on and just aren't paying attention.
No insults here QC- just observation based on the facts.
In any case, there are some extremely unstable idiots inhabiting this place and I would be very careful before I put faith or trust in their ironicly flawed definition of patriotism if I were you. Don't get me wrong, the left side has them too, and in no small numbers, but speaking generally, they are usually a hell of a lot smarter and less bigoted.
With that, I say goodnight.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 19, 2006 12:31 AM (P0Rz4)
338
"No insults here QC- just observation based on the facts."
Yer facts aint facts. They're spin. I won't bother trying to explain what was intended to be communicated by me above- you don't want to understand me. I know you.
This deciscion will not stand. My quoted text on FISA stands. The lie refuting the quote became silent on the issue, and turned to name calling, subtrafuge, and spell patrolling.
International electronic communications via 3rd party commercial networks have no right to not be monitored by the government.
Yer facts aint facts. They're spin. I won't bother trying to explain what was intended to be communicated by me above- you don't want to understand me. I know you.
This deciscion will not stand. My quoted text on FISA stands. The lie refuting the quote became silent on the issue, and turned to name calling, subtrafuge, and spell patrolling.
International electronic communications via 3rd party commercial networks have no right to not be monitored by the government.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 12:59 AM (LoKA7)
339
To everyone:
I think everyone here should be reminded of a section of an amazing document written 219 years ago:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Please read it and think about what it means. Not about race, creed, color or religion of individuals.
I think everyone here should be reminded of a section of an amazing document written 219 years ago:
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Please read it and think about what it means. Not about race, creed, color or religion of individuals.
Posted by: ConstitutionBuddy1787 at August 19, 2006 01:14 AM (RzLiF)
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 01:26 AM (LoKA7)
341
QC,
My apologies.
I gave you the benefit of the doubt, assuming you are a rational adult.
I won't make this mistake again.
Obviously, you are a juvenile retard (yup, these are insults, and yup, you ARE A DUMBASS!)
But you know what is worse? I'll tell you. You are a fucking liar, QC, that is what is worse. Even when the facts are painstakingly presented in front of you, rather than "man up", you disappear and instead create false arguments and unrelated tangents.
You're not bright, QC, and you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. I spend much of my day with conservatives who disagree with much of what I have to say, but unlike you, their positions are based in rational discourse and admit points given and taken.
And, in case your reading comprehension challenged brain didn't get it, let me repeat- You're not honest, QC. A fascist liar should get along great in this weblog- fine by me, I'll waste absolutely not another second with such scum.
Consider these "insults" if it makes you sleep better, pal, but the sad reality for you is you don't get it, and my commentary is based on observation. Glad you are with the rednecks, though I doubt you can hunt or fish for shit.
Toodles, and Gizout!
My apologies.
I gave you the benefit of the doubt, assuming you are a rational adult.
I won't make this mistake again.
Obviously, you are a juvenile retard (yup, these are insults, and yup, you ARE A DUMBASS!)
But you know what is worse? I'll tell you. You are a fucking liar, QC, that is what is worse. Even when the facts are painstakingly presented in front of you, rather than "man up", you disappear and instead create false arguments and unrelated tangents.
You're not bright, QC, and you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. I spend much of my day with conservatives who disagree with much of what I have to say, but unlike you, their positions are based in rational discourse and admit points given and taken.
And, in case your reading comprehension challenged brain didn't get it, let me repeat- You're not honest, QC. A fascist liar should get along great in this weblog- fine by me, I'll waste absolutely not another second with such scum.
Consider these "insults" if it makes you sleep better, pal, but the sad reality for you is you don't get it, and my commentary is based on observation. Glad you are with the rednecks, though I doubt you can hunt or fish for shit.
Toodles, and Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 19, 2006 01:58 AM (P0Rz4)
342
As said by me previously, you don't seek to understand, you seek to sling insults.
Your "points" are nothing but name calling and insults. Anger and hatred like you spew won Bush the last election. We dumb hicks were treated with contempt, and witnessed the viscious hatred of the leftists that saturated every single discussion and debate on every issue. You can't control yourselves, and this reveals your heart to us. But then self control is something the left claims is not real, like they claim evil is not real.
We're fighting evil here, something you either care nothing about, or you seek victory for the darkness. Your effort displayed on this comment thread indicates the latter.
Your "points" are nothing but name calling and insults. Anger and hatred like you spew won Bush the last election. We dumb hicks were treated with contempt, and witnessed the viscious hatred of the leftists that saturated every single discussion and debate on every issue. You can't control yourselves, and this reveals your heart to us. But then self control is something the left claims is not real, like they claim evil is not real.
We're fighting evil here, something you either care nothing about, or you seek victory for the darkness. Your effort displayed on this comment thread indicates the latter.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 02:33 AM (LoKA7)
343
Why do we keep referring to these terrorist hugging commies as democrats? Democrats are not as bad as these SOB's who cheer for everything that will help the enemy. This is the same group that you see at every pro gay, pro Al Sharpton, pro Castro, pro muslim, pro socialist rally. Social outcasts, pissed at God for making them nerds.
Lets find out what blogs they normally hang out at.
Lets find out what blogs they normally hang out at.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 19, 2006 05:41 AM (MXHg4)
344
301 - is that a record Rusty? Sorry I didn't bother to participate - BDS by any other name bores me.
Posted by: hondo at August 19, 2006 09:08 AM (XrexX)
345
Woohoo! This post really made the lefturds put down their Ben & Jerry's, crawl out from under their rocks, and work themselves up into a self-righteous, socialist tizzy! There's nothing I like better than to piss-off a lefturd, and listen to them whine and sputter about things they don't understand, like "Liberty", and "security". It's really funny when they quote Franklin, Jefferson, or the Constitution, without the lest semblance of understanding of what they're talking about, like parrots squawking.
I'm really, really looking forward to the inevitable war in our own streets.
I'm really, really looking forward to the inevitable war in our own streets.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 19, 2006 10:11 AM (v3I+x)
346
From where they came, I do know. Clear your mind, feel the force flow, and know where to click you will.
Posted by: Darth Odie at August 19, 2006 10:24 AM (YdcZ0)
347
I presume that the majority of these people here are for profiling, correct?
As someone mentioned above, what is wrong with profiling with the wiretapping? Would that not be the middle ground that would make everyone happy?
As someone mentioned above, what is wrong with profiling with the wiretapping? Would that not be the middle ground that would make everyone happy?
Posted by: MadamSim at August 19, 2006 11:43 AM (Iv3aA)
348
MadamSim, if one makes a phone call that goes to Afghanistan, or North Korea that call should be monitored. If that's profiling I don't know.
I just don't believe that one has the right to expect privacy on an international call. You certainly don't have that guarantee from the gov't of the other country, so I don't know what you acheive by preventing our side from gathering the info. Our govt could just purchase the information from the other govt, or steal it from their systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of course this filters all of the information through foreign agents and filters and/or degrades the content of the information.
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
I just don't believe that one has the right to expect privacy on an international call. You certainly don't have that guarantee from the gov't of the other country, so I don't know what you acheive by preventing our side from gathering the info. Our govt could just purchase the information from the other govt, or steal it from their systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of course this filters all of the information through foreign agents and filters and/or degrades the content of the information.
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 12:24 PM (LoKA7)
349
What is really pathetic about this bunch of Leftists and liberals is that we are trying to save their lives. Hell, I live on a ranch in W. Texas for most of the year, although I have been working in a small city in the Ozark Mountains of Arkansas part of the year. My point, I don't have to fear a terrorist attack. The terrorists are going to attack the large cities, not a single ranch, or a single home in a small Arkansas city. So I'm not the least bit scared, never have been, because I know I will not be attacked. And I'm beginning to care a lot less about whether these idiots are. I 'm sure all that "Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death" talk will be just that when the SHTF. I can see these clowns wetting their pants at the first indication of an attack.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 19, 2006 02:50 PM (rUyw4)
350
LOL!
QC, what you lack in reading comprehension skilz you definitely make up with that ironic sense of humor, whether or not intended.
Fighting evil? You've never fought in your life, and if you believe the banal bigoted homophobic banter in here is anything more than mutual masterbation, you are dumber than you sound.
OF COURSE I've joined the redneck insult agenda- Time and time again your points have been refuted, yet you fail to acknowledge same. If that doesn't define moronic, what does?
This is getting more fun by the minute, QC. Where is the Grey Whitetrash today? Hope they didn't cut his electricity off!
Gizout!
QC, what you lack in reading comprehension skilz you definitely make up with that ironic sense of humor, whether or not intended.
Fighting evil? You've never fought in your life, and if you believe the banal bigoted homophobic banter in here is anything more than mutual masterbation, you are dumber than you sound.
OF COURSE I've joined the redneck insult agenda- Time and time again your points have been refuted, yet you fail to acknowledge same. If that doesn't define moronic, what does?
This is getting more fun by the minute, QC. Where is the Grey Whitetrash today? Hope they didn't cut his electricity off!
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 19, 2006 03:59 PM (P0Rz4)
351
Gizzard, if I were a conservative political organization, I would hire you to work for the other side. You schtick is weak. You are the Greyrooster of the left. (sorry Greyrooster, but your racisim is quite distasteful- although I have my flaws too)
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
Posted by: QC at August 19, 2006 04:25 PM (LoKA7)
Posted by: MadamSim at August 19, 2006 07:27 PM (Iv3aA)
353
To everyone (including QC & Gizzard):
The aspect of the 4th amendment to "unreasonable searches and seizuresâ€; is most commonly applied in court (often called a ‘court standard’) is that it must be a search and confiscation of evidence "upon probable cause".
That has to be "supported by oath or affirmation" i.e., witness or court of law, also that it must "particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized" i.e., must specified what you are looking for or taking.
The issue of "reasonable/unreasonable†search is being used often most recently deputy director of National Intelligence General Michael Hayden: "Fourth Amendment actually protects all of us against unreasonable search and seizure." Surveillance without a warrant are addressed in Katz v. United States (1967) it was concluded that "Unanimously, the Court held that at least in cases of domestic subversive investigations, compliance with the warrant provisions of the Fourth Amendment was required." Also Justice Mark Stewart said "… that searches conducted outside the judicial process, without prior approval by judge or magistrate, are per se unreasonable under the Fourth Amendment …" I think its just a play of words by General Michael Hayden.
Of course there is the question of Presidential powers endowed by the constitution that is -- as of yet -- an unresolved judiciary issue. Perhaps not for long.
As for the item of leftist or rightist split of political parties. The interesting aspect of this is that the founding fathers really didn’t think the party system should be applicable in a true democracy.
The party system of political discourse was a failure in their eyes since the parliamentary system has an unelected head of representation i.e., King, Queen, or any other hereditary endowed power. That caused taxation of effects without representation. Therefore, we have the President; he is our elected representation but not our King, Queen, or hereditary endowed power representative. The people are the power of the President and they are his mandate.
Please don’t take my word for read the constitution it is truly an incredible document: http://www.findlaw.com/casecode/constitution/
The aspect of the 4th amendment to "unreasonable searches and seizuresâ€; is most commonly applied in court (often called a ‘court standard’) is that it must be a search and confiscation of evidence "upon probable cause".
That has to be "supported by oath or affirmation" i.e., witness or court of law, also that it must "particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized" i.e., must specified what you are looking for or taking.
The issue of "reasonable/unreasonable†search is being used often most recently deputy director of National Intelligence General Michael Hayden: "Fourth Amendment actually protects all of us against unreasonable search and seizure." Surveillance without a warrant are addressed in Katz v. United States (1967) it was concluded that "Unanimously, the Court held that at least in cases of domestic subversive investigations, compliance with the warrant provisions of the Fourth Amendment was required." Also Justice Mark Stewart said "… that searches conducted outside the judicial process, without prior approval by judge or magistrate, are per se unreasonable under the Fourth Amendment …" I think its just a play of words by General Michael Hayden.
Of course there is the question of Presidential powers endowed by the constitution that is -- as of yet -- an unresolved judiciary issue. Perhaps not for long.
As for the item of leftist or rightist split of political parties. The interesting aspect of this is that the founding fathers really didn’t think the party system should be applicable in a true democracy.
The party system of political discourse was a failure in their eyes since the parliamentary system has an unelected head of representation i.e., King, Queen, or any other hereditary endowed power. That caused taxation of effects without representation. Therefore, we have the President; he is our elected representation but not our King, Queen, or hereditary endowed power representative. The people are the power of the President and they are his mandate.
Please don’t take my word for read the constitution it is truly an incredible document: http://www.findlaw.com/casecode/constitution/
Posted by: ConstitutionBuddy1787 at August 19, 2006 09:31 PM (YkWPO)
354
QC: No problem with you disagreeing with my thinking. Remember, that your way of thinking on the race issue is quite distasteful to me. You have your opinion. Fine. I have mine. So far I haven't seen a thing to change my views. In fact, the world of late seems to confirm them.
The issue is this old bag's poor decision making. I say it was decided in part by politics and race. The other judge jumping out to agree with the old bag also is black and comes from a city that is black controlled. Namely, New Orleans. The most racist city in the country. With the possible exception of Detroit. So two black judges, both democrats, both from predominately black cities with black mayors, etc: Out of the hundreds of big cities and hundreds of judges the desenters just happen to be blacks from black controlled cities. Bullshit! Moreover Detroit I understand has a large muslim population. Coincidence? Bullshit! Don't know much about Detroit. I have passed thru it (holding my nose) on my way to Canada. I do know what blacks say and do in New Orleans. They are anti-bush, anti-republican, anti-white and pro-muslim. Sometimes the admitted racist is the one with his eyes open. Yea, yea. Not all blacks are this way. Well, not all muslims are terrorists either. We've been over that one before. Where is the outrage from the good muslims? Where is the outrage from the good blacks in Detroit and New Orleans? Excuse me if I continue to be the racist while waiting for the outrage.
All this really doesn't matter. It was merely temporary fodder for the commies. The ruling will be overturned by intelligent patriotic judges.
I believe in freedom of speech just as the writers of the Constitution. But nowhere did they say I couldn't listen to this free speech. The freedom to listen to freedom of speech is my constitutonal right.
The issue is this old bag's poor decision making. I say it was decided in part by politics and race. The other judge jumping out to agree with the old bag also is black and comes from a city that is black controlled. Namely, New Orleans. The most racist city in the country. With the possible exception of Detroit. So two black judges, both democrats, both from predominately black cities with black mayors, etc: Out of the hundreds of big cities and hundreds of judges the desenters just happen to be blacks from black controlled cities. Bullshit! Moreover Detroit I understand has a large muslim population. Coincidence? Bullshit! Don't know much about Detroit. I have passed thru it (holding my nose) on my way to Canada. I do know what blacks say and do in New Orleans. They are anti-bush, anti-republican, anti-white and pro-muslim. Sometimes the admitted racist is the one with his eyes open. Yea, yea. Not all blacks are this way. Well, not all muslims are terrorists either. We've been over that one before. Where is the outrage from the good muslims? Where is the outrage from the good blacks in Detroit and New Orleans? Excuse me if I continue to be the racist while waiting for the outrage.
All this really doesn't matter. It was merely temporary fodder for the commies. The ruling will be overturned by intelligent patriotic judges.
I believe in freedom of speech just as the writers of the Constitution. But nowhere did they say I couldn't listen to this free speech. The freedom to listen to freedom of speech is my constitutonal right.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 19, 2006 11:21 PM (2a6q3)
355
All of you right wing bedwetting losers are just pathetic. There are so many lies being peddled from the right that black is white, up is down, and right is wrong. And you people are too stupid to see it. The "balance" constantly being pushed at us by the MSM is "truth" vs "Bush lies" and their idea of balance it to give credibility to lies.
It's truly sad that you people are willing to give Bin Laden everything he wants because you are so scared of some unseen horde of terrorists who you are so sure are going to kill us all. Better check under your beds, some of them might be there.
Will terrorists attack us again? Of course they will. You people are just so pathetic that you are willing to sell your souls to the devil to have big brother protect you. What a bunch of pussies. Your parents and grandparents who fought in the two world wars would be embarrassed by your behavior. If Bush were president in 1941, he would have attached Russia because the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor.
The germans didn't think Hitler could do what he did until it was too late. This is exactly how countries descend into tyranny...one small step at a time. It has happened throughout history. If you think it can't happen here, you really are naive. I swear people should have to pass a civics test to be able to vote.
Listen up; it's not that hard to understand. We are a nation of laws. Everyone must obey the law including you boy king, George Bush. You may be fine with giving up your civil rights, but I most certainly am not. And until every one of us who cares about our constitution decides otherwise, we expect our government to obey the law. Got it douchebags?
I know how the Dems can win a landslide in November...just pass the word that "the turrists" are planning to attack the polls. All you Republican wimps will stay home and hide in the closet while us real Americans will vote to kick your Republican fear mongers straight back to the 18th century.
It's truly sad that you people are willing to give Bin Laden everything he wants because you are so scared of some unseen horde of terrorists who you are so sure are going to kill us all. Better check under your beds, some of them might be there.
Will terrorists attack us again? Of course they will. You people are just so pathetic that you are willing to sell your souls to the devil to have big brother protect you. What a bunch of pussies. Your parents and grandparents who fought in the two world wars would be embarrassed by your behavior. If Bush were president in 1941, he would have attached Russia because the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor.
The germans didn't think Hitler could do what he did until it was too late. This is exactly how countries descend into tyranny...one small step at a time. It has happened throughout history. If you think it can't happen here, you really are naive. I swear people should have to pass a civics test to be able to vote.
Listen up; it's not that hard to understand. We are a nation of laws. Everyone must obey the law including you boy king, George Bush. You may be fine with giving up your civil rights, but I most certainly am not. And until every one of us who cares about our constitution decides otherwise, we expect our government to obey the law. Got it douchebags?
I know how the Dems can win a landslide in November...just pass the word that "the turrists" are planning to attack the polls. All you Republican wimps will stay home and hide in the closet while us real Americans will vote to kick your Republican fear mongers straight back to the 18th century.
Posted by: ConservativesAreIdiots at August 19, 2006 11:54 PM (SV/4K)
356
To review, QC, here is a highlight of the posts you would like to "stand":
"jim. You don't get it. There is no privacy on a phone."
-Plainly incorrect. Illustrates lack of understanding of "privacy" and the contextual use of same during this conversation.
"However, in a third case, the special review court for FISA
“[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
-The first part was cut and pasted from a Wiki subsection that had absolutely NO relevance to the discussion and clearly indicates you don't even understand the Wiki cite you copied. The second proves that you REALLY doesn't get the context of the Wiki you cited. BY NO MEANS WHATSOEVER doe the wiki section state that other courts have decided the issue- rather it was establishing a stipulation limiting the scope of the third case under discussion. Once again, YOU READ IT AND YOU DID NOT UNDERSTAND IT.
"Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications."
-Great, you don't only have trouble comprehending case law, you also can't fathom the Bill of Rights. Just the kind of guy I want arguing about "freedom"
"Gizzard, are you implying that there is something wrong with being gay?"
-...nor can he even understand my simpleton lingo.
"You are the Greyrooster of the left."
-Not that you have a proud track record here, but Greyrooster speaks down upon blacks, gays, muslims, eurasians, etc. I have NEVER done such thing; rather I hoist you upon you groups own petard by aligning you with the stereotype you represent. Hardly in common at all with what Greyrooster does.
In conclusion- your feelings toward my "schtick" are wasted energy pal- Concentrate next time on understanding what you are talking about and perhaps you won't get your ass handed to you so summarily.
Gizout!
To review, QC, here is a highlight of the posts you would like to "stand":
"jim. You don't get it. There is no privacy on a phone."
-Plainly incorrect. Illustrates lack of understanding of "privacy" and the contextual use of same during this conversation.
"However, in a third case, the special review court for FISA
“[A]ll the other courts to have decided the issue [have] held
-The first part was cut and pasted from a Wiki subsection that had absolutely NO relevance to the discussion and clearly indicates you don't even understand the Wiki cite you copied. The second proves that you REALLY doesn't get the context of the Wiki you cited. BY NO MEANS WHATSOEVER doe the wiki section state that other courts have decided the issue- rather it was establishing a stipulation limiting the scope of the third case under discussion. Once again, YOU READ IT AND YOU DID NOT UNDERSTAND IT.
"Also your post on the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses... IN meaning in their houses, not outside of them, or in international telecommunications."
-Great, you don't only have trouble comprehending case law, you also can't fathom the Bill of Rights. Just the kind of guy I want arguing about "freedom"
"Gizzard, are you implying that there is something wrong with being gay?"
-...nor can he even understand my simpleton lingo.
"You are the Greyrooster of the left."
-Not that you have a proud track record here, but Greyrooster speaks down upon blacks, gays, muslims, eurasians, etc. I have NEVER done such thing; rather I hoist you upon you groups own petard by aligning you with the stereotype you represent. Hardly in common at all with what Greyrooster does.
In conclusion- your feelings toward my "schtick" are wasted energy pal- Concentrate next time on understanding what you are talking about and perhaps you won't get your ass handed to you so summarily.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 20, 2006 12:54 AM (P0Rz4)
Posted by: Kevin Simms at August 20, 2006 01:30 AM (9gEiF)
358
Gizzard you'll get no further tips from I. Your stripes are shown.
Our govt could just purchase the information from the other govt, or
steal it from their systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of
course this filters all of the information through foreign agents and
filters and/or degrades the content of the information.
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
Our govt could just purchase the information from the other govt, or
steal it from their systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of
course this filters all of the information through foreign agents and
filters and/or degrades the content of the information.
The argument that other gov'ts should have this information, but ours should not is what this boils down to.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 02:44 AM (LoKA7)
359
Gizzard: Quit your exxagerations. Blacks, gays and muslims. Not Asians. I like Asians. When referring to me. Get it right.
As far as gays. I don't hate them. I just feel they are weird. I take such pleasure with women (as God and nature intended) I can't understand how someone could enjoy themselves with children or the same sex. YUK! SICK!
Yes, something is wrong with gays. And something is wrong with those who don't realize it.
Sorry QC if you are one of them. You're problem.
QC: I am implying that there is something wrong with gays. And anyone who don't think something is wrong with their unnatural behavior is as sick as they.
As far as gays. I don't hate them. I just feel they are weird. I take such pleasure with women (as God and nature intended) I can't understand how someone could enjoy themselves with children or the same sex. YUK! SICK!
Yes, something is wrong with gays. And something is wrong with those who don't realize it.
Sorry QC if you are one of them. You're problem.
QC: I am implying that there is something wrong with gays. And anyone who don't think something is wrong with their unnatural behavior is as sick as they.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 08:29 AM (FTx5X)
360
QC,
It isn't surprising you respond in such way. After being revealed as someone who can't even follow the discussion thread I really can't say I was expecting more, such as defending your blather which I painstakingly reposted for you.
I stand by my commentary- sorry you consider it insulting, I would think humiliating would be a more appropriate term...
Next time you engage in one of these discussions, I would suggest reviewing the "reading is fundamental" commercials we watched as children.
Greyrooster,
Clean your trifocals, you bigotted racist joke- I wrote "Eurasians", not asians. When whining like a uneducated little girl, GR, "get it right" or shut the hell up.
I suspect gays could care less if you think they are "weird". You have proven yourself hardly the arbiter of enlightened sociology- rather the posterchild for whitetrash ignorance instead. I personally think it is weird that your mother, aunt, and sister are actually less than 3 people, but that is just me. ;-)
I'm curious- when you were "driving through Detroit"- was it to get to the titty bars of Windsor, Ontario because a toothless, smelly, uneducated old fart like you can't get women without laying down hard cash? That is my bet.
Just wait, GR, on "your" judgement day, St. Peter is going to take one look at you, shake his head with a sad smile, and thrust you on a one way elevator to the abyss. I suspect you'll see former acquaintances there, so at least you won't be lonely.
Gizout!
It isn't surprising you respond in such way. After being revealed as someone who can't even follow the discussion thread I really can't say I was expecting more, such as defending your blather which I painstakingly reposted for you.
I stand by my commentary- sorry you consider it insulting, I would think humiliating would be a more appropriate term...
Next time you engage in one of these discussions, I would suggest reviewing the "reading is fundamental" commercials we watched as children.
Greyrooster,
Clean your trifocals, you bigotted racist joke- I wrote "Eurasians", not asians. When whining like a uneducated little girl, GR, "get it right" or shut the hell up.
I suspect gays could care less if you think they are "weird". You have proven yourself hardly the arbiter of enlightened sociology- rather the posterchild for whitetrash ignorance instead. I personally think it is weird that your mother, aunt, and sister are actually less than 3 people, but that is just me. ;-)
I'm curious- when you were "driving through Detroit"- was it to get to the titty bars of Windsor, Ontario because a toothless, smelly, uneducated old fart like you can't get women without laying down hard cash? That is my bet.
Just wait, GR, on "your" judgement day, St. Peter is going to take one look at you, shake his head with a sad smile, and thrust you on a one way elevator to the abyss. I suspect you'll see former acquaintances there, so at least you won't be lonely.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 20, 2006 11:11 AM (P0Rz4)
361
QC,
It isn't surprising you respond in such way. After being revealed as someone who can't even follow the discussion thread I really can't say I was expecting more, such as defending your blather which I painstakingly reposted for you.
I stand by my commentary- sorry you consider it insulting, I would think humiliating would be a more appropriate term...
Next time you engage in one of these discussions, I would suggest reviewing the "reading is fundamental" commercials we watched as children.
Greyrooster,
Clean your trifocals, you bigotted racist joke- I wrote "Eurasians", not asians. When whining like a uneducated little girl, GR, "get it right" or shut the hell up.
I suspect gays could care less if you think they are "weird". You have proven yourself hardly the arbiter of enlightened sociology- rather the posterchild for whitetrash ignorance instead. I personally think it is weird that your mother, aunt, and sister are actually less than 3 people, but that is just me. ;-)
I'm curious- when you were "driving through Detroit"- was it to get to the titty bars of Windsor, Ontario because a toothless, smelly, uneducated old fart like you can't get women without laying down hard cash? That is my bet.
Just wait, GR, on "your" judgement day, St. Peter is going to take one look at you, shake his head with a sad smile, and thrust you on a one way elevator to the abyss. I suspect you'll see former acquaintances there, so at least you won't be lonely.
Gizout!
It isn't surprising you respond in such way. After being revealed as someone who can't even follow the discussion thread I really can't say I was expecting more, such as defending your blather which I painstakingly reposted for you.
I stand by my commentary- sorry you consider it insulting, I would think humiliating would be a more appropriate term...
Next time you engage in one of these discussions, I would suggest reviewing the "reading is fundamental" commercials we watched as children.
Greyrooster,
Clean your trifocals, you bigotted racist joke- I wrote "Eurasians", not asians. When whining like a uneducated little girl, GR, "get it right" or shut the hell up.
I suspect gays could care less if you think they are "weird". You have proven yourself hardly the arbiter of enlightened sociology- rather the posterchild for whitetrash ignorance instead. I personally think it is weird that your mother, aunt, and sister are actually less than 3 people, but that is just me. ;-)
I'm curious- when you were "driving through Detroit"- was it to get to the titty bars of Windsor, Ontario because a toothless, smelly, uneducated old fart like you can't get women without laying down hard cash? That is my bet.
Just wait, GR, on "your" judgement day, St. Peter is going to take one look at you, shake his head with a sad smile, and thrust you on a one way elevator to the abyss. I suspect you'll see former acquaintances there, so at least you won't be lonely.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 20, 2006 11:11 AM (P0Rz4)
362
Greyrooster, I was going after his use of homosexuality as a weapon- which is in direct contrast with his liberalness- in order to expose his unthinking hypocracy, which is in line with his liberalness.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 11:20 AM (LoKA7)
363
Gizzard,
It is fallacy to expect one has privacy on an international phone
call via commercial networks. You certainly don’t have that guarantee
from the gov’t of the other country, so I don’t know what you achieve
by preventing our side from gathering the info. Our govt could just
purchase the information from the other govt, or steal it from their
systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of course this filters all
of the information through foreign agents and filters and/or degrades
the information.
The argument that other gov’ts should have this information, but ours should not, is what this boils down to.
Posted by: QC at August 20, 2006 11:23 AM (LoKA7)
364
These stupid pseudo-liberals like Gizzard never cease to amaze me. They criticize someone as being a racist, etc. and then turn around in the next sentence and make bigoted remarks. They claim to be tolerant, but their actions and speech are otherwise. Nothing but stinking hypocrits of the worst variety, claiming to be liberal. And by the way, giz, the decision of this particular judge is very likely to be overturned, or do you take this judge's decision to be the final word in this matter? You are just a plain stupid little bigot.
