October 04, 2005
The father of a University of Oklahoma student, Joel Henry Hinrichs III, that blew himself up on Saturday is denying reports that his son's death was somehow politically motivated.
However, both World Net Daily and the Northeast Intelligence Network are reporting that law enforcement agents found jihadi material in Hinrich's apartment. Included in the material were instructions on how to make bombs used in suicide attacks.
Doug Hagmann, a seasoned investigator, told WND he was informed by multiple reliable law-enforcement sources familiar with the investigation into the incident that authorities recovered a "significant amount" of "jihad" materials, as well as Hinrichs' computer.TATP is the explosive used in the London transit bombings.Hagmann also said those same sources indicated police and federal agents "had pulled additional explosives from [Hinrichs'] house," including triacetone triperoxide, or TATP, "homemade explosive [that is] very potent but relatively easily manufactured."
The confiscated jihad documents "referenced bomb-making manuals and that type of thing," Hagmann said, who added Hinrichs' apartment in Norman, Okla., is "located near the Islamic Society [of Norman]."Larry Hagmann is the director of the Northeast Intelligence Network, so both stories are based on the same uncorraborated reports. NEIN has been called 'the world's most alarmist website' by a number of people in the past, so we'll let that stand as a disclaimer. It will be very interesting to follow this story and see what really motivated Hinrichs to kill himslelf in this fashion.
However, if the WND/NEIN reports are true about jihadi material, but Hinrichs was not motivated by jihad, then think about what this is saying. If you want to blow yourself up, then who better to consult than the local chapter of the Islamic Society of North America? That's a pretty sad statement.
Hat tip to blog-son Eric from Vince Aut Morire who found it at Clarity and Resolve
UPDATE: Super-sikrit note to Bill Quick and Kevin Aylward. Maybe not jihadi, but if you're going to kill yourself why not consult with the experts.....
Posted by: Rusty at
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FBI
ATF
Joint Terrorism Task Force
University of Oklahoma Police Department
Norman Police Department
Cleveland County Sheriff's Office
- and decide how long/how much money is to be dedicated to accepting Islam, a most intolerant concept, protected under the US constitution as a valid religion.
Posted by: discombobyulated at October 04, 2005 09:14 AM (7auSQ)
Posted by: Oyster at October 04, 2005 09:44 AM (fl6E1)
When he sees his father for only a half hour in a year, I highly doubt the father knew what was going on in his son's life.
Hinrichs last visited his family this year, when he stopped by for about a half hour while on a road trip, his father said.
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Also NEIN seems to be right about the TATP since the FBI told the father that hydrogen peroxide was used to construct the bomb, and the father told the AP.
And TATP can be made from H2O2.
So NEIN might also be correct about the Jihad papers.
Posted by: oxen at October 04, 2005 10:15 AM (w9vWW)
Posted by: Michael Wright at October 04, 2005 11:12 AM (9Z4a7)
Posted by: Brad Hillery at October 04, 2005 05:55 PM (ONIdh)
You guys should consider for a minute that suicide is common among young men, and common among engineers, in relation to the general population. Joe apparently had been having a hard time lately, and that certainly correlates with suicidal tendencies as well. So tell me, Oyster, would you in such a state have given a half a goddamn for what other people would do after you died??? Not much point in killing yourself if you care about public opinion, eh?
Think for a minute, guys, how much unfounded rumor you are spreading. Which of you saying he had jihadi literature (one off the record comment reported by one not-well-respected source of information (NIN is the American Debka)) were - or still are - piling on the media for their New Orleans reporting? Don't be assholes, 'kay?
Posted by: Jeff Medcalf at October 04, 2005 06:57 PM (4pYF5)
Right now, I'm still more inclined to believe he was a disturbed young man with a flair for the dramatic.
Posted by: Nemo at October 04, 2005 08:21 PM (0iuqP)
Posted by: Ken at October 04, 2005 08:48 PM (ywZa8)
Let me take a crack at profiling the suspect:
Given the descriptions I've read of Hinrichs, he suffered from depression, neurosis, and likely had a deep need for the systemization of the world around him. This last characteristic manifested itself in his intense and early interest in machines, and his difficulty in relating with his peers. ( I fathom that he may have had at least a mild autistic tendencies.)
Ultimately, I think he was able to find a philosophical structure which provided him a complete, and, for him, what must have been a blessedly inflexible systemization of life and the world. He pursued this structure to one of its natural consequences.
Again, check the beard, people. I don't think he was trying to look like Weird Al in the "Amish Paradise" vid.
Posted by: Lyle at October 04, 2005 10:43 PM (CYMYg)
Posted by: Thomas Bramtley at October 05, 2005 07:52 AM (VxRdE)
Given the reports of jihadist literature in the bombers room, his Pakistani roomate, and the use of a chemical known to be a favorite of the Islamists, it would appear that this was an attempt to do a lot more than kill himself.
Posted by: Kenneth Price at October 05, 2005 08:17 AM (XTPbZ)
I think the biggest problem we have with Islamo-facist infiltration is with student visas, not an open border with Mexico. It seems to be a lot easier to convince the State Dept to let you in the US than taking the illegal route.
