February 12, 2007
Toyota FT-HS Hybrid Sports Car
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Posted by: Ragnar at
12:57 PM
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1
Nice car.
It'd be nicer with a small block V8 and a high-performance 6-speed tranny though. Who the hell wants to drive a sports car that sounds like an RC toy? Hell, I'd take a high performance DIESEL over that electric crap any day.
It'd be nicer with a small block V8 and a high-performance 6-speed tranny though. Who the hell wants to drive a sports car that sounds like an RC toy? Hell, I'd take a high performance DIESEL over that electric crap any day.
Posted by: Wearyman at February 12, 2007 02:39 PM (puky3)
2
I love V8s as much as the next guy, but as much as I love 'em, they have their limitations. There's no denying that straight internal combustion propulsion has had a damn impressive run, but you eventually run into a point of diminishing returns and the advantages of the next generation technology become painfully obvious.
I'll be looking forward to watching hybrids in a straight-up match against straight gas-powered cars in road races. Once hybrids are consistently kicking the crap out of the straight gas-powered buggies, you won't be able to GIVE the old tech machines away.
I'll be looking forward to watching hybrids in a straight-up match against straight gas-powered cars in road races. Once hybrids are consistently kicking the crap out of the straight gas-powered buggies, you won't be able to GIVE the old tech machines away.
Posted by: Ragnar the Skankophile at February 12, 2007 04:56 PM (c/4ax)
3
That's not going to happen for a LOOONG time.
Primary reason? Weight to torque ratio of Battery+Electric vs Internal Combustion. Yes, electric motors CAN have insane amounts of torque and acceleration. The problem is, those motors also take an insane amount of electricity to run. The batteries required to run a motor capable of producing equivalent Horsepower to a V8 (or an inline 4, for that matter) are so heavy that they completely negate the horsepower. It's like trying to race a 1/2 ton pickup with a full load. You just can't go very fast, very quickly. or if you CAN go very fast very quickly with that kind of load, then you are running your batteries dry in no time flat.
Which, incidentally, is exactly how this car achieves it's high performance. It sacrifices any kind of useful range just to gain that level of speed and acceleration. That may work well in overbuilt Tokyo, but here in the U.S. it isn't going to do you any good.
Maybe in 10 - 20 years when they perfect the nanotube capacitor we will have a viable hybrid or electric. Until then I'll stick with my Internal combustion, thank you.
Primary reason? Weight to torque ratio of Battery+Electric vs Internal Combustion. Yes, electric motors CAN have insane amounts of torque and acceleration. The problem is, those motors also take an insane amount of electricity to run. The batteries required to run a motor capable of producing equivalent Horsepower to a V8 (or an inline 4, for that matter) are so heavy that they completely negate the horsepower. It's like trying to race a 1/2 ton pickup with a full load. You just can't go very fast, very quickly. or if you CAN go very fast very quickly with that kind of load, then you are running your batteries dry in no time flat.
Which, incidentally, is exactly how this car achieves it's high performance. It sacrifices any kind of useful range just to gain that level of speed and acceleration. That may work well in overbuilt Tokyo, but here in the U.S. it isn't going to do you any good.
Maybe in 10 - 20 years when they perfect the nanotube capacitor we will have a viable hybrid or electric. Until then I'll stick with my Internal combustion, thank you.
Posted by: wearyman at February 13, 2007 09:45 AM (puky3)
4
Wearyman -
First, let me congratulate and thank you for a well-reasoned and level-headed response. It's rare enough on the internet to be notable.
Second, you've identified problems inherent to the current crop of electric cars which may or may not be evident in a particular hybrid car. Yes, purely electric cars are seriously range limited. Hybrids, not so much.
As to the technology, it appears that we both agree that the torque output of an electric drive system is primarily governed by the electrical power the battery can generate rather than the size and weight of the battery itself. A small battery can be designed to output a pretty substantial level of juice. As you noted, it just can't do it for very long--at least not with our current battery technology. It bears noting, I think, that hybrids don't necessarily need to include an electrical drive system at all. There is at least one design out there for a purely-mechanical hybrid system.
As to my racing prediction and your response, if we were talking about a drag race or a stock car race, I'd agree that the hybrid equipment would almost certainly be more of a hindrance than a benefit. I didn't make any predictions on drag races or stock car races. My prediction is limited to road races--and I'll be sticking by that prediction. In fact, I'll go one further and predict we're looking at something closer to 5-10 years rather than 10-20 years.
First, let me congratulate and thank you for a well-reasoned and level-headed response. It's rare enough on the internet to be notable.
Second, you've identified problems inherent to the current crop of electric cars which may or may not be evident in a particular hybrid car. Yes, purely electric cars are seriously range limited. Hybrids, not so much.
As to the technology, it appears that we both agree that the torque output of an electric drive system is primarily governed by the electrical power the battery can generate rather than the size and weight of the battery itself. A small battery can be designed to output a pretty substantial level of juice. As you noted, it just can't do it for very long--at least not with our current battery technology. It bears noting, I think, that hybrids don't necessarily need to include an electrical drive system at all. There is at least one design out there for a purely-mechanical hybrid system.
As to my racing prediction and your response, if we were talking about a drag race or a stock car race, I'd agree that the hybrid equipment would almost certainly be more of a hindrance than a benefit. I didn't make any predictions on drag races or stock car races. My prediction is limited to road races--and I'll be sticking by that prediction. In fact, I'll go one further and predict we're looking at something closer to 5-10 years rather than 10-20 years.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold, Arrogant Prick at February 13, 2007 11:29 AM (bCngg)
5
Quit drinking that stuff.
Posted by: greyrooster at February 13, 2007 01:20 PM (E0zAj)
6
Not sure how the hydraulic assist systems are coming along (I think by Ford) but that sure seems a lot more powerful off the start and more stable/reusable than all those batteries and extra motors - especially on a truck platform...
Posted by: tbone at February 14, 2007 12:11 AM (iK3oF)
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