Gizout, MF
Gizout, MF
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 20, 2006 01:15 PM (rUyw4)
365
Gizzrd: Toothless? Nope have all but one and one crown. Smelly? nope I'm a shower freak. Uneducated? Have degree in Mechanical Engineering. Owned my own firm for 17 yrs.
Can't get women without laying down hard cash? Why bring your mother into this?
You're exactly what you call everyone else. I know it, you know it. Just a jealous little gay shit. Your brains are as fucked up as your hormones. You ain't nothin. Do your self and the world a favor and find a bridge to leap from. Go ahead boy/girl. Do something manly for the first time in your horrid, miserable, confused life.
Can't get women without laying down hard cash? Why bring your mother into this?
You're exactly what you call everyone else. I know it, you know it. Just a jealous little gay shit. Your brains are as fucked up as your hormones. You ain't nothin. Do your self and the world a favor and find a bridge to leap from. Go ahead boy/girl. Do something manly for the first time in your horrid, miserable, confused life.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 08:52 PM (IcUVJ)
366
So many dopes, so little time...
QC, non sequitor. Just quit when you are behind. I gave you every opportunity to try to amend your clear lack of understanding for the discussion, even quoting your own words, and you failed. Time for you to quit, while you are WAY behind.
Jesusland, Let's see, I use the terms bigot and redneck to describe one who condemns folks based on race, religion, and sexual preference and you have problems with that? And you call ME a hypocrite? Slinger of rude ad hominems perhaps, but hardly hypocrite. No, we save that terms for weaseling little cocksuckers who talk bold about profiling and waging war while claiming to stand behind the Bible. That, pal, is a HYPOCRITE. And, while we are focusing on vocabulary, I suggest before you use the word again, learn what "bigot" means.
You folks slay me!
Grey,
My apologies if I was wrong about your level of education. I am sorry for that, and if I you are telling the truth, I retract that particular statement. Facts are facts, and it sound like the error was mine. With that said, what happened? Granted, ME ain't EE and it even gives civil engineers someone to poke fun of, but nonetheless it represents some level of intellectual attainment. Instead of following through with practical science, you now seem fit to consider sexuality defined by your particular superstition that is loosely (in your particular case, VERY FREAKING LOOSELY) centered around a book written hundreds of years ago mostly about an incredible man by writer who were born centuries after the subject "died"... It ain't the "Joy of Sex" gramps, and the fifteen translations it has undergone and the preponderence of metaphor is hardly source material for good sex/ bad sex.
You call me gay... Why? A shithead like yourself doesn't deserve the edification, but I am faithfully hetero, have a beautiful wife and two kids and have never had a whole lot of problem succeeding with the opposite sex. While the idea of two girls definitely works for me, a guy and a girl or a guy sure doesn't... So, pretty much the only thing of substance you have said about me is patently false. Believe me, if i WERE gay, I'd have no
problems trumpeting it in front of your redneck ass.
But, the REALLY interesting part is just that- calling me "gay" is your best shot at insulting me. THAT is why and how your are fucked up pal.
Why would I jump off a bridge and kill myself? I think I would at least wait until the estate tax sunsets or is repealed so lovely Mrs. Liberal wouldn't have to waste time and money with lawyers ensuring marital and family trusts are properly funded to avoid tax (note to Jesusland dipshit- THIS is evidence of hypocrisy- I do NOT like the estate tax when it affects me, but I am against repeal... Guess having republican Goldwater/Miller parents took its toll). Plus, I look forward to seeing both of my sons graduate from college. Hopefully better than Cum Laude, like pop was.
By the way Grey, I absolutely LOVE the momma jokes!! Keep 'em coming Kid Dynomite!
Gizout!
QC, non sequitor. Just quit when you are behind. I gave you every opportunity to try to amend your clear lack of understanding for the discussion, even quoting your own words, and you failed. Time for you to quit, while you are WAY behind.
Jesusland, Let's see, I use the terms bigot and redneck to describe one who condemns folks based on race, religion, and sexual preference and you have problems with that? And you call ME a hypocrite? Slinger of rude ad hominems perhaps, but hardly hypocrite. No, we save that terms for weaseling little cocksuckers who talk bold about profiling and waging war while claiming to stand behind the Bible. That, pal, is a HYPOCRITE. And, while we are focusing on vocabulary, I suggest before you use the word again, learn what "bigot" means.
You folks slay me!
Grey,
My apologies if I was wrong about your level of education. I am sorry for that, and if I you are telling the truth, I retract that particular statement. Facts are facts, and it sound like the error was mine. With that said, what happened? Granted, ME ain't EE and it even gives civil engineers someone to poke fun of, but nonetheless it represents some level of intellectual attainment. Instead of following through with practical science, you now seem fit to consider sexuality defined by your particular superstition that is loosely (in your particular case, VERY FREAKING LOOSELY) centered around a book written hundreds of years ago mostly about an incredible man by writer who were born centuries after the subject "died"... It ain't the "Joy of Sex" gramps, and the fifteen translations it has undergone and the preponderence of metaphor is hardly source material for good sex/ bad sex.
You call me gay... Why? A shithead like yourself doesn't deserve the edification, but I am faithfully hetero, have a beautiful wife and two kids and have never had a whole lot of problem succeeding with the opposite sex. While the idea of two girls definitely works for me, a guy and a girl or a guy sure doesn't... So, pretty much the only thing of substance you have said about me is patently false. Believe me, if i WERE gay, I'd have no
problems trumpeting it in front of your redneck ass.
But, the REALLY interesting part is just that- calling me "gay" is your best shot at insulting me. THAT is why and how your are fucked up pal.
Why would I jump off a bridge and kill myself? I think I would at least wait until the estate tax sunsets or is repealed so lovely Mrs. Liberal wouldn't have to waste time and money with lawyers ensuring marital and family trusts are properly funded to avoid tax (note to Jesusland dipshit- THIS is evidence of hypocrisy- I do NOT like the estate tax when it affects me, but I am against repeal... Guess having republican Goldwater/Miller parents took its toll). Plus, I look forward to seeing both of my sons graduate from college. Hopefully better than Cum Laude, like pop was.
By the way Grey, I absolutely LOVE the momma jokes!! Keep 'em coming Kid Dynomite!
Gizout!
Posted by: gizzard at August 20, 2006 11:25 PM (P0Rz4)
367
Oh, and Gizzard,
It is fallacy to expect one has privacy on an international phone
call via commercial networks. You certainly don’t have that guarantee
from the gov’t of the other country, so I don’t know what you achieve
by preventing our side from gathering the info. Our govt could just
purchase the information from the other govt, or steal it from their
systems- that is certainly outside of FISA. Of course this filters all
of the information through foreign agents and filters and/or degrades
the information.
The argument that other gov’ts should have this information, but ours should not, is what this boils down to.
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 02:32 AM (LoKA7)
368
Methinks the gizzard is grinding out a lot of shit. The purpose of a gizzard.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 07:46 AM (4t6sV)
369
Haha, he is too stupid to know how stupid he is, GR. Ah, if a liberal/Leftist was worth half as much as he/she thinks they are, each would be a millionaire. However, if their true worth would be known, yep, chicken gizzard would be about it. And him claiming to have a family and all, now that is truly funny, and dysfunctional to the extreme. I can see his kids now, GR, the sad sacks who never get picked for the team, because they spend so much time reading classics such as The DaVinci Code. But they do have Japanese anime, and think of all the cool signs they make for such as the Breasts not Bombs crowd. What a bunch of losers! Oh, yeah, Gizout, dumb ass.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 09:17 AM (rUyw4)
370
Oh, by the way, dipshit, an ME Degree is much superior to the CE variety, and in some quarters is given preference over EE as regards yearly income. I should know, as my oldest son holds an ME. He does seem to always fall below the CE, but his associate degree in nuclear technology does help. So don't wax eloquent, my boy, on what you know little about, as it makes you look stupid. As for someone claiming to be a Christian, and making the statements you reference, please try to be more specific, as I know of very few posters here who claim to be practicing Christians. So your accusations are mostly built on a foundation of sand, and as a geologist, I can tell you with absolute authority that your house will fail. As your logic has.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 09:31 AM (rUyw4)
371
Clarification for leftists and gizzards-first CE means Civil Engineer, second CE means Chemical Engineer, just so you know.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 09:40 AM (rUyw4)
372
QC,
Son, you really need to stop. You've lost big, on every point, and you just sound sillier by the minute. I have no rights, duties, or freedoms expressed or implied to me by any other country than the one of which I am citizen. Your point, just like pretty much all of them, is senseless and completely irrelevant.
Gizout!
Son, you really need to stop. You've lost big, on every point, and you just sound sillier by the minute. I have no rights, duties, or freedoms expressed or implied to me by any other country than the one of which I am citizen. Your point, just like pretty much all of them, is senseless and completely irrelevant.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 12:44 PM (FyFm5)
373
Rooster,
Excellent last post- you got a chuckle out of me.
Hey, speaking of shit, did you catch Fearless Leader's press conference today?
"In a moment of candor in this morning's presidential press conference, George W. Bush acknowledged that Saddam Hussein didn't had neither weapons of mass destruction nor anything at all to do with the attacks of 9/11.
The truth-telling didn't last long.
After acknowledging that Saddam had no hand in 9/11, Bush tried to argue that his administration had never claimed as much. "Nobody has ever suggested that the attacks of September the 11th were ordered by Iraq," he said."
Speaks for itself, doesn't it!
Gizout!
Excellent last post- you got a chuckle out of me.
Hey, speaking of shit, did you catch Fearless Leader's press conference today?
"In a moment of candor in this morning's presidential press conference, George W. Bush acknowledged that Saddam Hussein didn't had neither weapons of mass destruction nor anything at all to do with the attacks of 9/11.
The truth-telling didn't last long.
After acknowledging that Saddam had no hand in 9/11, Bush tried to argue that his administration had never claimed as much. "Nobody has ever suggested that the attacks of September the 11th were ordered by Iraq," he said."
Speaks for itself, doesn't it!
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 12:46 PM (FyFm5)
374
Gizzard,
So your position is that other governments should have this information, but ours should not?
So your position is that other governments should have this information, but ours should not?
Posted by: QC at August 21, 2006 12:47 PM (PX+vn)
375
Gizzard has never even addressed the fact that this particular judge was shopped by the ACLU, and most objective legal scholars admit her decision had little or no legal precedent, but was mostly just legal babble that ignored previous appellate court decisions. This ruling will be overturned on appeal.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 01:15 PM (rUyw4)
376
Jesusland-
Tell you what, let's pick an independent agent, and we can each send him/her our 2005 income tax returns with backup, with personal data and social security numbers removed.
I'll wager $1,000 my numbers are superior to yours. But, because I find you far from honest, I will require you to post your $1,000 up front, in certified funds, as will I. If you'd rather keep IRS forms out of this, we can do statements of net worth, provided they are attested to by a CPA. Anyway, big talking pal- let me know if you have the balls, otherwise just shut the fuck up about things of which you have no idea.
Making fun of my children while tapping away at a keyboard, using words like "chicken", "loser", and "dipshit"? How ironic my little brave Jesusjackass! How brave and manly you are! I have two Labs as well- perhaps you'd like to try some beastiality humor while you are at it? Such a good Christian boy, gotta' love it!
...and just because either A- you are too stupid or B- you are too lazy to read the thread in which you've interjected yourself, I was CLEARLY using the biblical reference in response to Grey's rationale that his god tells him sucking cock is bad if done by another male, or something along those lines. I would at least suppose someone who quotes the Bible as foundation for beliefs is presuming to do so as a Christian don't you, "dipshit"??
Man... Fish in a barrel.
Gizout!
Tell you what, let's pick an independent agent, and we can each send him/her our 2005 income tax returns with backup, with personal data and social security numbers removed.
I'll wager $1,000 my numbers are superior to yours. But, because I find you far from honest, I will require you to post your $1,000 up front, in certified funds, as will I. If you'd rather keep IRS forms out of this, we can do statements of net worth, provided they are attested to by a CPA. Anyway, big talking pal- let me know if you have the balls, otherwise just shut the fuck up about things of which you have no idea.
Making fun of my children while tapping away at a keyboard, using words like "chicken", "loser", and "dipshit"? How ironic my little brave Jesusjackass! How brave and manly you are! I have two Labs as well- perhaps you'd like to try some beastiality humor while you are at it? Such a good Christian boy, gotta' love it!
...and just because either A- you are too stupid or B- you are too lazy to read the thread in which you've interjected yourself, I was CLEARLY using the biblical reference in response to Grey's rationale that his god tells him sucking cock is bad if done by another male, or something along those lines. I would at least suppose someone who quotes the Bible as foundation for beliefs is presuming to do so as a Christian don't you, "dipshit"??
Man... Fish in a barrel.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 01:18 PM (FyFm5)
377
Good one, rooster, and an apropriate nick for the guy. Sometimes the idiots prove to everyone out there how truly stupid they are by their choice of a nick, but most of the time it is their rhetoric. I prefer the nick, as I do not have to spend my time reading the drivel that oozes from their minds, or lack thereof in this case.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 01:21 PM (rUyw4)
378
Hahaha, Gizzard! Why in the world would I even care how much money you make? I showcased your lack of knowledge as regards engineering, as you tried to disrespect Rooster's ME degree by making the dumb statement that a Civil Engineer was more respected than a Mechanical Engineer. That in itself says something. And to say that "it represents some level of intellectual attainment" is hardly to describe the the regimen that an engineering graduate would have conquered. By the way, Greyrooster is an admitted agnostic, so you are wrong again. Frankly, I find you disingenious, with a smugness born from having a silver spoon stuck in your mouth, and not having done much other than sop the gravy from mommy and daddy's table. But such is the case for most of the Left. They hate the very thing that provides their comfort. So be it. As for me, I am a junior partner in a very small oil and gas concern; we produce about 2400 bpd, a few million cubic feet of natural gas, and own two drilling rigs in a partnership with a company in Alabama. I'll let you do the math, but suffice it to say we are doing pretty well right now. And who said I was a Christian, as Jesusland denotes a place, not a religion. And I was wrong to bring your kids into it. For that, you do have my apology, as they can hardly be blamed for their parents. Fish in a barrel, you say, damn right, it is just too easy to best you. You are no challenge, so run along to Kos or wherever someone thinks you are an intellectual, cause no one here is fooled by you. Or your lack on intelligence.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 21, 2006 01:51 PM (rUyw4)
379
Gizzard you are such a dumb assed commie. Yes, I listened to the president today. Again, you are a liar. You are a liar because you intentionally left out part of what he say. He did admit that there was no concrete evidence that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction. The part a leftie, commie like you left out was that he said Saddam had the ability to get them. Stopping that was a wise decision given Saddam's History. So I must say to me you are a proven liar. Therefore nothing else you have claimed since the beginning of your comments on this blog can be relied on.
I seriously doubt you do anything but sit at your computer and wait for your monthly welfare check. By your lies you have lost all credibility.
The mostly democratic government employees were the ones who advises Mr. Bush and others of Saddam's abilities. I assure all that the vast majority of government employees in our spy network are democrats. They goofed the call.
In any case you are a liar. Knew it the whole time. Just a bullshit artist. $1000.00 wow man. That would give me almost a third of a tank in my boat. That woudl let me my three whole bets with my bookie every Sunday. What a dumb shit.
Jesusland: There is nothing civil about a civil engineer.
This asshole apparently didn't know I was a Berkley grad born and raised in San Francisco. Just another assuming liberal prick.
I seriously doubt you do anything but sit at your computer and wait for your monthly welfare check. By your lies you have lost all credibility.
The mostly democratic government employees were the ones who advises Mr. Bush and others of Saddam's abilities. I assure all that the vast majority of government employees in our spy network are democrats. They goofed the call.
In any case you are a liar. Knew it the whole time. Just a bullshit artist. $1000.00 wow man. That would give me almost a third of a tank in my boat. That woudl let me my three whole bets with my bookie every Sunday. What a dumb shit.
Jesusland: There is nothing civil about a civil engineer.
This asshole apparently didn't know I was a Berkley grad born and raised in San Francisco. Just another assuming liberal prick.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 21, 2006 05:25 PM (SRtFc)
380
Jesusland-
Maybe I miscontrued your challenge. Apology accepted re kids- these webthings get momentum running.
Alabama, eh? I am an Appalachian boy, but I did live in Mountainbrook near B'ham for a while and still have good clients in Mobile. Never really figured out Alabama, but boy, I've never ate so well in my life, no question about it.
You need a tax expert on the AMT ramifications of oil and gas depletion, maybe I'll forgive your political ideology and let you pay me. It is an interesting venue for tax planning I've found.
Greyfreak-
I don't proclaim to have your Berkeley credentials, as I went to public university near home as I am an only child and my mother was alone and dying. Wasn't so bad, the school was so cheap my Nat'l Merit Scholarship actually turned me a bit of a profit for undergrad.
Anyway, you say I am a liar because I did not include the entire transcript? Then you call me a commie? Are you always this insipid or do you still have 'good days'?
Democrats goofed the call re Iraq? Then why didn't Clinton attack? God, you are such a partisan piece of dishonest crap! One has to wonder if you believe your own bullshit.
Get real- and as far as assuming goes, one doesn't need to go far to make an ass out of you. You take care of that yourself quite nicely! By the way, does the boat make up for the short dick? ;-)
Gizout!
Maybe I miscontrued your challenge. Apology accepted re kids- these webthings get momentum running.
Alabama, eh? I am an Appalachian boy, but I did live in Mountainbrook near B'ham for a while and still have good clients in Mobile. Never really figured out Alabama, but boy, I've never ate so well in my life, no question about it.
You need a tax expert on the AMT ramifications of oil and gas depletion, maybe I'll forgive your political ideology and let you pay me. It is an interesting venue for tax planning I've found.
Greyfreak-
I don't proclaim to have your Berkeley credentials, as I went to public university near home as I am an only child and my mother was alone and dying. Wasn't so bad, the school was so cheap my Nat'l Merit Scholarship actually turned me a bit of a profit for undergrad.
Anyway, you say I am a liar because I did not include the entire transcript? Then you call me a commie? Are you always this insipid or do you still have 'good days'?
Democrats goofed the call re Iraq? Then why didn't Clinton attack? God, you are such a partisan piece of dishonest crap! One has to wonder if you believe your own bullshit.
Get real- and as far as assuming goes, one doesn't need to go far to make an ass out of you. You take care of that yourself quite nicely! By the way, does the boat make up for the short dick? ;-)
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 21, 2006 06:03 PM (P0Rz4)
381
339 - unbelieveable! And all over nothing!
Posted by: hondo at August 21, 2006 08:15 PM (XrexX)
382
Your mother was dying of shame. Which is understandable.
Now begone. You have been exposed as nothing but a liar, a sham and a bullshit artist.
Now begone. You have been exposed as nothing but a liar, a sham and a bullshit artist.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 22, 2006 11:19 AM (/GBNb)
383
...and you went to Berkeley, you pathetic,lying racsist fuck. Sure you did.
One more time - S L O W L Y, to accomodate your substandard comprehension:
I quoted a paragraph your buttmaster President uttered and you call me a liar. Were you holding your woobie and sucking your thumb as you typed "liar"?
You've got nothing substantive on your side at all, you ratshit coward. Why not go find a John Birch Society meeting where you can circle jerk why bemoaning all the "commies" who've infiltrated this great country..
Weak, Greyfreak, very weak.
Momma jokes to boot.
What a sad piece of neurotic, cowardly shit you are, pal.
Gizout!
One more time - S L O W L Y, to accomodate your substandard comprehension:
I quoted a paragraph your buttmaster President uttered and you call me a liar. Were you holding your woobie and sucking your thumb as you typed "liar"?
You've got nothing substantive on your side at all, you ratshit coward. Why not go find a John Birch Society meeting where you can circle jerk why bemoaning all the "commies" who've infiltrated this great country..
Weak, Greyfreak, very weak.
Momma jokes to boot.
What a sad piece of neurotic, cowardly shit you are, pal.
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 22, 2006 12:02 PM (P0Rz4)
384
Gizzard: "Democrats goofed the call re Iraq? Then why didn't Clinton attack?"
2 reasons:
1: His lies destroyed his ability to lead. It looked like wag the dog to get the attention off of his scandals.
2: Pre 9-11 world. Containment was given much more creedence than today.
2 reasons:
1: His lies destroyed his ability to lead. It looked like wag the dog to get the attention off of his scandals.
2: Pre 9-11 world. Containment was given much more creedence than today.
Posted by: QC at August 22, 2006 02:52 PM (PX+vn)
385
Got the Gizzard punk going now. Ha, ha.
And I used to be a member of the John Birch Society. Made lots of friends who count. You don't. Little cry baby shit.
You ain't nothing but an America hating piss ant. No reason for your miserable little life. Do yourself a favor and find the bridge.
And I used to be a member of the John Birch Society. Made lots of friends who count. You don't. Little cry baby shit.
You ain't nothing but an America hating piss ant. No reason for your miserable little life. Do yourself a favor and find the bridge.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 23, 2006 07:06 AM (dQaun)
386
QC,
You're kidding, right?
Grey,
How unsurprising it is to find you are a proud member of an organization that strongly opposed the Civil Rights Movement.
How unsurprising it is to find you still are breathless squealing insults as well. As I said, VERY weak, tedious as well..
You call me a "liar", Grey. Prove this statement NOW, or you are the liar, aren't you?
You also call me a "sham". Is one a "liar and a sham" just because they don't subscribe to your redneck agenda?
So Grey, the ball is in your court- ARE YOU A LIAR?
And, by the way, if you are so unable to deal with my discussion and want me dead- COME GET ME, YOU PUSSY!!! Otherwise, shut your drooling piehole.
Gizout! "very proud that Grey has graduated from mommy jokes to crybaby jokes-- I know a 'man's man' when I see him!"
You're kidding, right?
Grey,
How unsurprising it is to find you are a proud member of an organization that strongly opposed the Civil Rights Movement.
How unsurprising it is to find you still are breathless squealing insults as well. As I said, VERY weak, tedious as well..
You call me a "liar", Grey. Prove this statement NOW, or you are the liar, aren't you?
You also call me a "sham". Is one a "liar and a sham" just because they don't subscribe to your redneck agenda?
So Grey, the ball is in your court- ARE YOU A LIAR?
And, by the way, if you are so unable to deal with my discussion and want me dead- COME GET ME, YOU PUSSY!!! Otherwise, shut your drooling piehole.
Gizout! "very proud that Grey has graduated from mommy jokes to crybaby jokes-- I know a 'man's man' when I see him!"
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 12:49 PM (P0Rz4)
387
Oh, one more thing, Greygirl-
As I really doubt your ability to follow any thread of complex thought, it is obviously necessary to point out to you that providing direct, unedited quotation of your buttmaster President by definition, can NOT constitute "lying"...
So, Greygirl, it seems you ARE the liar, doesn't it??!?
Real shocker....
Gizout!
As I really doubt your ability to follow any thread of complex thought, it is obviously necessary to point out to you that providing direct, unedited quotation of your buttmaster President by definition, can NOT constitute "lying"...
So, Greygirl, it seems you ARE the liar, doesn't it??!?
Real shocker....
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 12:54 PM (P0Rz4)
388
Here's what it is. Say you are part of a huge military force which is stridently scoping out the enemy. The orders are to hold fire until we can get the enemy right where we want them. Meanwhile a chickenhawk comes running out blasting away and the rest of us are forced to regroup since our strategics have suddenly come in need of alteration. Simple. " We can do better "
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 23, 2006 05:44 PM (gLMre)
389
Hey QC,
We are on the wrong side of much of this, but unlike Grey, you don't seem primarily motivated by fear and racism, so I thought I'd annoy you a tad with my fave snippet of the day, courtesy of Newsweek:
"There is a grand American tradition behind this sort of personal involvement of America's chief executive, one that goes back almost precisely a century. Teddy Roosevelt spent much of August 1905 directing talks in Portsmouth, N.H, that prodded Japan and Russia into an agreement ending the Russo-Japanese war. Woodrow Wilson went to Paris for nearly six months between January and June of 1919 to negotiate the end of World War I. Franklin Roosevelt, though he was dying and suffered a terrible physical disability, flew halfway around the world to hash out the postwar peace at Yalta. Richard Nixon went to China, Ronald Reagan journeyed to Reykjavik and Jimmy Carter holed up at Camp David, where he tested the limits of brinksmanship with Menachem Begin and Anwar Sadat.
George W. Bush is going to Kennebunkport, where he'll test his golf skills with Poppy"
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14483814/site/newsweek/
Gizout!
We are on the wrong side of much of this, but unlike Grey, you don't seem primarily motivated by fear and racism, so I thought I'd annoy you a tad with my fave snippet of the day, courtesy of Newsweek:
"There is a grand American tradition behind this sort of personal involvement of America's chief executive, one that goes back almost precisely a century. Teddy Roosevelt spent much of August 1905 directing talks in Portsmouth, N.H, that prodded Japan and Russia into an agreement ending the Russo-Japanese war. Woodrow Wilson went to Paris for nearly six months between January and June of 1919 to negotiate the end of World War I. Franklin Roosevelt, though he was dying and suffered a terrible physical disability, flew halfway around the world to hash out the postwar peace at Yalta. Richard Nixon went to China, Ronald Reagan journeyed to Reykjavik and Jimmy Carter holed up at Camp David, where he tested the limits of brinksmanship with Menachem Begin and Anwar Sadat.
George W. Bush is going to Kennebunkport, where he'll test his golf skills with Poppy"
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14483814/site/newsweek/
Gizout!
Posted by: Gizzard at August 23, 2006 06:16 PM (P0Rz4)
390
I think I've already showed that you are nothing but a lying, manipulating commie when you attempted to hide the meaning of our presidents speech.
Therefore you have not creedence on anything else you say.
So fuck you and your anti-American bullshit. All you turds are pussy. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it. Go find a liberal commie blog to continue your muslim hugging shit.
Therefore you have not creedence on anything else you say.