FYI: Just read "Teeth of the Tiger" by Clancy. I'm a Clancy fan, so read at your own risk. Uses the open border idea pretty well. Good fiction, not necessarily a good basis for developing immigration policy.
Posted by: Scott at October 05, 2005 09:22 AM (q7DL4)
Posted by: Michael Zorrick at October 05, 2005 09:54 AM (liXPv)
SECOND: His father, "as a father", hopes it was an accident and not suicide.
If a man was trying to grasp the nature of his son's bizarre death, what would he say? /joel had be despondent for some time/ he was estranged, we hadn't heard from him in years, we're in shock/ we had no idea he converted, he never told us/
He'd like to think it was an accident---He'd like to think it was an accident---He'd like to think it was an accident.
The only way it could be an accident is if this convert was planning to kill civilians WITH A BOMB. The legacy of that type of explosive goes directly to Muslims and Islamic terrorism. Detonating explosives against his intended plan was the ACCIDENT.
Joel H. Hinrichs converts to Islam, wears the uniform beard, leaves school for a year, dies in an explosion while in possession of specific explosive materials and has a father who says it was suicide but would it would be best if it was an accident.
There's no reason for the father to qualify the event in this manner. It speaks volumes.
we pass for what we are
Posted by: still anonymous at October 05, 2005 10:08 AM (/IMqw)
SECOND: His father, "as a father", hopes it was an accident and not suicide.
If a man was trying to grasp the nature of his son's bizarre death, what would he say? /joel had be despondent for some time/ he was estranged, we hadn't heard from him in years, we're in shock/ we had no idea he converted, he never told us/
He'd like to think it was an accident---He'd like to think it was an accident---He'd like to think it was an accident.
The only way it could be an accident is if this convert was planning to kill civilians WITH A BOMB. The legacy of that type of explosive goes directly to Muslims and Islamic terrorism. Detonating explosives against his intended plan was the ACCIDENT.
Joel H. Hinrichs has a Pakistani room-mate, converts to Islam, wears the uniform beard, leaves school for a year, dies in an explosion while in possession of specific explosive materials and has a father who says it was suicide but would it would be best if it was an accident.
There's no reason for the father to qualify the event in this manner. It speaks volumes.
we pass for what we are
Posted by: still anonymous at October 05, 2005 10:12 AM (/IMqw)
You should listen to your own words. You didn't present any facts. Suicide is not "common" among young men. Suicide at a football game is not "common". Suicide by TATP self detontation is not "common". I've never heard of suicide by TATP self detonation before, but we've all heard of suicide terror attacks using TATP. It's obvious that this situtation needs to be thoroughly investigated. Something that the mainstream media doesn't seem to want to do. In absence of the facts, you will get rumors and speculation.
Posted by: mark at October 05, 2005 12:07 PM (XNJVz)
1) Engineering student: This major is number one for most Islamic Terrorists........so he would have plenty of time to meet Jihadists.
2) His father works with Computer Software.....another possible liberal dad from the 60's or early 70's.
3) Sister is named BEREKELY............mmmmmmmm...........can we say LIBERAL .......Make love, not war......San Francisco Bay Area....Acid Dropping Hippie Parents!
4)Father HOPES IT WAS AN ACCIDENT.......why? Can we say FATHER GUILT........selfish Dad who still is trying to find his own personal NERVANA.
5) He fits the same profile as Johnnie Walker Lind....the San Franciso Bay Area child......who came from a set of Liberal left over 60 hippies! Father and mother divorced.......Dad finding out that he likes men rather than women.......Johnnie hating that fact....mother exploring the ancient religions like her son.
6) Then you have Berg....loans his computer for a future terrorist to send an email.........later finds himself in Iraq getting his head cut off for the cameras. Berg's father comes out and speaks....totally felt for this father. Later on his liberal views come out and my original profiling of his demeanor takes the best over me..........fits the total profile of a liberal San Francisco Bay Area........hippie male from the 60's.
Let's wake up........this will be the profile of all American Sucide Bombers! They will come from upper middle class backgrounds....fathers will look like the singer James Taylor.....and father's occupation will be either an Engineer, Lawyer, Doctor, and Scientist. The sucide bomber will be in college or will have a college degree and will rarely speak to his father.......the same way his father could not relate to his "OLD MAN!"
The Oklahoma Bomber was a total Islamic Convert who was trying to find some purpose in life.......and was nothing but a ponzi for the Muslim Brotherhood (Hamas cell in Oklahoma).
Posted by: Renee at October 06, 2005 12:34 PM (rBR8e)
1) Engineering student: This major is number one for most Islamic Terrorists........so he would have plenty of time to meet Jihadists.
2) His father works with Computer Software.....another possible liberal dad from the 60's or early 70's.
3) Sister is named BEREKELY............mmmmmmmm...........can we say LIBERAL .......Make love, not war......San Francisco Bay Area....Acid Dropping Hippie Parents!