So fuck you and your anti-American bullshit. All you turds are pussy. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it. Go find a liberal commie blog to continue your muslim hugging shit.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 24, 2006 09:11 AM (eId1k)
391
What an inept bungling clown we have for prez! Fore! L o ~~~~ 0
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 24, 2006 12:39 PM (gLMre)
392
GreyRooster and Buzzard meet, have a beer, become long-life friends and live happily ever after. THE END
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 24, 2006 02:20 PM (gLMre)
Posted by: Jacob at September 17, 2006 08:29 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Robert at September 18, 2006 03:33 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Ange at September 20, 2006 11:28 AM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Christopher at September 20, 2006 07:28 PM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Joshua at September 20, 2006 11:30 PM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Hailey at September 21, 2006 03:31 AM (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Maureen at September 21, 2006 05:28 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Ange at September 21, 2006 07:28 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Alton at September 21, 2006 11:28 AM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Jacob at September 21, 2006 01:30 PM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Jasmine at September 21, 2006 07:28 PM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Joshua at September 22, 2006 03:28 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Michael at September 22, 2006 07:28 AM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Jacob at September 22, 2006 09:28 AM (3vJbW)
Posted by: George at September 22, 2006 11:28 AM (pu/Ki)
Posted by: Zachary at September 22, 2006 05:28 PM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Brian at September 22, 2006 07:28 PM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Matthew at September 22, 2006 09:28 PM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: John at September 22, 2006 11:28 PM (3vJbW)
Posted by: Hannah at September 23, 2006 01:28 AM (pu/Ki)
Posted by: John at September 23, 2006 05:28 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Richard at September 23, 2006 07:28 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Daniel at September 23, 2006 05:28 PM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Larry at September 24, 2006 01:27 AM (Lbd2o)
Posted by: Bill at September 24, 2006 09:29 AM (Lbd2o)
418
Very useful http://bbi.awardspace.co.uk/air-ticket/
Posted by: John at September 24, 2006 01:35 PM (Lbd2o)
419
Good Luck! http://megamozg.com/credit-cards/map.html
Posted by: Anthony at November 04, 2006 03:52 PM (yu/yc)
420
Thanks for taking http://megamozg.com/distance-learning/map.html
Posted by: Christopher at November 04, 2006 05:12 PM (yu/yc)
421
Cool design http://megamozg.com/car-insurance/map.html
Posted by: Donald at November 04, 2006 09:54 PM (IXBXc)
422
thanks for mentioning http://megamozg.com/bonds/map.html
Posted by: Alton at November 04, 2006 11:29 PM (IXBXc)
423
archy it i http://megamozg.com/private-jets/map.html
Posted by: Elizabeth at November 05, 2006 01:37 AM (IXBXc)
424
Very useful http://megamozg.com/investing/map.html
Posted by: Lori at November 06, 2006 07:55 PM (Ynl3q)
425
Interesting site http://megamozg.com/equity-line-credit/map.html
Posted by: Dylan at November 06, 2006 09:55 PM (ntnSG)
426
It very interesting http://megamozg.com/mortgages/map.html
Posted by: Jasmine at November 06, 2006 11:58 PM (Ynl3q)
427
Great web site http://megamozg.com/win-at-poker/map.html
Posted by: Alexis at November 07, 2006 01:16 AM (IXBXc)
428
this site rocks! http://megamozg.com/refinance-home-loan/map.html
Posted by: Barbara at November 07, 2006 03:48 AM (IXBXc)
429
thanks for mentioning http://megamozg.com/transfer-money/map.html
Posted by: Ange at November 08, 2006 01:39 AM (7uHqW)
430
thanks for mentioning http://megamozg.com/jet-charter/map.html
Posted by: Carol at November 10, 2006 12:51 AM (bapmV)
431
Thanks for taking http://megamozg.com/ultimate-bet/map.html
Posted by: Christopher at November 10, 2006 03:49 PM (VkfSU)
432
Good Luck! http://megamozg.com/online-trading/map.html
Posted by: John at November 10, 2006 05:45 PM (EPgxM)
433
Great work on website. http://megamozg.com/travel-insurance/map.html
Posted by: Jasmine at November 10, 2006 07:57 PM (EPgxM)
434
Hi, nice site! http://megamozg.com/homeowners-insurance/map.html
Posted by: Anthony at November 10, 2006 09:46 PM (EPgxM)
435
VERY GOOD I THINK http://megamozg.com/need-money/map.html
Posted by: Maureen at November 10, 2006 11:41 PM (EPgxM)
436
Thanks for taking http://megamozg.com/bachelor-degree/map.html
Posted by: Daniel at November 11, 2006 01:41 AM (EPgxM)
437
Very nice site! http://megamozg.com/life-insurance/map.html
Posted by: George at November 11, 2006 04:34 AM (EPgxM)
438
Very good site http://megamozg.com/calling-cards/map.html
Posted by: Leonard at November 11, 2006 06:33 AM (EPgxM)
439
thanks for mentioning http://megamozg.com/texas-holden-tip/map.html
Posted by: Alton at November 11, 2006 08:08 AM (EPgxM)
440
Hi, nice site! http://megamozg.com/online-banking/map.html
Posted by: William at November 11, 2006 10:14 AM (EPgxM)
441
this site rocks! http://megamozg.com/texas-holden/map.html
Posted by: Dylan at November 11, 2006 12:03 PM (EPgxM)
442
Good Luck! http://megamozg.com/extra-money/map.html
Posted by: Jacob at November 11, 2006 02:47 PM (EPgxM)
443
Interesting site http://megamozg.com/wagering/map.html
Posted by: Barbara at November 11, 2006 05:54 PM (EPgxM)
444
Is very interesting http://megamozg.com/cancer/map.html
Posted by: Herman at November 11, 2006 08:10 PM (EPgxM)
445
thanks for mentioning http://megamozg.com/quick-book/map.html
Posted by: Bill at November 11, 2006 09:54 PM (KslY2)
446
VERY GOOD I THINK http://megamozg.com/drug-rehab/map.html
Posted by: Bill at November 12, 2006 12:11 AM (EPgxM)
447
Exciting website. http://megamozg.com/cash-advance/map.html
Posted by: Hannah at November 12, 2006 02:15 AM (KslY2)
448
Good Luck! http://megamozg.com/rewards-cards/map.html
Posted by: Barbara at November 12, 2006 04:10 AM (EPgxM)
449
this site rocks! http://megamozg.com/structured-settlements/map.html
Posted by: Matthew at November 12, 2006 08:22 AM (EPgxM)
Posted by: Samantha at November 13, 2006 02:58 PM (VkfSU)
451
i like you! http://wwwwtahoo.com/fha-loan-mortgage-va/
Posted by: Jasmine at November 14, 2006 07:53 PM (nLR+7)
452
Very good site http://wwwwtahoo.com/cartridge-world/
Posted by: Frank at November 14, 2006 10:08 PM (nLR+7)
453
Very nice site! http://wwwwtahoo.com/printer-toner-cartridge/
Posted by: Lori at November 14, 2006 11:46 PM (nLR+7)
454
this site rocks! http://wwwwtahoo.com/firm-law-lexington-review/
Posted by: Hannah at November 15, 2006 01:45 AM (nLR+7)
455
VERY GOOD I THINK http://wwwwtahoo.com/canon-cartridge-inkjet-refill/
Posted by: Reginald at November 15, 2006 03:45 AM (nLR+7)
456
Is very interesting http://wwwwtahoo.com/canon-inkjet-printer-cartridge/
Posted by: Carol at November 15, 2006 05:46 AM (nLR+7)
457
this site rocks! http://wwwwtahoo.com/ultimate-bet-poker/
Posted by: Jacob at November 15, 2006 11:44 AM (nLR+7)
458
Interesting site http://wwwwtahoo.com/business-inkjet-refill/
Posted by: William at November 16, 2006 04:57 AM (0FyPm)
459
Very nice site! http://wwwwtahoo.com/brother-ink-cartridge/
Posted by: Carol at November 16, 2006 06:00 AM (Lqndl)
460
Thank you... http://wwwwtahoo.com/laser-printer-cartridge/
Posted by: Carol at November 16, 2006 10:10 AM (CFbWP)
461
Hi, nice site! http://wwwwtahoo.com/hewlett-packard-inkjet-cartridge/
Posted by: Hannah at November 16, 2006 02:51 PM (y415J)
462
i like you! http://wwwwtahoo.com/phono-cartridge/
Posted by: Dale at November 16, 2006 04:41 PM (P229J)
463
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/hp-57-inkjet-cartridge/
Posted by: Leonard at November 16, 2006 06:48 PM (0FyPm)
464
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/fha-mortgage-loan/
Posted by: George at November 17, 2006 12:45 AM (UMDhw)
465
VERY GOOD I THINK http://wwwwtahoo.com/hp-ink-jet-cartridge/
Posted by: Dale at November 17, 2006 02:25 AM (UMDhw)
466
archy it i http://wwwwtahoo.com/horse-wager/
Posted by: Matthew at November 17, 2006 04:35 AM (20GCz)
467
This great resource http://wwwwtahoo.com/inkjet-refill-system/
Posted by: Zachary at November 17, 2006 06:20 AM (oudhW)
468
i like you! http://wwwwtahoo.com/compatible-inkjet-cartridge/
Posted by: Matthew at November 17, 2006 10:16 AM (0FyPm)
469
this site rocks! http://wwwwtahoo.com/epson-inkjet-printer-refill/
Posted by: Zachary at November 17, 2006 11:52 AM (UMDhw)
470
this site rocks! http://wwwwtahoo.com/dell-photo-printer-720-ink-cartridge/
Posted by: Dale at November 17, 2006 04:22 PM (5JLjs)
471
Your hard work paid off http://wwwwtahoo.com/remanufactured-toner-cartridge/
Posted by: Anthony at November 17, 2006 08:32 PM (0FyPm)
472
VERY GOOD I THINK http://wwwwtahoo.com/inkjet-kit-lexmark-refill/
Posted by: Joshua at November 17, 2006 10:06 PM (UMDhw)
473
archy it i http://wwwwtahoo.com/ink-inkjet-refill-universal/
Posted by: Hailey at November 18, 2006 12:02 AM (UMDhw)
474
Is very interesting http://wwwwtahoo.com/fha-mortgage/
Posted by: Brian at November 18, 2006 02:16 AM (VbQer)
475
Exciting website. http://wwwwtahoo.com/credit-law-lexington/
Posted by: Samantha at November 18, 2006 03:53 AM (5Ii2K)
476
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/inkjet-ink-cartridge/
Posted by: Richard at November 18, 2006 06:07 AM (5Ii2K)
477
This great resource http://wwwwtahoo.com/ink-cartridge-uk/
Posted by: Herman at November 18, 2006 08:16 AM (Pu5oL)
478
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/basketball-picking-wager-winner/
Posted by: Mark at November 18, 2006 12:24 PM (Pu5oL)
479
This great resource http://wwwwtahoo.com/brother-toner-cartridge/
Posted by: Lori at November 18, 2006 04:11 PM (5Ii2K)
480
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/hp-56-black-inkjet-print-cartridge/
Posted by: Brianna at November 19, 2006 12:39 AM (5Ii2K)
481
Very nice site http://wwwwtahoo.com/printer-ink-cartridge/
Posted by: Carol at November 19, 2006 08:26 AM (zKGg8)
482
archy it i http://wwwwtahoo.com/credit-law-lexington-repair/
Posted by: Brian at November 19, 2006 10:56 AM (5Ii2K)
Posted by: oru at November 24, 2006 11:35 AM (y415J)
484
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/national-debt/
Posted by: Zachary at December 09, 2006 02:47 AM (bRdtj)
485
archy it i http://portaldiscount.com/debt-consolidation-refinance/
Posted by: Joshua at December 09, 2006 04:27 PM (Zq7BR)
486
Very nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/trans-union-credit-report/
Posted by: Kaylee at December 09, 2006 06:11 PM (Zq7BR)
487
Thank you... http://portaldiscount.com/federal-loan-consolidation/
Posted by: Jacob at December 09, 2006 08:35 PM (Zq7BR)
488
It very interesting http://portaldiscount.com/global-forex-trading/
Posted by: Anthony at December 09, 2006 10:09 PM (Zq7BR)
489
Hi, nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/j-cash/
Posted by: Michael at December 10, 2006 12:06 AM (lEom2)
490
Interesting site http://portaldiscount.com/online-car-loan/
Posted by: Herman at December 10, 2006 02:23 AM (Zq7BR)
491
this site rocks! http://portaldiscount.com/forex-cargo/
Posted by: Samantha at December 10, 2006 04:25 AM (Zq7BR)
492
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/american-home-mortgage/
Posted by: Michael at December 10, 2006 08:40 AM (lEom2)
493
Is very interesting http://portaldiscount.com/home-mortgage-rate/
Posted by: Hannah at December 10, 2006 02:21 PM (EuGx5)
494
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/california-mortgage-loan/
Posted by: Samantha at December 11, 2006 10:24 PM (LCv8b)
495
Exciting website. http://portaldiscount.com/federal-credit-union/
Posted by: Anthony at December 12, 2006 12:11 AM (LCv8b)
496
Exciting website. http://portaldiscount.com/online-credit-report/
Posted by: Michael at December 12, 2006 02:07 AM (LCv8b)
497
Very useful http://portaldiscount.com/cash-money/
Posted by: Barbara at December 12, 2006 04:19 AM (LCv8b)
498
Thank you... http://portaldiscount.com/debt-recovery/
Posted by: Anthony at December 12, 2006 11:00 AM (LCv8b)
499
Cool design http://portaldiscount.com/best-broker-forex/
Posted by: John at December 12, 2006 02:59 PM (ErcJy)
500
Your hard work paid off http://portaldiscount.com/mobile-home/
Posted by: Mark at December 12, 2006 04:54 PM (jlG/x)
501
Great web site http://portaldiscount.com/credit-card-for-people-with-bad-credit/
Posted by: Jacob at December 15, 2006 08:25 PM (jlG/x)
502
Very nice site http://portaldiscount.com/debt-collection-attorney/
Posted by: Ada at December 15, 2006 10:12 PM (jlG/x)
503
Hi, nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/apply-online-for-credit-card/
Posted by: Samantha at December 17, 2006 05:11 PM (CwiH0)
504
This great resource http://portaldiscount.com/new-century-mortgage/
Posted by: Hailey at December 26, 2006 10:47 PM (XQgbJ)
505
It very interesting http://portaldiscount.com/forex-rate/
Posted by: Anthony at December 29, 2006 11:18 AM (GjOl7)
506
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/home-health-care/
Posted by: Michael at December 29, 2006 01:01 PM (GjOl7)
507
Very good site http://portaldiscount.com/lowest-mortgage-rate/
Posted by: Dale at December 30, 2006 03:06 PM (KqEwN)
508
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/florida-mortgage-loan/
Posted by: Emily at December 30, 2006 05:03 PM (KqEwN)
509
this site rocks! http://portaldiscount.com/learn-forex/
Posted by: Donald at December 30, 2006 07:12 PM (KqEwN)
510
VERY GOOD I THINK http://portaldiscount.com/kb-home/
Posted by: Hailey at December 30, 2006 08:38 PM (KqEwN)
511
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/credit-card-machine/
Posted by: Joshua at December 30, 2006 11:09 PM (KqEwN)
512
Hi, nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/online-credit-card-application/
Posted by: Carol at December 31, 2006 01:15 AM (KqEwN)
513
Great work on website. http://portaldiscount.com/school-loan/
Posted by: Hailey at December 31, 2006 05:21 AM (KqEwN)
514
Exciting website. http://portaldiscount.com/live-forex-chart/
Posted by: Richard at December 31, 2006 06:46 AM (GjOl7)
515
VERY GOOD I THINK http://portaldiscount.com/countrywide-home-loan/
Posted by: Ada at December 31, 2006 08:55 AM (KqEwN)
516
Interesting site http://portaldiscount.com/hawaii-mortgage/
Posted by: Brianna at December 31, 2006 01:06 PM (GjOl7)
517
Great web site http://portaldiscount.com/forex-demo/
Posted by: Herman at December 31, 2006 03:17 PM (GjOl7)
518
Very useful http://portaldiscount.com/forex-option/
Posted by: Larry at December 31, 2006 04:53 PM (KqEwN)
519
Hi, nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/credit-card-debt-relief/
Posted by: Emily at December 31, 2006 07:07 PM (KqEwN)
520
This great resource http://portaldiscount.com/forex-trading-software-online/
Posted by: Samantha at December 31, 2006 08:47 PM (KqEwN)
521
archy it i http://portaldiscount.com/debt-consolidator/
Posted by: Daniel at December 31, 2006 11:01 PM (KqEwN)
522
Cool design http://portaldiscount.com/used-car-loan/
Posted by: Lori at January 01, 2007 01:04 AM (KqEwN)
523
Very nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/forex-demo-account/
Posted by: Reginald at January 01, 2007 02:53 AM (KqEwN)
524
Very useful http://portaldiscount.com/free-mortgage-calculator/
Posted by: Jacob at January 01, 2007 05:06 AM (KqEwN)
525
Hi, nice site! http://portaldiscount.com/bad-credit-debt-consolidation/
Posted by: Larry at January 01, 2007 07:15 AM (KqEwN)
Lefty Fears Bush Agenda More than Iranian Genocide Agenda
I am not an admirer of George W. Bush. He's a fantastic failure on many fronts. Especially his stubborn and unforgivable unwillingness to fire generals when they clearly deserve it.
But for all of Bush's stupidity, at least he fights. The alternative seems to be a Democratic party which has returned to it's 1864 roots. In that year, the Democrats nominated General George McClellen on an end the war/bring home the troops platform.
The Democrats were sick of the blood and carnage caused by what they called "Mr. Lincoln's War" which would eventually claim the lives of over 500,000 Americans. They also feared the very real suppression of civil liberties--suppression which was sometimes bloody. They feared Lincoln more than they feared Lee.
Kevin Drum, what's old is new.
And yet, I know perfectly well that criticism of Iran is not just criticism of Iran. Whether I want it to or not, it also provides support for the Bush administration’s determined and deliberate effort to whip up enthusiasm for a military strike....Ah, yes, slavery is bad, but Lincoln is worse.I’m simply not willing to be a pawn in the Bush administration’s latest marketing campaign.
See Dub has the rest and a very good analysis.
Posted by: Rusty at
09:51 AM
| Comments (49)
| Add Comment
Post contains 213 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Military action + Iran = innevitable regardless of how soon or who squeezes the trigger.. short of a miracle.
Posted by: JeepThang at August 17, 2006 10:01 AM (0411H)
2
Gee, Rusty, I think General Lee must be rolling in his grave with that comparison to Iran. And Lee's agenda was hardly fomenting the doctrine of slavery on the Northern States. But that is another argument for another place. Lee, however, was a decent man. Can't say that about the nut in Iran.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 10:14 AM (rUyw4)
3
GOD BLESS ROBERT E LEE. Lincoln was an ugly retard in a stupid hat.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 10:49 AM (jgE7Y)
4
Lee was a traitor. Please look up the definition of treason if you admire the man.
Posted by: Rusty at August 17, 2006 11:01 AM (JQjhA)
5
Rusty, I know that popular history doesn't teach much of the truth, but Lee was totally within his Constitutional rights to renounce his citizenship in the US and declare himself a citizen of the sovereign state of Virginia, which was also Constitutionally justified in leaving the union. There never was anything in the Constitution that said a state could not leave the union, and all other considerations aside, like it or not, Lincoln had no legal authority to compel states to remain in the union. The citizens of the various states democratically voted to leave the union, and Federal troops in the South became de facto occupiers on foreign soil. Lincoln's refusal to remove the troops from Ft. Sumpter was an act of war, and military action to remove them was justified.
America stopped being a free republic and became a tyranny at that point. If we do not have the right to associate and disassociate freely, then we are not really free. If we don't have the right to disassociate ourselves through the democratic process, then what do our votes count? If our votes don't count, then there is no liberty, there is only a lie in its place. If military force is required to compel us to remain loyal to the Federal government, then we are living under tyranny.
America stopped being a free republic and became a tyranny at that point. If we do not have the right to associate and disassociate freely, then we are not really free. If we don't have the right to disassociate ourselves through the democratic process, then what do our votes count? If our votes don't count, then there is no liberty, there is only a lie in its place. If military force is required to compel us to remain loyal to the Federal government, then we are living under tyranny.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 11:30 AM (v3I+x)
6
Lee was a Virginian. Once the South suceeded he was a member of the Confederate States of America. He was not a traitor to the Confederacy or his race. Are you?
Before Israel there was Palestine. I guess anyone fighting against Palestine is a traitor in your book.
ACADEMIC MEATHEAD.
Before Israel there was Palestine. I guess anyone fighting against Palestine is a traitor in your book.
ACADEMIC MEATHEAD.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 11:57 AM (jgE7Y)
7
Uh, I'm afraid you two knuckleheads have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
Nowhere in the Constitution is there an ability to "secceed". The Constitution was not ratified by the States, but by CONVENTIONS of the people in the States. No "people" voted to leave the Union, rather the state legislatures did. The Founders specifically rejected the notion that states were sovereign when they established a system of convention elections for ratification. The people were and are sovereign.
I would also refer you to Jefferson's and later Andrew Jackson's handling of the nullification crisis. Both were state's rights advocates, but both rejected your idiotic notion that States could secceed. They can't.
Supporting armed insurection against the US is the very defintion of treason. Please see Article III, US Constitution.
"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort."
Traitors, all.
Nowhere in the Constitution is there an ability to "secceed". The Constitution was not ratified by the States, but by CONVENTIONS of the people in the States. No "people" voted to leave the Union, rather the state legislatures did. The Founders specifically rejected the notion that states were sovereign when they established a system of convention elections for ratification. The people were and are sovereign.
I would also refer you to Jefferson's and later Andrew Jackson's handling of the nullification crisis. Both were state's rights advocates, but both rejected your idiotic notion that States could secceed. They can't.
Supporting armed insurection against the US is the very defintion of treason. Please see Article III, US Constitution.
"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort."
Traitors, all.
Posted by: Rusty at August 17, 2006 01:18 PM (JQjhA)
8
Rusty, I'm a Northerner, but IM is right.
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 17, 2006 01:24 PM (gZnyq)
9
Right YBP.......there is a "natural right" to fight the Tyranny of the Fed govt......to do, what, exactly?
What "right" was it that the South "secceeded" for?
What, precisely, did Lincoln do that was so unbearable and repressive to the South?
Oh, right, the South secceeded BEFORE Lincold was inagurated and because he threatened to do one thing: end the expansion of slavery Westward.
That whole "natural right" to extend slavery West was being violated.
I'd suggest that the lot of you read the Declaration of Independence and the list of griveances.
Only a moron could believe that the South had a legitimate grievance and therefore a "natural right" to rebel against the Federal government.
What "right" was it that the South "secceeded" for?
What, precisely, did Lincoln do that was so unbearable and repressive to the South?
Oh, right, the South secceeded BEFORE Lincold was inagurated and because he threatened to do one thing: end the expansion of slavery Westward.
That whole "natural right" to extend slavery West was being violated.
I'd suggest that the lot of you read the Declaration of Independence and the list of griveances.
Only a moron could believe that the South had a legitimate grievance and therefore a "natural right" to rebel against the Federal government.
Posted by: Rusty at August 17, 2006 01:33 PM (JQjhA)
10
These issued were settled on the battlefield. Too many men died on both sides. The result of their spilling of their blood must be honored.
The way I like to honor it is if any nation or Islamist dare spill blood upon out ground paid for by the blood of those who fought the bloddiest of all wars they should be defeated mercilessly until they surrender or they are elimiated. Now I think that is something we could all agree on.
The way I like to honor it is if any nation or Islamist dare spill blood upon out ground paid for by the blood of those who fought the bloddiest of all wars they should be defeated mercilessly until they surrender or they are elimiated. Now I think that is something we could all agree on.
Posted by: Howie at August 17, 2006 01:34 PM (YdcZ0)
11
I would like to see IM's position as it is decribed in the constitution. Rusty, yours would need to be available as well. I already have my opinion but I will keep it to myself.
I would like to know who is standing on the side of the implied rights whether it is the side of secession, or if the implied interpretation is from Rusty's side of the debate.
Reading Article III is a good place to start. As a sitting President it would seem to be incumbent upon Lincoln to do everything he could to maintain the Union of the Southern states, and the North.
I would like to know who is standing on the side of the implied rights whether it is the side of secession, or if the implied interpretation is from Rusty's side of the debate.
Reading Article III is a good place to start. As a sitting President it would seem to be incumbent upon Lincoln to do everything he could to maintain the Union of the Southern states, and the North.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:35 PM (7teJ9)
12
The privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.
Would the secession of the Southern States be considered rebellion?
Would the secession of the Southern States be considered rebellion?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:43 PM (7teJ9)
13
Treason
treason n the offense of attempting to overthrow the government of one's country or of assisting its enemies in war Source: NMW
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:45 PM (7teJ9)
14
Section 4 - Republican government
The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:46 PM (7teJ9)
15
There was no treason. The South didn't want to overthrow the Northern government or "make" them part of the Confederacy. It just wanted to govern over its own states and live according to its own rules.
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 17, 2006 01:52 PM (gZnyq)
16
So Rusty, the various state legislatures, who are democratically elected by the people, don't represent the people? You're full of shit.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 01:52 PM (v3I+x)
17
Here is the part in the constitution where some argument can come into play.
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
It's not much but together without a clear mention for the Presidential power to prevent secession, there could be wiggle room.
Whatever, it is a moot point. Lee lost.
His former home is now the location of Arlinton National Cemetary.
Amendment X - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
It's not much but together without a clear mention for the Presidential power to prevent secession, there could be wiggle room.
Whatever, it is a moot point. Lee lost.
His former home is now the location of Arlinton National Cemetary.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 01:57 PM (7teJ9)
18
Was secession put to the people by referendum? I believe not. BTW what was the document created by the confederate states defining the secession called?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 02:51 PM (7teJ9)
19
And that is what pisses me off. That academic meathead claims that all the dead are buried on a traitors land.
The Constitution has as many interpretations as the Bible or Koran. Example, All men are created equal. Who were they talking about? White land owners. Asians? There wasn't any here. Muslims? There wasn't any here. Blacks? Many of the writers of the Constitution were slave owners. Did they think that life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness applied to their personal property? Bought and sold. One has to view the Constitution with common sense and apply it to modern values.
When God said Thou shall not kill, he didn't mean a head of cabbage.
Academia is devoid of common sense. Therefore academic meatheads don't count. And that should have been put in the Constitution.
Remember this idiot old hag of a Judge came from academia.
The Constitution has as many interpretations as the Bible or Koran. Example, All men are created equal. Who were they talking about? White land owners. Asians? There wasn't any here. Muslims? There wasn't any here. Blacks? Many of the writers of the Constitution were slave owners. Did they think that life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness applied to their personal property? Bought and sold. One has to view the Constitution with common sense and apply it to modern values.
When God said Thou shall not kill, he didn't mean a head of cabbage.
Academia is devoid of common sense. Therefore academic meatheads don't count. And that should have been put in the Constitution.
Remember this idiot old hag of a Judge came from academia.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:00 PM (jgE7Y)
20
Any association that is voluntarily entered by free people may be dissolved as long as those people remain free, but if the people are prevented by force of arms from dissolving that relationship by legal, democratic means, then they are no longer free. There is nothing in the Constitution that in any way denies the right of the states to dissassociate themselves the union, or that sanctions the use of arms to prevent disassociation, so we may consider ourselves to live under an unconstitutional tyranny.
Ironically, thanks to the Federal government's refusal to take action to secure our borders and enforce immigration laws, the Southwest will no longer be under the government's control within a few years, and the states will probably exist in a de facto state Hispanic confederacy with Mexico, and the Feds will be powerless to stop it. When that happens, I hope the Southern states will succeed as well, so we can get corrupt, incompetent Feds off our backs, and put our own house in order again.
Ironically, thanks to the Federal government's refusal to take action to secure our borders and enforce immigration laws, the Southwest will no longer be under the government's control within a few years, and the states will probably exist in a de facto state Hispanic confederacy with Mexico, and the Feds will be powerless to stop it. When that happens, I hope the Southern states will succeed as well, so we can get corrupt, incompetent Feds off our backs, and put our own house in order again.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 03:02 PM (v3I+x)
21
And for old rusty brains. Down here Government employees get a paid day off for the great Rober E Lee's birthday. Must work on Lincolns. Lincoln was ugly, poorly dressed and caused millions to die over an issue that would have over time taken care of itself. A stupid move. In particular when you address the fact that had the south won. The nation would have been split into two forever.
Naw! The civil war was stupid and so was Lincoln. His dress, manner and poorly trimed beard made him look like a well dressed muslim.
Naw! The civil war was stupid and so was Lincoln. His dress, manner and poorly trimed beard made him look like a well dressed muslim.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:09 PM (jgE7Y)
22
Notice ole rusty brains never addressed the fact that Israel spit Palestine into two nations that were once one. Were they wrong to divide Palestine? Are all Jews therefore traitors in Rusty's eyes? Or does common sense addressing a need prevail.
Damn that sand must be warm.
Damn that sand must be warm.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 03:17 PM (jgE7Y)
23
I read the South Carolina Declaration, which BTW was written in 1852. The use the DOI written by the Continental congress as the basis for their own argument. They also define themselves clearly as a slaveholding state and also make it clear that the issue of slaveholding was the line by which the very differences between north and south were determined. Duh right?
The revisionist historians in Georgia have been trying to paint the secession of southern states as having been based on overall staes rights and the freedomes defined in article section 10 of the constitution. Meaning unless a power is clearly defined to reside in the hands of the federal govt. it then is implied to reside in the hands of state and local govt. IE the People.
The revisionist historians in Georgia have been trying to paint the secession of southern states as having been based on overall staes rights and the freedomes defined in article section 10 of the constitution. Meaning unless a power is clearly defined to reside in the hands of the federal govt. it then is implied to reside in the hands of state and local govt. IE the People.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (2HM/d)
24
greyrooster and improbulus maximus. Is the America that emerged from the ashes of civil better than the result if the southen seccession had led to two seperate countries? The standard of living you enjoy would not have been possible if the two regions had become seperate countries. People like you make me sick. I'd want to kill you for such stupid opinions, but I know you aren't serious.
Posted by: Finlay at August 17, 2006 03:56 PM (2XgZl)
25
greyrooster and improbulus maximus. Is the America that emerged from the ashes of civil better than the result if the southen seccession had led to two seperate countries? The standard of living you enjoy would not have been possible if the two regions had become seperate countries. People like you make me sick. I'd want to kill you for such stupid opinions, but I know you aren't serious.
Posted by: Finlay at August 17, 2006 03:58 PM (2XgZl)
26
I'd like to meet you so you could try Finlay, you gutless piece of shit.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 04:25 PM (v3I+x)
27
Finlay: You stupid ass. Go back and read my post again. What are you? Friggin brain dead. I said Lincoln put our country in jeopardy of being split into two nations.
The standard of living I would enjoy. You dumb ass you haven't been around here long have you. Next time I leave my farm and get on my $256,000 play toy, filled with 1200 gals of diesel, I'll ask my accountant if it affects my standard of living.
Little assuming people like you make me sick.
The standard of living I would enjoy. You dumb ass you haven't been around here long have you. Next time I leave my farm and get on my $256,000 play toy, filled with 1200 gals of diesel, I'll ask my accountant if it affects my standard of living.
Little assuming people like you make me sick.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 04:51 PM (jgE7Y)
28
I'm bored. It's cooling off so I think I'll go down to the boat launch and drink beer with the red necks.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 04:55 PM (jgE7Y)
29
Speaking of firing Generals, Lincoln fired McClellan but he had to play it carefully. McClellan was popular and a good organizer but a terrible battlefield General. He did not hide his disdain for Lincoln but Lincoln would have tolerated McClellan's arrogance if the man would fight or win on the battlefield.
Rusty, I'm curious, which Generals do you think should be fired. The whole crowd seem unimpressive and very PC. I did like Tommy Franks who was at the top; while the woman general at the prison was one of the worst.
Oh, and what was with Pace crying at a congressional hearing. Patton would be, er, surprised.
Rusty, I'm curious, which Generals do you think should be fired. The whole crowd seem unimpressive and very PC. I did like Tommy Franks who was at the top; while the woman general at the prison was one of the worst.
Oh, and what was with Pace crying at a congressional hearing. Patton would be, er, surprised.
Posted by: kate at August 17, 2006 05:32 PM (BOaC0)
30
It's the new Army. The Army of One.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 06:40 PM (n4VvM)
31
An argument I personally don't want to get involved with - however what I always found a lil' amusing is that the South was in the end fortunate that they lost.
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 07:57 PM (XrexX)
32
Well, let me end all the discussion with this little jewel. The United States Military Academy taught that secession was allowed under the Constitution of the United States. Just saying. Not that I would have wanted the nation to be split up, but Lee was not a traitor. And hondo would be a foreigner to me, and I would not like for him to live in a foreign country, or would I be the one living in a foreign country? hondo, say something!
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 08:34 PM (rUyw4)
33
Yes they were. The Republican party pretty much ran the carpetbagging system which hurt the former occupiers but protected poor whites and blacks. As soon as reconstruction ended, well lets just say, Georgia did not have a republican Gov until 2002. During that time we know what happened in the south.
It still took until 2005 for the last of the Jim Crow Laws to be written out of the books. Keep in mind every few decades, the Georgia Constitution is reviewed for editing and updating. During all that time, including the administration of James Earle Carter, Mr Human Rights himself, those same Jim Crow laws remained on the books.
Has anyone asked his Empathyness about that? Would someone with some access to him and a pair of cajones ask him why he did try to strike them from the law books?
Why wasn't Jesse Jackson pissing and moaning to the Democrat Gov's who occupied the office for ALL of those decades! Black people of the South you need to look at what has happened to help you since reconstruction, and when it ended. The NAACP and SCLC have their own agenda. It is not you. You are a means for them to make money.
Don't call me cracker or whitey because you may not know enough about me to make that determination.
It still took until 2005 for the last of the Jim Crow Laws to be written out of the books. Keep in mind every few decades, the Georgia Constitution is reviewed for editing and updating. During all that time, including the administration of James Earle Carter, Mr Human Rights himself, those same Jim Crow laws remained on the books.
Has anyone asked his Empathyness about that? Would someone with some access to him and a pair of cajones ask him why he did try to strike them from the law books?
Why wasn't Jesse Jackson pissing and moaning to the Democrat Gov's who occupied the office for ALL of those decades! Black people of the South you need to look at what has happened to help you since reconstruction, and when it ended. The NAACP and SCLC have their own agenda. It is not you. You are a means for them to make money.
Don't call me cracker or whitey because you may not know enough about me to make that determination.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 08:42 PM (n4VvM)
34
Would someone with some access to him and a pair of cajones ask him why he didn't try to strike them from the law books?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 17, 2006 09:29 PM (n4VvM)
35
I'm an Aussie and I'm no expert on the civil war, but I do admire President George W Bush.
Posted by: jonny at August 17, 2006 09:30 PM (KEQ/D)
36
Before the Civil War, (not The War between the States) it may have been debatable if a State could legally leave the Union.
After the Civil War, the debate is over. Whether you like it or not, a State may not leave the Union. Period.
So, if you do it now, you're a traitor.
We are free because we are united under one form of government. It ain't ideal, but it ain't tyranny.
The South got what it deserved.
After the Civil War, the debate is over. Whether you like it or not, a State may not leave the Union. Period.
So, if you do it now, you're a traitor.
We are free because we are united under one form of government. It ain't ideal, but it ain't tyranny.
The South got what it deserved.
Posted by: eman at August 17, 2006 09:30 PM (SD4ZE)
37
Secession, and the war that followed it, wouldn't have happened if the corrupt Northern politicians hadn't tried to screw with the economy of the South. I know most people won't agree, and I credit the PC indoctrination of our school systems, but slavery was only a secondary issue at best, and was definitely not the sole cause of the war. The South was getting rich on exports of cotton and tobacco to Europe, and imports of finished goods from same, which were much higher in quality than those available domestically,i.e. from the Northern states, and at roughly the same price since the ships were coming to the South anyway to pick up the exports. Why would Southerners buy inferior domestic goods when they could have the finest Europe had to offer at a comparable price? They wouldn't, and so, it was an economic issue, and the Northern states tried to raise the duties on imports and exports, (called imposts), so that their goods could compete in the Southern market, which didn't go well in the South. Democrats controlled Congress, so the attempts to raise the imposts weren't working, and so slavery became an issue, but not because of moral opposition to slavery, which existed in the North as well as the South, but because the Northern politicians knew that if they could stop the admittance of any more slave states, they could get more Republican votes in Congress, and push through the impost increases. It was all about money.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 09:31 PM (v3I+x)
38
Lee's home here in NYC (Ft Hamilton Bklyn) is a national landmark - nice lil' place - wish they had tours.
Never considered Lee or the South traitors. To me, a traitor is one who sides with or serves a foreign power. Always considered the War Between the States as purely a domestic family dispute (with lots of violence). Big difference.
Always viewed succession as fundamentally legal under certain circumstances - question is - were those circumstances met.
The Union is an agreement between the states (in writing dare say - and you all know what I'm talking about). Out of that agreement a central government is formed and maintained. The central government is not absolute - it oversees the implementation of that agreement - and must abide by that agreement.
When that agreement is no longer met, then succession would then be legal.
JJ - If I cam back down South again to burn down Atlanta - would you still mind - would you still love me?
Never considered Lee or the South traitors. To me, a traitor is one who sides with or serves a foreign power. Always considered the War Between the States as purely a domestic family dispute (with lots of violence). Big difference.
Always viewed succession as fundamentally legal under certain circumstances - question is - were those circumstances met.
The Union is an agreement between the states (in writing dare say - and you all know what I'm talking about). Out of that agreement a central government is formed and maintained. The central government is not absolute - it oversees the implementation of that agreement - and must abide by that agreement.
When that agreement is no longer met, then succession would then be legal.
JJ - If I cam back down South again to burn down Atlanta - would you still mind - would you still love me?
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 10:55 PM (XrexX)
39
eman: The WAR BETWEEN THE STATES need never happened except that Lincoln and crew insisted that it happen. The issue of slave ownership was dying. Only the very wealthy pressed issue of keeping slaves. More of an economic thing for them. The hatred for blacks came more after the civil war and during reconstruction. A freed black represented the hated federal government. How do you hate someone that you know and grew up with? Little white kids didn't hate little balck kids they played with. Regardsless of who owns who. Kids are kids. In truth, messing with the wrong mans slave could get your ass kicked.
Lincoln was a turkey that caused the death of millions and created a hatred and distrust that lasts to this day. Why? Just so he could go down in history.
If the South got what they deserved. So did Lincoln.
Lincoln was a turkey that caused the death of millions and created a hatred and distrust that lasts to this day. Why? Just so he could go down in history.
If the South got what they deserved. So did Lincoln.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 18, 2006 07:32 AM (BjTJ6)
40
Greyrooster,
You seem to have extensive knowledge of that time period.
Tell me, if you could live in that time, would you choose to be a slave?
Would you be property? Whould you choose to be bought and sold like cattle?
Or would you be a slave-owner? Would you break up a family and sell them like a litter of pigs? Would you rationalize that it was ok, that the life of a slave wasn't so bad?
The economic and other causes of the Civil War should not be ignored, but the overwhelming driving force was the conflict over slavery.
The South wanted the freedom to continue as slavemasters.
If slavery had had the time to wither away, would the former slaves have been treated as equals? Would they have transformed in the minds of Southerners from property to fellow human beings?
Also, if the Confederacy had endured, how would it prevent itself from breaking up into smaller and smaller entities? Would they have a once-only seccession rule? Would Jefferson Davis be forced to act as Lincoln did? The likely fate of the Confederacy would be unending seccessions and wars.
You seem to have extensive knowledge of that time period.
Tell me, if you could live in that time, would you choose to be a slave?
Would you be property? Whould you choose to be bought and sold like cattle?
Or would you be a slave-owner? Would you break up a family and sell them like a litter of pigs? Would you rationalize that it was ok, that the life of a slave wasn't so bad?
The economic and other causes of the Civil War should not be ignored, but the overwhelming driving force was the conflict over slavery.
The South wanted the freedom to continue as slavemasters.
If slavery had had the time to wither away, would the former slaves have been treated as equals? Would they have transformed in the minds of Southerners from property to fellow human beings?
Also, if the Confederacy had endured, how would it prevent itself from breaking up into smaller and smaller entities? Would they have a once-only seccession rule? Would Jefferson Davis be forced to act as Lincoln did? The likely fate of the Confederacy would be unending seccessions and wars.
Posted by: eman at August 18, 2006 09:48 AM (SD4ZE)
41
Eman, your arguments are hollow and based on false premises. To live in the antebellum South didn't mean one had to choose between being a slave-owner or being a slave. The vast majority of Whites didn't own slaves. Slavery was already a dying institution by the time of the war, and imports of slaves had been stopped some time before. Slavery was becoming less profitable because of the cost of purchasing and keeping slaves, and the amount of supervision they required. This, along with lower labor costs, and increased competition in the cotton and tobacco markets, that came with the increase of the White population, which made up the bulk of the labor force in most places, made slavery less profitable as time went on. Lower market prices due to increased supply, and advances in agricultural machinery and methods would have made slavery obsolete within another twenty years in any event, and this is not just hindsight, but can be verified by reading the literature of the day.
Slavery was just as legal in the North as in the South, but wasn't as widely practiced, because there was little need for it since the North always had enough cheap immigrant labor to drive its economy. There was little moral opposition to slavery in the North, except among certain religious groups, and almost no popular opposition whatsoever, and Linconl's Emancipation Proclamation on affected the slaves in the South, but not in the North, so your statement speaks of either your ignorance or your hypocrisy.
Your last assertion, that the South would continue to break up into smaller elements and continue in a state of perpetual war, is simply nonsense that is not supported by any rational explanation of political theory or historical fact. A confederacy is an alliance of sovreign states that are each free and independant, and who engage in trade and support one another militarily, but whose people cannot be taxed for the benefit of another state. America began as a confederacy. The anti-federalists feared what it might become, and they were right, because our government has usurped powers that it does not legally hold, and has negated the will of the people with a massive, corrupt political system which ensures that those in power remain in power through inertia, or the power of the gun, whichever is more expedient.
Slavery was just as legal in the North as in the South, but wasn't as widely practiced, because there was little need for it since the North always had enough cheap immigrant labor to drive its economy. There was little moral opposition to slavery in the North, except among certain religious groups, and almost no popular opposition whatsoever, and Linconl's Emancipation Proclamation on affected the slaves in the South, but not in the North, so your statement speaks of either your ignorance or your hypocrisy.
Your last assertion, that the South would continue to break up into smaller elements and continue in a state of perpetual war, is simply nonsense that is not supported by any rational explanation of political theory or historical fact. A confederacy is an alliance of sovreign states that are each free and independant, and who engage in trade and support one another militarily, but whose people cannot be taxed for the benefit of another state. America began as a confederacy. The anti-federalists feared what it might become, and they were right, because our government has usurped powers that it does not legally hold, and has negated the will of the people with a massive, corrupt political system which ensures that those in power remain in power through inertia, or the power of the gun, whichever is more expedient.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 10:47 AM (v3I+x)
42
hondo, Yankees in Atlanta! Yankees in Atlanta, Ms. Scarlett, them Yankees is gonna kill me. Help me Ms. Scarlett!............ Now, hondo, you wouldn't wanna come down here to Atlanta and scare Ms. Prissy again, now would you?
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 18, 2006 10:52 AM (rUyw4)
43
It is posible to study a subject so intently that a person begins to identify with people and things that do not deserve admiration or loyalty.
Slavery was then, and is now, a moral issue. The number of slaveowners, its declining economic role, and any and all tangential factors are irrelevant. It was and is a corrosive, insidious evil that needed to be purged from this Nation.
As to the long-term viability of the Confederacy.... we shall never know. But, I maintain that a state born from the idea that no bonds need be permanent is doomed by its inherent contradiction.
Slavery was then, and is now, a moral issue. The number of slaveowners, its declining economic role, and any and all tangential factors are irrelevant. It was and is a corrosive, insidious evil that needed to be purged from this Nation.
As to the long-term viability of the Confederacy.... we shall never know. But, I maintain that a state born from the idea that no bonds need be permanent is doomed by its inherent contradiction.
Posted by: Eman at August 18, 2006 02:59 PM (ljoDE)
44
Eman, this time you showed your love of dogma more than your ignorance, but don't worry, it still shows. What part of "slavery was a dying institution" didn't you understand? You justify the war based on nothing more than its resulting eradication of slavery, but what of the Jim Crow laws and a century and a half of directly subsequent racial problems consequential to the war?
Tell me; are you for or against the war in Iraq? It's a war to liberate a people from tyranny, so the same rule should apply, right?
Tell me; are you for or against the war in Iraq? It's a war to liberate a people from tyranny, so the same rule should apply, right?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 03:41 PM (v3I+x)
45
Eman: You seem to ignore the fact that slavery as an institution was on its way out. IN a few short years in would have ended. The industrial age would have ended it as much as anything. Mechanization, technology and modern farming methods brought about a surplus of the main reasons for slavery. Namely, cotton and tobacco.
To answer your question: Had I lived in those days. Given my family background, conditioning and peer group. Yes, I would have been one who sat on the porch and drank iced mint julips while watching the slaves go to work. Knowing myself, I also would have cared for them, properly housed them, fed them, cared for them in their old age and not allow beatings and such. It would have been impossible for me to grow up with someone and no have feelings for them.
I suspect the vast majority of slave owners would feel the same. But that doesn't make good propaganda does it? How would some liberal be outraged by someone who cared for his servants?
I also doubt that I would go to Africa, run people thru the jungle, put them in chains and sell them to slavers. Who did that anyway?. Ah, better ignore that question. Whose still doing it today? There's only one side to liberalism. The dark side.
To answer your question: Had I lived in those days. Given my family background, conditioning and peer group. Yes, I would have been one who sat on the porch and drank iced mint julips while watching the slaves go to work. Knowing myself, I also would have cared for them, properly housed them, fed them, cared for them in their old age and not allow beatings and such. It would have been impossible for me to grow up with someone and no have feelings for them.
I suspect the vast majority of slave owners would feel the same. But that doesn't make good propaganda does it? How would some liberal be outraged by someone who cared for his servants?
I also doubt that I would go to Africa, run people thru the jungle, put them in chains and sell them to slavers. Who did that anyway?. Ah, better ignore that question. Whose still doing it today? There's only one side to liberalism. The dark side.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 19, 2006 11:55 PM (2a6q3)
46
eman: A question. Why do liberals always question and blame slavery on Southern Whites? The Romans had slaves, the Greeks, the Egyptians, the Chinese, the muslims, Vikings, the North Africans, the Aztecs, the Incas, etc: The entire fucking world. Why do southern whites have to take the heat for what the entire world did? Must be some silly liberal thing. Did you democrats question the slavery issue when the south of called the solid south? Namely, always voted democratic. When I grew up it was a Republican thing.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 20, 2006 12:02 AM (2a6q3)
47
"The South was getting rich on exports of cotton and tobacco to Europe,"
Right.
How'd they grow that stuff, again?
There were two systems - one based on wage-labor, the other on slave-labor. (A lot of the antebellum Southern intellectuals sound like hippie commies, by the way, when they went off on "wage slavery.")
Conflict between these systems was, probably, inevitable.
It's totally unfair that today's white southerners still bear the suspicion of the entire world. But you're not helping your case any by whitewashing (heh) slavery.
Some small farmers (some quite rich, just they were farming less area) did indeed treat their slaves humanely.
But the mass-scale plantations of the Deeper South? Slave labor camps. Like the goddamn gulag.
Yes, Lincoln was a tyrant. No, everything wouldn't have been peaches and cream if the north had let the south go.
Don't cover your body in George Allen stickers. Don't dance to the tune of a cynical carpetbagger. Stop fighting for The Cause. The Cause is dead.
Long live the New South.
Right.
How'd they grow that stuff, again?
There were two systems - one based on wage-labor, the other on slave-labor. (A lot of the antebellum Southern intellectuals sound like hippie commies, by the way, when they went off on "wage slavery.")
Conflict between these systems was, probably, inevitable.
It's totally unfair that today's white southerners still bear the suspicion of the entire world. But you're not helping your case any by whitewashing (heh) slavery.
Some small farmers (some quite rich, just they were farming less area) did indeed treat their slaves humanely.
But the mass-scale plantations of the Deeper South? Slave labor camps. Like the goddamn gulag.
Yes, Lincoln was a tyrant. No, everything wouldn't have been peaches and cream if the north had let the south go.
Don't cover your body in George Allen stickers. Don't dance to the tune of a cynical carpetbagger. Stop fighting for The Cause. The Cause is dead.
Long live the New South.
Posted by: Knemon at August 22, 2006 11:15 AM (bnARE)
48
Before Israel there was Palestine.
Sorry Rooster, you lost your history cred right there.
I am sick of people buying into this Arab/Moslem revisionist history crap.
So here is your lesson for today..
c.1030bce – Israelites form kingdom in the land of Israel, territory including modern state of Israel, West Bank, Gaza Strip, parts of Jordan, southwestern Syria and southern Lebanon.
c.1020bce – Saul first king of Israelites
c.1006bce – King David moves capital from Hebron to Jerusalem
c.965bce – Temple of Solomon
c.922bce – Kingdom splits into Judah, capital Jerusalem, and northern kingdom, Israel, capital Samaria
....lets skip ahead 700 years or so...
139bce – Roman Senate recognizes Jewish autonomy
131bce – Israel throws off Syrian rule, establishes kingdom
63bce – Rome annexes area as Judea
66ce – Rome loots Jerusalem, city then seized by the Jewish Zealots
70ce – Destruction of Second Temple, area renamed Palestine by Romans
73ce – Last Jewish resistance crushed at Masada
The utopian "Arab/Moslem Palestine" everyone fights over never existed. The Jews never occupied Arab lands, it was the other way around & it still is today.
Sorry Rooster, you lost your history cred right there.
I am sick of people buying into this Arab/Moslem revisionist history crap.
So here is your lesson for today..
c.1030bce – Israelites form kingdom in the land of Israel, territory including modern state of Israel, West Bank, Gaza Strip, parts of Jordan, southwestern Syria and southern Lebanon.
c.1020bce – Saul first king of Israelites
c.1006bce – King David moves capital from Hebron to Jerusalem
c.965bce – Temple of Solomon
c.922bce – Kingdom splits into Judah, capital Jerusalem, and northern kingdom, Israel, capital Samaria
....lets skip ahead 700 years or so...
139bce – Roman Senate recognizes Jewish autonomy
131bce – Israel throws off Syrian rule, establishes kingdom
63bce – Rome annexes area as Judea
66ce – Rome loots Jerusalem, city then seized by the Jewish Zealots
70ce – Destruction of Second Temple, area renamed Palestine by Romans
73ce – Last Jewish resistance crushed at Masada
The utopian "Arab/Moslem Palestine" everyone fights over never existed. The Jews never occupied Arab lands, it was the other way around & it still is today.
Posted by: A. Weasel at August 22, 2006 12:07 PM (RvUfa)
49
Before Israel there was Palestine.
Sorry Rooster, you lost your history cred right there.
I am sick of people buying into this Arab/Moslem revisionist history crap.
So here is your lesson for today..
c.1030bce – Israelites form kingdom in the land of Israel, territory including modern state of Israel, West Bank, Gaza Strip, parts of Jordan, southwestern Syria and southern Lebanon.
c.1020bce – Saul first king of Israelites
c.1006bce – King David moves capital from Hebron to Jerusalem
c.965bce – Temple of Solomon
c.922bce – Kingdom splits into Judah, capital Jerusalem, and northern kingdom, Israel, capital Samaria
....lets skip ahead 700 years or so...
139bce – Roman Senate recognizes Jewish autonomy
131bce – Israel throws off Syrian rule, establishes kingdom
63bce – Rome annexes area as Judea
66ce – Rome loots Jerusalem, city then seized by the Jewish Zealots
70ce – Destruction of Second Temple, area renamed Palestine by Romans
73ce – Last Jewish resistance crushed at Masada
The utopian "Arab/Moslem Palestine" everyone fights over never existed. The Jews never occupied Arab lands, it was the other way around & it still is today.
Sorry Rooster, you lost your history cred right there.
I am sick of people buying into this Arab/Moslem revisionist history crap.
So here is your lesson for today..
c.1030bce – Israelites form kingdom in the land of Israel, territory including modern state of Israel, West Bank, Gaza Strip, parts of Jordan, southwestern Syria and southern Lebanon.
c.1020bce – Saul first king of Israelites
c.1006bce – King David moves capital from Hebron to Jerusalem
c.965bce – Temple of Solomon
c.922bce – Kingdom splits into Judah, capital Jerusalem, and northern kingdom, Israel, capital Samaria
....lets skip ahead 700 years or so...
139bce – Roman Senate recognizes Jewish autonomy
131bce – Israel throws off Syrian rule, establishes kingdom
63bce – Rome annexes area as Judea
66ce – Rome loots Jerusalem, city then seized by the Jewish Zealots
70ce – Destruction of Second Temple, area renamed Palestine by Romans
73ce – Last Jewish resistance crushed at Masada
The utopian "Arab/Moslem Palestine" everyone fights over never existed. The Jews never occupied Arab lands, it was the other way around & it still is today.
Posted by: A. Weasel at August 22, 2006 12:08 PM (RvUfa)
Nine Hours a Day Memorizing the Koran
Yes, we've all heard the stories of those third-world madrassas that teach school-age boys nothing but the words of the Koran. Such madrassas are all over the world--even in New York. From the NYT via Ann Althouse:
By not offering instruction in other subjects, the school may be inadvertently running afoul of state law, according to city and state education officials. Private religious schools like the Muslim Center’s program are required to provide “substantially equivalent†instruction to that offered in public schools, they said. But tracking every school-age child who leaves the public school system can be difficult. . . .Tick, tick, tick...[The mother of one of the students] confessed that she sometimes questioned whether she was doing the right thing with her son, fretting that Thaha, who would have been entering the sixth grade this year if he had stayed in regular school, does not know his multiplication tables, for example.
But the beauty of this country, Mrs. Sherwani said, is that her son is free to have it both ways, to be steeped in Islam and be whatever he wants.
Cross-posted to The Sammenhold Blog.
Posted by: Ragnar at
12:43 AM
| Comments (18)
| Add Comment
Post contains 187 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Dangerous .... but stupid. What a combination!
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 01:03 AM (XrexX)
2
As expected I didn't see the following names: Brad Pitt, George Clooney, Angelina Jolie, Tom Cruise, Mel Gibson. Any others?
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 02:07 AM (gLMre)
3
I'd rather deal with stupid terrorists that can't count to 20 than smart terrorists who study nuclear physics or biochemistry...
Posted by: CanForce 101 at August 17, 2006 03:39 AM (BMrv8)
4
Uh, Mrs. Sherwani, no. He's damn sure not "free to have it both ways, to be steeped in Islam and be whatever he wants." Guess she doesn't really get the gist of it, you know that whole steeping thing.
Steeped in shit, little Thaha grew up in his Grandfathers footsteps to become Thaha Sherwani Du Turd.
Steeped in shit, little Thaha grew up in his Grandfathers footsteps to become Thaha Sherwani Du Turd.
Posted by: forest hunter at August 17, 2006 04:22 AM (TjUVb)
5
CanForce, it's the stupid ones who willingly strap on the bombs that the smart ones make, all of which is paid for by the "peaceful" ones. There's a simple solution though - extermination.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 08:51 AM (v3I+x)
6
and now we know why the islam are willing to die. they know nothing better. their teachers teach them that dying is the thing to do. what a waist of good childhood. they will have their comming up soon
Posted by: frank la may at August 17, 2006 09:28 AM (B/KNF)
7
Child abuse, pure and simple.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 10:27 AM (rUyw4)
8
Oh, yeah, and in a few years we will see these children blowing themselves up in cafes in NYC. So you liberals out there take note, your children are likely to be the ones killed when these children of NYC are trained to become killers. You are also the ones who need to take action. And quick.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 17, 2006 10:29 AM (rUyw4)
9
I think the Islamist movement involves alot of brainwashing:
1.multiple prayer session a day, combined with rabid immans preaching jihad, anti-Western brochures and fliers to take home
2.isolation of the individual from other communities because infidels are unclean
3.emphasis that individuals give up much of their individual identity for the cult-identity
I don't study cults or brainwashing, but the similarities do pop out at me.
1.multiple prayer session a day, combined with rabid immans preaching jihad, anti-Western brochures and fliers to take home
2.isolation of the individual from other communities because infidels are unclean
3.emphasis that individuals give up much of their individual identity for the cult-identity
I don't study cults or brainwashing, but the similarities do pop out at me.
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at August 17, 2006 10:39 AM (up9HT)
10
JJ, we reap what we sow. Liberals are sowing the wind, and shall reap the whirlwind. When the bombs are going off in New York and California so regularly that you could set your watch by them, I will try very hard to feel sympathy for the victims who have spent so many years enabling and empowering their murderers.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 11:33 AM (v3I+x)
11
IM: We must get Hondo out first. Hondo, ever have a gator in your back yard?
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 11:48 AM (jgE7Y)
12
Anyone who lives in Lefturdistan will just have to shift as well as they can when TSHTF.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 01:50 PM (v3I+x)
13
I'm not dirty.
BTW, this is scary stuff. They should make a movie. Call it 9-11 or something.
It is 2006, and we are watching history unfold. Between the Muslims, and illegal aliens there is going to be big problems ahead.
Written this day of our Lord 17-August-2006 @ 1832 hours by the Greatest of All Barbaric Christian Infidels.
BTW, this is scary stuff. They should make a movie. Call it 9-11 or something.
It is 2006, and we are watching history unfold. Between the Muslims, and illegal aliens there is going to be big problems ahead.
Written this day of our Lord 17-August-2006 @ 1832 hours by the Greatest of All Barbaric Christian Infidels.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 17, 2006 06:38 PM (D2g/j)
14
At least he's not being home schooled. That stuff's dangerous. Kid needs to get out and mingle, become acculterated, experience diversity sort of thing.
Seriously, is this for real - an accredited institution? In New York City? Where's the teachers union when they could actually do some good?
Seriously, is this for real - an accredited institution? In New York City? Where's the teachers union when they could actually do some good?
Posted by: ktel60 at August 17, 2006 07:30 PM (o9zcI)
15
Ktel60, they're too busy fighting over allowing kids to read anything other than evolution to worry about dirtying their hands with potentially offending anyone. "Brainwashing? what's that? I'm sure they're getting a well-rounded education as it is"
Posted by: Ranba Ral at August 17, 2006 09:14 PM (zjZWE)
16
ktel60, did you get "acculterated" in public school?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 17, 2006 09:33 PM (v3I+x)
17
There are actually several of these "institutions" here in NYC - and yes - its all true!
Board Of Ed & Teachers Union (both very liberal) don't bother them at all - its amazing at how effective fear of physical violence and intimidation works with new age liberals! Add to that the lib fear of not appearing PC and understanding enough.
Living in NYC has its advantages - with soooo many different types of immigrants, you learn quickly that they all dislike and distrust the muslims - and (for you GR & IM) they all hold blacks in contempt. God! I love diversity! (An overall generalization I admit - but wow! You'd have to see it to believe it!)