4)Father HOPES IT WAS AN ACCIDENT.......why? Can we say FATHER GUILT........selfish Dad who still is trying to find his own personal NERVANA.
5) He fits the same profile as Johnnie Walker Lind....the San Franciso Bay Area child......who came from a set of Liberal left over 60 hippies! Father and mother divorced.......Dad finding out that he likes men rather than women.......Johnnie hating that fact....mother exploring the ancient religions like her son.
6) Then you have Berg....loans his computer for a future terrorist to send an email.........later finds himself in Iraq getting his head cut off for the cameras. Berg's father comes out and speaks....totally felt for this father. Later on his liberal views come out and my original profiling of his demeanor takes the best over me..........fits the total profile of a liberal San Francisco Bay Area........hippie male from the 60's.
Let's wake up........this will be the profile of all American Sucide Bombers! They will come from upper middle class backgrounds....fathers will look like the singer James Taylor.....and father's occupation will be either an Engineer, Lawyer, Doctor, and Scientist. The sucide bomber will be in college or will have a college degree and will rarely speak to his father.......the same way his father could not relate to his "OLD MAN!"
The Oklahoma Bomber was a total Islamic Convert who was trying to find some purpose in life.......and was nothing but a ponzi for the Muslim Brotherhood (Hamas cell in Oklahoma).
Posted by: renee at October 06, 2005 12:37 PM (rBR8e)
He apparently DID care. If he didn't, then a nice quiet overdose would have been in order. If he did, he might have jumped from a building or put a gun in his mouth in public. But no, Jeff, he BLEW HIMSLEF UP, JIHAD-STYLE, NEXT TO A PACKED STADIUM. Please take into consideration that many jihadis' strongest assets are CHEMISTS and ENGINEERS who build their bombs and tell them where to place them for maximum effect.
You're not adressing any of the actual facts when you assume it was intended to be no more than a single suicide.
1) he lived around the corner from an Islamic center
2) his roommate was Pakistani
3) he was "troubled" (a perfect candidate for recruitment)
4) he tried to buy ammonium nitrate days before (we all know who has used it in the past)
5) HE BLEW HIMSLEF UP, JIHAD-STYLE, NEXT TO A PACKED STADIUM
And those are just the "absolute" facts.
And you ridicule us for suspecting it wasn't intended as just a single suicide?
I'll wait for the conclusive report. But, in the meantime there are too many oddities connected to this to just say, "Dude, he was just depressed."
Posted by: Oyster at October 06, 2005 12:40 PM (YudAC)
Posted by: Purple Avenger at October 06, 2005 01:24 PM (X+OCl)
Posted by: foreign devil at October 06, 2005 03:57 PM (57Faw)
"Oct. 6, 2005 — The New York City Police Department is investigating what it deems a credible tip that 19 operatives have been deployed to New York to place bombs in the subway, and security in the subways will be increased, sources told ABC News.
While the police department is taking the threat seriously, it is also urging the public not to be alarmed because — while the source is credible — the information has not been verified.
NYC Increases Subway Security After Threat
According to sources in intelligence, emergency services and police headquarters, when three Iraqi insurgents were arrested several days ago during a raid by a joint FBI-CIA team, one of those caught disclosed the threat. Because it slipped out during the arrest, the plot was deemed credible.
After several days of work, sources said, the NYPD is increasingly concerned because it has been unable to discredit the initial source and additional information from the source.
The 19 operatives were to place improvised explosive devices in the subways using briefcases, according to two sources.
The police are deploying additional officers, dogs and heavy weapons teams in subways and commuter rail terminals, sources said.
Department of Homeland Secuirty sources told ABC News they are very doubtful the threat information is credible, though NYPD sources said the information continues to come in and is disturbing."
Posted by: renee at October 06, 2005 04:30 PM (rBR8e)
For MORE.........follow link provided@ Alien Nation Report
Posted by: Alien Nation Report at October 06, 2005 05:05 PM (mo1rX)
Naturally it has attracted petro-muslims in large numbers.
The combination of engineering smarts and fanaticism should make this university an FBI priority.
Posted by: blert at October 06, 2005 08:28 PM (LRJEa)
http://thewoman.blogspot.com/2005/10/breath-still-being-held.html
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8852689&postID=112846727472222889
Let's cut to the chase!
Posted by: STILL ANONYMOUS™ at October 07, 2005 12:32 PM (jK2x+)
Bush's policies may be wrong AND the kid may have been a not-so-competent Jihadi. These things are not mutually exclusive.
Get yer knees under control, people.
Posted by: Mark Poling at October 11, 2005 05:18 AM (+HWIo)
Posted by: June Gagnon at October 16, 2005 09:55 PM (2FzlO)
If the organization is for real, then there may be some urban warfare occuring on streets OUTSIDE of Baghdad.
Posted by: CHRISTIAN DEFENSE FORCE at October 19, 2005 09:22 PM (/Oui+)
Posted by: Trevor Cole at December 03, 2005 09:17 PM (x96dl)
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