I'm fine where I am on Staten Island - with a front row seat - GR if you remember where the Navy homeport is/was - I'm due west straight back up in the steep heavily forrested ridgeline hills overlooking the NY harbor near the rock cliffs.
Like I said before maxie - the only guaranteed fast way out of this city is by sea - you just can't see the marinas down below because of the dense forrest.
No gators in backyard - but I do have raccoons, opossums, wild turkeys n' a lot of other lil' critters.
Oh - my daughter was homeschooled.
Board Of Ed & Teachers Union (both very liberal) don't bother them at all - its amazing at how effective fear of physical violence and intimidation works with new age liberals! Add to that the lib fear of not appearing PC and understanding enough.
Living in NYC has its advantages - with soooo many different types of immigrants, you learn quickly that they all dislike and distrust the muslims - and (for you GR & IM) they all hold blacks in contempt. God! I love diversity! (An overall generalization I admit - but wow! You'd have to see it to believe it!)
I'm fine where I am on Staten Island - with a front row seat - GR if you remember where the Navy homeport is/was - I'm due west straight back up in the steep heavily forrested ridgeline hills overlooking the NY harbor near the rock cliffs.
Like I said before maxie - the only guaranteed fast way out of this city is by sea - you just can't see the marinas down below because of the dense forrest.
No gators in backyard - but I do have raccoons, opossums, wild turkeys n' a lot of other lil' critters.
Oh - my daughter was homeschooled.
Posted by: hondo at August 17, 2006 09:56 PM (XrexX)
18
Hondo, I don't hold blacks in contempt; I hold idiots in contempt, and many of them just happen to be black. Truth be told, whent TSHTF, I worry a lot more about white liberals helping muslims plant bombs than I do about blacks or any other group.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 03:52 PM (v3I+x)
August 16, 2006
Didn't Mohammed Marry Someone Her Age?
Muslims find it offensive that five year old girl poses for passport photo with bare shoulders.
Far less offensive, it seems, is the thought of their 'Prophet' Mohammed marrying six year old Aisha and then molesting her when she was nine.
Dhimmitude on display in England:
A five-year-old girl had her passport form rejected when an official said the bare shoulders on her photograph could offend Muslims.Don't offend those Muslims. Those people go loco, esse.The post office assistant stunned Hannah Edwards's parents by claiming the skin exposed by her daughter's halter-neck dress would not be accepted by the Passport Office as it might prove unacceptable in a Muslim country.
Hat tip: someone who is cooler than me. Update: Cooler? Yes. But also a whiney biyatch.
Posted by: Rusty at
12:47 PM
| Comments (31)
| Add Comment
Post contains 132 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Did someone photoshop her eyes?
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 12:55 PM (7teJ9)
2
Cute!
Posted by: Mohammed at August 16, 2006 01:24 PM (8e/V4)
3
This may be a hoax.... I've cut and trimmed hairpieces and I'm pretty sure this kid is wearing either a hairpiece or a wig (and an askew wig at that) Notice the unbalanced cut (uneven on both sides), how the hair appears to all come from the top center, the highly unnatural colour pattern, and the fact that no part is visible - no scalp either. Interesting too is the shoulder musculature on the child, much more typical of a small boy's bone structure than a girl's.
hmmm.
hmmm.
Posted by: emmal at August 16, 2006 01:28 PM (yj3GU)
4
No, I think Mohammed waited another year to rape her and then another two years to marry her.
You know, because he was such a great guy.
You know, because he was such a great guy.
Posted by: Laurence Simon at August 16, 2006 01:58 PM (uBCxH)
5
Nice try "Israhell",
The "six years" reference here does not mean 6 years old. It is in reference to the fact that male slaves were to be freed every 7 years.
I have no problem with cultures that marry young, but prepubecent sex is something we call "pedophelia". Maybe you've heard of it.
Much of what passes for "molestation" is, in fact, "statutory rape". Having sex with a 13 year old, for instance, is wrong, but it quite different than sex with a 10 year old.
What Mohammed did was clearly molestation under even the most liberal definitions.
The "six years" reference here does not mean 6 years old. It is in reference to the fact that male slaves were to be freed every 7 years.
I have no problem with cultures that marry young, but prepubecent sex is something we call "pedophelia". Maybe you've heard of it.
Much of what passes for "molestation" is, in fact, "statutory rape". Having sex with a 13 year old, for instance, is wrong, but it quite different than sex with a 10 year old.
What Mohammed did was clearly molestation under even the most liberal definitions.
Posted by: Rusty at August 16, 2006 02:01 PM (JQjhA)
Posted by: JeepThang at August 16, 2006 02:07 PM (0411H)
7
The UK must begin mass deportations or no longer be referred to as England. Time for the Irish to take their place as the true rulers of the UK.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 16, 2006 02:19 PM (vCjBd)
8
Freaking Linknazi.
Posted by: Leopold Stotch at August 16, 2006 02:41 PM (E6GxJ)
9
Hey israhell, F##k off, and die, you moon god worshipping POS.
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 16, 2006 02:48 PM (8uWFo)
10
Has paranoia set in? Why photoshop a picture of a kid's face?
Posted by: youngbourbonprofessional at August 16, 2006 02:52 PM (gZnyq)
11
If the bare shoulders of a 6 year old girl make you have lusty thoughts, you are one sick SOB and should remove yourself from the human gene pool pronto!
Mohammed was a sick sad puppy!
Mohammed was a sick sad puppy!
Posted by: howdy at August 16, 2006 03:24 PM (hph70)
12
grey, ireland is a good pint of ginuess and thats about all ...
Posted by: rob at August 16, 2006 03:34 PM (QpkBe)
Posted by: rob at August 16, 2006 03:35 PM (QpkBe)
14
oh, it's on now. Let the blogwar begin ...
Posted by: Leopold Stotch at August 16, 2006 03:51 PM (E6GxJ)
Posted by: Stinking Irish Drunk at August 16, 2006 03:56 PM (YdcZ0)
16
A good pit of Guinness is worth fighting for.
You know. I more I think about this post the more I wonder?
Either it's an exaggeration, or I think to well of the muslims. And I already think they're lower than dog shit.
But the world is fucked up. Today they arrested in Thailand the supposed killer of Jon Bene Ramsey. A month after her mother Patsy died.
You know. I more I think about this post the more I wonder?
Either it's an exaggeration, or I think to well of the muslims. And I already think they're lower than dog shit.
But the world is fucked up. Today they arrested in Thailand the supposed killer of Jon Bene Ramsey. A month after her mother Patsy died.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 16, 2006 03:58 PM (idxSv)
17
Haywood wants to extend a warm welcome to all our new lefTard friends who've gotten piped in. Enjoy some truth while you're here.
Even hardened theologeans and bible scholars know that anyone who believes the good book is anything but parables and guidelines is displaying their lack of common sense. Like IsraHell.
Haywood wishes common sense were common.
Even hardened theologeans and bible scholars know that anyone who believes the good book is anything but parables and guidelines is displaying their lack of common sense. Like IsraHell.
Haywood wishes common sense were common.
Posted by: haywood jablowmi at August 16, 2006 04:12 PM (VUmVc)
18
It is also written that the leaders of the times did the best they could at making their laws and governing themselves....
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 16, 2006 05:20 PM (gLMre)
19
The look in her eyes seems to inquire: " Why are you wearing that suicide belt? "
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 16, 2006 05:24 PM (gLMre)
20
Dad, when I grow up I want to be just like Mohahmmed. I want to boink young girls , enslave women, and start a religion that spreads by merciless conquest.
That's my boy!
That's my boy!
Posted by: eman at August 16, 2006 05:42 PM (SD4ZE)
21
Hey "Support Israhell",
It's not just what your so-called prophet did 1400 years ago; it is what you Mo-slime barbarians do today!
For instance according to the regulations of the Islamic Republic mullhacracy ruling Iran, a 9 year old girl can be married off. In other words, Islam has no problem with a, say, 50 year old man "marrying" a 9 year old child! Yes, your filthy pseudo-religion sanctions pedophilia.
Ayatollah Khomeini himself told his devout followers that having sex with a girl who's never had a period is a "blessing" from Allah and that fathers should marry off their daughters before they've seen their first "blood". These obscenities are inseparable from Islam.
I'll put it in terms that even you can understand: Take your filthy barbaric pedophilic pseudo-religion and shove it up your arse where it rightly belongs.
It's not just what your so-called prophet did 1400 years ago; it is what you Mo-slime barbarians do today!
For instance according to the regulations of the Islamic Republic mullhacracy ruling Iran, a 9 year old girl can be married off. In other words, Islam has no problem with a, say, 50 year old man "marrying" a 9 year old child! Yes, your filthy pseudo-religion sanctions pedophilia.
Ayatollah Khomeini himself told his devout followers that having sex with a girl who's never had a period is a "blessing" from Allah and that fathers should marry off their daughters before they've seen their first "blood". These obscenities are inseparable from Islam.
I'll put it in terms that even you can understand: Take your filthy barbaric pedophilic pseudo-religion and shove it up your arse where it rightly belongs.
Posted by: Garduneh Mehr at August 16, 2006 07:24 PM (Bp6wV)
22
Her eyes look unnaturally big is all. That's all I'm saying.
Please check this site out. They already gave all they had. Give them a few minutes.
http://www.pcsuccess.us/yrg/farewell.html
Please check this site out. They already gave all they had. Give them a few minutes.
http://www.pcsuccess.us/yrg/farewell.html
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 08:01 PM (n4VvM)
23
Five-year-olds do have unnaturally big eyes. And unnaturally big heads too.
...
Ahhh! The eyes, they follow me around the room!!
...
Ahhh! The eyes, they follow me around the room!!
Posted by: Pixy at August 16, 2006 08:56 PM (FRalS)
24
Looking at this childs face, can you picture yourself telling her to hate anyone? "You must hate this man because he is a Jew. He stole from you what is rightfully yours." "What is that Daddy? What did he steal?" "I'm not really sure. But that is what Allah says to do. So hate him or you will get the belt."
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 09:25 PM (n4VvM)
25
BTW Rusty, when the comment thingy pops up, biyatch is all that you can read under the child's picture.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 09:27 PM (n4VvM)
26
I can't find it now but the whole *diaper your goat thing* so's not to tempt the likes of pedopukes like Israhell or face the Islamic wrath of another sick fuck, trying its best to get extinct. If you hold a seashell to your ear and listen close, you can almost hear an Islamoass get its neck snapped.
Posted by: forest hunter at August 17, 2006 12:03 AM (TjUVb)
27
Oh! The double-standard. Racist comments get deleted while naked shoulder child porn flys unabashed! I'm shocked Maxie! I tells you I'm shocked! :-o
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 12:42 AM (gLMre)
Posted by: greyrooster at August 17, 2006 09:18 AM (W1CgA)
29
Would that be done in Texas? Ooooh! Feel the racism! Delete Police! ( Sorry Rusty, I have trouble controlling myself. I'm trying to go the day without my horse tranquilizers. Keep up the good work! ) :-)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 17, 2006 04:53 PM (gLMre)
30
Larry, you picked the wrong week to quit horse tranquilizers.
By the way - do you like gladiator movies, Larry?
By the way - do you like gladiator movies, Larry?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 18, 2006 06:04 PM (v3I+x)
31
Yeah! I think I'll wait until next week! I watched Gladiator 2 times and still havn't made it through the whole thing!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 22, 2006 04:37 PM (gLMre)
Kossack : Stop Worrying About Terrorism
DarkSyde, who blogs at DailyKos, is tired of the country "whining" about terrorism:
when did the Republican Party become infested with what sound like so many loud, whining cowardly pundits? One second Reagan is up there standing toe-to-toe with the Rooskis, negotiating cool as a cucumber with 20,000 nukes pointed at him, and the next thing I know, the likes of Limbaugh or the crew at Powerwhine and Freeperland, are all shrieking like a class full of tweaked-out, neurotic fifth-graders having a panic attack every time OBL pops up in a grainy video with a rusty AK in the background. ...Of course, if DailyKos didn't have the most Stalinist comment control system known to mankind, you could go over and post your own thoughts for this fellow. Unfortunately, you can't, because the brave Kossacks, who are clearly too tough and fearless to give Osama a second thought, are nonetheless mortified at the thought that a Freeper might sneak in, post a dissenting opinion and wound their inner children....reading or hearing a bunch of yelping GOP crybabies incessantly screeching in craven horror that Al Qaeda is the worst, gosh-darn biggest bad-ass threat we've ever faced is, frankly, an act that has grown tired and embarrassing. And when they yammer, time and time again, that it's not enough for them to be quivering under their beds, they insist the entire country crawl under there and obsess along with them, while they lay in fetal position swaddled in their faded George Bush security blanket squawking in fear, it's enough to make Burt the Turtle duck and cover in disgust. (emphasis added)
The ironic thing here is that DarkSyde is one of DailyKos' resident "sky is falling" Chicken Littles on--you guessed it--CLIMATE CHANGE. DarkSyde is fond of posting dire announcements of "startling new data indicating that climate change and global melt may be even worse than we thought" and similar alarmism:
There are many dangers associated with global warming. What's critical to understand is they often work together in ways that are genuinely alarming to contemplate. A near term, moderate rise in sea level of even a few feet, combined with a virtually instant increase in the intensity of hurricanes, both products of global warming, means that the deadly and destructive storm surges that accompany hurricanes would be greater and reach further inland. Gulf states, from Florida to Texas, would be especially vulnerable to this synergy. The Houston shipping channel, gulf energy platforms, the port of Miami; all could be knocked out of commission for months at time, or cease to exist. Imagine several million refugees fleeing a wrecked, inundated coastline at the same time a significant fraction of oil imports and other essential supplies are cut off, and you have some appreciation for the near term consequences of climate change. (emphasis added)In other words, DarkSyde has no problem with shrieking, having panic attacks and quivering under his bed--so long as he's hiding from greenhouse gasses.
Posted by: Ragnar at
01:51 AM
| Comments (24)
| Add Comment
Post contains 497 words, total size 3 kb.
1
I love seeing the hysterics over Global Warming, mainly because it seems that anything people do contribute to it. I wrote a little reaction to the latest "discovered" cause of global warming: bird hunting. Yeah, not only is it wrong to hurt poor defenseless birds, we're giving Mother Earth the bitch-slap of death! Hoo-boy, these guys crack me up.
Posted by: joeschmo1of3 at August 16, 2006 02:40 AM (Lj9nP)
2
It plain by the number of hurricanes this season that climate chage caused by global warming will be the end of us all. BTW, GR may just be happy for a foot or two rise in sea level.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 06:54 AM (7teJ9)
3
I am new to this blog, and it is good to see people not comfortable with "official" truth. There is a good book about climate change and some other things, by a former Danish Reenpeace activist called Bjorn Lomberg. It is quite interesting the results of the statistics study achieved...
One more thing for all the climateclaimers:It is possible that a climate warm up is not only happening, but even be unstoppable, for it could a part of the long term Earth cycles. As such when vikings discovered Groenland and gave that land the name Green Land...
One more thing for all the climateclaimers:It is possible that a climate warm up is not only happening, but even be unstoppable, for it could a part of the long term Earth cycles. As such when vikings discovered Groenland and gave that land the name Green Land...
Posted by: Pablo at August 16, 2006 08:02 AM (VPvXe)
4
I am for any rise in sea level which would wipe out the evil cess-pool of N.O. ! It is a bad place. Mardi Gras is a bitch-slap to the face of God! The evil-doers think they can hide behind a mask and fool God! :-(
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 16, 2006 08:02 AM (gLMre)
5
I don't believe that DarkSyde would think that [to paraphrase]: reading or hearing a bunch of yelping liberal crybabies incessantly screeching in craven horror that George W. Bush is the worst, gosh-darn biggest bad-ass threat we've ever faced is, frankly, an act that has grown tired and embarrassing.
Posted by: Graeme at August 16, 2006 08:07 AM (z0LeB)
6
This is off topic, but I have not seen many tributes to the Marines lately. I received this link from a co-worker. If you decide to visit the site, be patient, it takes a moment to load, and be sure you have the volume up to hear the music.
http://www.pcsuccess.us/yrg/farewell.html
I am still getting goosebumps.
http://www.pcsuccess.us/yrg/farewell.html
I am still getting goosebumps.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 08:14 AM (7teJ9)
7
D@mn KosKooks. This one (DarkSyde) is an particularly simple idiot.
I call them Kogs. Kos + Borgs = Kogs. Because that's all they are, mindless automatons of the head KosKook.
~V5
I call them Kogs. Kos + Borgs = Kogs. Because that's all they are, mindless automatons of the head KosKook.
~V5
Posted by: VictorFive at August 16, 2006 08:50 AM (Pp32v)
8
They are for the most part the produce of our public school system.Crap like this has been drilled into their heads since kindergarten.
Global warming is a huge threat to us all, Bush is Hitler, Islamofacism is the brain child of the wicked conservatives to distract us from the real goal of taking away our rights.
Hey, they have to write and eventually believe all this shit. How else do they get an A on the report card.
Long live Private schools!
Global warming is a huge threat to us all, Bush is Hitler, Islamofacism is the brain child of the wicked conservatives to distract us from the real goal of taking away our rights.
Hey, they have to write and eventually believe all this shit. How else do they get an A on the report card.
Long live Private schools!
Posted by: Brad at August 16, 2006 08:53 AM (6mUkl)
9
I'm sorry, which part of "go find these bastards and whack them before they get another free shot at us" was it that makes me a "screeching coward"?
Twit.
Twit.
Posted by: mojo at August 16, 2006 09:14 AM (0qPz6)
10
In April, The Pirate Armada successfully boarded DailyKos and put up this blog entry.
Of course, the Kossack moderators immediately began disappearing Pirate posts, which we expected; that's why we got screen captures of some telling entries.
The scandalized KosKidz were a wonderful. I haven't seen so much clucking and scurrying since Granny went after the rooster with a chain saw.
Of course, the Kossack moderators immediately began disappearing Pirate posts, which we expected; that's why we got screen captures of some telling entries.
The scandalized KosKidz were a wonderful. I haven't seen so much clucking and scurrying since Granny went after the rooster with a chain saw.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 16, 2006 09:29 AM (vBK4C)
11
So, for those Kos-types who are old enough, do you think they backed Reagan when he was standing toe-to-toe with the Russkis?
Or were they then screeching about how the USSR wasn't a threat, it was Reagan who was war-mongering, Pershing IIs would result in World War III, etc.?
Typical. The current threat is never really a threat. Only the last one and the next one.
Or were they then screeching about how the USSR wasn't a threat, it was Reagan who was war-mongering, Pershing IIs would result in World War III, etc.?
Typical. The current threat is never really a threat. Only the last one and the next one.
Posted by: Lurking Observer at August 16, 2006 09:29 AM (/ZD7V)
12
People like this guy LOVE to use straw men arguments any time they get a chance and today he used the "Al Qaeda is the worst [...] threat we've ever faced" canard. Clearly Al Qaeda is merely one piece of a much larger threat best described as Islamic Fascism or Radical Islam.
The lefties love to mention one small piece of the problem in order to minimalize the threat and make all of our efforts seem very heavyhanded when, in fact, we aren't doing ENOUGH.
Oh, to Lurking Observer: Reminds me of this.
The lefties love to mention one small piece of the problem in order to minimalize the threat and make all of our efforts seem very heavyhanded when, in fact, we aren't doing ENOUGH.
Oh, to Lurking Observer: Reminds me of this.
Posted by: Christopher Ross at August 16, 2006 10:19 AM (etcdC)
13
Who's scared? I'm not scared of Osama, Global Warming, Bird Flu, Terrorists, or anything else on this Earth, and especially not a pussy from the Kos site. They are nothing but a bunch of blowhards who do nothing but talk...talk...talk.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 16, 2006 10:22 AM (rUyw4)
14
al-Qeada is only one head of the multi headed beast of revelations. Iraq and Afghanistan represent the the two mortally wounded heads.
I am open for who the whore of Babylon is. My guess it is oil. Maybe oil is the beast and al-Sadr is the whore.
Just random passing thoughts. BTW please have a look at the linky to the Marines memorial slide show. I liked it so much I didn't link to my lame website first. I linked directly to the site where it can be viewed. But you can see a link at my site if you dare.
I am open for who the whore of Babylon is. My guess it is oil. Maybe oil is the beast and al-Sadr is the whore.
Just random passing thoughts. BTW please have a look at the linky to the Marines memorial slide show. I liked it so much I didn't link to my lame website first. I linked directly to the site where it can be viewed. But you can see a link at my site if you dare.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 10:46 AM (7teJ9)
15
mojo: What are you talking about. We have a rule on this blog. If you smoke it. Share it.
Posted by: greyrooster at August 16, 2006 12:03 PM (vCjBd)
16
You have to admit that since 9/11/01, Americans have acted like they are scared shitless of terrorists. How else to explain why we are willing to let snoops tap our phones and read our mail?
Yes we got suckerpunched. But if we live in fear ("terror") of another attack from now on, then the terrorists have won. Let's protect ourselves, but come on! Show a little courage!
No more wimps. No more fear. No more voting for politicians who try to manipulate us with fear.
Yes we got suckerpunched. But if we live in fear ("terror") of another attack from now on, then the terrorists have won. Let's protect ourselves, but come on! Show a little courage!
No more wimps. No more fear. No more voting for politicians who try to manipulate us with fear.
Posted by: larryk at August 16, 2006 12:59 PM (IFx9J)
17
I tried to sign up to comment there, and was banned before I even made a post. seems they checked my site and found it not in line with their ideology.
Posted by: SeeMonk at August 16, 2006 01:04 PM (7teJ9)
18
larryK: politicians manipulating us with fear, are you talking about the Dems who lied about the nature of NSA international call surveillance, or the ones screaming that the world is ending because we still use piston engines?
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 16, 2006 04:34 PM (vBK4C)
19
...Manipulating us with fear? It seems to me that G.W. and his compadres are repeatedly put into an impossible logical position. If they fail to act on threats and do their utmost to prevent another attack, they will be condemned.
However -any- reasonably effective security or investigative measures will immediatly be hailed as a threat to civil liberties, and condemned--as if there really were no real threat of young Middle Easterners blowing themselves up in the name of Allah.
Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
I personally think there'd be a lot less of this raw hatred spewing from the left if GW had carried Florida by a much larger margin the first time he was elected(To the degree that recounts would have been irrelevant).
However -any- reasonably effective security or investigative measures will immediatly be hailed as a threat to civil liberties, and condemned--as if there really were no real threat of young Middle Easterners blowing themselves up in the name of Allah.
Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
I personally think there'd be a lot less of this raw hatred spewing from the left if GW had carried Florida by a much larger margin the first time he was elected(To the degree that recounts would have been irrelevant).
Posted by: Psicattus at August 16, 2006 05:36 PM (uAWuO)
20
My hatred of GW spews mainly because he took legal action to nullify votes by resisting a recount. Hell, that could have been my vote! Had I lived in Florida. I get riled when someone tries to take away my vote. To arrogantly suppress truth is the muslim way. That is why the moderate muslims don't do anything to stop terrorism. Lies, deceit and denial is there way of life. .....
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 16, 2006 06:08 PM (gLMre)
21
Psicattus- its the same thing when they "question the timing" of whatever. The timing is either in favor of bush because he's trying to counter bad poll numbers or he's trying to boost himself or someone else in an upcoming election. Or he's trying to deflect "bad news" about something or another, like in an election that was just held or some other such news. There's _never_ any time that they would never "question the timing" because at any time between now and January 2009, any of these events apply to the Bush administration.
Posted by: h0mi at August 16, 2006 07:42 PM (zpJBl)
22
Um, I'm pretty sure that GW didn't "take legal action to nullify votes". There was some "legal action" by the State Department in terms of closing the books after the 2nd or 3rd recount or whatever it was and telling the Democrats to essentially take a hike and accept that they lost. Whatever votes that nullified would not have been anywhere near enough to tip the balance.
It's amazing how many people are still in denial about the 2000 elections. Enough already - he won the popular vote in 2004 in addition to the electoral college. Whatever complaints people had about the 2000 elections should have been laid to rest in '04 when Democrats had the chance to do something about it - America was listening to them intently but but all it heard was "BushHitler Chimpy McHaliburton lied about Iraq!". It's not the Republicans' fault that the Democrats consistently use transparent schoolyard tactics and choose unelectable, batshit-crazy candidates like Al Gore, John Kerry and Howard Dean to represent them.
Or were you just being sarcastic?
It's amazing how many people are still in denial about the 2000 elections. Enough already - he won the popular vote in 2004 in addition to the electoral college. Whatever complaints people had about the 2000 elections should have been laid to rest in '04 when Democrats had the chance to do something about it - America was listening to them intently but but all it heard was "BushHitler Chimpy McHaliburton lied about Iraq!". It's not the Republicans' fault that the Democrats consistently use transparent schoolyard tactics and choose unelectable, batshit-crazy candidates like Al Gore, John Kerry and Howard Dean to represent them.
Or were you just being sarcastic?
Posted by: Aaron G at August 16, 2006 08:40 PM (1xiB4)
23
larryk -
Do you believe there's such a thing as rational concern, or does every concern necessarily equate to cowardly fear?
If I decide against jumping out of an airplane without a parachute, does that make me a spineless coward? What if I decide against jumping in front of a moving bus? What if I decide against buying that "amazing" stock I just read about in that spam email I just received, or contacting that bank manager in Nigeria with the $10,000,000 secret account in the name of my long-lost uncle Mbuto Nkembe, esq.? If I steer clear of these "opportunities", am I being a "wimp", or simply exercising good judgment? Isn't it possible to make a rational cost-benefit decision in favor of one's own personal well-being without being a "wimp" or being "scared shitless"?
BTW, are government "snoops" really tapping your phones and reading your mail? Are they reading your brainwaves, too? How do you know this?
Do you believe there's such a thing as rational concern, or does every concern necessarily equate to cowardly fear?
If I decide against jumping out of an airplane without a parachute, does that make me a spineless coward? What if I decide against jumping in front of a moving bus? What if I decide against buying that "amazing" stock I just read about in that spam email I just received, or contacting that bank manager in Nigeria with the $10,000,000 secret account in the name of my long-lost uncle Mbuto Nkembe, esq.? If I steer clear of these "opportunities", am I being a "wimp", or simply exercising good judgment? Isn't it possible to make a rational cost-benefit decision in favor of one's own personal well-being without being a "wimp" or being "scared shitless"?
BTW, are government "snoops" really tapping your phones and reading your mail? Are they reading your brainwaves, too? How do you know this?
Posted by: The All-Seeing Eye at August 16, 2006 10:31 PM (JBdud)
24
I think all the opening of our borders has served the government well. After the riots of the 60's it seems the people would be easier to manage if they are less homogeneous. More difficult to unify and start trouble. And easier to hoodwink by gesturing and chuckling and nodding the head. Is that why big gov has turned a blind eye towards border security? However the '04 vote turned out, it is pretty well evident that many wish they had voted differently with approval ratings so low. Far as managing, directing and follow-thru on the war, I think " We can do better ". " Fore! ... Rummy, when is another one of these 5-week war-time vacations coming up?, I hope soon 'cause I need more work with my 9 iron! " L o ....... O
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at August 16, 2006 11:51 PM (gLMre)
August 10, 2006
Overheard On The Radio
A caller to a highly influential right-wing radio talk show, which was indirectly responsible for the massive upsurge in this blog's traffic, opined on the discovery of today's terror plot by saying...
...wait for it...
......hold on....
....just another pixel or two, you're not gonna die.... more...
Posted by: Vinnie at
06:51 PM
| Comments (12)
| Add Comment
Post contains 173 words, total size 1 kb.
1
http://www.dailykos.com/poll/1155227975_jgeNnclZ
I've added category titles and added totals to the Kos poll:
__Sane__(179 votes = 6%)__
It's a legitimate interdiction against terrorists, and I am thankful for it. 179 votes - 6 %
__Cynical__(1374 votes = 49.7%)__
It's a legitimate interdiction against terrorists, but one that Bush and Blair will use to help boost their sagging popularity. 510 votes - 18 %
The plot may have been real, but the timing of the arrests and the hoopla are mighty suspicious. 864 votes - 31 %
__Crazy__(350 votes = 12.7%)__
This is a concocted effort to divert attention from Lebanon and Iraq. 64 votes - 2 %
This is a concocted effort to divert attention away from Lamont's victory. 30 votes - 1 %
This is a hoax, pure and simple. 23 votes - 0 %
This is a hoax, and it's just one of several that will take place between now and November. 233 votes - 8 %
__Slow__(859 votes = 31.1%__
I am withholding judgment until I have a couple more pieces of information. 131 votes - 4 %
I am withholding judgment until I have a lot more information. 588 votes - 21 %
I don't have a clue 123 votes - 4 %
Other. 17 votes - 0 %
I've added category titles and added totals to the Kos poll:
__Sane__(179 votes = 6%)__
It's a legitimate interdiction against terrorists, and I am thankful for it. 179 votes - 6 %
__Cynical__(1374 votes = 49.7%)__
It's a legitimate interdiction against terrorists, but one that Bush and Blair will use to help boost their sagging popularity. 510 votes - 18 %
The plot may have been real, but the timing of the arrests and the hoopla are mighty suspicious. 864 votes - 31 %
__Crazy__(350 votes = 12.7%)__
This is a concocted effort to divert attention from Lebanon and Iraq. 64 votes - 2 %
This is a concocted effort to divert attention away from Lamont's victory. 30 votes - 1 %
This is a hoax, pure and simple. 23 votes - 0 %
This is a hoax, and it's just one of several that will take place between now and November. 233 votes - 8 %
__Slow__(859 votes = 31.1%__
I am withholding judgment until I have a couple more pieces of information. 131 votes - 4 %
I am withholding judgment until I have a lot more information. 588 votes - 21 %
I don't have a clue 123 votes - 4 %
Other. 17 votes - 0 %
Posted by: wooga at August 10, 2006 07:11 PM (tAB8A)
2
I was listening at that moment also....
I can picture the screener deciding who gets through.
Caller 1: rational guy
Caller 2: military mom
Caller 3: nutbag conspiracy "I question the timing" goof
The guest host did remind him that it was the Brits who aprehended the terror plotters.
It didn't seem to dent the guys theory though.
I can picture the screener deciding who gets through.
Caller 1: rational guy
Caller 2: military mom
Caller 3: nutbag conspiracy "I question the timing" goof
The guest host did remind him that it was the Brits who aprehended the terror plotters.
It didn't seem to dent the guys theory though.
Posted by: mrclark at August 10, 2006 07:11 PM (172dE)
3
It's funny that if this had happened BEFORE the primaries, the Dems would be howling that it was a hoax designed to make Lamont lose to Leiberman.
But when it happens AFTER the primaries, it's a hoax designed to steal Lamont's thunder.
But when it happens AFTER the primaries, it's a hoax designed to steal Lamont's thunder.
Posted by: wooga at August 10, 2006 07:16 PM (tAB8A)
4
Well you have to admit it is sorta funny, big anti-war dude Lamount wins the primary, then gets stepped on big time by the terrorist plotting. From what I heard, the terrorists were planning to begin execution in 2 days.
Just look at it this way, if they had busted them Monday Lieberamn would have won. Lose lose, it's the Kos way.
Just look at it this way, if they had busted them Monday Lieberamn would have won. Lose lose, it's the Kos way.
Posted by: bill at August 10, 2006 07:22 PM (7evkT)
5
spooky... at 6:55 I posted:
"My question is: Is anyone out there contending that these 24 terrorists only wanted to blow-up planes to take attention away from all those stage-managed and fake photographs?"
"My question is: Is anyone out there contending that these 24 terrorists only wanted to blow-up planes to take attention away from all those stage-managed and fake photographs?"
Posted by: lumberjack at August 10, 2006 08:46 PM (wMUe9)
6
Hey, I question the timing, too. Just when the blogosphere is mercilessly pummeling the media over faked and staged reports from Lebanon...BOOM...they concoct a wild fantasy about alleged terrorists plotting to bomb planes.
Mark my words, Dan Rather and his cronies are behind this.
Mark my words, Dan Rather and his cronies are behind this.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 10, 2006 09:28 PM (vBK4C)
7
Who's more dangerous the enemy within or the enemy without? Jump ball!!
Posted by: Ken at August 10, 2006 10:35 PM (k4F45)
8
What a bunch of dumbasses. If you're going to fake a terror alert because of Lieberman, YOU DO IT BEFORE THE ELECTION, NOT AFTER, YOU STUPID DUMBASSES.
Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at August 10, 2006 11:35 PM (OmT61)
Posted by: Oyster at August 11, 2006 06:38 AM (YudAC)
10
That bit of logic you threw at the moonbats went right over their heads. I keep wondering how much more stupid these people can get, and dammit, they keep raising the bar. Their stupidity might just be, what's the mathematical term, infinite.
Posted by: jesusland joe at August 11, 2006 10:19 AM (rUyw4)
11
I keep wondering how much more stupid these people can get, and dammit, they keep raising the bar. Their stupidity might just be, what's the mathematical term, infinite.
JJ, I think Einstein had an opinion on that matter.
JJ, I think Einstein had an opinion on that matter.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 11, 2006 10:51 AM (v3I+x)
12
We all know that this is a performance art prank by Bush and Blair to mess with all the folks in Europe who are headed to Burning Man. No liquids! HAHAHAHAHA!
Posted by: crosspatch at August 12, 2006 04:33 AM (b53q9)
August 07, 2006
Hush Little Baby Don't Say A Word
I hit the meatiest of the other side's meatsacks, Kos and Atrios, and neither of them has made a peep about Reutergate.
I should be shocked and appalled, but I'm not.
Posted by: Vinnie at
06:36 PM
| Comments (43)
| Add Comment
Post contains 38 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Not a peep from Brian Wilson, either. The wagons are circled.
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 07, 2006 06:42 PM (vBK4C)
2
There's only one Kos diary that even mentions Hajj.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/8/7/124252/7131
And it has a grand total of five comments, one of them mine.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/8/7/124252/7131
And it has a grand total of five comments, one of them mine.
Posted by: wooga at August 07, 2006 06:44 PM (tAB8A)
3
I think some of these people fall into one of two camps:
Some pretend bad things don't exist they'll just go away (or even better, just not exist in the first place).
The others, failing that, believe nothing on this earth is really true or good. This makes the untruths and evil things less false/evil in relation to things that are true/good. These people also do not believe that absolutes can exist. (Which is nonsense, for example can you be "slightly dead"? A is A. It is not B.)
Perhaps some fall into both camps. I see those falling into either camp to be moral cowards who simply cannot face the fact that untruth/evil exist in this world. Perhaps this is simply the way they choose to deal with the fear we all experience knowing that evil does exist? I am not certain, for I have never believed lying to oneself about the realities of a situation will fix anything.
This is something I've observed in my few years on this earth. Perhaps this is the "moral relativity" that many speak of?
Some pretend bad things don't exist they'll just go away (or even better, just not exist in the first place).
The others, failing that, believe nothing on this earth is really true or good. This makes the untruths and evil things less false/evil in relation to things that are true/good. These people also do not believe that absolutes can exist. (Which is nonsense, for example can you be "slightly dead"? A is A. It is not B.)
Perhaps some fall into both camps. I see those falling into either camp to be moral cowards who simply cannot face the fact that untruth/evil exist in this world. Perhaps this is simply the way they choose to deal with the fear we all experience knowing that evil does exist? I am not certain, for I have never believed lying to oneself about the realities of a situation will fix anything.
This is something I've observed in my few years on this earth. Perhaps this is the "moral relativity" that many speak of?
Posted by: CanForce 101 at August 07, 2006 06:58 PM (xfvyZ)
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 07:09 PM (+nlyI)
5
Come on, are you really suprised? Not me, KOS is evil.
Jawa report is its counter.
What is the difference between a leader and a ruler?
I was just wondering ‘cause I often see the dictator of Saudi Arabia called a leader but hardly ever a ruler. Ya see I always taught a leader is someone who is chosen by the group to be in charge of the body politic. A ruler is not chosen but imposed from above. Hmm, I guess the people of Saudi Arabia, China, Cuba all chose their political heads. I should go back to college and speak to them about my Political Science professors. It seems that I was misinformed about certain definitions. Gee it must be me since it appears that the media use the terms interchangeably. Next time I meet a Saudi king I’ll have to remember to ask him what percentage of the vote he got in the kingdoms most recent election.
And what’s up with the use of militant vs. terrorist? I was led to believe that a militant is someone who takes up arms in a struggle against another armed group. …
Read the rest at:
http://amassachusettsrepublican.blogspot.com
Jawa report is its counter.
What is the difference between a leader and a ruler?
I was just wondering ‘cause I often see the dictator of Saudi Arabia called a leader but hardly ever a ruler. Ya see I always taught a leader is someone who is chosen by the group to be in charge of the body politic. A ruler is not chosen but imposed from above. Hmm, I guess the people of Saudi Arabia, China, Cuba all chose their political heads. I should go back to college and speak to them about my Political Science professors. It seems that I was misinformed about certain definitions. Gee it must be me since it appears that the media use the terms interchangeably. Next time I meet a Saudi king I’ll have to remember to ask him what percentage of the vote he got in the kingdoms most recent election.
And what’s up with the use of militant vs. terrorist? I was led to believe that a militant is someone who takes up arms in a struggle against another armed group. …
Read the rest at:
http://amassachusettsrepublican.blogspot.com
Posted by: massachusetts republican at August 07, 2006 07:17 PM (TiKv7)
6
Republicans in Massachusetts are log cabin boys if there were ever any.
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 07:33 PM (+nlyI)
7
Hey, you got rid of the punchline on my first post?
It's not the same without the link to the picture!
Maybe you can substitute this picture...
http://www.vinceautmorire.mu.nu/wp-content/images/Picture%20289.jpg
It's not the same without the link to the picture!
Maybe you can substitute this picture...
http://www.vinceautmorire.mu.nu/wp-content/images/Picture%20289.jpg
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 07:48 PM (+nlyI)
8
Give those useless tools some time. They're thinking about how they're gonna spin it.
Posted by: dick at August 07, 2006 09:14 PM (UT7XD)
9
>> Some pretend bad things don't exist they'll just go away (or even better, just not exist in the first place).
Exactly what Charles Johnson has done with the Floyd Landis scandal. You'd think that such a cycling enthusiast who fawned all over Landis during the TDF would have something to say about his being caught doping, but nope -- not a peep. Hush little baby, indeed.
Exactly what Charles Johnson has done with the Floyd Landis scandal. You'd think that such a cycling enthusiast who fawned all over Landis during the TDF would have something to say about his being caught doping, but nope -- not a peep. Hush little baby, indeed.
Posted by: bigjoe at August 08, 2006 12:34 AM (HGPzF)
10
A year ago, I would be right with the right-wing blogosphere in condemning Kos for putting his hands over his eyes and ears and mouth regarding the WOT, and I am not surprised to learn now that he is against Israel defending itself even though Bush needs to praised for getting Israel to do what the USA would have had to do otherwise.
But then Senator Brownback (R) helped push through a law that makes it illegal for Americans to meet foreigners online for dating. The IMBRA law says that you now have to send a criminal background form to a foreigner on a dating site with more than 50% foreigners, but on most such websites the foreigner doesn't have email herself (or himself) and cannot approve a background form. Thus the law bans Americans from meeting approximately 100,000 foreigners who are now online.
Here is the kicker: The entire right-wing blogosphere REFUSES to even discuss the new law or the restraining order a Democrat judge threw against the day before it was supposed to come into effect. A left wing law firm in DC, Arnold & Porter, is doing everything it can to get this law upheld by the Supreme Court. No right wing pundit will touch the issue. I consider them more useless than Kos as a result.
All I hear is the Silence of the Lambs from the right wing. If any man mentions IMBRA at FreeRepublic, he will have his account deleted even if he is a Middle East and Nazi war expert like myself.
And why? Well, Security Moms have taken the reigns of power in the Republican Party and at FreeRepublic leaving single male heterosexual businessmen to be moralized to and told we have to date and marry American conservative women our own age in what would be a perfect new conservative American world.
But if I want to date a 22 year old Polish woman after meeting her online...then new laws need to be made to stop me.
So right wing bloggers think they are so cool pointing out the blind spot in the liberal mentality...while ignoring the fact that heterosexual males no longer hold the reigns of power in the Republican Party and they are supposedly just fine with that.
I call that "metrosexualism". Its like Republican males have allowed themselves to be neutered in order to have the support of Security Moms in this war. It is not worth it. I'd sooner lose to the Arabs and have them reinstitute polygamy.
At least Kos will allow discussion of IMBRA at his site, although its alarming to see the high number of gay men over there who have zero compassion or solidarity with heterosexual males who complain about laws that regulate simple dating practices like saying hello to a foreigner.
Do a Google search to see that there is a blazing battle going on in which the right wing blogosphere is shockingly silent.
But then Senator Brownback (R) helped push through a law that makes it illegal for Americans to meet foreigners online for dating. The IMBRA law says that you now have to send a criminal background form to a foreigner on a dating site with more than 50% foreigners, but on most such websites the foreigner doesn't have email herself (or himself) and cannot approve a background form. Thus the law bans Americans from meeting approximately 100,000 foreigners who are now online.
Here is the kicker: The entire right-wing blogosphere REFUSES to even discuss the new law or the restraining order a Democrat judge threw against the day before it was supposed to come into effect. A left wing law firm in DC, Arnold & Porter, is doing everything it can to get this law upheld by the Supreme Court. No right wing pundit will touch the issue. I consider them more useless than Kos as a result.
All I hear is the Silence of the Lambs from the right wing. If any man mentions IMBRA at FreeRepublic, he will have his account deleted even if he is a Middle East and Nazi war expert like myself.
And why? Well, Security Moms have taken the reigns of power in the Republican Party and at FreeRepublic leaving single male heterosexual businessmen to be moralized to and told we have to date and marry American conservative women our own age in what would be a perfect new conservative American world.
But if I want to date a 22 year old Polish woman after meeting her online...then new laws need to be made to stop me.
So right wing bloggers think they are so cool pointing out the blind spot in the liberal mentality...while ignoring the fact that heterosexual males no longer hold the reigns of power in the Republican Party and they are supposedly just fine with that.
I call that "metrosexualism". Its like Republican males have allowed themselves to be neutered in order to have the support of Security Moms in this war. It is not worth it. I'd sooner lose to the Arabs and have them reinstitute polygamy.
At least Kos will allow discussion of IMBRA at his site, although its alarming to see the high number of gay men over there who have zero compassion or solidarity with heterosexual males who complain about laws that regulate simple dating practices like saying hello to a foreigner.
Do a Google search to see that there is a blazing battle going on in which the right wing blogosphere is shockingly silent.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 03:39 AM (c1WDz)
11
Hear is a further defense of Kos:
How many guys here have seen "The Man Show"? I admit the show is crass. You probably won't admit to watching it in mixed company...especially right wing mixed company, correct? OK so far.
But you do stop surfing with the remote long enough to view those Bavarian women in mini-skirts don't you? Guess what? European women in mini-skirts really do exist outside of television.
Plus...and this is the kicker...they often love meeting American men. So what are you doing on your couch watching "The Man Show" when you can get on a plane? Its only 7 hours each way.
But hold it. Stop.
No thanx to the right wing blogosphere, there is a significant law that will prevent you from meeting any of these women online before you take the flight. They got the law passed because they labeled the foreign women with an epithet called "mail order bride."
You agree that the epithet supposedly describes someone whom you wouldn't want. After all, you've swallowed what radical feminist organizations have said was the "vulnerability" of foreign women when they come to a new country so far from their family and friends.
So just remain on your couch watching the foreign women in mini-skirts on "The Man Show". You can look but you can't touch. And you are happy, right?
They should rename that program "The Eunuch Show."
How many guys here have seen "The Man Show"? I admit the show is crass. You probably won't admit to watching it in mixed company...especially right wing mixed company, correct? OK so far.
But you do stop surfing with the remote long enough to view those Bavarian women in mini-skirts don't you? Guess what? European women in mini-skirts really do exist outside of television.
Plus...and this is the kicker...they often love meeting American men. So what are you doing on your couch watching "The Man Show" when you can get on a plane? Its only 7 hours each way.
But hold it. Stop.
No thanx to the right wing blogosphere, there is a significant law that will prevent you from meeting any of these women online before you take the flight. They got the law passed because they labeled the foreign women with an epithet called "mail order bride."
You agree that the epithet supposedly describes someone whom you wouldn't want. After all, you've swallowed what radical feminist organizations have said was the "vulnerability" of foreign women when they come to a new country so far from their family and friends.
So just remain on your couch watching the foreign women in mini-skirts on "The Man Show". You can look but you can't touch. And you are happy, right?
They should rename that program "The Eunuch Show."
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 04:24 AM (c1WDz)
12
Jeez. This one seems close to your heart...
But fear not! I checked the law in question, and it seems only to apply to marriage.
You can meet - and boff - them to your heart's content
But fear not! I checked the law in question, and it seems only to apply to marriage.
You can meet - and boff - them to your heart's content
Posted by: Mr Nobody at August 08, 2006 07:17 AM (BV7IP)
13
"meatsacks"
Quality in neologisms: THAT'S why I read this blog.
BTW: I too was dissapointed that Charles didn't mention the Tour doping debacle. Call me old fashioned, but I think crap like that reflects poorly on America - at a time we REALLY don't need that sort of nonsense - and I think that asshat ought to be dragged to the nearest bar ditch and ought to receive a good plow cleaning.
Quality in neologisms: THAT'S why I read this blog.
BTW: I too was dissapointed that Charles didn't mention the Tour doping debacle. Call me old fashioned, but I think crap like that reflects poorly on America - at a time we REALLY don't need that sort of nonsense - and I think that asshat ought to be dragged to the nearest bar ditch and ought to receive a good plow cleaning.
Posted by: Hucbald at August 08, 2006 07:54 AM (Q6gPh)
14
In one life you're Mr. anderson whining and complaining that you can't boink foreign women because you can't read law. In another life you're Neodious defending all that's glorious in "Kosworld", that alternative universe where right is wrong and wrong is right and "blazing battles" are fought over foreign women's rights to hook up with American men. How noble!
Now, you can take the red pill or the blue pill. But you chose the blue pill, so hey, you're stuck being a self-proclaimed Middle East and Nazi war "expert".
But we believe in you. Really ... we do. We will now march, zombie-like, into the fray to appease you're sensibilities in all things relating to "dating".
Now, you can take the red pill or the blue pill. But you chose the blue pill, so hey, you're stuck being a self-proclaimed Middle East and Nazi war "expert".
But we believe in you. Really ... we do. We will now march, zombie-like, into the fray to appease you're sensibilities in all things relating to "dating".
Posted by: Oyster at August 08, 2006 07:59 AM (YudAC)
15
Actually...no. Thanks to Republicans making a backroom deal with the Democrats in order to stop a filibuster for Alito, IMBRA was passed and says that you have to send a background form including a statement on past marriages and kids...and then the foreigner has to agree to contact...before you can say "hello". See the law at http://www.veteransabroad.com/legal.html.
Whether this is about sex or marriage, OF COURSE this issue would be close to the heart of any male who has a pair.
Do you think rescuing foreign women from their burkhas is more important? So we rescue them from the Arab male chauvinists...and then we have to send US government forms to get permission to say hello?
Of course you can lie on the form (for instance, I'd have no intention of wasting my time listing every state I've ever lived in) but the trick isn't getting you to tell the truth, but in making it impossible for anyone to meet on anything other than anonymous webmail. That takes 100,000 women off the Internet the moment the Supreme Court upholds this (which is unlikely).
About this being "close to the heart"...do you honestly think that fighting a war for your culture means allowing the culture to get changed by security moms back in the Congress while you are in the field fighting?
I guess losing the right to meet someone online before flying to Europe to meet them is a minor detail (not mainstream) when confronted with the need for every single blog posting to be about how the Democrats are "hiding their heads in the sand" regarding foreign policy?
Believe me, the Democrat jackasses are foolish regarding the need to liberate Iran and get this WOT over with. But note that, despite a restraining order from another judge, an Ohio Republican federal judge stated on May 26th "The Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners for relationships."
Does anyone here agree with that statement?
I served 4 years in the US Army for a "democracy" with judges like that?
I voted for Bush in 2004 for him to sign on to that? I don't think so.
Seriously, I like The Jawa Report's sarcastic tone regarding the bozo photoshopper...but the bozo US Congresspeople who are trying to make weird laws back home deserve at least one post in the month of August.
Let's have some variety in blogging topics. Let's attack the Iranian hardliners in 3 posts per day, but spare one post per day to keeping an eye on Congress.
Whether this is about sex or marriage, OF COURSE this issue would be close to the heart of any male who has a pair.
Do you think rescuing foreign women from their burkhas is more important? So we rescue them from the Arab male chauvinists...and then we have to send US government forms to get permission to say hello?
Of course you can lie on the form (for instance, I'd have no intention of wasting my time listing every state I've ever lived in) but the trick isn't getting you to tell the truth, but in making it impossible for anyone to meet on anything other than anonymous webmail. That takes 100,000 women off the Internet the moment the Supreme Court upholds this (which is unlikely).
About this being "close to the heart"...do you honestly think that fighting a war for your culture means allowing the culture to get changed by security moms back in the Congress while you are in the field fighting?
I guess losing the right to meet someone online before flying to Europe to meet them is a minor detail (not mainstream) when confronted with the need for every single blog posting to be about how the Democrats are "hiding their heads in the sand" regarding foreign policy?
Believe me, the Democrat jackasses are foolish regarding the need to liberate Iran and get this WOT over with. But note that, despite a restraining order from another judge, an Ohio Republican federal judge stated on May 26th "The Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners for relationships."
Does anyone here agree with that statement?
I served 4 years in the US Army for a "democracy" with judges like that?
I voted for Bush in 2004 for him to sign on to that? I don't think so.
Seriously, I like The Jawa Report's sarcastic tone regarding the bozo photoshopper...but the bozo US Congresspeople who are trying to make weird laws back home deserve at least one post in the month of August.
Let's have some variety in blogging topics. Let's attack the Iranian hardliners in 3 posts per day, but spare one post per day to keeping an eye on Congress.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 08:01 AM (c1WDz)
16
Oyster,
Actually, in Kosworld, the reaction on IMBRA depends on whether you say IMBRA is a Republican iniative or a radical feminist iniative. If you say that it comes from the far right desire to control other sex lives, they are indignant about the law and want to fight it. If you write a "diary" that says it is a feminist iniative, they will turn against the diarist and scream that the law "protects women."
Similarly, your surprising comment in defense of the law and the judge's comment "Americans have no liberty interest in meeting foreigners"...seems to come from your perception that I love the Koskidz intrinsically and that I am somehow not as much for fighting Islamofascists as you are.
Smart people, however, are on to the game that it might be OK to be completely behind Israel and the Bush Doctrine, but it doesn't mean kneeling to a whole slew of crazy attitudes such as the implication that it is wrong for anyone to enlighten others on recent bad legislation.
Do a Google search to see the battle is happening outside the regular blogosphere and not really in Kosworld or any of the leftist blogs which all support IMBRA. My concern is that the right-wing blogs are silent on the matter.
On top of that, I live overseas and have a girlfriend who can come to visit without the immigration hassles that the USA imposes on American men. If male bloggers, who are really heterosexual, are OK with all the new limitations on their freedom (whether sex or marriage), I guess that is fine with me. Nothing to see here folks. Keep your eyes on the War on Terror and just accept what comes to you in the Congress where others are busy reorganizing US culture.
Actually, in Kosworld, the reaction on IMBRA depends on whether you say IMBRA is a Republican iniative or a radical feminist iniative. If you say that it comes from the far right desire to control other sex lives, they are indignant about the law and want to fight it. If you write a "diary" that says it is a feminist iniative, they will turn against the diarist and scream that the law "protects women."
Similarly, your surprising comment in defense of the law and the judge's comment "Americans have no liberty interest in meeting foreigners"...seems to come from your perception that I love the Koskidz intrinsically and that I am somehow not as much for fighting Islamofascists as you are.
Smart people, however, are on to the game that it might be OK to be completely behind Israel and the Bush Doctrine, but it doesn't mean kneeling to a whole slew of crazy attitudes such as the implication that it is wrong for anyone to enlighten others on recent bad legislation.
Do a Google search to see the battle is happening outside the regular blogosphere and not really in Kosworld or any of the leftist blogs which all support IMBRA. My concern is that the right-wing blogs are silent on the matter.
On top of that, I live overseas and have a girlfriend who can come to visit without the immigration hassles that the USA imposes on American men. If male bloggers, who are really heterosexual, are OK with all the new limitations on their freedom (whether sex or marriage), I guess that is fine with me. Nothing to see here folks. Keep your eyes on the War on Terror and just accept what comes to you in the Congress where others are busy reorganizing US culture.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 08:15 AM (c1WDz)
17
Jack, here's my point, which I won't criticize you on not catching because I wasn't clear on it. To come to someone's blog and criticize what issues are discussed because they do not include what interests you strikes me as a bit disingenuous. My advice would be to start your own blog. And when people visit and criticize you for not focusing on what their interests are, you may understand. 90% of this blog is dedicated to issues that interest its contributors - Islamic fascism.
If a Kos "diarist", or anyone else, is interested in something else which coincides with your own interests, then fine. But to enter a site whose title embodies its very purpose and say, "Well why aren't you talking about this?" would be like one of us appearing on a blog about crocheting and ask why they don't talk about knitting. At least Vinnie's not at Kos criticizing their lack of discussion on the issue of photoshopping images to manipulate public opinion. He has used his own forum to criticize. Similarly, I could express disgust at your lack of interest in any manner of things which you haven't brought up.
You got your point across. Someone may find it interesting and do further research. Maybe not. But hijacking a thread and articulating criticism of those who haven't focused on what you deem important is not the best way to gain interest. Rather, you will evoke an immediate defense.
¿Comprende?
If a Kos "diarist", or anyone else, is interested in something else which coincides with your own interests, then fine. But to enter a site whose title embodies its very purpose and say, "Well why aren't you talking about this?" would be like one of us appearing on a blog about crocheting and ask why they don't talk about knitting. At least Vinnie's not at Kos criticizing their lack of discussion on the issue of photoshopping images to manipulate public opinion. He has used his own forum to criticize. Similarly, I could express disgust at your lack of interest in any manner of things which you haven't brought up.
You got your point across. Someone may find it interesting and do further research. Maybe not. But hijacking a thread and articulating criticism of those who haven't focused on what you deem important is not the best way to gain interest. Rather, you will evoke an immediate defense.
¿Comprende?
Posted by: Oyster at August 08, 2006 09:05 AM (iari8)
18
Hey Jack, want some cheese with that whine? Honestly, is it really more important that you get to solicit underage Filipino girls for marriage than for us to discuss terrorism related matters? You're an idiot; go away.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 08, 2006 09:37 AM (v3I+x)
19
Verstanden. I have my own blog. And, this week, I am almost as interested in Reutergate and the Lebanon War as I am in the expected court ruling this week on the other matter.
I only made one post directly related to the theme of "Hush Little Baby" and how the "Silence of the Lambs" effect is not just a left wing phenom, but deeply infects the right blogosphere on some uncomfortable topics that might split conservatives (smoking, immigration, sex). You seemed to want to discuss the matter by throwing insults and saying that I had not read the law. Logic would say that you were as much responsible for any socalled "hijacking".
The other guy's response was hard to decipher: he said "Don't worry this only affects the right to marriage"...which sounded like he was agreeing with me that a right-wing blogger might want to consider what's going on in his own backyard while the WOT is happening in Lebanon.
But you are correct that Vinnie's expertise might be more military and foreign policy and he would have no interest in anything the Congress tries to pull regarding the right to heterosexual marriage, dating or whatever (even though American servicemen overseas take a great interest in such matters).
He has a right to complete silence on these topics.
He is doing a great job on the topic of Lebanon I might add.
I only made one post directly related to the theme of "Hush Little Baby" and how the "Silence of the Lambs" effect is not just a left wing phenom, but deeply infects the right blogosphere on some uncomfortable topics that might split conservatives (smoking, immigration, sex). You seemed to want to discuss the matter by throwing insults and saying that I had not read the law. Logic would say that you were as much responsible for any socalled "hijacking".
The other guy's response was hard to decipher: he said "Don't worry this only affects the right to marriage"...which sounded like he was agreeing with me that a right-wing blogger might want to consider what's going on in his own backyard while the WOT is happening in Lebanon.
But you are correct that Vinnie's expertise might be more military and foreign policy and he would have no interest in anything the Congress tries to pull regarding the right to heterosexual marriage, dating or whatever (even though American servicemen overseas take a great interest in such matters).
He has a right to complete silence on these topics.
He is doing a great job on the topic of Lebanon I might add.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 09:42 AM (c1WDz)
20
Maximus,
Sure the topic of the Lebanon War is exciting to read about and critically important to our safety from nuclear weapons (IF WE HAVE THE BALLS TO ATTACK IRAN which needs to happen).
But what part of "The Supreme Court has never explictly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners" do you not understand?
Do you agree with that?
And do you think that, if the Supreme Court upholds that statement, we'd be living in the kind of country that I spent 4 years defending?
Did you serve your country overseas? Or, if you did serve, did you wash trucks at Fort Riley in Kansas?
Although I agree that this blog is apparently only about the war, do you really think that the Lebanon War is more important than anything the Congress might pass while you're not looking?
Do you honestly think that IMBRA is about marrying underage Filipinas? What about adult Germans and Swiss?
Conflating one issue into "its about underage Filipinas" is exactly like the Arabs conflating the need to fight Islamofascism into "its about the occupation of Palestine."
Sure the topic of the Lebanon War is exciting to read about and critically important to our safety from nuclear weapons (IF WE HAVE THE BALLS TO ATTACK IRAN which needs to happen).
But what part of "The Supreme Court has never explictly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners" do you not understand?
Do you agree with that?
And do you think that, if the Supreme Court upholds that statement, we'd be living in the kind of country that I spent 4 years defending?
Did you serve your country overseas? Or, if you did serve, did you wash trucks at Fort Riley in Kansas?
Although I agree that this blog is apparently only about the war, do you really think that the Lebanon War is more important than anything the Congress might pass while you're not looking?
Do you honestly think that IMBRA is about marrying underage Filipinas? What about adult Germans and Swiss?
Conflating one issue into "its about underage Filipinas" is exactly like the Arabs conflating the need to fight Islamofascism into "its about the occupation of Palestine."
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 09:54 AM (c1WDz)
21
This point is totally related to the blog:
We all agree that too many Arabs conflate the need to "stop using terrorism and supporting fascism" with "the need to stop Israel from occuping Palestine."
In other words, everything we say goes in one word and out the other.
Too many Arabs hear us speak and then go right back toward their racism and hate towards the Jews. They've a one track mind, they conflate down to a fixed idea, and it is just so hard to break them of this propaganda.
And yet, after making a clear and sound case for the endangered-at-home first amendment right to association including foreigners (Europeans in my case)...some presumably American "male" conflates the entire issue into that of "meeting foreigners is about soliciting underage Filipinas". They've a one track mind, they conflate down to a fixed idea, and it is just so hard to break them of this propaganda.
The mentality is exactly the same. I'd rather live in the Middle East among Israel-haters than among metrosexuals who think that the right to date a Swedish college student is the equivalent of soliciting an underage Filipina.
At least the Arabs can reason that what happened in 1947 was unfair while I tell them to get over it. There is no reasoning with an American male who conflates adult Swedish women with underage Filipinas.
That said, I'd rather not live in Arab cities while they are begging to be nuked by Israel. ;-)
We all agree that too many Arabs conflate the need to "stop using terrorism and supporting fascism" with "the need to stop Israel from occuping Palestine."
In other words, everything we say goes in one word and out the other.
Too many Arabs hear us speak and then go right back toward their racism and hate towards the Jews. They've a one track mind, they conflate down to a fixed idea, and it is just so hard to break them of this propaganda.
And yet, after making a clear and sound case for the endangered-at-home first amendment right to association including foreigners (Europeans in my case)...some presumably American "male" conflates the entire issue into that of "meeting foreigners is about soliciting underage Filipinas". They've a one track mind, they conflate down to a fixed idea, and it is just so hard to break them of this propaganda.
The mentality is exactly the same. I'd rather live in the Middle East among Israel-haters than among metrosexuals who think that the right to date a Swedish college student is the equivalent of soliciting an underage Filipina.
At least the Arabs can reason that what happened in 1947 was unfair while I tell them to get over it. There is no reasoning with an American male who conflates adult Swedish women with underage Filipinas.
That said, I'd rather not live in Arab cities while they are begging to be nuked by Israel. ;-)
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 10:28 AM (c1WDz)
22
In other words, Jack, not broaching a subject implies a tacit approval of it? I have a blog too. I blog about what I like, when I like. I haven't said a thing about pedophilia and ridiculous laws in some states being passed which allow more opportunity for them to offend again. Does this mean I approve of these laws? Or that it's simply not on my radar at the moment because I have prioritized things in a fashion that suits me?
I'm not done reading all the particulars or implications of this law you are concerned about, but so far what I see is more stringent protection and the closing of loopholes which provide for abuse of a "priviledge", not a "basic human right". And as the law clearly states, it isn't gender specific. So here in America, where you don't live and the fact that you've given no indication of your experience with our culture and the unique problems we face, what's to stop a woman from importing her terrorist lover under a pretense of just wanting to date or marry?
And to simply say you live overseas and have a girlfriend (from another country, I assume) who visits frequently without restrictions tells me nothing about how your situation even applies or is affected. So it remains moot from my viewpoint unless I know more. Are you in Germany and she's in France right next door? Or are you in Indonesia and she's in Tibet? Are you an American citizen who lives elsewhere? Or are you a citizen of the country you reside in and are merely concerned about our Congress?
Furthermore, the site you provide a link to merely speculates on what could happen in a system that is already replete with opportunity for abuse. While it may make it harder for foreign nationals to "hook-up", it also appears to protect those who may be affected by their bad choices. So it's harder to bring a foreign national into the country now under the pretext of love when more nefarious purposes may be under it all - that can't be ALL bad.
That's the terrific thing about America. If something's wrong we have the freedom and power to change it or ammend it.
And yes, I insulted you. And I won't promise not to do it again.
I'm not done reading all the particulars or implications of this law you are concerned about, but so far what I see is more stringent protection and the closing of loopholes which provide for abuse of a "priviledge", not a "basic human right". And as the law clearly states, it isn't gender specific. So here in America, where you don't live and the fact that you've given no indication of your experience with our culture and the unique problems we face, what's to stop a woman from importing her terrorist lover under a pretense of just wanting to date or marry?
And to simply say you live overseas and have a girlfriend (from another country, I assume) who visits frequently without restrictions tells me nothing about how your situation even applies or is affected. So it remains moot from my viewpoint unless I know more. Are you in Germany and she's in France right next door? Or are you in Indonesia and she's in Tibet? Are you an American citizen who lives elsewhere? Or are you a citizen of the country you reside in and are merely concerned about our Congress?
Furthermore, the site you provide a link to merely speculates on what could happen in a system that is already replete with opportunity for abuse. While it may make it harder for foreign nationals to "hook-up", it also appears to protect those who may be affected by their bad choices. So it's harder to bring a foreign national into the country now under the pretext of love when more nefarious purposes may be under it all - that can't be ALL bad.
That's the terrific thing about America. If something's wrong we have the freedom and power to change it or ammend it.
And yes, I insulted you. And I won't promise not to do it again.
Posted by: Oyster at August 08, 2006 10:53 AM (iari8)
23
Well said and refuted, Oyster. This seems like a thread hijacking, if ever there was one.
But you started this by saying: Jack, here's my point, which I won't criticize you on not catching because I wasn't clear on it. To come to someone's blog and criticize what issues are discussed because they do not include what interests you strikes me as a bit disingenuous.
Isn't this exactly what Kos and Atrios were being criticized for? For not covering the Reuters scandal? It seems to be HUGE news here at Jawa, as if it were the single most important news out of the ME right now. I agree it is shocking, and it should make us all more skeptical about photos and the media. But is it really more important than the rape/murder trial in Baghdad? I haven't seen a whiff on that horrible story, since Rusty assured us all it couldn't possibly be true when it first was reported. Turns out, they have a confession from one of the participants, that three of them raped at 15 year old, shot her, and one of them shot her family. Then they covered it up by pouring gasoline on the bodies and burning them, and then participated in the investigation, falsely.
Compared to some doctored photos by this yahoo--which one is worth blogging more about? A bunch of raping murdering pedophiles wearing the uniform of this great nation--or the Reuters scandal?
But you started this by saying: Jack, here's my point, which I won't criticize you on not catching because I wasn't clear on it. To come to someone's blog and criticize what issues are discussed because they do not include what interests you strikes me as a bit disingenuous.
Isn't this exactly what Kos and Atrios were being criticized for? For not covering the Reuters scandal? It seems to be HUGE news here at Jawa, as if it were the single most important news out of the ME right now. I agree it is shocking, and it should make us all more skeptical about photos and the media. But is it really more important than the rape/murder trial in Baghdad? I haven't seen a whiff on that horrible story, since Rusty assured us all it couldn't possibly be true when it first was reported. Turns out, they have a confession from one of the participants, that three of them raped at 15 year old, shot her, and one of them shot her family. Then they covered it up by pouring gasoline on the bodies and burning them, and then participated in the investigation, falsely.
Compared to some doctored photos by this yahoo--which one is worth blogging more about? A bunch of raping murdering pedophiles wearing the uniform of this great nation--or the Reuters scandal?
Posted by: jdkazoo at August 08, 2006 01:28 PM (EIH/4)
24
Thanx JDKazoo for the backhanded support in terms of the faked photographs NOT being the most important issue in the world today (Arabs lying and cheating isn't news).
But this thread was not hijacked because I only meant to post once but then had to defend the point.
Nothing in Netiquette says that a thread is hijacked if someone simply defends attacks made on a single post if those attacks are substantive and not procedural.
Sure...I want the Israelis to topple the Syrian government and a secretly trained Iranian Army to capture the Iranian oilfields.
I could talk about how, if I were Rumsfeld I would already have had an army of Iranian exiles prepared to take the oilfields and just let the Mullahs rot for a month before sane people finally finished them off.
But guess what? Its all conjecture and for a busy executive American in Germany who has a Lithuanian girlfriend who visits a lot, I just don't have the time to waste commenting too much on what I would do if I were in the White House. I was in the US Army years ago where I did know a lot but I don't have direct contact with "the world" anymore.
And no Oyster, my Lithuanian girlfriend could not visit me so often if I lived in the USA. Europe now has an oversupply of young single adult women whom the American security moms are blocking with more vigor than Mexican illegals...for obvious reasons having nothing to do with terror fears or "protecting vulnerable women from abuse."
Everybody knows why young single women are being blocked from entering the USA.
I read these war blogs voraciously. I am in and I am out. I read the comments quite often because soldiers often post here who DO know what's going on. I get zero news from Kos. But I do check out AngryArab.Blogspot.com.
At AngryArab, I often find myself commenting because the people there have this suicidal attitude that Israel will be defeated because the Israelis will all run away after the first terror nukes explode. You folks might want to invade their space a bit too. Blogs need some mixing. Its boring when everyone thinks the same.
I sometimes comment when I see people being unreasonable.
I commented here because the "Hush Little Baby Don't Say a Word" criticism of Kos hit a nerve in that every blogger puts up barriers to discussing topics that might rock their world view. Kos is ridiculous but FreeRepublic is far more active than Kos in terms of zotting people they don't agree with.
I lasted 9 months as a Freeper recently and posted tons of material on Iraq and Nazi Germany that often ran to 400 or more positive comments...but then I told a security mom who said that dating foreigners was a privilege that "you have no Goddamn right to take Americans rights away and arrogantly call them a privilege."
The zot came as a surprise because I had been considered a "mans man" who knew military history well. But there was a moderator seachange where security moms seemed to take over FR's agenda. I now know that FReeper "male chauvinists" in general are being zotted and, although the FR mission statement condemns feminism, a quick FR search reveals that no critique of feminism has appeared on FR in more than six months (without being deleted). FR has gotten very, very politically correct in the past six months. Many veterans and active duty males find they can't hold on for long without someone who never served a day of service in her life calling for a zot.
There also was and remains an undertone at FR (and maybe here) that Constitutional rights are better described as privileges. It is true that the Bill of Rights is flimsy, with the "right to assembly" easily mistaken for a "right to protest peaceably" with no real right to travel and make friends domestic or foreign implied. But, if we weren't a democracy with a judicial system, a difference in opinion over the right to assemble would easily be grounds for civil war. I say it is a right granted by the First Amendment. I don't expect the Supreme Court to disagree with me but the left wing law firm of Arnold & Porter is trying its best. Go to www.arnoldporter.com to see how this law firm is also the leading edge in promoting same-sex marriage, which is ironic considering their simultaneous attack on marriage by American heterosexual men to heterosexual foreign women.
It is important to note that the military members of FreeRepublic agreed with me when I posted at FR.
Go to FR and do a search for "On March 6th". You will see my last post "On March 6th, Americans Lose Right to Date Foreign Women" in which I got near universal agreement that IMBRA was a bad law. I got zotted when I was made to look like I was hijacking another thread, but where I was only defending a point.
Finally, many of the FR old timers (but not all) are trailer park trash who don't have passports and who would easily conflate "beautiful foreign woman" with "mail order bride" or "underage Filipina." One cannot reason with Arabs who conflate "a new Middle East" to "zionism" and one cannot reason with FReeper types who conflate the right to assembly to "soliciting underage Filipinas."
If Maximus wants a law condemning the solicitation of underage Filipinas, he can introduce a law specifically banning the solicitation of underage Filipinas, while leaving saying hello to adults alone.
I am saddened that Jim Robinson, owner of FR, is so willing to throw away internationally savvy veterans and servicemen to maintain his motley crew of insular security moms, smokers rights advocates and old-timer non-passport holders.
I assumed after I saw Howard Dean start squawking that I was a conservative Republican by nature. I fully support wiretapping of all international phone calls. But I have to draw the line in the sand when I see things like "the Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners."
That line isn't about bringing people into the USA, which is arguably a privilege although I disagree that a proven non-terrorist female should be blocked because American women don't want the competition.
The law says that even meeting foreigners in their own country is a privilege. That trumps the Twin Towers for me. News about the WOT now takes second fiddle.
If you actually read the IMBRA law at www.veteransabroad.com/legal.html, you will see that it looks "harmless" in terms of insisting that all Internet dating be conducted using anonymous webmail...if you call that harmless. It is clearly the foot in the door for regulating all of Internet dating domestically as well as internationally.
Also, since 100,000+ foreign college students and other non-prostitutes openly offer their phone numbers and postal addresses to Americans...the new law, if upheld, would shut down their profiles, many of which look a lot better than the kind of "I am a liberal" profile you see at Match.com or Yahoo Personals where the American women purposefully try NOT to look attractive in hopes of avoiding stalkers. The wording of the law was purposefully meant to make it impossible for women without email addresses to "approve" of men's background forms. The law was meant to put American-owned dating websites out of business unless they had more than 50% American women.
To be honest, the law is protectionism against social globalization. It has nothing to do with "protecting" anyone and certainly doesn't deal with "loopholes." To say that this is "closing a loophole" would be like saying that your right to (bear arms) keep a weapon in your home is a loophole.
For that reason, a judge in Georgia slapped a restraining order on it. Please read the restraining order document.
I couldn't believe that the Maximus guy actually suggested that Lebanon's 45th war in 145 years was more important than the right, not privilege of Americans to MEET whom they want. He had a right to say that "this blog" was about Lebanon and I was off topic, but he went further to say that the war in Lebanon was more important than his right to meet a Swedish college student online and then fly to Stockholm to meet her (right to assembly). I wonder if he'd say the same things if the right to bear arms had just been legislated away?
Now what can you say about a man who values his weapon more than his "gun"?
Again, this isn't a hijacked thread because I had only meant to post once.
If you want to bring an argument or discussion offline, I can be reached at veteran at veteransabroad.com or you can see the discussion at online-dating-rights.com.
But this thread was not hijacked because I only meant to post once but then had to defend the point.
Nothing in Netiquette says that a thread is hijacked if someone simply defends attacks made on a single post if those attacks are substantive and not procedural.
Sure...I want the Israelis to topple the Syrian government and a secretly trained Iranian Army to capture the Iranian oilfields.
I could talk about how, if I were Rumsfeld I would already have had an army of Iranian exiles prepared to take the oilfields and just let the Mullahs rot for a month before sane people finally finished them off.
But guess what? Its all conjecture and for a busy executive American in Germany who has a Lithuanian girlfriend who visits a lot, I just don't have the time to waste commenting too much on what I would do if I were in the White House. I was in the US Army years ago where I did know a lot but I don't have direct contact with "the world" anymore.
And no Oyster, my Lithuanian girlfriend could not visit me so often if I lived in the USA. Europe now has an oversupply of young single adult women whom the American security moms are blocking with more vigor than Mexican illegals...for obvious reasons having nothing to do with terror fears or "protecting vulnerable women from abuse."
Everybody knows why young single women are being blocked from entering the USA.
I read these war blogs voraciously. I am in and I am out. I read the comments quite often because soldiers often post here who DO know what's going on. I get zero news from Kos. But I do check out AngryArab.Blogspot.com.
At AngryArab, I often find myself commenting because the people there have this suicidal attitude that Israel will be defeated because the Israelis will all run away after the first terror nukes explode. You folks might want to invade their space a bit too. Blogs need some mixing. Its boring when everyone thinks the same.
I sometimes comment when I see people being unreasonable.
I commented here because the "Hush Little Baby Don't Say a Word" criticism of Kos hit a nerve in that every blogger puts up barriers to discussing topics that might rock their world view. Kos is ridiculous but FreeRepublic is far more active than Kos in terms of zotting people they don't agree with.
I lasted 9 months as a Freeper recently and posted tons of material on Iraq and Nazi Germany that often ran to 400 or more positive comments...but then I told a security mom who said that dating foreigners was a privilege that "you have no Goddamn right to take Americans rights away and arrogantly call them a privilege."
The zot came as a surprise because I had been considered a "mans man" who knew military history well. But there was a moderator seachange where security moms seemed to take over FR's agenda. I now know that FReeper "male chauvinists" in general are being zotted and, although the FR mission statement condemns feminism, a quick FR search reveals that no critique of feminism has appeared on FR in more than six months (without being deleted). FR has gotten very, very politically correct in the past six months. Many veterans and active duty males find they can't hold on for long without someone who never served a day of service in her life calling for a zot.
There also was and remains an undertone at FR (and maybe here) that Constitutional rights are better described as privileges. It is true that the Bill of Rights is flimsy, with the "right to assembly" easily mistaken for a "right to protest peaceably" with no real right to travel and make friends domestic or foreign implied. But, if we weren't a democracy with a judicial system, a difference in opinion over the right to assemble would easily be grounds for civil war. I say it is a right granted by the First Amendment. I don't expect the Supreme Court to disagree with me but the left wing law firm of Arnold & Porter is trying its best. Go to www.arnoldporter.com to see how this law firm is also the leading edge in promoting same-sex marriage, which is ironic considering their simultaneous attack on marriage by American heterosexual men to heterosexual foreign women.
It is important to note that the military members of FreeRepublic agreed with me when I posted at FR.
Go to FR and do a search for "On March 6th". You will see my last post "On March 6th, Americans Lose Right to Date Foreign Women" in which I got near universal agreement that IMBRA was a bad law. I got zotted when I was made to look like I was hijacking another thread, but where I was only defending a point.
Finally, many of the FR old timers (but not all) are trailer park trash who don't have passports and who would easily conflate "beautiful foreign woman" with "mail order bride" or "underage Filipina." One cannot reason with Arabs who conflate "a new Middle East" to "zionism" and one cannot reason with FReeper types who conflate the right to assembly to "soliciting underage Filipinas."
If Maximus wants a law condemning the solicitation of underage Filipinas, he can introduce a law specifically banning the solicitation of underage Filipinas, while leaving saying hello to adults alone.
I am saddened that Jim Robinson, owner of FR, is so willing to throw away internationally savvy veterans and servicemen to maintain his motley crew of insular security moms, smokers rights advocates and old-timer non-passport holders.
I assumed after I saw Howard Dean start squawking that I was a conservative Republican by nature. I fully support wiretapping of all international phone calls. But I have to draw the line in the sand when I see things like "the Supreme Court has never explicitly recognized a fundamental liberty interest in Americans meeting foreigners."
That line isn't about bringing people into the USA, which is arguably a privilege although I disagree that a proven non-terrorist female should be blocked because American women don't want the competition.
The law says that even meeting foreigners in their own country is a privilege. That trumps the Twin Towers for me. News about the WOT now takes second fiddle.
If you actually read the IMBRA law at www.veteransabroad.com/legal.html, you will see that it looks "harmless" in terms of insisting that all Internet dating be conducted using anonymous webmail...if you call that harmless. It is clearly the foot in the door for regulating all of Internet dating domestically as well as internationally.
Also, since 100,000+ foreign college students and other non-prostitutes openly offer their phone numbers and postal addresses to Americans...the new law, if upheld, would shut down their profiles, many of which look a lot better than the kind of "I am a liberal" profile you see at Match.com or Yahoo Personals where the American women purposefully try NOT to look attractive in hopes of avoiding stalkers. The wording of the law was purposefully meant to make it impossible for women without email addresses to "approve" of men's background forms. The law was meant to put American-owned dating websites out of business unless they had more than 50% American women.
To be honest, the law is protectionism against social globalization. It has nothing to do with "protecting" anyone and certainly doesn't deal with "loopholes." To say that this is "closing a loophole" would be like saying that your right to (bear arms) keep a weapon in your home is a loophole.
For that reason, a judge in Georgia slapped a restraining order on it. Please read the restraining order document.
I couldn't believe that the Maximus guy actually suggested that Lebanon's 45th war in 145 years was more important than the right, not privilege of Americans to MEET whom they want. He had a right to say that "this blog" was about Lebanon and I was off topic, but he went further to say that the war in Lebanon was more important than his right to meet a Swedish college student online and then fly to Stockholm to meet her (right to assembly). I wonder if he'd say the same things if the right to bear arms had just been legislated away?
Now what can you say about a man who values his weapon more than his "gun"?
Again, this isn't a hijacked thread because I had only meant to post once.
If you want to bring an argument or discussion offline, I can be reached at veteran at veteransabroad.com or you can see the discussion at online-dating-rights.com.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 04:51 PM (c1WDz)
25
Longtime readers are going to be shocked by what I'm about to say:
but man, you need to learn how to say things with a bit more brevity! This is a blog comment section, not an essay website.
Much value in what you say, but meandering topicality kills readership.
but man, you need to learn how to say things with a bit more brevity! This is a blog comment section, not an essay website.
Much value in what you say, but meandering topicality kills readership.
Posted by: jdkazoo at August 08, 2006 05:30 PM (z1swP)
26
Sorry. Here is brevity: It is interesting that Murtha, a former Marine, wants a ceasefire with the murderers of 240+ Marines.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 08, 2006 06:21 PM (c1WDz)
27
Bloggers should be able to post about whatever they want. Readers should be free to speculate on the meaning of posting choices. I think that Kos and Atrios are hoping very hard that if they close their eyes and click their heels three times, this "Reutersgate" issue will go away.
Oh, and Charles did post on the doping allegations. Only once, but that takes him out of the "nary a peep" category.
Oh, and Charles did post on the doping allegations. Only once, but that takes him out of the "nary a peep" category.
Posted by: Kimberly at August 08, 2006 06:35 PM (uTNgt)
28
Bloggers are free to post about whatever they want. Readers are free to speculate on the meaning of posting choices. I think that Kos and Atrios are hoping very hard that if they close their eyes and click their heels three times, this "Reutersgate" issue will go away.
Oh, and Charles did post on the doping allegations. Only once, but that takes him out of the "nary a peep" category.
Oh, and Charles did post on the doping allegations. Only once, but that takes him out of the "nary a peep" category.
Posted by: Kimberly at August 08, 2006 06:37 PM (uTNgt)
29
Sorry for the double post. Had a hard time getting through the first time.
Posted by: Kimberly at August 08, 2006 06:54 PM (uTNgt)
30
Whoa - this topic sure did stray into the twilight zone! Jack Sanderson - I'm tempted to ask "what's your point" - but then decided - I don't want to know!
Oyster - this one is all yours.
Oyster - this one is all yours.
Posted by: hondo at August 08, 2006 07:18 PM (XrexX)
31
Damn Jack!
Posted by: greyrooster at August 08, 2006 08:45 PM (ysMVV)
32
Hondo,
Don't play tag team. Others see my point. And I've given my email address at Veterans Abroad so you can be a man and insult me by email if you've got the balls. Veterans Abroad is determined to punish the weak Republican senators like Conrad Burns who voted for IMBRA.
The point was simple: Jim Robinson of FreeRepublic is behaving more childish than Marcos Zuninga of DailyKos in that Kos is at least rather open about his unwillingess to discuss the truth and all real debate about the Middle East. Jim Robinson has yet to openly admit that he's abandoned his forum's former anti-feminist stance as of approximately six months ago in order to accommodate an influx of security moms who complained heavily last fall about the culture of male chauvinism at FR.
I am making a very serious accusation here. It is either right or wrong, but its only "twilight zone" if proven wrong.
You can test this by directly asking Jim Robinson to respond to the accusation by reaffirming his stance on feminism, including specific womyn's organizations like the Tahirih Justice Center, as well as getting his specific opinion of IMBRA.
You can also test this by posting a thread on IMBRA over at FreeRepublic where you will see the military men and other males who have a pair condemn the law...but the thread will be mysteriously deleted around comment #100.
It is not as if what I am saying cannot be proven.
Try it now. Go to FreeRepublic. Refer to www.veteransabroad.com and see the military men agree until the security mom brigade finds the thread and the fireworks go off and then the thread gets silently deleted.
It is not off-topic or twilight zone to point out that "Hush Little Baby" not only refers to the Leftist unwillingness to debate the war like adults, but also the squeamishness of some Republicans in recognizing that there is a major split in their ranks regarding issues such as radical feminist legislation (which Republican Security Moms often support) as well as background checks for even domestic dating website users.
I am saying that US Servicemen and veterans are being silenced at FreeRepublic (I am not familiar with MyJawa's culture), on a topic that cuts to the heart of the definition of conservatism. That is more serious than Kos ignoring Reutergate.
This is relevant to a thread about bloggers like Kos being silent about or stonewalling what others think is important.
On both DailyKos and FreeRepublic, it is impossible to discuss radical feminism anymore (except its temporarily still OK to condemn lesbianism and abortion at FR if kept within that narrow definition of feminism).
Ask journalists to publicly ask Republican Senate and House candidates to state their policy on radical feminism. They will hem and haw. They will be afraid of how security moms will react.
There's nothing twilight zone about pointing out this relatively new squeamishness on the part of so-called "conservatives".
Don't play tag team. Others see my point. And I've given my email address at Veterans Abroad so you can be a man and insult me by email if you've got the balls. Veterans Abroad is determined to punish the weak Republican senators like Conrad Burns who voted for IMBRA.
The point was simple: Jim Robinson of FreeRepublic is behaving more childish than Marcos Zuninga of DailyKos in that Kos is at least rather open about his unwillingess to discuss the truth and all real debate about the Middle East. Jim Robinson has yet to openly admit that he's abandoned his forum's former anti-feminist stance as of approximately six months ago in order to accommodate an influx of security moms who complained heavily last fall about the culture of male chauvinism at FR.
I am making a very serious accusation here. It is either right or wrong, but its only "twilight zone" if proven wrong.
You can test this by directly asking Jim Robinson to respond to the accusation by reaffirming his stance on feminism, including specific womyn's organizations like the Tahirih Justice Center, as well as getting his specific opinion of IMBRA.
You can also test this by posting a thread on IMBRA over at FreeRepublic where you will see the military men and other males who have a pair condemn the law...but the thread will be mysteriously deleted around comment #100.
It is not as if what I am saying cannot be proven.
Try it now. Go to FreeRepublic. Refer to www.veteransabroad.com and see the military men agree until the security mom brigade finds the thread and the fireworks go off and then the thread gets silently deleted.
It is not off-topic or twilight zone to point out that "Hush Little Baby" not only refers to the Leftist unwillingness to debate the war like adults, but also the squeamishness of some Republicans in recognizing that there is a major split in their ranks regarding issues such as radical feminist legislation (which Republican Security Moms often support) as well as background checks for even domestic dating website users.
I am saying that US Servicemen and veterans are being silenced at FreeRepublic (I am not familiar with MyJawa's culture), on a topic that cuts to the heart of the definition of conservatism. That is more serious than Kos ignoring Reutergate.
This is relevant to a thread about bloggers like Kos being silent about or stonewalling what others think is important.
On both DailyKos and FreeRepublic, it is impossible to discuss radical feminism anymore (except its temporarily still OK to condemn lesbianism and abortion at FR if kept within that narrow definition of feminism).
Ask journalists to publicly ask Republican Senate and House candidates to state their policy on radical feminism. They will hem and haw. They will be afraid of how security moms will react.
There's nothing twilight zone about pointing out this relatively new squeamishness on the part of so-called "conservatives".
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 09, 2006 04:26 AM (ZBn4I)
33
FBI Alert: 11 Egyptian men are missing in the USA who were supposed to show up at a college in Montana. Another thread is discussing this. The men are between 18 and 22 years old.
Apparently, the USCIS Immigration Service was too busy keeping European women out, ages between 18 and 22 years old.
The same priority problem existed just before 9-11.
Arab men didn't wear mini-skirts so they weren't a threat.
But hush, don't say a word. :-(
Apparently, the USCIS Immigration Service was too busy keeping European women out, ages between 18 and 22 years old.
The same priority problem existed just before 9-11.
Arab men didn't wear mini-skirts so they weren't a threat.
But hush, don't say a word. :-(
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 09, 2006 09:07 AM (SQg8y)
34
Jack, you seem to be on our side, but honestly, not one of us here gives one good flying damn about your interest in foreign women. This is a political blog, not a dating site. And by the way, I did serve in the first Gulf War, so go fuck yourself.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 09, 2006 01:23 PM (v3I+x)
Posted by: Leatherneck at August 09, 2006 03:40 PM (D2g/j)
36
[This is a political blog, not a dating site. And by the way, I did serve in the first Gulf War, so go fuck yourself.]
Could have fooled me. I didn't serve with girlie man metrosexuals who would let women's organizations make the laws and control the politics. And what isn't political about Republicans bending over to any law the radical feminists want to have?
Can you, Maximus, even use the word radical feminist in a sentence or are you too politically correct for that? Disclose: what exactly IS your opinion on feminists?
Even cool feminists have more balls than you. Check out this feminist saying the law goes way too far:
Fox News Feature with Feminist Condemning IMBRA Law
Its pretty bad when feminists themselves are more help than a supposed Gulf War Veteran in terms of politically stopping a radical law.
I have a girlfriend so this is about the rights of the guys fighting in Iraq. If they want to go to Bulgaria on leave and get laid, they have the friggin right to do so without you watching the backs of those trying to take the right away. You seem to be satisfied with your hand.
And no, buddy, I am not on YOUR side, at least until you get something called a passport and then you can meet me in Stockholm and I'll show you what you're missing. The Republicans are expected to deal with the Iranian regime by November. They'll have to stop voting with the Democrats on bullshit laws before I'd consider supporting them further.
You think this is only about foreign women? Check out this from the same left wing law firm that brought us IMBRA:
Wisconsin Law Journal December 2005
Some guys just don't get it...yet. But don't worry. This left wing law firm isn't going to stop with IMBRA. The permanent injunction on the law is about to come down this month, but it might only slow them down.
Leatherneck: I have a site. Please read Veterans Abroad and do some research into this. Do a quick post on FreeRepublic and see what other veterans have to say about this political issue. I think you'll find that most Marines would like to keep their options open when they're on leave in Europe and not have Congress telling them whom they can meet.
I only meant to post once and expected full agreement like I had at FreeRepublic on February 17th "On March 6th" post. Some here are playing like mindless sharks who think they see "the enemy" or someone wounded in the water. That was my fault because I noted that the Kossacks will discuss this issue if I frame it without the word "feminism."
Now if you want to insult me instead of actually reading the law and writing to your Congressman, send an email like a real man and don't hide like Hezbollah by posting a "f&ck you" on a thread I might forget about and find again 2 months from now. Unlike so many at FreeRepublic, I am always connected to an email address.
Could have fooled me. I didn't serve with girlie man metrosexuals who would let women's organizations make the laws and control the politics. And what isn't political about Republicans bending over to any law the radical feminists want to have?
Can you, Maximus, even use the word radical feminist in a sentence or are you too politically correct for that? Disclose: what exactly IS your opinion on feminists?
Even cool feminists have more balls than you. Check out this feminist saying the law goes way too far:
Fox News Feature with Feminist Condemning IMBRA Law
Its pretty bad when feminists themselves are more help than a supposed Gulf War Veteran in terms of politically stopping a radical law.
I have a girlfriend so this is about the rights of the guys fighting in Iraq. If they want to go to Bulgaria on leave and get laid, they have the friggin right to do so without you watching the backs of those trying to take the right away. You seem to be satisfied with your hand.
And no, buddy, I am not on YOUR side, at least until you get something called a passport and then you can meet me in Stockholm and I'll show you what you're missing. The Republicans are expected to deal with the Iranian regime by November. They'll have to stop voting with the Democrats on bullshit laws before I'd consider supporting them further.
You think this is only about foreign women? Check out this from the same left wing law firm that brought us IMBRA:
Wisconsin Law Journal December 2005
Some guys just don't get it...yet. But don't worry. This left wing law firm isn't going to stop with IMBRA. The permanent injunction on the law is about to come down this month, but it might only slow them down.
Leatherneck: I have a site. Please read Veterans Abroad and do some research into this. Do a quick post on FreeRepublic and see what other veterans have to say about this political issue. I think you'll find that most Marines would like to keep their options open when they're on leave in Europe and not have Congress telling them whom they can meet.
I only meant to post once and expected full agreement like I had at FreeRepublic on February 17th "On March 6th" post. Some here are playing like mindless sharks who think they see "the enemy" or someone wounded in the water. That was my fault because I noted that the Kossacks will discuss this issue if I frame it without the word "feminism."
Now if you want to insult me instead of actually reading the law and writing to your Congressman, send an email like a real man and don't hide like Hezbollah by posting a "f&ck you" on a thread I might forget about and find again 2 months from now. Unlike so many at FreeRepublic, I am always connected to an email address.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 09, 2006 06:15 PM (SQg8y)
37
Jack, you know I've been intriqued enough by your posts to do a little investigating into this IMBRA law. This thing is so Anti-American and un-Constitutional it is incredible! How in the hell did such a thing ever get passed and why wasn't it reported in the media?
What really makes me mad is that The Tahirih Justice Center who is behind this piece of crap is named after an IRANIAN TERRORIST! Looks like Osama has some friends in the U.S.
While the guys with balls are fighting for our freedoms in the Middle East these Feminist Iranian Terrorist groups are busy cutting off our balls back here in America! Maybe some troops should come back to the USA and fight for our freedoms here which are being taken away. I'll marry whoever I damn well please. No feminist or politician has the right to stop that (and no I'm not looking for underage Filipino girls.) If I met a girl on leave and we wanted to marry it is MY business and nobody elses!
What really makes me mad is that The Tahirih Justice Center who is behind this piece of crap is named after an IRANIAN TERRORIST! Looks like Osama has some friends in the U.S.
While the guys with balls are fighting for our freedoms in the Middle East these Feminist Iranian Terrorist groups are busy cutting off our balls back here in America! Maybe some troops should come back to the USA and fight for our freedoms here which are being taken away. I'll marry whoever I damn well please. No feminist or politician has the right to stop that (and no I'm not looking for underage Filipino girls.) If I met a girl on leave and we wanted to marry it is MY business and nobody elses!
Posted by: frank johnson at August 10, 2006 01:59 AM (eAEik)
38
Guys,
Check out this other jawa thread and don't drool too much:
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/184191.php
Apparently a lot of guys on this blog really do want to meet hot Israeli chix who serve in the Israeli Army. Last I checked, Israeli women are foreign women.
Or am I missing something.
And guess who posted there? My friend Maximus. He's the guy who said he's not interested in foreign women so I can go f myself. I thought he was gay. But what was he doing on the other thread then?
Maybe he was thinking he and the other guys there deserve only to look but not touch. To contact such women online, if Americans lose the lawsuit in Georgia...the guys posting at the above thread will need to fill out government forms and beg the US government for their privilege to say hello.
Luckily the judge will overturn the law later this month. The other side will appeal however.
Remember this: The Asexual Agenda is worse than the Gay Agenda.
Check out this other jawa thread and don't drool too much:
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/184191.php
Apparently a lot of guys on this blog really do want to meet hot Israeli chix who serve in the Israeli Army. Last I checked, Israeli women are foreign women.
Or am I missing something.
And guess who posted there? My friend Maximus. He's the guy who said he's not interested in foreign women so I can go f myself. I thought he was gay. But what was he doing on the other thread then?
Maybe he was thinking he and the other guys there deserve only to look but not touch. To contact such women online, if Americans lose the lawsuit in Georgia...the guys posting at the above thread will need to fill out government forms and beg the US government for their privilege to say hello.
Luckily the judge will overturn the law later this month. The other side will appeal however.
Remember this: The Asexual Agenda is worse than the Gay Agenda.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 04:54 AM (859GW)
39
I forgot to use HTML.
Here is the link to the other Jawa thread:
Hot Israeli Soldiers Jawa Thread Worshipping Foreign Women
Don't drool on your keyboard.
Here is the link to the other Jawa thread:
Hot Israeli Soldiers Jawa Thread Worshipping Foreign Women
Don't drool on your keyboard.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 10, 2006 05:03 AM (859GW)
40
Is anyone else getting spammed by Jack with constant references to his website?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 11, 2006 11:09 AM (v3I+x)
41
Screw off Maximus. You were telling me in various emails that you wanted to write to me about how foreign women are terrorists and that is why communication needs to be regulated with them. Do you want me to post what you wrote, girlie man? Guys like you let the 9-11 hijackers in because you were too worried about keeping female college students out.
I pointed you to an example of a site with foreign women like the Israeli chicks and asked you if you thought they were terrorists or if you were gay. The example I used gets millions of hits and you've got a sick mind to think that huge websites are promoted in the manner you suggest.
That would be like you pointing to CNN and me saying "Stop trying to promote your news website."
By the way: Because I wrote the above I got an email from a television producer who is going to run a story on IMBRA.
Others who are being interviewed are reporting that the angle is going to be that the US Congress and the President should not have signed this law so fast. The show will come out around September 1st.
This could hurt the Republicans in November unless they pull away from their marriage to the Democrats on the issue.
All because I posted at Mypetjawa at a time when journalists were active at the site.
Of course, we could be liberating Iran at the time so maybe this won't be noticed. ;-)
Someone spoke too soon about nobody being interested about Americans losing their right to speak with foreigners.
I pointed you to an example of a site with foreign women like the Israeli chicks and asked you if you thought they were terrorists or if you were gay. The example I used gets millions of hits and you've got a sick mind to think that huge websites are promoted in the manner you suggest.
That would be like you pointing to CNN and me saying "Stop trying to promote your news website."
By the way: Because I wrote the above I got an email from a television producer who is going to run a story on IMBRA.
Others who are being interviewed are reporting that the angle is going to be that the US Congress and the President should not have signed this law so fast. The show will come out around September 1st.
This could hurt the Republicans in November unless they pull away from their marriage to the Democrats on the issue.
All because I posted at Mypetjawa at a time when journalists were active at the site.
Of course, we could be liberating Iran at the time so maybe this won't be noticed. ;-)
Someone spoke too soon about nobody being interested about Americans losing their right to speak with foreigners.
Posted by: Jack Sanderson at August 11, 2006 05:40 PM (yRhFu)
42
You're quite right, Walter Pater is the only justification for Mona Lisa.
Posted by: top rape clips at September 29, 2006 04:44 AM (B+1Bb)
Posted by: rape videos at October 23, 2006 09:53 PM (D0hNE)
Village Calling Idiot, Come In Please, Idiot
Great moments in higher educational history:
David Gabbard, an East Carolina education professor, acknowledges this isn't his field, but says "I'm smart enough to know … that fire from airplanes can't melt steel."
Well, that sounds about right. I mean, look at the guy.
I'll bet that he can melt steel.....with his mind.
stein hoist to haywood.
Posted by: Vinnie at
05:57 PM
| Comments (15)
| Add Comment
Post contains 64 words, total size 1 kb.
Posted by: Rusty at August 07, 2006 06:00 PM (x+8Rs)
2
Doesn't have to melt it. Just has to soften it up enough to take its rigidity outside of the design limits, et voila! - the steel can no longer support the thousands of tons of concrete it was holding up.
And the only physics I ever took was Ex-Lax!
And the only physics I ever took was Ex-Lax!
Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at August 07, 2006 06:05 PM (vBK4C)
Posted by: Darth Vag at August 07, 2006 06:45 PM (+nlyI)
4
He looks like an old rock star or something, he must be right!
Posted by: CanForce 101 at August 07, 2006 07:06 PM (xfvyZ)
5
Someone been smokin some WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED.
Posted by: Brad at August 07, 2006 07:55 PM (6mUkl)
6
David Gabbard, an East Carolina education professor
In other words, someone who spent the time to get the piece of paper, but hasn't got the brainpower to get a meaningful one.
In other words, someone who spent the time to get the piece of paper, but hasn't got the brainpower to get a meaningful one.
Posted by: Robert Crawford at August 07, 2006 08:54 PM (bH9q3)
7
Lost member of the grateful dead?
Posted by: Leovinus at August 07, 2006 09:22 PM (I42Iw)
8
Some Ex-Lax will turn that frown... UPSIDE DOWN!
Posted by: David Ross at August 07, 2006 09:30 PM (d4VRl)
9
I'm not worried about global warming....I'm worried about global INSANITY. Lock this guy up and throw away the key.
Posted by: n.a. palm at August 08, 2006 07:58 AM (GgzQe)
10
he appears to do a lot of thinking but not much bathing. read some of his material, this guy is dangerous.
Posted by: jd clark at August 08, 2006 08:27 AM (TAx90)
11
Notice his page reads, "Comrades", instead of "friends". He's somebody who's obviously sucked in by the romantic notion of "fightin' the powah!" It's really depressing to think people like this are in charge of "educating" our young people.
Posted by: Richard H. at August 08, 2006 08:54 AM (7KF8r)
12
This is prime proof that when TSHTF, clearing out the universities will be a high priority.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at August 08, 2006 09:47 AM (v3I+x)
13
Glad ya'll enjoyed it.
Haywood got a really nicely thought out reply from Dave, complaining that the AP reporter picked out that quote to disparage the professor. Maybe Dave didn't read the last name.
If East Carolina has an alumni committee like the one at my school, they ought to focus their fundraising attention on students who got a good grade in his class.
I mean comrades, comrades who suck up to this windbag. Dull crayons in that box.
heaven, help us
Haywood got a really nicely thought out reply from Dave, complaining that the AP reporter picked out that quote to disparage the professor. Maybe Dave didn't read the last name.
If East Carolina has an alumni committee like the one at my school, they ought to focus their fundraising attention on students who got a good grade in his class.
I mean comrades, comrades who suck up to this windbag. Dull crayons in that box.
heaven, help us
Posted by: haywood jablowmi at August 08, 2006 10:27 AM (VUmVc)
Posted by: Billy Hollis at August 08, 2006 10:47 AM (mSHw6)
15
Yes, fire cannot burn hot enough to melt steel but it doesn't have to. All it needs to do is soften it enough to where it loses it rigidity and bends. Thus breaking the supports that hold it up in the first place - i.e popping the rivits on the supprt beam its attached to or breaking away from the concrete wall its rivited to. Its also not just the jet fuel but also the fire from the surrounding area like insulation, office furniture, paper, carpeting, plane seats etc.
Just another fine example of morons with college degrees.
Just another fine example of morons with college degrees.
Posted by: VoiceofReason at August 09, 2006 12:02 AM (45rke)
July 31, 2006
The Bottom Line.
This is a good article over at The Conservative Voice. Personally I think Hezbollah and the rest of the Middle East is laughing their ass off right now. Our concern for their manufactured hardships was easily predicted and shows our weakness. Yes we are being played like a fiddle.
The Conservative Voice: In this brave new world of political correctness and human rights for Islamic terrorists who have vowed to destroy Western civilization and all who adhere to civilization in general, only terrorists are now being given the green light to wage war. The arguments (AKA excuses) for this insane line of thinking are few and tepid. But, they are apparently powerful enough for those who continue to maintain a hatred for the Western world and a love for the “poor oppressed terrorists†in our midst....Remember Muhammad's words, "War is Deceit!"...The Israeli airstrikes against Hezbollah rocket launchers in the village of Qana resulted in over 50 women and children, located in an apartment building, being killed. But, it appears that no men were killed. Hmmm. Interestingly, this is a standard terrorist Hezbollah tactic. It removes the men (so that they can continue to fight with Hezbollah) and leaves women and children for “collateral damageâ€â€”to be used as a public relations’ ploy for the world press. It worked and continues to work to Hezbollah’s advantage. Hezbollah was and is not blamed—only its victims (in this case Israel) are. The leftist mainstream press drinks long and hard from the wine Hezbollah and other worldwide terrorist organizations provide to them and then proceeds to become drunk on it.
The bottom line? Only the terrorists should be allowed to fight. Yeah. That should do it!
Related at Rhymes with Right. Hat Tip: Master Vinnie.
Posted by: Howie at
11:41 AM
| Comments (18)
| Add Comment
Post contains 293 words, total size 2 kb.
1
Heard on NPR this morning one of the 'fathers' pledging his life and loyalty to Hezbolla. No word yet on whether he was simply repeating a past pledge or if this was one of those newly minted terrorist the left constantly reminds everyone that killing Islamists creates.
Posted by: Kurt at July 31, 2006 12:01 PM (IcdWu)
2
I am beginning to think that even the loss of a city or two will not be enough to wake up our governing elites. And I imagine the next day any protestors in cities yet to be targeted will gleefully take to the streets and blame the usual victims. More and more frequently now I am told by ersatz feminists that "wearing cover" might not be so bad and that they are beginning to appreciate the way it "shows respect for women". On the other hand are the Coughlinites - who somehow think they are conservatives - who share the Islamist hatred for Jews and think they can surf the jihad back to their imaginary 1950s.
This should be so easy: Democracy over dictatorship. Liberty or death. I do not understand the mystery. I see no nuance here.
Maybe something breaks inside when people live comfortable lives. Maybe the Light has to endure a new Dark Age before we regain our senses. Time to re-read Heinlein, folks. We are going to need the advice.
This should be so easy: Democracy over dictatorship. Liberty or death. I do not understand the mystery. I see no nuance here.
Maybe something breaks inside when people live comfortable lives. Maybe the Light has to endure a new Dark Age before we regain our senses. Time to re-read Heinlein, folks. We are going to need the advice.
Posted by: Flea at July 31, 2006 12:12 PM (2Jb/7)
3
Flea, I am of the opinion that the Left is seeking to use the Islamists as a springboard for a return to power in the US. As I observe what is going on in Sweden, for instance, I could hardly argue with your premise. The Left is in power in Sweden, and they are apparently serving up the non-Muslim citizens for chicken soup, if one is to believe the statistics coming out of Sweden on the numbers of rapes and murders committed by immigrants, i.e. denizens of Islam. Look for more of the same in the rest of Europe, and eventually the US as well.
Posted by: jesusland joe at July 31, 2006 12:23 PM (rUyw4)
4
Is it easier to be a spectator to the world than to participate in it?
BTW I would like to see where feminists are saying the burka is respectful and acceptable. That would be an interesting read depending on who said it.
BTW I would like to see where feminists are saying the burka is respectful and acceptable. That would be an interesting read depending on who said it.
Posted by: Cmunk at July 31, 2006 12:31 PM (7teJ9)
5
Flea: "This should be so easy: Democracy over dictatorship. Liberty or death. I do not understand the mystery. I see no nuance here."
I'm atarting to think that fear is driving the appeasement and denial. We are soft.
And who wants to enter a nightmare when we're having so much fun?
I'm atarting to think that fear is driving the appeasement and denial. We are soft.
And who wants to enter a nightmare when we're having so much fun?
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at July 31, 2006 12:32 PM (aH6Zf)
6
Well, Dreamer, the sleeper is about to be awakened. And I'm afraid it will be by another manifestation of the jihad. The nightmare is about to be real and fun time is over. Besides, you can only have fun for so long, and then more important matters tend to pop up, like being an adult. Our fetish in the West for adolescence needs to end, and end quickly, or we will find everything we have worked for so long "gone with the wind". Others have suffered before because they refused to take things seriously. It can happen again.
Posted by: jesusland joe at July 31, 2006 01:03 PM (rUyw4)
7
The sleeper has awakened!
Posted by: Muad Dib at July 31, 2006 01:13 PM (D3+20)
8
"Remember Muhammad's words, 'War is Deceit!'"
Sun Tzu came up with that baby about 1000 years earlier. "All warfare is based on deception," sayeth The Man.
He also said something about attacking your enemy's weakness, and the biggest weakness of the West is their compassion. It's also a weakness they can depend on to be there tomorrow because even secular Westerners build their identity on it. If Western tanks had some weakness that allowed them to be knocked out, that weakness would soon be recognized and the tanks modified to erase it; but the when the weakness is kindness they will not modify their philosophy to protect themselves. You can resign yourself to watching your countrymen get jerked around by Hezballah's ilk for as long as they can show raw bodies to the camera crews.
Sun Tzu came up with that baby about 1000 years earlier. "All warfare is based on deception," sayeth The Man.
He also said something about attacking your enemy's weakness, and the biggest weakness of the West is their compassion. It's also a weakness they can depend on to be there tomorrow because even secular Westerners build their identity on it. If Western tanks had some weakness that allowed them to be knocked out, that weakness would soon be recognized and the tanks modified to erase it; but the when the weakness is kindness they will not modify their philosophy to protect themselves. You can resign yourself to watching your countrymen get jerked around by Hezballah's ilk for as long as they can show raw bodies to the camera crews.
Posted by: ShannonKW at July 31, 2006 01:24 PM (AeUo8)
9
Thankfully, I have yet to see the pro-burqa "feminist" line making much headway yet. Though the fact is that NOW, women's studies programs and basically everyone who was anti-Taliban up until the current administration decided to do something about it are now largely silent on the issue of women's equality in the Muslim world.
I am relating what I am personally hearing from some nominally feminist women. I am not alone in hearing this kind of talk. Writing for The Age a couple years ago is Monash prof, Karen Green. "The burqa stripped bare" describes how her sister's greatest act of rebellion against her tolerant family was to become a Muslim. Shades of John Walker Lindh. I expect we are going to see much, much more of this in the coming years and decades.
I am relating what I am personally hearing from some nominally feminist women. I am not alone in hearing this kind of talk. Writing for The Age a couple years ago is Monash prof, Karen Green. "The burqa stripped bare" describes how her sister's greatest act of rebellion against her tolerant family was to become a Muslim. Shades of John Walker Lindh. I expect we are going to see much, much more of this in the coming years and decades.
Posted by: Flea at July 31, 2006 01:59 PM (2Jb/7)
10
MEMO TO: Israel
FROM: Free world
Fight harder, now, or you will cause the whole world to suffer in your defeat. You can't fight like a bunch of limp-wristed liberals, and expect to win.
FROM: Free world
Fight harder, now, or you will cause the whole world to suffer in your defeat. You can't fight like a bunch of limp-wristed liberals, and expect to win.
Posted by: n.a. palm at July 31, 2006 02:05 PM (mTlKc)
Posted by: Heroic Dreamer at July 31, 2006 02:13 PM (aH6Zf)
12
Flea, I noticed at LGF this morning that one of the protesters at whatever venue in Seattle had gained her outrage at Israel by gaining "knowledge" of Israeli atrocities from the "Paleostinian" giving her free lessons in Arabic. I live in West Texas where there are few if any mosques, so is it common for these mosques to give free lessons in Arabic to attract visitors, and perhaps converts? Do you know, or does anyone know the answer to that question?
Posted by: jesusland joe at July 31, 2006 02:21 PM (rUyw4)
13
I don't know about the free language lessons but I expect it is a common practice. If you belong to a proseletyzing and believe the closest thing to the word of God is written in 7th-century Arabic it would make sense for people to be able to read it. For what it is worth, I wish more Christians would take the time to pick up a little Hebrew and Biblical Greek. The Greek is actually pretty straightforward once you get the alphabet down.
On a related note: Behind the Veil, a Muslim Feminist.
On a related note: Behind the Veil, a Muslim Feminist.
Posted by: Flea at July 31, 2006 02:26 PM (2Jb/7)
Posted by: Flea at July 31, 2006 02:30 PM (2Jb/7)
15
Ahhhh! Joe! But the fun has just begun! We soon will be unloading all that stored up ammo and frustration into muslime bodies!
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at July 31, 2006 02:33 PM (gLMre)
Posted by: Flea at July 31, 2006 02:42 PM (2Jb/7)
17
I had to take a shower after going through the Culture Kitchen(hardly a fitting name), Flea. But suffice it to say that I understand. These Leftists tie themselves in knots trying to apologize for their allies the Islamists. Pathetic.
Posted by: jesusland joe at July 31, 2006 07:56 PM (rUyw4)
18
That burka chick has it wrong. Women should be seen, not heard. Where is my supper women? You sexy thing!
Posted by: Leatherneck at July 31, 2006 08:30 PM (D2g/j)
July 20, 2006
Terrorists & Their Useful Idiots (Updated)
Hey! Get down off that fence, you Islamist cockroach!
The ever-vigilant zombie over at zombietime has coverage of a pro-terror, anti-Israel rally (media would dub them "supporters of the Palestinian cause") outside the Israeli consulate in San Francisco last week. Still have any doubts that the enemy is alive and well among us here at home?
Also - one of the terror supporters featured in this video clip looks suspiciously like the same one who threatened Evan Coyne Maloney of Brain Terminal fame when he filmed an anti-Israel rally at Rutgers in 2003 (about halfway through the clip, Evan has a verbal confrontation with the guy, who later makes a speech at the screeching hatefest). Tolerant, they.
Update: Here's a side-by-side screenshot to compare - see if you think its the same POS peaceful supporter of the Palestinian cause.
Cross-posted at Mein BlogoVault.
Posted by: Good Lt. at
05:39 AM
| Comments (10)
| Add Comment
Post contains 149 words, total size 2 kb.
1
I was glad to see there were counter-protesters there. I've never been to a protest; maybe, I need to go to one. Cindy what's-her-name will be in Crawford before too long. I have to plan to be there.
Posted by: pivalleygirl at July 20, 2006 06:15 AM (BQRI6)
2
That photo makes me think of the ape scene in 2001: A Space Odyssey.
Posted by: Graeme at July 20, 2006 06:44 AM (Zu9Cf)
3
Maybe, Graeme, but the ape scene when Charleton Heston was captured the second time in Planet of the Apes, and he finally speaks, comes to my mind.
Posted by: jesusland joe at July 20, 2006 10:31 AM (rUyw4)
4
Way to go blacks in the group. I can see that they are true palestinians. Wooried about your people. Friggin idiots.
Posted by: greyrooster at July 20, 2006 11:45 AM (TLSvi)
5
Graeme, if you replace the flags with bones, it's exactly the Space Odyssey ape scene.
Posted by: Ron Jon at July 20, 2006 12:00 PM (Gr2vx)
Posted by: Good Lt at July 20, 2006 01:18 PM (jWYAe)
7
Some arabs claim to be white.
Posted by: greyrooster at July 20, 2006 09:27 PM (x1lvn)
8
Which ones are white? The one with the Camera? Or is he taking pictures of the scum. Please open eyes a bit more.
Posted by: greyrooster at July 20, 2006 09:30 PM (x1lvn)
9
There are more pics at the link, rooster. Take a look at them. My eyes are wide open.
This is not a "black" or "white" problem - it is a cultural and religious one. John Walker Lindh was white. Padilla is a Hispanic. The Islamism cuts across racial lines.
This is not a "black" or "white" problem - it is a cultural and religious one. John Walker Lindh was white. Padilla is a Hispanic. The Islamism cuts across racial lines.
Posted by: Good Lt at July 21, 2006 07:07 AM (yT+NK)
Posted by: Last gasp Larry at July 23, 2006 12:17 AM (gLMre)
Odes Of A Moron
Why, oh why am I not a world famous musician?
this weekend i went upstate to the woodstock farm animal sanctuary and spent the night and hung out with cows and goats and chickens and turkeys and sheep and pigs and cats and dogs(and people, too, although the weekend was more about quadripeds than bipeds...
although the bipedal creatures were nice, too).
a farm animal sanctuary is a place where farm animals go to live out their lives free from the threat of being killed or tortured or made to suffer at the hands of people.
Maybe it's because that while I may post inanities from time to time, I don't post them all the time?
stein hoist: the blogmother.
Posted by: Vinnie at
01:14 AM
| Comments (1)
| Add Comment
Post contains 124 words, total size 1 kb.
1
Ya know, there's really nothing insulting anyone can say about that little sack of crap that isn't truth to which he would gladly admit. Since when the did the opinion of degenerates become so important in our society?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at July 20, 2006 06:01 AM (v3I+x)
839kb generated in CPU 0.1741, elapsed 0.2203 seconds.
56 queries taking 0.1132 seconds, 1357 records returned.
Powered by Minx 1.1.6c-pink.
56 queries taking 0.1132 seconds, 1357 records returned.
Powered by Minx 1.1.6c-pink.
